Etiquette of drinking alcohol when dating?

[GrrlFriday]

I have always been a real lightweight. As a consequence of that, I drink only when I can collapse for 8 hours and not have to walk anywhere, and only in social situations when I can pour my drink in a shot glass or sherry glass while everyone else has full drinks. This translates to roughly once every 2 or 3 months - birthdays of my immediate family and Christmas. A branch of my extended family is Seventh Day Adventist who do not drink alcohol, and so I'm used to weddings, big Christmases, etc. being without alcohol. It sometimes embarrasses me how much alcohol affects me - a friend has now permanently decided that I am an alcoholic because I once drank in front of her, and I got giggly and then I had to go to sleep.

I once dated a guy who realised that he had never seen me drunk. He invited me to drink with him, and it seemed bizarrely important to him. When I asked why it was so important to him, he said that he wanted to see me drink so that he could see what I'm like when I'm drunk because 'in vino veritas', and so that I could demonstrate my trust in him. This struck me as not being a good reason to drink, and I told him as much. He continued to wheedle and whine. I went through every reason why I do not drink, as patiently as I could. I told him that I'd raise a tiny glass to celebrate with him some time, and that one of my reasons for being mindful about my alcohol use is respect for my relatives' religious beliefs. (Which is true - and seemed to be the one reason that he respected.) Yes, he turned out to be not a good partner in many other ways, and 'some time' never eventuated.

I'm mystified about the general etiquette of drinking alcohol when dating. Because I'm a lightweight, I have to 'just say no', but I'm not sure if I'm saying it in the right way - without accidentally coming off as someone who is protesting too much, looks down on others who drink, or that I'm pregnant or have experienced addiction. My experience with my ex has left me wondering if there is such a thing as a 'drunk girl' fetish for guys, and if so, how does that work. I realise that that won't always be the case, and that guys won't know that I'm a lightweight, and that they might just be innocently offering me the traditional 'one to take the edge off' to be hospitable. Trouble is, with me, one drink leaves me two sheets to the wind, which is also a no-no. Also, how do you know when it's ok to drink with a partner? (Beyond 'they'll be ok with it if I have to go to sleep straight after...')



Thank you, all.

 

[NippleMuncher]

You owe nobody a reason as to why you don't drink. If they press, simply tell them that you don't care for it, just as some people have an aversion to certain foods, scents, etc. You can add that you don't care if they drink or not, so that they don't feel as odd with an adult beverage by themselves.

From your description, you may have an allergy to certain types of alcohol, and more likely certain components, such as sulphites in wine. While naturally occurring in most, some wines are fortified with sulphites. Hard liquor is made with different grains/materials, fermented, distilled, then blended with other ingredients, again, you could have a sensitivity to one of these components.

As for whom you hang out with, if they're demanding that you drink to satisfy some weird fetish or curiosity they have, then maybe that is a good sign that this is someone whom shouldn't be in your life.

I have a very dear friend, who, like you, doesn't drink. To my knowledge, she doesn't have the issues that you mention, it's just not something she chooses to do. Suffice it to say, you do not need to drink to have a good time.

 

[pplwatching]

This is a good (and surprisingly complicated) question. First and foremost, your ex was a jerk for not respecting your boundaries. Anyone who insists that you have a drink with them over your wishes should be kicked to the curb. Always remember that.

All through high school and into my early 20s I rarely ever even drank a beer. I lost friends because I wouldn't get stoned or drink, but that was typical high school behavior and friendships were shallow. I eventually did when I was ready, and now enjoy a beer once every couple of weeks to a month depending on our social calendar. It is still almost unheard of for me to drink at home, and a friend of mine has described me as "the only man alive who can leave a 1/2 full beer on the table."

As to why the answer is complicated, it seems like some people simply don't like to drink alone. Alcohol ads present drinking as a social activity, and some people feel a sense of camaraderie having a conversation over a drink. It makes them feel like "we're cut from the same cloth". Conversely, they feel that not being able to "bond" over a drink is somehow a sign that we have insurmountable differences. Sometimes they go so far to feel that it is rude to refuse a drink when offered. There would occasionally be people at parties who thought that as the only sober person in the room I must be judging them. I just ignored them.

As to when it's okay to have a drink with a date, the answer would be simply when you feel like you would enjoy having a drink with a date. If you feel safe, that you won't be judged, and and most importantly that you want to then by all means enjoy a drink. I eventually married a woman who drinks even less than I do, although she does enjoy having a drink with me from time to time. I have never seen her drunk and she's never seen me drunk, because neither of us enjoys drinking to excess. I also feel completely comfortable handing her the keys to the car if I do decide to have more than one drink. That's just part of the trust equation.

If you don't enjoy drinking, then don't drink. If you feel like you would enjoy being able to have a drink socially, then you may find that having a drink every now and again helps you build up a little tolerance.

 

[FGB]

I have a high tolerance for alcohol as my roommate made the mistake of forgetting about a year ago.

I have gone years without drink any Alcohol at all.

Some people just cannot handle it with varying results from blacking out to really getting sick.

If I'm "OUT" and driving the most I will drink is probably two beers in 6-10 hours.

One should error on the side of safety... Alcohol is a drug and a poison.

 

[GrrlFriday]

Thanks all. I'd forgotten that some of my direct ancestors have allergies to alcohol - beer and red wine. I have a tendency to forget about how much alcohol affects me 'between drinks'. Last time, I was wearing sensible shoes and had to walk ~300 meters back to the car... and I remembered why I don't walk when I get drunk.

The only part that 'building up a tolerance' seems to affect is the giggly stage - not the rest. I don't mind once in a while having a drink, but it feels like the stars have to align for me to drink in a way that feels comfortable to me.

Thanks for the idea of alcohol being social lubricant/glue - that makes a lot of sense in some situations. I think my mother thinks like this sometimes. When she pours, I generally get more than I'd like - in most cases, though, it's ok because the rest of everything is alright. She has stuck up for me when I've had to refuse drinks at other occasions by making a joke of it so that the person offering doesn't feel like I'm being ungrateful by saying 'no thanks'.

 

[Que]

I have always been a real lightweight. As a consequence of that, I drink only when I can collapse for 8 hours and not have to walk anywhere, and only in social situations when I can pour my drink in a shot glass or sherry glass while everyone else has full drinks. This translates to roughly once every 2 or 3 months - birthdays of my immediate family and Christmas. A branch of my extended family is Seventh Day Adventist who do not drink alcohol, and so I'm used to weddings, big Christmases, etc. being without alcohol. It sometimes embarrasses me how much alcohol affects me - a friend has now permanently decided that I am an alcoholic because I once drank in front of her, and I got giggly and then I had to go to sleep.

I once dated a guy who realised that he had never seen me drunk. He invited me to drink with him, and it seemed bizarrely important to him. When I asked why it was so important to him, he said that he wanted to see me drink so that he could see what I'm like when I'm drunk because 'in vino veritas', and so that I could demonstrate my trust in him. This struck me as not being a good reason to drink, and I told him as much. He continued to wheedle and whine. I went through every reason why I do not drink, as patiently as I could. I told him that I'd raise a tiny glass to celebrate with him some time, and that one of my reasons for being mindful about my alcohol use is respect for my relatives' religious beliefs. (Which is true - and seemed to be the one reason that he respected.) Yes, he turned out to be not a good partner in many other ways, and 'some time' never eventuated.

I'm mystified about the general etiquette of drinking alcohol when dating. Because I'm a lightweight, I have to 'just say no', but I'm not sure if I'm saying it in the right way - without accidentally coming off as someone who is protesting too much, looks down on others who drink, or that I'm pregnant or have experienced addiction. My experience with my ex has left me wondering if there is such a thing as a 'drunk girl' fetish for guys, and if so, how does that work. I realise that that won't always be the case, and that guys won't know that I'm a lightweight, and that they might just be innocently offering me the traditional 'one to take the edge off' to be hospitable. Trouble is, with me, one drink leaves me two sheets to the wind, which is also a no-no. Also, how do you know when it's ok to drink with a partner? (Beyond 'they'll be ok with it if I have to go to sleep straight after...')



Thank you, all.

I would think that as a women (and hence no macho pressure) explaining you are a lightweight with alcohol would be simple.

I can walk into any bar with a $20, stay drunk for 5 hours, tip outrageously and walk out with change.

The way I explain it to people is that I grew up without any alcohol at all, didn't have my first drink till I was 44, so consequently a tiny amount is more than sufficient to get me drunk. People seem to buy that. Especially since it is true. They have seen how drunk I get with one beer. I've built some tolerance. I can now (barely) handle one double, but a single shot is really still plenty.

If you have a situation with an actual bartender they will (or at least should) take you at your word about your tolerance level. Have the bartender make you a mixed drink at 1/2 or 1/4 strength.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

Alcohol use signals social class. I go years without alcohol and spent much of my youth drinking Coke and Pepsi, I prefer cola. Drinking what I prefer tells the world I'm a bonafide elite.

The bourgeoisie drink alcohol socially. Theyre so choreographed and scripted, alcohol is necessary so they can relax.

The proletariat are beasts of burden and drink alcohol to elevate their mood a little.

 

[Nezhul]

I'm a guy. I don't drink alcohol at all, and never once have I been drunk in my life. A bottle of beer or a glass of champagne at New Year is the most I've had, and as I have a good meal with it - I didn't notice a thing.
I don't drink often on social occasions too. And when someone suggests it, I simply say "no". I can drink juice or Cola or something with the company. And People sometimes find it odd, but I never was criticized about it.

I just don't like alcohol. The taste of it, mostly. I dont like seeing drunk people too and I don't want to look like them. For the life of me, I don't know about why would I need to get drunk - I'm always laughing and joking and in a lightened mood as I am, I don't need to stimulate it.

That's the background.

Now, I believe there are occasions where it's a custom to drink some. Weddings, funeral, new year. You shouldn't escape those, but you can limit yourself to one glass of wine, and as long as you have had a good meal before that - you will be fine.
There's no justification to have to drink otherwise. Especially on a date. If someone gets offended that you dont drink - that's not a good person for you anyway, because it means that his attraction to alcohol will get him drunk from time to time, and do you want that? No.
Most normal people will understand your habit NOT to drink. You can still have a good time together, just without any alcohol or it being consumed just by your partner if he really wants (for example some meals are better with a good wine. It's okay to let him have it, it's a part of the meal. You don't need to drink it yourself).

Now, if someone wants to get you drunk on purpose, or wants to get drunk together - that's a huge red warning sign for me. It's like asking to share your bank account to show your trust. Or tell him all of your secrets. A man who really loves you will never have you prove anything, especially by getting you intoxicated. You dont have to prove anything to anyone in the first place. So feel free to say a firm "No". If anyone needs an explanation, just tell him that you don't like drinking alcohol. If someone PRESISTS, than that person doesn't love you and pursues some other interest. Because what loving person will ever make you do something that you don't like doing?
Suggest him to drink a full bottle of hot souse, how will he like that?

 

[Que]

Double post

 

[tishadomina]

I once dated a guy who realised that he had never seen me drunk. He invited me to drink with him, and it seemed bizarrely important to him. When I asked why it was so important to him, he said that he wanted to see me drink so that he could see what I'm like when I'm drunk because 'in vino veritas', and so that I could demonstrate my trust in him. This struck me as not being a good reason to drink, and I told him as much. He continued to wheedle and whine. I went through every reason why I do not drink, as patiently as I could. I told him that I'd raise a tiny glass to celebrate with him some time, and that one of my reasons for being mindful about my alcohol use is respect for my relatives' religious beliefs. (Which is true - and seemed to be the one reason that he respected.) Yes, he turned out to be not a good partner in many other ways, and 'some time' never eventuated.

Which to me screams 'I want to know what your limits are with alcohol so I can push them' combined with bullshit trust-testing. You shouldn't *have* to test a partner's trust, period. You either trust them (or they trust you), or you/they don't. No middle ground. Partially trusting someone is like being partially dead; it doesn't work.

My suggestion regarding etiquette with drinking while dating is to stick to your guns. I personally always try to take a glass of water or a soft drink per every alcoholic drink, but I also am no longer on the dating scene - I therefore only drink socially amongst people that I know and trust, be they friends or work colleagues.

 

[GiggLeGasm]

As to why the answer is complicated, it seems like some people simply don't like to drink alone. Alcohol ads present drinking as a social activity, and some people feel a sense of camaraderie having a conversation over a drink. It makes them feel like "we're cut from the same cloth". Conversely, they feel that not being able to "bond" over a drink is somehow a sign that we have insurmountable differences. Sometimes they go so far to feel that it is rude to refuse a drink when offered. There would occasionally be people at parties who thought that as the only sober person in the room I must be judging them. I just ignored them.

I had originally thought that the ex-boyfriend was just a selfish ass.. but
this is something I agree with. It softens my opinion of him a bit for the reasons that are stated so well in this response.

and there might be great truth in it. Maybe you need to find someone who shares your choices, regardless the underlying reason.

by the way, I have allergies to yeast, mold, anything aged...
I don't get "more drunk." I'm not sure that I'd run out and get tested unless it would change your actions regarding what you eat/drink.

 

[Que]

I had originally thought that the ex-boyfriend was just a selfish ass.. but
this is something I agree with. It softens my opinion of him a bit for the reasons that are stated so well in this response.

and there might be great truth in it. Maybe you need to find someone who shares your choices, regardless the underlying reason.

by the way, I have allergies to yeast, mold, anything aged...
I don't get "more drunk." I'm not sure that I'd run out and get tested unless it would change your actions regarding what you eat/drink.

As a lifelong teetotaler, I thought the concept of "social drinking" was silly. What difference does it make to you that I am sober? I had a couple of drinks with my soon after to be ex-wife, but decided (I think wisely) not to experiment with alcohol till I was in a good stable place.

I had a hard drinking roommate for a while. We would go to the bars, and he was fine with me staying sober as long as we were around some people that drank. I assumed he was simply using the concept of not drinking alone as a guard against problem drinking. I told him on more than one occasion that I had absolutely no objection or judgment if he wanted to have a beer or 12 in our home. He wouldn't though unless someone else that did drink stopped by. He was not defensive. He would just shrug and say "It isn't the same."

One day I was in a bar chatting up a friend who bartended and she assumed that as always I would have a soda. It occurred to me that I was in a pretty good place at the time, and decided to have a drink on my own. She made me a SoCo and lime. It was pleasant and interesting, and led to me experimenting with it in social situations.

There is something that happens when you drink and I am not sure what it is. My working theory is it alters pheromones. In my case there is no advantage of a loosened tongue, I am already overly verbal and not the least bit shy. Yet, people react to me differently when I am also drinking as opposed to when I am not. I have tried to control for variables. Sometimes being sober while looking like I am drinking, (Cranberry juice, sans vodka or Virgin Bloody Marys), sometimes I am drunk but no one knows that. I will pre-drink before I enter the bar and order a soda. For some reason, even at levels that cause no outward signs of alcohol use, it is a social lubricant.

Some primitive cultures ferment things and use it in bonding rituals. That part seems to be real.

 

[GrrlFriday]

Wow, great thoughts, everyone!

Because it's such a strong and fast reaction, when I say 'no thanks, I'm a lightweight' it tends to provoke more curiosity and testing than anything else. As I mentioned before, one friend of mine, after having seen me drink my customary thimbleful, now assumes I'm an alcoholic. I remember the course of that evening clearly - there was no tabletop dancing or blackouts. I giggled, I opined, I got sleepy. Even if I don't have to 'prove my manhood' like a fella might be under pressure to, I as a woman had to prove to him as my man that I trusted him by drinking with him.

Even if I have a stomach lining of a full meal, even if I drink water like a fish, I still have a very strong reaction of the 'fallen down and can't get up' variety. It's at least partially my heritage - thinking about it, I have lightweights on both sides of my family. I have a couple of back issues which might also be at play here.

At the time, my ex and I weren't exactly in a situation where the booze was flowing every weekend, so I was surprised he even noticed. Maybe he'd had a pint with a colleague and that put the idea into his head. I was surprised by how strongly he wanted me to drink with him, and I was wondering if this was a common experience.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[NOIRTRASH]

Forty plus years ago a guy offered my uncle a joint. He refused it. Asked why, he said he didn't smoke and pot was just another smoke. I turned down pussy from an ugly woman one time.

 

[Conager]

Wow, great thoughts, everyone!

Because it's such a strong and fast reaction, when I say 'no thanks, I'm a lightweight' it tends to provoke more curiosity and testing than anything else. As I mentioned before, one friend of mine, after having seen me drink my customary thimbleful, now assumes I'm an alcoholic. I remember the course of that evening clearly - there was no tabletop dancing or blackouts. I giggled, I opined, I got sleepy. Even if I don't have to 'prove my manhood' like a fella might be under pressure to, I as a woman had to prove to him as my man that I trusted him by drinking with him.

Even if I have a stomach lining of a full meal, even if I drink water like a fish, I still have a very strong reaction of the 'fallen down and can't get up' variety. It's at least partially my heritage - thinking about it, I have lightweights on both sides of my family. I have a couple of back issues which might also be at play here.

At the time, my ex and I weren't exactly in a situation where the booze was flowing every weekend, so I was surprised he even noticed. Maybe he'd had a pint with a colleague and that put the idea into his head. I was surprised by how strongly he wanted me to drink with him, and I was wondering if this was a common experience.

The way you see this it sounds like something he just noticed and decided to push. Is it possible that there was a sexual component to it, was he hoping to push some sort of boundary there, and rather than be direct, thought you needed to be "loosened up?"

 

[IrisAlthea]

I'd steer clear of "it makes me giggly and sleepy" because it sounds kind of cute and people will get curious about how giggly etc.

If you go with "I don't like it, because I get sick", you can easily dismiss anyone who thinks you should drink anyway just to entertain them, as someone not worth your time.

 

[GrrlFriday]

My friend has treated me differently because of her assumption, and that annoys me. A lot of the AA, etc. people have some real struggles going on, and I don't want to make light of that by going 'me too!'. I'm happy to borrow my relatives' halo because I think that if I were capable of being religious, that I would probably have joined that church.

The argument about alcohol was actually one of the later ones in our relationship - we had several, and the general theme seemed to be that I wasn't good enough, or that if I just tried harder, things would be perfect. Because there is that cultural conversation about alcohol, this was one of the easier arguments to have.

I don't really describe my symptoms more than 'legless' when talking to people - I'm more likely to say 'it's just not worth it', 'don't waste it on me' or 'no thanks, I'm alright.' It's hard to always say no without setting up an irresistible challenge.

 

[stickygirl]

I'm sure GFriday, like anyone that chooses not to drink, has heard all the actually quite rude comments drinkers make when you refuse. There is definitely a bonding thing going on and if you don't join in, then you're excluding yourself from the group because "we're not good enough blah".
The other side of the coin is that being sober in a room full of drunks has got to be the most tedious social experience!
Tipping your drink into a flowerpot works well - no one notices when they're all drunk

 

[pplwatching]

The other side of the coin is that being sober in a room full of drunks has got to be the most tedious social experience!

Word. And when it's not tedious it's sometimes downright horrifying. Lest anyone think that I am a saint, one of my few and simultaneously worst experience when I was younger was vomiting all over my brothers brand new boots at a kegger. The absolute worst experience we ever had as a couple was a woman doing her best impression of a drunken sailor, swearing her undying love for me while unbuttoning her blouse ... in front of her husband, my wife, and a room full of our friends. She never really spoke to me before or after that, but when she was lubricated she got lubricated. What a nightmare. The difference is some people grow out of it, and some people never seem to learn.

So, Ms. Friday if you think that you might enjoy a social drink then by all means enjoy. Otherwise, if you don't want to limit your date's options then there is no harm in saying "I'd love to have a drink with you" and then sipping a coke while holding up your end of a conversation.

Here's a bonus : http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/keywords/drunk.html

 

[NippleMuncher]

I don't really describe my symptoms more than 'legless' when talking to people - I'm more likely to say 'it's just not worth it', 'don't waste it on me' or 'no thanks, I'm alright.' It's hard to always say no without setting up an irresistible challenge.

Another good one is to say that alcohol doesn't mix well with the medications you take to quell the voices in your head telling you to kill people who ask too many questions about why you don't or won't drink!

 

[GiggLeGasm]

Another good one is to say that alcohol doesn't mix well with the medications you take to quell the voices in your head telling you to kill people who ask too many questions about why you don't or won't drink!

or..
"oh I couldn't. vodka makes my pussy hurt"

but you need to whisper it with a rather innocent smile.. as if sharing a secret

 

[GrrlFriday]

When I get drunk, I only speak Quenya?

 

[Bramblethorn]

II once dated a guy who realised that he had never seen me drunk. He invited me to drink with him, and it seemed bizarrely important to him. When I asked why it was so important to him, he said that he wanted to see me drink so that he could see what I'm like when I'm drunk because 'in vino veritas', and so that I could demonstrate my trust in him. This struck me as not being a good reason to drink, and I told him as much. He continued to wheedle and whine. I went through every reason why I do not drink, as patiently as I could. I told him that I'd raise a tiny glass to celebrate with him some time, and that one of my reasons for being mindful about my alcohol use is respect for my relatives' religious beliefs. (Which is true - and seemed to be the one reason that he respected.) Yes, he turned out to be not a good partner in many other ways, and 'some time' never eventuated.

I had a very similar experience with a co-worker - not dating, just social bonding where they kept badgering me to get drunk. Got so obnoxious I ended up reporting them to their supervisor.

I think it's an extremely bad idea to interrogate somebody on why they don't drink - they might be a recovering alcoholic, they might have had bad experiences involving alcohol, all sorts of reasons they might not be okay talking about. It should be enough that they don't want to drink.

But it makes a useful arsehole filter. Anybody who refuses to respect my choices about alcohol is somebody who won't respect my choices about other things, and I'm better off keeping them at arm's length.

I'm not actually a teetotaller, but my rule is that I only drink when I want to, never ever for the sake of fitting in.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]