Epicticus

[cantdog]

I gotta go with Liar on this one, Des. In a Humean sense, we can't have any idea to what extent our ideas of what happens have been distorted. And the proportion of open minds is small, anyhow, even leaving aside the larger question of whether or not we ever can know what happens, without varnish.

 

[jomar]

We can't be disturbed by what happens, because all we know are our perceptions of what happens. And all perception is colored by presupposition, culture, ideology and, ulimately, opinion.

I disagree. As humans, we have the ability to choose to listen to others perspectives and try to understand their perceptions...which can help change our own. It's only when we close our minds that all we can see are our own perceptions.

I gotta go with Liar on this one, Des. In a Humean sense, we can't have any idea to what extent our ideas of what happens have been distorted. And the proportion of open minds is small, anyhow, even leaving aside the larger question of whether or not we ever can know what happens, without varnish.

If I get a divorce, or are diagnosed with terminal cancer I will certainly be upset. But the things I tell myself about the situation can help me feel better or create worse feelings. I have a bad meeting, or do not get a contract. Maybe I feel sorry for myself and tell myself I can't do anything right, that I'm a loser.

These are the things I'm referring too. The things we tell ourselves that help create bad feelings. There's a world of research on the application of Epititus's concept, most notably with cognitive therapy for depression (Beck, Burns).

But also Albert Ellis who was afraid of rejection (had a cognitive distortion about it) and sat on a bench in Central Park asking every woman he saw out on a date - big time rejection, but it changed his thinking about what it says about himself as a person to be rejected. His book Rational Living also talked about the things we tell ourselves that create problems - the absolutes like must (musterbating) and should (shoulding on oneself). Such absolutes are inflexible and when we can't live up to them, and we never do, we feel bad.

Becoming aware of such thoughts and putting things back into a more realistic perspective is clearly in line with Epictitus's quote. So I'm not even talking here about understanding another's perspective. But that is a good thing to try.

Say I see a movie with a friend. I love it, my friend hates it. We have different filters. That doesn't mean i can't try to understand what he liked about it, even if I disagree. Or I do subtle things that another person takes as racism/ageism/etc. We have to talk - maybe I'm blind to it because of my upbringing/culture/unintended lack of sensitivity, maybe they have their own distortion that makes them touchy, maybe a little of both.

So I think in this sense that Des has a good point. And there's always going to be varnish - the trick is understanding how thick it is for each of us, and maybe a refinish if need be.

 

[cantdog]

Des and Perls, gestalt and cognitive therapy, and many others. Even Goebbels was no stranger to the idea that one's feelings about one's life color it.

It's up to us to take whatever control of these things we are allowed to exert, and use them for good and decent purposes.

 

[jomar]

Des and Perls, gestalt and cognitive therapy, and many others. Even Goebbels was no stranger to the idea that one's feelings about one's life color it.

It's up to us to take whatever control of these things we are allowed to exert, and use them for good and decent purposes.

There ya go.