Does Grammar Matter?

[Carnevil9]

I admit that I am a grammar snob. I'm just wondering if that is a good thing, or a bad thing.

When I read a post with horrendous grammar, I tend to dismiss the opinions of the author as the ravings of an uneducated pinhead. Am I wrong to do that? It it unfair of me to expect my fellow posters to know the difference between there, their, and they're?

Is it possible that someone unschooled in the dainty art of stringing words into properly formed sentences might still have something worthwhile to share with us, and worth my time to read? Or am I correct to dismiss their (not "there") blitherings out of hand?

If they can get their (not "they're") point across, why should I care if they violate every rule in the book? A good point is a good point, despite the haphazard structure of their tortured constructions, isn't it?

Or does the non-standard elocution so inhibit the average reader's ability to absorb their thesis that they should be ostracized, until and unless they can learn to follow the rules so long and carefully established for discourse between educated personages?

I'm just asking. Any thoughts?.......Carney

 

[NoJo]

I admit that I am a grammar snob. I'm just wondering if that is a good thing, or a bad thing.

When I read a post with horrendous grammar, I tend to dismiss the opinions of the author as the ravings of an uneducated pinhead. Am I wrong to do that? It it unfair of me to expect my fellow posters to know the difference between there, their, and they're?

Is it possible that someone unschooled in the dainty art of stringing words into properly formed sentences might still have something worthwhile to share with us, and worth my time to read? Or am I correct to dismiss their (not "there") blitherings out of hand?

If they can get their (not "they're") point across, why should I care if they violate every rule in the book? A good point is a good point, despite the haphazard structure of their tortured constructions, isn't it?

Or does the non-standard elocution so inhibit the average reader's ability to absorb their thesis that they should be ostracized, until and unless they can learn to follow the rules so long and carefully established for discourse between educated personages?

I'm just asking. Any thoughts?.......Carney

For me eloquence is more important than spelling, pronunciation or grammar

 

[Jailhouse]

I admit that I am a grammar snob. I'm just wondering if that is a good thing, or a bad thing.

Nothing is worth getting so picky or choosy about that you make other people feel bad about themselves for it. Sometimes that happens when someone gets too focused on the details (grammar) and not enough on the accomplishment (a story or expression of some kind). I think people often miss the point by zeroing in on minute details like grammar.

That having been said, I think grammar is very important. Expressing yourself is a matter of organizing your thoughts, and the language you use to organize those thoughts has rules and structure and boundaries. If you go outside those limits then you are asking the reader to figure out what you mean and to organize your thoughts for you... and that makes it harder to read your work. I think that strong grammar is a sign of an organized thinker, and I think that serious writers should strive to learn about proper grammar just as a painter learns about paint and a guitarist learns about string gauges. If you're a writer, grammar is your medium. In fact, any sort of linguistic expression benefits from organization and methodology.

 

[Weird Harold]

Is it possible that someone unschooled in the dainty art of stringing words into properly formed sentences might still have something worthwhile to share with us, and worth my time to read? Or am I correct to dismiss their (not "there") blitherings out of hand?

If they can get their (not "they're") point across, why should I care if they violate every rule in the book? A good point is a good point, despite the haphazard structure of their tortured constructions, isn't it?

Or does the non-standard elocution so inhibit the average reader's ability to absorb their thesis that they should be ostracized, until and unless they can learn to follow the rules so long and carefully established for discourse between educated personages?

Grammar (and spelling) does matter, but my stupid, dyslexic fingers failed every class I ever took.

Still some of the wisest people I've ever known had the worst language skills.

It doesn't take me very long to sort out which people have ideas worth the trouble to translate into comprehesible language and which are just wasting screen phospors.

 

[NoJo]

Grammar (and spelling) does matter, but my stupid, dyslexic fingers failed every class I ever took.

Still some of the wisest people I've ever known had the worst language skills.

It doesn't take me very long to sort out which people have ideas worth the trouble to translate into comprehesible language and which are just wasting screen phospors.

Yes, you've made the point: The reason normative grammar and writing style are important is not because it makes you clever, it's almost the opposite: It makes you simpler to understand.

The distinctive spelling and punctuation you see in "youth" chatspeak is partly there because of the cliquiness -- it makes you part of a group to use and know a special language, IMHO

 

[hollyocks]

to me the person and what they're saying matters more than the spelling and grammar.... but it does help if you can understand what they are trying to say.... one of our tutors at college is brilliant in his subject, an accomplished artist, and he's fun to chat with.... but he can't string three words together properly, or spell them.

yes before you leap and scream, i don't use the caps button cos i'm a lazy little tart

 

[Lauren Hynde]

I admit that I am a grammar snob. I'm just wondering if that is a good thing, or a bad thing.

When I read a post with horrendous grammar, I tend to dismiss the opinions of the author as the ravings of an uneducated pinhead. Am I wrong to do that? It it unfair of me to expect my fellow posters to know the difference between there, their, and they're?

I'm one of those as well. In fact, it's not only grammar: I feel the same way about general sloppiness, the use of different-sized colours and fonts for no reason, the overuse of images, signatures that extend the window beyond reasonable, avatars, etc. The reasons are easy to understand, I think. If someone is this sloppy (and even disrespectful of others?) in presenting themselves and their ideas, how much thought could really have gone into those ideas? I'm a snob (and reportedly weird and pretentious.)

That's quite normal, though. The impressions we form of people in real everyday life are based on a numberless of small details that we don't even realise: what they look like, how they dress, posture, diction. Within seconds, you already have an opinion on someone you're seeing for the first time. Books have a cover for a reason.

The problem is that once you get over the initial aversion and listen to what is being said, it's not uncommon to find out that this person is actually someone interesting and with a worthwhile story, or that there is a reason for the some of the things that made you pre-judge him or her, or a million other things that override that first impression.

First impressions are important, but they're not the ultimate character-defining tool in existence. As Weird Harold said, it doesn't take long to find out who has worthy things to say despite their superficial "defects".

.......Carney

Argh! What the hell is that "......." thing? Now you must die a slow and painful social death.

 

[NoJo]

What you find out from those "superficial" things is their socio-economic background, which is not particularly important to me these days.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

yes before you leap and scream, i don't use the caps button cos i'm a lazy little tart

I think that's the thing exactly. Carney wouldn't think less of you for not using caps simply because "that's not proper". The immediate mental association would be "she's a lazy little tart": if she can't be bothered to hold the shift key once in a while, did she bother to think about what she said in this post?

(Don't take this personally, I'm just using what you said as an example of the first-impression process. I'm sure you have great things to say. )

 

[English Lady]

My grammar sucks, my typing sucks and my spelling sucks too.

I also don't take as much care in answering a thread on a forum as I would if say I were writing a letter to someone, or composing a story. So my posts are often typo/spelling mistake ridden and I know my grammar is nothing like it should be. I am learning,though.

I tend not to read txt spk psts. Simply because it gives me a headache but I will forgive a person the odd "U" instead of "you" etc etc.

Life is too short to be so picky, but I'm a lazy so and so, so I would say that

 

[hollyocks]

I think that's the thing exactly. Carney wouldn't think less of you for not using caps simply because "that's not proper". The immediate mental association would be "she's a lazy little tart": if she can't be bothered to hold the shift key once in a while, did she bother to think about what she said in this post?

(Don't take this personally, I'm just using what you said as an example of the first-impression process. I'm sure you have great things to say. )

but i am a lazy little tart

 

[NoJo]

but i am a lazy little tart

you'd never have guessed it from your posting rate

 

[hollyocks]

you'd never have guessed it from your posting rate

i'm also a prick teasing flirt

 

[NoJo]

i'm also a prick teasing flirt

See? When you're motivated, you're not really lazy.

 

[hollyocks]

See? When you're motivated, you're not really lazy.

motivated... that's a new word for it

 

[Lauren Hynde]

What you find out from those "superficial" things is their socio-economic background, which is not particularly important to me these days.

Not necessarily, Joe. When I referred to the way people look and dress, I was thinking more of the way you carry your clothes than what those clothes are. You may have perfect skin and your eyes may give out an impression of being a dufus. It all comes down to a sense of sloppiness. And that has nothing to do with socio-economic background.

 

[hollyocks]

Not necessarily, Joe. When I referred to the way people look and dress, I was thinking more of the way you carry your clothes than what those clothes are. You may have perfect skin and your eyes may give out an impression of being a dufus. It all comes down to a sense of sloppiness. And that has nothing to do with socio-economic background.

so does my avatar and dress sense say i'm a lazy prick teasing tart ?

 

[NoJo]

Not necessarily, Joe. When I referred to the way people look and dress, I was thinking more of the way you carry your clothes than what those clothes are. You may have perfect skin and your eyes may give out an impression of being a dufus. It all comes down to a sense of sloppiness. And that has nothing to do with socio-economic background.

Come to England and be cured of all that

 

[Lauren Hynde]

so does my avatar and dress sense say i'm a lazy prick teasing tart ?

No. Only the prick teasing tart bit. Actually, it adds some conflicting senses to the first impression, because it shows a highly motivated drive that isn't compatible with the lazy thing.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Come to England and be cured of all that

I hear wonders about NHS.

 

[Aurora Black]

Nothing is worth getting so picky or choosy about that you make other people feel bad about themselves for it. Sometimes that happens when someone gets too focused on the details (grammar) and not enough on the accomplishment (a story or expression of some kind). I think people often miss the point by zeroing in on minute details like grammar.

I agree with Jailhouse. Of course, grammar is lovely and important, but it isn't everything. There are times when an author has a point to make in his/her work and a "perfect" expression of the idea in mind just won't do. Then, I believe, the author has the option to break away from the rules and stay true to the story no matter what.

 

[hollyocks]

No. Only the prick teasing tart bit. Actually, it adds some conflicting senses to the first impression, because it shows a highly motivated drive that isn't compatible with the lazy thing.

ok i lied about the lazy... i'm just a rebel

 

[NoJo]

ok i lied about the lazy... i'm just a rebel

from the waist down, I guess

 

[hollyocks]

from the waist down, I guess

no love... the whole thing... what you see is what you get

 

[Liar]

Argh! What the hell is that "......." thing? Now you must die a slow and painful social death.

Says the girl littering the thread with little green grins.