KillerMuffin
Seraphically Disinclined
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2000
- Posts
- 25,603
Or however it's spelled. I have absolutely no short term memory it seems.
DRxBlue said:
Drx Blue! April 10, 2002
- Thread starter KillerMuffin
- Start date
Rumple Foreskin
The AH Patriarch
- Joined
- Jan 18, 2002
- Posts
- 11,109
Hi Doc,
It’s tough to critique the third chapter of a story w/o having read the first two. Therefore, I’m going to treat your post like a stand-alone submission. When that gets me off target, just consider the source.
You said not to say anything about your use of uncapitalized “I’s”. So what I will mention is that some of them were capitalized, and some weren’t.
When it comes to spelling, I ran your piece through MS Word spell checker which caught some errors in hyphenation, but otherwise only came up with, “magickal” (magical) and “spasming” which according to my Webster’s, ain’t really a word. You might try to “show don’t tell” at this point. Describe, instead of just identifying what Lucy is seeing.
When it comes to punctuation, the main problem I noticed was a severe shortage of commas.
IMHO, you mention the passage of “time” way too much. For example, here are the openings to about nine consecutive paragraphs. “They cuddled naked for a while…,” “After a long, good-night kiss…,” “The next day…,” “The rest of the day…,” “As soon as…,” “Kevin shivered as Lucy kissed "Fido" and his balls long and lovingly.” “After they ran out of clothes…,” “Eventually…,” “Once again…,”
IMHO, the story is slow to the point of being tedious. The first three paragraphs read like an info dump thrown in to set up a short story. And the first sentence seemed pointless, generic, and bland. “The sun had set but it was still blue in the western sky, stars shone in the east as Ralph and Rose approached their cabin on Blue Lake.”
Here’s a suggestion. Begin with the lovers in bed and stopping whatever it is they’re doing when they hear the approaching boat. As they’re getting dressed, you can use either narrative or the couple in the boat to provide background.
Perhaps it was due to this being the third chapter in your story or maybe I just missed something, but I never got an impression of what the two main characters looked like.
Here’s a last suggestion which, like the rest of this critique, is no doubt worth even less than it cost you. Open with them in bed feeling each other up. This would let you slip in a LITTLE info about their looks and ages. This period could also be used to insert the paragraphs concerning the reasons they haven’t “gone all the way,” at least not yet.
Hope some of this helps.
Rumple Foreskin
It’s tough to critique the third chapter of a story w/o having read the first two. Therefore, I’m going to treat your post like a stand-alone submission. When that gets me off target, just consider the source.
You said not to say anything about your use of uncapitalized “I’s”. So what I will mention is that some of them were capitalized, and some weren’t.
When it comes to spelling, I ran your piece through MS Word spell checker which caught some errors in hyphenation, but otherwise only came up with, “magickal” (magical) and “spasming” which according to my Webster’s, ain’t really a word. You might try to “show don’t tell” at this point. Describe, instead of just identifying what Lucy is seeing.
When it comes to punctuation, the main problem I noticed was a severe shortage of commas.
IMHO, you mention the passage of “time” way too much. For example, here are the openings to about nine consecutive paragraphs. “They cuddled naked for a while…,” “After a long, good-night kiss…,” “The next day…,” “The rest of the day…,” “As soon as…,” “Kevin shivered as Lucy kissed "Fido" and his balls long and lovingly.” “After they ran out of clothes…,” “Eventually…,” “Once again…,”
IMHO, the story is slow to the point of being tedious. The first three paragraphs read like an info dump thrown in to set up a short story. And the first sentence seemed pointless, generic, and bland. “The sun had set but it was still blue in the western sky, stars shone in the east as Ralph and Rose approached their cabin on Blue Lake.”
Here’s a suggestion. Begin with the lovers in bed and stopping whatever it is they’re doing when they hear the approaching boat. As they’re getting dressed, you can use either narrative or the couple in the boat to provide background.
Perhaps it was due to this being the third chapter in your story or maybe I just missed something, but I never got an impression of what the two main characters looked like.
Here’s a last suggestion which, like the rest of this critique, is no doubt worth even less than it cost you. Open with them in bed feeling each other up. This would let you slip in a LITTLE info about their looks and ages. This period could also be used to insert the paragraphs concerning the reasons they haven’t “gone all the way,” at least not yet.
Hope some of this helps.
Rumple Foreskin
Ray Dario
Literotica Guru
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2000
- Posts
- 529
DRxBlue;
You have done a good job developing your two main characters. They both have personality a sense of being. I think this is one of the harder things to do in writing, and you have done it well with the two main characters.
Problems that I saw:
To much telling and not enough showing. You use the narrator as a character. I'm a good one to tell you about that because it is one of my biggest faults as well.
Another thing was something that I have heard refered to as a "lazy" plot. doesn't mean you were lazy writting it. It means that the story didn't have a well defined beginning, middle, and end. This could have been because it was a lone chapter in a series. If that's the case, ignore what I said. If not, if this story was meant to stand on it's own, then look at plot development. I didn't get a real good feel for what the story was really about at the end.
Stilted dialog. It may have just been me, but I didn't feel like the dialog flowed naturally. I can't put my finger on what the problem is, it just didn't feel right to me.
I would have also liked more elucidation about why these people lived such isolated lives and why a cousin was included in the household. Again this might be explained in previous chapters that I didn't read for this review. That's why it's so hard to critique a single chapter of a long work.
Again, you suceeded in building two interesting characters. I finished the chapter wanting to know more about them and that is, to me, a key factor in writing a story.
Hope this helps and is what you were looking for.
Ray
You have done a good job developing your two main characters. They both have personality a sense of being. I think this is one of the harder things to do in writing, and you have done it well with the two main characters.
Problems that I saw:
To much telling and not enough showing. You use the narrator as a character. I'm a good one to tell you about that because it is one of my biggest faults as well.
Another thing was something that I have heard refered to as a "lazy" plot. doesn't mean you were lazy writting it. It means that the story didn't have a well defined beginning, middle, and end. This could have been because it was a lone chapter in a series. If that's the case, ignore what I said. If not, if this story was meant to stand on it's own, then look at plot development. I didn't get a real good feel for what the story was really about at the end.
Stilted dialog. It may have just been me, but I didn't feel like the dialog flowed naturally. I can't put my finger on what the problem is, it just didn't feel right to me.
I would have also liked more elucidation about why these people lived such isolated lives and why a cousin was included in the household. Again this might be explained in previous chapters that I didn't read for this review. That's why it's so hard to critique a single chapter of a long work.
Again, you suceeded in building two interesting characters. I finished the chapter wanting to know more about them and that is, to me, a key factor in writing a story.
Hope this helps and is what you were looking for.
Ray
abashed-dreamer
Really Experienced
- Joined
- Jun 30, 2001
- Posts
- 132
DrxBlue,
I skimmed Chs 1 and 2 and read 3. I think it's a good story, and probably a focus on the lowest level of mechanics is not that useful. There is some nice humor is her talk/treatment of his penis. The telling is pretty 'fresh' in many ways, and conveys youth, yearning, first sexual feelings well. The young characters, at first, are developed. The 'ugly duckling' theme certainly can have its interest.
A couple points. There is perhaps, excessive detail at times; each piece of ignorance and discovery--about erections, for instance-- is told several ways and several underscorings of her amazement. The reader gets the point after a couple events and after hearing a couple of her thoughts or statements.
You might consider, also, abreviating certain events in your account. Just draw a line and pick up an hour or a day later. There is a sort of hour by hour, "log" (as in ship's) feel to it.
Some of the early tension seems to dissipate and not much replaces it. She feels unpretty and unloved; then suddenly she's appreciated and 'blooms' in a day or two. I saw no 'hitches' or halts. Their early misunderstandings are, in general, replaced by almost perfect understanding (exception, his laughing at her ignorance about erections.)
This is tied up with a kind of devolution of plot. Of course sexual exploration is somewhat predictable, from kiss to fondling, to masturbation-related things, etc, etc. But there is an absence of surprises; since this plot has been used 10,000 times, you have to vary it to maintain interest. Couldn't anything happen 'out of sequence'; could a step be skipped? could there be a 'hitch' so it's not so smooth?
Overall it was enjoyable, though I confess that the skimming was not just for lack of time.
Jack
abashed-dreamer
I skimmed Chs 1 and 2 and read 3. I think it's a good story, and probably a focus on the lowest level of mechanics is not that useful. There is some nice humor is her talk/treatment of his penis. The telling is pretty 'fresh' in many ways, and conveys youth, yearning, first sexual feelings well. The young characters, at first, are developed. The 'ugly duckling' theme certainly can have its interest.
A couple points. There is perhaps, excessive detail at times; each piece of ignorance and discovery--about erections, for instance-- is told several ways and several underscorings of her amazement. The reader gets the point after a couple events and after hearing a couple of her thoughts or statements.
You might consider, also, abreviating certain events in your account. Just draw a line and pick up an hour or a day later. There is a sort of hour by hour, "log" (as in ship's) feel to it.
Some of the early tension seems to dissipate and not much replaces it. She feels unpretty and unloved; then suddenly she's appreciated and 'blooms' in a day or two. I saw no 'hitches' or halts. Their early misunderstandings are, in general, replaced by almost perfect understanding (exception, his laughing at her ignorance about erections.)
This is tied up with a kind of devolution of plot. Of course sexual exploration is somewhat predictable, from kiss to fondling, to masturbation-related things, etc, etc. But there is an absence of surprises; since this plot has been used 10,000 times, you have to vary it to maintain interest. Couldn't anything happen 'out of sequence'; could a step be skipped? could there be a 'hitch' so it's not so smooth?
Overall it was enjoyable, though I confess that the skimming was not just for lack of time.
Jack
abashed-dreamer
DRxBlue
Literotica Guru
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2002
- Posts
- 891
Thanks very much!
Between what you've pointed out, and the technical treatises of KillerMuffin and Whispersecret, i've really learned a lot.
In the 2½ months i've been at Lit, i've had a chance to learn from some really brilliant writers. The flawed and bloated chapters i've completed are really the prequel of something i still might tackle.
It really wasn't meant to be pornography, in spite of the fact that porn is the subject of the story.
The narrator is the biographer of Lucy, and will be a big part of the story. His intrusions are deliberate. The characters have turned out to be "realer" than i intended them to be.
They're real to the point of being unruly, but i'll get a grip on them. i believe i'll find my voice.
Thanks for the time you've taken.
Doc Blue
Between what you've pointed out, and the technical treatises of KillerMuffin and Whispersecret, i've really learned a lot.
In the 2½ months i've been at Lit, i've had a chance to learn from some really brilliant writers. The flawed and bloated chapters i've completed are really the prequel of something i still might tackle.
It really wasn't meant to be pornography, in spite of the fact that porn is the subject of the story.
The narrator is the biographer of Lucy, and will be a big part of the story. His intrusions are deliberate. The characters have turned out to be "realer" than i intended them to be.
They're real to the point of being unruly, but i'll get a grip on them. i believe i'll find my voice.
Thanks for the time you've taken.
Doc Blue
cherrylips_au
Perhaps perhaps perhaps
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2002
- Posts
- 1,035
DRx Blue
I'm not sure what I can really add as I'm very much the beginner writer here.
I only read the 3rd chapter I enjoyed it but at times felt a little lost until things were explained later maybe if I had read the previous chapters it would have been clearer.
One of these things was the fact he was wearing Old Spice aftershave something I relate to my dad, but when you later said it was 1970 it clicked.
Also the fact the were both exploring sexual issues for the first time I wasn't sure of their ages but you mentioned that Kevin had been on dates before yet never been kissed, something I thought was a little strange if he so easierly kissed his cousin.
One thing I really liked was the way you described Kevin kissing Lucy on the porch all the different emotions and feelings that couldn't be expressed in other ways.
One thing I didn't like as it just seem to jolt the writing for me was with the anal exploration on Lucy, Kevin describes it as 'the old poop chute' then your next description in the following line has it called her 'little rosebud'.
I did enjoy the way you built up the characters I was left wanting to know more about them.
I'm not sure what I can really add as I'm very much the beginner writer here.
I only read the 3rd chapter I enjoyed it but at times felt a little lost until things were explained later maybe if I had read the previous chapters it would have been clearer.
One of these things was the fact he was wearing Old Spice aftershave something I relate to my dad, but when you later said it was 1970 it clicked.
Also the fact the were both exploring sexual issues for the first time I wasn't sure of their ages but you mentioned that Kevin had been on dates before yet never been kissed, something I thought was a little strange if he so easierly kissed his cousin.
One thing I really liked was the way you described Kevin kissing Lucy on the porch all the different emotions and feelings that couldn't be expressed in other ways.
One thing I didn't like as it just seem to jolt the writing for me was with the anal exploration on Lucy, Kevin describes it as 'the old poop chute' then your next description in the following line has it called her 'little rosebud'.
I did enjoy the way you built up the characters I was left wanting to know more about them.
DRxBlue
Literotica Guru
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2002
- Posts
- 891
Thank you cherrylips_au
i just accidently noticed that you'd posted. Sorry about the delay.
This chapter, when i sent it to KillerMuffin i decribed as "fairly standalone". It's meant to be a part of a larger work, so i neglected restating all the info from previous chapters.
i mostly wondered if the characters were coming off as real people to others besides me. You're the second person who like the "kissing paragraph". The other one was a woman too. i don't think guys get it. (even though i am one)i'm really glad i didn't axe that paragraph.
The main thing i've learned from writing these chapters is that they really weren't meant to be what's called "erotic" around here. i LOVE the stories i've read, but this tale is more about a "self invented female pioneer".
The fact that she becomes a multi-millionaire in the porn industry still won't make it "horny" enough to be good smut. There is a lot of that around here.
Thank...uuh..Who should i thank? i think God might be offended. Anyway, i love good smut.
One more thing, about Lucy's "anal thing". You said it was a shock. Well, she's been in my head as a character for over 30 years, and i was shocked.
It barely came across, but Lucy was freaking HORRIFIED! Neither of these two had ever heard of "anal sex". Not many had in 1970, it was a "secret".
i plan on wrapping up this episode, then referring to this whole 3 week incident obliquely in the main story, which will probably be in the "Novellas" section.
This was supposed to be just one chapter dealing with how Lucy learned to "deep throat". It turned into an extensive learning process for me, Lucy AND Kevin.
Thanks for your input and time. G'day mate.
i just accidently noticed that you'd posted. Sorry about the delay.
This chapter, when i sent it to KillerMuffin i decribed as "fairly standalone". It's meant to be a part of a larger work, so i neglected restating all the info from previous chapters.
i mostly wondered if the characters were coming off as real people to others besides me. You're the second person who like the "kissing paragraph". The other one was a woman too. i don't think guys get it. (even though i am one)i'm really glad i didn't axe that paragraph.
The main thing i've learned from writing these chapters is that they really weren't meant to be what's called "erotic" around here. i LOVE the stories i've read, but this tale is more about a "self invented female pioneer".
The fact that she becomes a multi-millionaire in the porn industry still won't make it "horny" enough to be good smut. There is a lot of that around here.
Thank...uuh..Who should i thank? i think God might be offended. Anyway, i love good smut.
One more thing, about Lucy's "anal thing". You said it was a shock. Well, she's been in my head as a character for over 30 years, and i was shocked.
It barely came across, but Lucy was freaking HORRIFIED! Neither of these two had ever heard of "anal sex". Not many had in 1970, it was a "secret".
i plan on wrapping up this episode, then referring to this whole 3 week incident obliquely in the main story, which will probably be in the "Novellas" section.
This was supposed to be just one chapter dealing with how Lucy learned to "deep throat". It turned into an extensive learning process for me, Lucy AND Kevin.
Thanks for your input and time. G'day mate.
