Extramarital Affairs in Women.

[Tommelon]

Hey everyone,

I've been thinking about relationships lately and wanted to open up a discussion. What are your thoughts on the topic of infidelity? I'm curious to hear about your experiences and what you think might lead a woman to engage in an extramarital affair? No judgment here, just interested in hearing different perspectives.

 

[Dreamer110]

Simple. Neither of us cheats and we stay married.

 

[marriedbigrl]

You should have just asked what leads people to cheat. Men and women really arent that different. So, the exact same things that lead to men cheating. Unhappiness in their relationship, feelings of neglect(including but not limited to lack of sex), being taken for granted, etc, all while the attraction to and possibility of a different guy fills the needs she feels are neglected. I.E. She doesn't feel like you appreciate/are attracted to her while the other guy does make her feel that way.

Or, also just as with guys, sometimes they're just incapable of monogamy. Though I do feel like that's more common with men than women in my, admittedly biased, opinion.

 

[TravisAW]

People cheat for various reasons. Lack of attention from the other half is a big one, whether it's time, physical or emotional attention or a combination thereof. You could have a family night watching TV but if the SO is on their tablet device for the whole night, they've simply been in the same room. Failure to communicate, someone else shows them attention, they're flattered, chain of dominos leads to infidelity.

 

[Mike130]

There are emotional and physical aspects to this question.

Emotionally, trust and honesty are basic tenants of a relationship. You always should be honest with your partner. There is also a question of jealousy; are you mature enough to handle her having a relationship with another man?

From the physical side, I think men and women fantasize a lot about having sex with other people. Seems pretty natural, women are attracted to movie stars, attractive men, men are attracted to … well almost anything.

I think if a woman or man is honest with their partner and desires sex with another person with no emotional attachment, just fucking and sucking, that’s fine.

 

[LMWM321]

Or, also just as with guys, sometimes they're just incapable of monogamy. Though I do feel like that's more common with men than women in my, admittedly biased, opinion.

I think "incapable of monogamy" is more common than people realize.

Nowadays, it's often dismissed as lack of willpower, or weak character. But I can't help but wonder if in the years ahead, the need for multiple partners that some people have will be regarded as just an inherent sexual orientation - something they can't really control or affect. And to try to forbid someone from doing it will be seen as unrealistic and cruel as telling a gay man or woman, "..You need to ignore your desires and be with opposite gender!!"

 

[marriedbigrl]

I think "incapable of monogamy" is more common than people realize.

Nowadays, it's often dismissed as lack of willpower, or weak character. But I can't help but wonder if in the years ahead, the need for multiple partners that some people have will be regarded as just an inherent sexual orientation - something they can't really control or affect. And to try to forbid someone from doing it will be seen as unrealistic and cruel as telling a gay man or woman, "..You need to ignore your desires and be with opposite gender!!"

Your reply here has no relation to cheating though. As matter of fact it's not even forbidden for people to have multiple partners. But if you are a person who needs multiple partners you shouldn't be putting yourself in a relationship where there is an expectation of monogamy. Serial cheaters will never get sympathy like you are advocating for.

 

[LMWM321]

But if you are a person who needs multiple partners you shouldn't be putting yourself in a relationship where there is an expectation of monogamy

I agree, but it may be a need that one isn't aware of until they are much older. And people often confuse polyamory with the desire for multiple sex partners. They are NOT the same.

My wife and I found monogamy to be quite easy for the first 25 years of our marriage. After which our desire to love only each other remained strongly intact, but the desire for occasional NSA (no strings attached) sex outside the marriage grew stronger and stronger.

 

[marriedbigrl]

I agree, but it may be a need that one isn't aware of until they are much older. And people often confuse polyamory with the desire for multiple sex partners. They are NOT the same.

My wife and I found monogamy to be quite easy for the first 25 years of our marriage. After which our desire to love only each other remained strongly intact, but the desire for occasional NSA (no strings attached) sex outside the marriage grew stronger and stronger.

Which still isn't cheating if you both discussed it and agreed to it. If you are doing it behind her back, you are cheating and you are still an asshole. This post was specifically about cheating.

 

[Islander55]

Which still isn't cheating if you both discussed it and agreed to it. If you are doing it behind her back, you are cheating and you are still an asshole. This post was specifically about cheating.

I think if people are honest with themselves, sometimes there is simply a desire for someone different. Probably for men at any age but for women, it is more likely to hit them in their 40's or at least it did in my case.

 

[LMWM321]

I think if people are honest with themselves, sometimes there is simply a desire for someone different. Probably for men at any age but for women, it is more likely to hit them in their 40's or at least it did in my case.

exactly. By the time we were married 25 years we had had sex over 3000 times (basically 2.5x/wk), and that doesn't include the 5 years of monogamy while we were dating. It's utterly understandable that at that point each of us would want to occasionally be w/ someone different - especially once we reach a point in our relationship when neither of us has a single insecurity about the permanence of our marriage.

And this is relevant to the OP's question about why people cheat. Perhaps the OP should more clearly explain what sort of cheating. Is it a wife who, on three separate occasions over a 30 year career of hectic business travel, spent a single night (or maybe just a few hours) with another man? ..A man she has not communicated with since? Or are you talking about a wife who's been having sex with someone else 2x per week for many months? The two are very different, have different reasons and reflect differently on the health of the marriage. And of course these same questions apply to a cheating husband.

 

[magicalmoments]

You should have just asked what leads people to cheat. Men and women really arent that different. So, the exact same things that lead to men cheating. Unhappiness in their relationship, feelings of neglect(including but not limited to lack of sex), being taken for granted, etc, all while the attraction to and possibility of a different guy fills the needs she feels are neglected. I.E. She doesn't feel like you appreciate/are attracted to her while the other guy does make her feel that way.

Or, also just as with guys, sometimes they're just incapable of monogamy. Though I do feel like that's more common with men than women in my, admittedly biased, opinion.

I have no illusions as to why I cheated. It was none of the reasons given in this response. I wasn't unhappy in the marriage, I certainly wasn't neglected, sexually or otherwise, or taken for granted. No I was simply a selfish prick. I loved feeling my cock sink into a different woman as often as possible. Plain and simple.

 

[Britva415]

it may be a need that one isn't aware of until they are much older. And people often confuse polyamory with the desire for multiple sex partners. They are NOT the same.

My wife and I found monogamy to be quite easy for the first 25 years of our marriage. After which our desire to love only each other remained strongly intact, but the desire for occasional NSA (no strings attached) sex outside the marriage grew stronger and stronger.

So, you renegotiated?

 

[marriedbigrl]

I have no illusions as to why I cheated. It was none of the reasons given in this response. I wasn't unhappy in the marriage, I certainly wasn't neglected, sexually or otherwise, or taken for granted. No I was simply a selfish prick. I loved feeling my cock sink into a different woman as often as possible. Plain and simple.

That reason is listed in my response. At that time in your life you were incapable of monogamy. It was just a fancier way of saying "some people are assholes who listen to their dick/pussy, without any thought of the consequences." I'm not trying to be judgmental, as I myself was that way much of my teens and 20s. But it is the same thing.

 

[LMWM321]

I'm not trying to be judgmental

It sure sounds like you are....

The reasons people cheat are many. Calling anyone who has done it an "asshole who listened to their dick/pussy, without any thought of the consequences" reveals a lack of empathy for the many people who are stuck in loveless marriages. People who may maybe financially unable to leave or fear harm to their children. Or maybe just threatening to do so provokes violence.

I wouldn't recommend you consider marriage counseling as a career, marriedbigrl.

'btw, I've NEVER cheated, so my comments are not just rationalizations of personal behaviour

 

[marriedbigrl]

It sure sounds like you are....

The reasons people cheat are many. Calling anyone who has done it an "asshole who listened to their dick/pussy, without any thought of the consequences" reveals a lack of empathy for the many people who are stuck in loveless marriages. People who may maybe financially unable to leave or fear harm to their children. Or maybe just threatening to do so provokes violence.

I wouldn't recommend you consider marriage counseling as a career, marriedbigrl.

'btw, I've NEVER cheated, so my comments are not just rationalizations of personal behaviour

Lmao, I didn't call anyone who has done it assholes, just said it was one of many reasons for people to cheat. I mean, hell, did you even read my original post?

Thankfully, I am not a marriage counselor nor do I plan to be, so thank you for the advice. As long as we are handing out advice, I might suggest you go to school and improve your reading comprehension.

Also, it sure does sound like you are trying rationalize some kind of behavior.

 

[policywank]

I do believe that the prospect that some of us aren't wired for monogamy is pertinent. It is not a good reason to cheat in the sense that we should have known and not entered into a monogamous relationship in the first place. But that changes when coupled with the fact that most married adults today were raised to believe that non-monogamy wasn't a viable option and even thinking it made you a bad person. Moreover if you wanted non-monogamy and your preferred partner did not then they were right and you were wrong as opposed to the possibility that it was equally valid for either of you to sacrifice your preference in order to be together.

Some may argue that means that those of us who couldn't resist are more selfish. Maybe there is something to that, but I think it is too simplistic. For a person who has limited interest in sexual variety and has limited access to sexual opportunity to resist cheating is much easier than it is for a person who craves variety and has abundant sexual opportunity. I might argue that it is natural to crave variety, some of us crave it more than others and when that meets up with opportunity the outcome is just a by-product of human nature. We all have weaknesses. Some are just deemed more acceptable than others.

I am reminded of the example of Tiger Woods. When he cheated a lot of people were quick to judge his morality and question his motivation given that he had a beautiful wife at home. But the vast majority of people making those judgments never faced anything like the sexual opportunities that were regularly thrown at him. If they did then a lot of them would have cheated too and we would be talking more about how it is just in our nature and in order to avoid the damage associated with it we should not expect monogamy in the first place.

No doubt selfishness is part of it. But is it some sort of exceptional selfishness? Or is it a combination of regular human selfishness that just happens to intersect with an area in which a give person also has opportunity and which society deems especially negative.

 

[policywank]

It sure sounds like you are....

The reasons people cheat are many. Calling anyone who has done it an "asshole who listened to their dick/pussy, without any thought of the consequences" reveals a lack of empathy for the many people who are stuck in loveless marriages. People who may maybe financially unable to leave or fear harm to their children. Or maybe just threatening to do so provokes violence.

I wouldn't recommend you consider marriage counseling as a career, marriedbigrl.

'btw, I've NEVER cheated, so my comments are not just rationalizations of personal behaviour

The loveless marriage is something that has come up many times in these discussions. And I do believe that it is something we often gloss over too easily with simplistic solutions or answers (not saying anybody here did that).

In my view sex is an integral part of marriage. Neither party should expect it on demand, but nor is it purely optional based upon each partner's whim. But some people don't see it that way and an otherwise loving partner can and will behave as though it is incumbent upon their partner to remain faithful, while having no sex life up to the point that failure to do so will have catastrophic consequences. Consider the scenario where a person faces three bad options: 1) remain faithful in a sexless marriage denying one's legitimate human need for sexual intimacy; 2) end the marriage with acrimony, a custody fight, massive financial damage and possibly even a vindicate ex obstructing access to one's children; 3) have a quiet and discrete affair.

I am not suggesting that this is the case in every sexless marriage. And there are always two sides to every story. But nor is it far fetched to imagine scenarios wherein option #3 is the least bad option.

 

[LMWM321]

But the vast majority of people making those judgments never faced anything like the sexual opportunities that were regularly thrown at him. If they did then a lot of them would have cheated too and we would be talking more about how it is just in our nature and in order to avoid the damage associated with it we should not expect monogamy in the first place.

A great point well said.

I think the institution of marriage needs a re-think that contemplates how long people live and how some peoples libido remain quite high very late in life. A first-world problem, for sure, but a reality of better food, shelter, and healthcare.

And such a re-think of the institution of marriage will recognize that for some people, the need for sexual variety is as much an orientation - one that may not reveal itself until much later in life - as is being gay, or bi-sexual.

 

[marriedbigrl]

I do believe that the prospect that some of us aren't wired for monogamy is pertinent. It is not a good reason to cheat in the sense that we should have known and not entered into a monogamous relationship in the first place. But that changes when coupled with the fact that most married adults today were raised to believe that non-monogamy wasn't a viable option and even thinking it made you a bad person. Moreover if you wanted non-monogamy and your preferred partner did not then they were right and you were wrong as opposed to the possibility that it was equally valid for either of you to sacrifice your preference in order to be together.

Some may argue that means that those of us who couldn't resist are more selfish. Maybe there is something to that, but I think it is too simplistic. For a person who has limited interest in sexual variety and has limited access to sexual opportunity to resist cheating is much easier than it is for a person who craves variety and has abundant sexual opportunity. I might argue that it is natural to crave variety, some of us crave it more than others and when that meets up with opportunity the outcome is just a by-product of human nature. We all have weaknesses. Some are just deemed more acceptable than others.

I am reminded of the example of Tiger Woods. When he cheated a lot of people were quick to judge his morality and question his motivation given that he had a beautiful wife at home. But the vast majority of people making those judgments never faced anything like the sexual opportunities that were regularly thrown at him. If they did then a lot of them would have cheated too and we would be talking more about how it is just in our nature and in order to avoid the damage associated with it we should not expect monogamy in the first place.

No doubt selfishness is part of it. But is it some sort of exceptional selfishness. Or is it a combination of regular human selfishness that just happens to intersect with an area in which a give person also has opportunity and which society deems especially negative.

It's definitely regular human selfishness. And I mostly agree on the Tiger Woods thing. I think just about everyone makes the same mistakes in that situation. However, I disagree that it's an example of why we shouldn't expect monogamy. Whatever your upbringing, if a monogamous relationship is what you agreed to, you shouldn't cheat. Breakup, get a divorce, or have an honest discussion about it like @LMWM321 and @OlderFitterWiser did with their wives and come to an agreement.

Hurting someone by cheating on them is wrong. Even if you are Tiger Woods, in a sexless marriage or just bored. If you are in a relationship communicate, always.

 

[NormalMarriedWhiteGuy]

Your reply here has no relation to cheating though. As matter of fact it's not even forbidden for people to have multiple partners. But if you are a person who needs multiple partners you shouldn't be putting yourself in a relationship where there is an expectation of monogamy. Serial cheaters will never get sympathy like you are advocating for.

I agree 100%. At the risk of sounding like an old fart, as long as the "rules" are established up front there should be no issues with poly relationships. If you have that mutual understanding, then fine and go for it. But if the expectation is exclusivity and one party changes thier mind and starts sneaking behing the other's back then yeah, that does make you a jerk.

 

[policywank]

It's definitely regular human selfishness. And I mostly agree on the Tiger Woods thing. I think just about everyone makes the same mistakes in that situation. However, I disagree that it's an example of why we shouldn't expect monogamy. Whatever your upbringing, if a monogamous relationship is what you agreed to, you shouldn't cheat. Breakup, get a divorce, or have an honest discussion about it like @LMWM321 and @OlderFitterWiser did with their wives and come to an agreement.

Hurting someone by cheating on them is wrong. Even if you are Tiger Woods, in a sexless marriage or just bored. If you are in a relationship communicate, always.

I think that is the ideal approach, but unwinding a monogamous marriage isn't always that easy and the consequences can be enormous. See my subsequent post about least bad option.

I don't mean that couples shouldn't expect monogamy if that is what they agreed to. I mean that as a society we should open our minds to the prospect that it isn't for everyone so that we all feel free to express our preferences without judgment.

A few years ago I read comments from a woman online lamenting the terribleness of men. She had started a chat online with a man with whom she seemed to be getting along nicely. When the topic of getting together in real life came up he said he would love to but wanted her to know that he was non-monogamous and intended to stay that way. The vitriol she poured on him was nasty. But I was just thinking, hey he told you before things got too serious. That is all he realistically owed you. And you had no right to disparage someone for their legitimate preference expressed in a diplomatic and timely way. But to her the mere fact that he wanted to be non-monogamous was itself proof of something negative.

No none of us should be guided by society's pressure. But most people are to some degree and that is reality. As long as being non-monogamous is regarded with disdain and people are encouraged to adopt the view that they must be monogamous or be alone, we will have people choosing the former and subsequently struggling to maintain that commitment due in part to their basic nature.

 

[policywank]

It's definitely regular human selfishness. And I mostly agree on the Tiger Woods thing. I think just about everyone makes the same mistakes in that situation. However, I disagree that it's an example of why we shouldn't expect monogamy. Whatever your upbringing, if a monogamous relationship is what you agreed to, you shouldn't cheat. Breakup, get a divorce, or have an honest discussion about it like @LMWM321 and @OlderFitterWiser did with their wives and come to an agreement.

Hurting someone by cheating on them is wrong. Even if you are Tiger Woods, in a sexless marriage or just bored. If you are in a relationship communicate, always.

Nice in principle but not always realistic. I have known lots of married people whose otherwise loving spouse was (or could reasonably be assumed they would be) completely closed to attempts to re-engage their marital sex life or pursue non-monogamy. Meanwhile ending the relationship would have had potentially major negative consequences.

Why is it that if one partner completely disregards the sexual needs of their partner and their partner ends up cheating all the guilt falls on the latter? Wasn't it the first partner who first failed to hold up their end of the marital bargain? I am not saying that justifies the cheating, but it isn't all black and white. Communication is a two-way street. If one party refuses to engage they are part of the problem and cannot reasonably blame the entire outcome on the other party.

 

[LMWM321]

Hurting someone by cheating on them is wrong. Even if you are Tiger Woods, in a sexless marriage or just bored. If you are in a relationship communicate, always.

I've never cheated, but I also never judge.

Neither my mother nor my father ever cheated on each other. But my father was a total shit to my mom their entire marriage. He never beat her, but he always made her feel small, worthless... unloved. Our culture would applaud his faithfulness while just dismissing his being an inveterate asshole as something he couldn't help.

We elevate fidelity above ALL the other marital vows. Well, I would have loved learning - as an adult - that my Mom at least felt adored/ cherished by a lover. And I would have rather had a father who treated my mother more kindly, and respectfully... but but had a few affairs.

 

[marriedbigrl]

Nice in principle but not always realistic. I have known lots of married people whose otherwise loving spouse was (or could reasonably be assumed they would be) completely closed to attempts to re-engage their marital sex life or pursue non-monogamy. Meanwhile ending the relationship would have had potentially major negative consequences.

Why is it that if one partner completely disregards the sexual needs of their partner and their partner ends up cheating all the guilt falls on the latter? Wasn't it the first partner who first failed to hold up their end of the marital bargain? I am not saying that justifies the cheating, but it isn't all black and white. Communication is a two-way street. If one party refuses to engage they are part of the problem and cannot reasonably blame the entire outcome on the other party.

I almost completely agree with this. I wouldn't say all the blame falls on the cheater in that situation at all. But choosing to cheat over divorce, for whatever reason, is still dumb in my opinion, as divorce in that situation is going to happen much more often than not. And in the process the cheater has surrendered the moral high ground, and the divorce will likely be even worse for them than if they had just divorced to start with.