Extended tours of duty are challenged in federal court

[shereads]

Seven soldiers asked the court to force the Pentagon to release them from service. Their attorney argues that the "Stop Loss" program is a bait-and-switch operation, because soldiers were recruited and signed on for limited tours of duty, and were not told their tours could be extended.

Finally, somebody will have to justify this legalized kidnapping in a court of law. Acknowledging that our troops are spread too thin is politically distasteful, so we force them to remain indefinitely - and still call it an "all volunteer army."

 

[logophile]

And this is precisely why it doesn't matter what Bush said during his campaign... we're going to have to reinstate the draft. Our soldiers are dwindling and new recruit numbers are in the toilet. Unless our president is willing to just walk away from the war when we run out of soldiers, he's going to have to do something. And there really isn't another choice.

Just one more big fat lie that lots of Americans were fed and believed a couple of months ago. Makes my stomach hurt...

 

[LadyJeanne]

I fear there may be something in the fine print that makes it legal for them to extend tours, maybe indefinitely, in times of war or for acts of God - some loophole they will use to justify it.

 

[logophile]

I have the same fear...

 

[Evil Alpaca]

I have the same fear...

And what's worse, those pesky democrats actually pointed that out and their adversaires referred to it as "fear mongering." All I can say is, I voted, therefore I reserve the right to criticize. I hope the soldier's challenge is upheld (or however it should be phrased.)

 

[shereads]

And this is precisely why it doesn't matter what Bush said during his campaign... we're going to have to reinstate the draft. Our soldiers are dwindling and new recruit numbers are in the toilet. Unless our president is willing to just walk away from the war when we run out of soldiers, he's going to have to do something. And there really isn't another choice.

Just one more big fat lie that lots of Americans were fed and believed a couple of months ago. Makes my stomach hurt...

You're wrong about the draft, logo. If the president proposed reinstating the draft, it would be a flipflop. Resolute presidents don't flipflop; they don't know how.

That's where the No Child Left Behind program comes in.

Let's suppose that Iran and North Korea do the nuclear macarena simultaneously, the Taliban continues to regroup in Afghanistan, and we're still stuck in Falujeh. The case against "stop loss" goes to the Supreme Court, the Pentagon loses, and tens of thousands of soldiers sue to end their indefinitely extended tours of duty.

Does the president mention the "D" word? Not at all. He becomes the Education President again, insists that Congress fully fund the No Child Left Behind program, and sends America's public high school students on an all-expenses-paid field trip to the Middle East.

Think of the opportunity for inner city kids, who typically don't get to experience the Middle East until they're 18.

It'll be called "No Child Left Behind II."

 

[cantdog]

There was a photo which circulated the 'net not long after Saddam's disappearance and Baghdad's fall. An APC with camo paint letters on the windshield: "1 WEEKEND A MONTH MY ASS!"

Soldier has a right to bitch and moan.

 

[BlackShanglan]

My feelings on the war are deeply divided, but my feelings on this "stop-loss" policy are not. I hope that the soliders win, and that the decision breaks the back of this concept now and swiftly. It's an insult to those who have served honestly and with great sacrifice to treat them in this fashion.

Shanglan

 

[shereads]

The beauty of "No Child Left Behind" Part II is that the mass field trips will be primarily funded by local school districts, with an assist from PTA bake sales.

I think I'll call the president. This should be worth a cabinet post; even better, an ambassadorship. New Zealand seems nice.

 

[shereads]

If these seven soldiers don't win their case, will they be extra-popular with their superior officers?

 

[logophile]

If these seven soldiers don't win their case, will they be extra-popular with their superior officers?

Good question. Your idea about No Child Left Behind II is truly frightening and I sincerely want to get the image out of my head! Yikes!

 

[she_is_my_addiction]

Will they draft women?

 

[logophile]

Yup. One version of a bill that's in congress (or so I've been told) says men AND women, ages 18 to 31.

 

[she_is_my_addiction]

Yup. One version of a bill that's in congress (or so I've been told) says men AND women, ages 18 to 31.

They do it and I'll have someone break my back for me.

 

[shereads]

Will they draft women?

I don't think the Bush twins will end up driving a supply truck in Afghanistan, do you? To be fair, a reinstated draft should be non-discriminatory, which is one reason Congress and the prez are so afraid of it. Reinstating the draft as it was during the Vietnam era - when so many people in this administration and this Congress used college deferrments to stay out of the war - would be hard to justify as anything but a slap in the face to low income families. They bear the brunt of the volunteer army as it is, especially when unemployment is high. After all the hooplah about Chicken Hawks like Cheney (5 deferrments) and Ashcroft (administration record-holder with 7 deferrments), this would be a tough tap-dance.

 

[cjh]

i'm jumping boards. my apologies. but i'm interested in this topic.

i think women would have to be drafted if women if it is reinstated; otherwise the draft would be subject to equal protection challenges.

let me add this to the thread (it twists it, but not much): american soldiers have started applying for asylum in canada.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/202432_resist06.html

the moral underpinnings of this war will be explored, despite the administration's best efforts to try to convert it into some form of humanitarian gesture.

 

[The_old_man]

This same question came up during WW ll. Then again in Korea where I got the Truman Year.

They do not have a chance of winning as the fine print allows it.

 

[she_is_my_addiction]

Fuck the burning Bush









that's all i have to say

 

[Weird Harold]

Their attorney argues that the "Stop Loss" program is a bait-and-switch operation, because soldiers were recruited and signed on for limited tours of duty, and were not told their tours could be extended

If that's their argument, they'll lose.

In 21 years I signed five enlistment/reenlistment contracts; each time I had to initial the clause that makes "for the good of the service" a magic phrase.

Unless enlistment contracts have changed a great deal in the last 20 years, EVERY service member has read and intialed that clause in their contract.

 

[cantdog]

This same question came up during WW ll. Then again in Korea where I got the Truman Year.

They do not have a chance of winning as the fine print allows it.

This war is illegal, under international law and the Charter. The WW II was a declared war, and Germany and Japan declared before we did. That's a big difference in international cases.

cantdog

 

[rgraham666]

I don't think the Shrubbies will see it that way.

 

[Weird Harold]

This war is illegal, under international law and the Charter. The WW II was a declared war, and Germany and Japan declared before we did. That's a big difference in international cases.

cantdog

The question was also tested in Vietnam and several times during peacetime. The precedents are fairly consistent since the Civil War generated the clause that everyone has to read and initial in enlistment contracts.

"For the good of the service" is a magic phrase that has been upheld repeatedly as permitting the military to refuse discharge at the end of a normal enlistment if the thirty years military service commitment is fulfilled.

 

[Edward Teach]

Does anybody seriously think that this crowd isn't going to get whatever in the hell they want?

They have both houses of congress, the Supreme Court and the fucking media on their side.

They stole the 2000 election and got away with it for Christ's sake.

They ain't gonna lose any court cases.

But even if a miracle should happen and they do, hell, a few free concerts with Toby Keith and the gang, some drum beating by the media and a little slick advertising, they'll have recruits lined up begging to go to Iraq without any fucking pay.


Ed

 

[BlackShanglan]

They do it and I'll have someone break my back for me.

Oh, don't worry about that. Just nuzzle some bush (not the capitalized kind) or cock and talk about it publically. So far as I know, if you tell, you shouldn't be asked - no?

Shanglan

 

[shereads]

i'm jumping boards. my apologies. but i'm interested in this topic.

DEFCON ORANGE! I've spotted a board jumper!









What's a board jumper?



Welcome to this one. Are you evading the draft at another forum?