Editors and beta readers...or no?

[astuffedshirt_perv]

I think I have issues with my prose, both written and spoken (particularly with punctuation), so I have always tried to use volunteer editors and beta readers. Lately it has gotten so hard to find one that I gave up and just posted the stories. They ended up being my highest rated ever...?!?!? Maybe I shouldn't use editors.

 

[Sammael Bard]

That logically doesn't make any sense.

Unless your beta-readers and editors are doing something more than editing (like changing the content itself), it's all yours. Both the lower and higher rated stories were written by you. Why point fingers at someone else for lower scores?

As for not finding editors/beta-readers, maybe you should try and stick to a few select group of people that you've worked with before. That usually solves a lot of problems.

 

[ThisNameIsntTakenYet]

You can't compare two different stories just based on whether they are edited or not. There are a lot of other factors to consider, but if you would post the edited and unedited version of the same story the edited one would almost be guaranteed to score higher.

When I am editing I never change aspects of the story, but do sometimes give suggestions on where it could be improved. The most I would do is to suggest to add, remove or change certain words, but that's always up to the writer. The content of a story that I edit never changes, and the general quality of the writing stays the same. If you send me a badly written story then you get back a badly written story with corrected grammar and maybe tips on how to improve the writing. Blaming an editor for scoring lower doesn't make sense since they usually raise your rating a bit. You probably were just lucky with the voting or maybe the story was written better than the others or posted in a category with readers that vote better on average. Lots of other possibilities.

 

[astuffedshirt_perv]

>Why point fingers at someone else...

>Blaming an editor...

Hah! Shows why I need an editor! I strongly value the work of my editor and am greatly desirous of their help. They consistently point out errors in my work: "His hands slid off her cami" has a different meaning than "His hands slipped off of her cami", for example. However, it has been difficult to find them as of late. I really don't think I've gotten that much better at writing, and I find it odd that the latest set is doing so well.

 

[ThisNameIsntTakenYet]

If you don't think the writing of your latest story has improved and it wasn't edited then it might be a good idea to take a moment to find why it scores better. Just some things to get you started:

Did you post in a different category than usual?
Was you story longer or shorter than your average length?
Was there a difference in age/gender from your usual characters?
Was the length/frequency of the sex scenes different than usual?

Find out what makes this story different from your other stories and you might find the reason why it scored better. Then try to apply those differences to your next story and see if it also scores better. If it does, you know that at least one of those differences is something your readers like. If the score goes back to what you usually get then it might just have been luck after all.

 

[Sammael Bard]

>Why point fingers at someone else...

>Blaming an editor...

Hah! Shows why I need an editor! I strongly value the work of my editor and am greatly desirous of their help. They consistently point out errors in my work: "His hands slid off her cami" has a different meaning than "His hands slipped off of her cami", for example. However, it has been difficult to find them as of late. I really don't think I've gotten that much better at writing, and I find it odd that the latest set is doing so well.

Maybe you improved as a writer.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

I just read a how to write book by Lawrence Block. He includes some experiences with editors.

For him editors fuck up more than they fix.

An editors chief utility is finding enough stuff to fill his magazine or paper or whatever.

 

[Jay321]

nevermind.

 

[sr71plt]

I think I have issues with my prose, both written and spoken (particularly with punctuation), so I have always tried to use volunteer editors and beta readers. Lately it has gotten so hard to find one that I gave up and just posted the stories. They ended up being my highest rated ever...?!?!? Maybe I shouldn't use editors.

As the Bard indicated, maybe you learned some improved writing skills by way of the edits that stuck with you--which is as it should be with edits. If you got good edits and paid attention to them, your subsequent writing should be better even without additional editing.

Responding to JBJ (not you), no writer is so good that he/she can't benefit from a review by a fresh set of eyes--and even better if it is by a trained editor who knows what he/she is doing (which wouldn't be to rewrite anything). There, though, are a lot of writers who are arrogant enough to hold that they won't benefit from an edit by a trained editor.

 

[OmnislashXX]

I never use editors. I kinda feel like the story isn't originally mine anymore if they go and change things. Now, I don't mind proof reading because it can be difficult to spot every little mistake, but if you are willing to take the time to read over your material multiple times then you don't need those either.

 

[Jay321]

I never use editors. I kinda feel like the story isn't originally mine anymore if they go and change things. Now, I don't mind proof reading because it can be difficult to spot every little mistake, but if you are willing to take the time to read over your material multiple times then you don't need those either.

I read over one of my stories, then had someone edit it. They found several errors that needed my attention. It was not because I was not looking, and I do not consider myself stupid by any stretch of the word, I just missed them. It being your own words, its easy to miss something.

If I put something up here in the future that I don't have edited, it was probably something I shouldn't have posted, because I didn't care enough about it to have it polished.

 

[sr71plt]

I never use editors. I kinda feel like the story isn't originally mine anymore if they go and change things. Now, I don't mind proof reading because it can be difficult to spot every little mistake, but if you are willing to take the time to read over your material multiple times then you don't need those either.

A good editor doesn't change anything but the technicals (and even then shows you the changes and, usually, explains why it needs to be changed). A good editor doesn't change the content--although may point to issues you should consider to improve it (in addition to pointing out where a fact check doesn't support your "facts"). And no matter how many times an author reviews his/her work, she/he isn't going to find all of the mistakes that a trained fresh set of eyes can find. For one thing, a lot of mistakes an author makes are because they don't know it's wrong--and they'll just continue getting it wrong until they learn what's right. In other cases, the mind sees what it intended to write rather than what the hand actually wrote and will just continue to do so unless you set the work aside for a while before reviewing it again.

I agree that many authors know the technicals well enough for posting to Literotica without an editor (but that's because Literotica isn't the New Yorker). But anyone who thinks that their copy can't be improved with another set of eyes on it--the more trained to editing the better--just is misleading her/himself.

 

[ThisNameIsntTakenYet]

I read over one of my stories, then had someone edit it. They found several errors that needed my attention. It was not because I was not looking, and I do not consider myself stupid by any stretch of the word, I just missed them. It being your own words, its easy to miss something.

If I put something up here in the future that I don't have edited, it was probably something I shouldn't have posted, because I didn't care enough about it to have it polished.

When I'm reading my own work I always know exactly what I wanted to write, so my brain is a bit ahead of my eyes when reading. When you read someone else's story you have to pay attention to the words because you don't know what they have written. I think that's the biggest reason as to why it's hard to spot errors in your own writing. Waiting a couple of days before you edit your own writing helps a bit though, although it's still not as good as having someone else look over it for you. Also for plot-related issues. Something might be obvious to you as the writer, but for someone who doesn't know everything that you do something can be weird or hard to follow.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

In fact all of us are buried beneath stories from infancy, on. Then we're buried beneath spoken and written language forever.

The problem is lazy fuggin writers with oodles of bad habits.

 

[sr71plt]

As often is the case, that's irrelevant to anything being discussed here. But then you like to post to hear your head rattle.

 

[sr71plt]

nevermind.

I liked what you originally posted. So true.

 

[Jay321]

I liked what you originally posted. So true.

I was wondering if anyone caught it...

 

[Tigersman]

your story

I've been editing for about a year and a half now. Some of the authors I work with put out a pretty polished story before it's sent to me. I told all the authors from the start it's their story so they can either accept or reject any changes. If I find a sentence that to me it does not make sense, I leave them a note saying as much. On occasion I have discovered consistency problems involving pronoun usage or proper name usage.

I try really hard to return to the author a corrected story with only the necessary changes. I have on occasion suggested where the story could be improved by deleting some unnecessary text.

 

[Jay321]

I've been editing for about a year and a half now. Some of the authors I work with put out a pretty polished story before it's sent to me. I told all the authors from the start it's their story so they can either accept or reject any changes. If I find a sentence that to me it does not make sense, I leave them a note saying as much. On occasion I have discovered consistency problems involving pronoun usage or proper name usage.

I try really hard to return to the author a corrected story with only the necessary changes. I have on occasion suggested where the story could be improved by deleting some unnecessary text.

This is the gentleman that edited my story. He did a fantastic job. Every suggestion he made was quality, and even if I did not use his particular suggestion for the change, there was an adjustment to clear out the confusion that comes in from reading "Jay-ease"

 

[PervOtaku]

When I started out, I didn't know about volunteer editors in the erotica site forums, so I just proofread my story myself by reading through it several times. That seemed to work well enough and it ended up being a fairly well-received story, so that is still how I do it.

Obviously that can't be a universal approach, some people may not be so fastidious with their grammar and really do need someone else to attend to that, but I would say if you are confident in your work, do not be afraid of going ahead without third-party help.

 

[SamScribble]

A good editor doesn't change anything but the technicals (and even then shows you the changes and, usually, explains why it needs to be changed).

...

I agree that many authors know the technicals well enough for posting to Literotica without an editor (but that's because Literotica isn't the New Yorker). But anyone who thinks that their copy can't be improved with another set of eyes on it--the more trained to editing the better--just is misleading her/himself.

Perhaps the best RL editor I ever had used to 'discuss' my copy over a game of backgammon and a bottle of wine. He wasn't too concerned with whether I could write a good sentence; he was more concerned with what that sentence 'said' to the reader.

 

[sr71plt]

There are different types of editors. In a publishing house, the acquisitions editor theoretically is supposed to work with the author on the content and structure of the work and, when the content is shaped up, turn it over to the manuscript editor for the technical edit (although the manuscript editor certainly should be watching for readability too). That's the theory. In the publishing houses I worked in, though, the acquisitions editor didn't do the complete job the theory assigned to them (and they were being paid for), though.