Dixie Chicked again.

[sweetnpetite]

Casino ejects Ronstadt over 'Fahrenheit' praise
Tuesday, July 20, 2004 Posted: 0419 GMT (1219 HKT)


LOS ANGELES, California (Reuters) -- Singer Linda Ronstadt was thrown out of the Aladdin casino in Las Vegas on the weekend after dedicating a song to liberal filmmaker Michael Moore and his movie "Fahrenheit 9/11," a casino spokeswoman said Monday.

Ronstadt, who had been hired for a one-show engagement Saturday night at the Las Vegas Strip casino, dedicated a performance of "Desperado" to Moore and his controversial documentary, which criticizes President Bush and the U.S.-led war in Iraq.

That dedication angered some Aladdin guests who spilled drinks, tore down posters and demanded their money back, said casino spokeswoman Sara Gorgon.

"We had quite a scene at the box office," she said.

About a quarter of the 4,500 people in the audience got up and left before the performance had finished, Gorgon said.

Before her concert, Ronstadt had laughingly told the Las Vegas Review-Journal that she hoped that the casino performance would be her last.

"I keep hoping that if I'm annoying enough to them, they won't hire me back," she was quoted as telling the newspaper.

A statement issued by the Aladdin said Ronstadt had been "escorted out of the hotel" just after her performance and said the performer would "not be welcomed back."

"Ms. Ronstadt was hired to entertain the guests of the Aladdin, not to espouse political views," the casino said.

Ronstadt was not immediately available for comment.

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/07/19/ronstadt.reut/index.html



And the Repbublican party is apparently proud to have a constituancy that behaves so badly.

 

[cloudy]

I gotta disagree with you here, SnP.

The casino is, I assume, privately owned, and they can hire, not hire, or fire anyone they choose. Their decision was mostly likely based on what was best for their business.

Not agreeing or disagreeing with any of her remarks, but I don't think the casino should be flamed for making what is probably a business-based decision.

Just like the deal with Whoopi. If Slim-fast felt that it was not in their interests to keep her on as a spokesperson, then it's their right to let her go.

The people who make those remarks, right or wrong, just need to consider the possible consequences, right or wrong.

Business is business. And, before I'm flamed for being a neo-con, which seems to be the thing to do these days, I'm not talking about a person's right to say what they like. I'm talking about a privately held business' right to make their own decisions about who will and who will not represent their company.

 

[sweetnpetite]

This is the thing that gets me in all of this. These people trash the hotel and casino, spill there drinks and generally behave teribly because she expressed a political/artistic opinion that they apparently disagree with.

And she is the one in the wrong.

I guess as long as they stay in there miserable codependant mariages and escew the use of birth control and remain prudently prudish about sex, their decorum and maners in public don't really matter. They can still consider themselves to be moral and patriotic. (Personally, I find destruction of property the absolutly best way to expess my good morals and patriotism.)

And because capitalism and free enterprise is the highest ideal of democracy, there bad behavior is simply their way of expressing their dissatisfaction that an entertainer is also an artist who expresses her dissatisfaction with words rather than riot. Forgive the paying customers. Boot the singer.




Those rock stars should be ashamed of themselves.

 

[KarenAM]

Much as the behavior of the crowd as the casino is appalling and sadly typical of the culture these days, I have to agree with Cloudy. The effort against the Dixie Chicks by Clear Channel was an effort to prevent their work from being played on the public airwaves, which are (in theory) publically owned and which Clear Channel (in theory) is borrowing provided they act in the public interest (in theory).

The casino is private property and has a right to hire and fire as they please, provided they comply with applicable laws in hiring and firing (they can't fire her because she's a woman, for example, or because she holds her particular political views). Ronstadt (whose work I adore) might have a claim against them for violating her right to free speech while at the workplace, but this could be countered by the casino, who could argue that she was inciting a riot while working for them, which I don't think would be covered by Ms. Ronstadt's 1st ammendment rights.

It's that old public vs. private issue. And the customers, bigots and buffoons though they may be, are still the reason the casino is able to stay in business. Putting up with asshole customers is an unfortunate but real part of capitalism, which the casino is designed to benefit from.

 

[sweetnpetite]

I gotta disagree with you here, SnP.

The casino is, I assume, privately owned, and they can hire, not hire, or fire anyone they choose. Their decision was mostly likely based on what was best for their business.

Not agreeing or disagreeing with any of her remarks, but I don't think the casino should be flamed for making what is probably a business-based decision.

Just like the deal with Whoopi. If Slim-fast felt that it was not in their interests to keep her on as a spokesperson, then it's their right to let her go.

The people who make those remarks, right or wrong, just need to consider the possible consequences, right or wrong.

Business is business. And, before I'm flamed for being a neo-con, which seems to be the thing to do these days, I'm not talking about a person's right to say what they like. I'm talking about a privately held business' right to make their own decisions about who will and who will not represent their company.

Sure they have that right.

But I am far more disgusted by the behavior of the customers than that of the artist.

I'm also rather disgusted by people who get mad when artists behave like artists rather than as mindless 'entertainers' entertaining the mindless masses. You don't become an artist or a performance artist if you don't feel strongly and have oppinions about things. And you don't create anything but crap if all you want to do is not offend anyone. Meaning and substance after all are far to controversial.

Also, i think there is a proper way to express your displeasure and unhappyness over some words somebody said. The scorn should be heaped on the consumer, but instead, the almighty buck dictates that their worst behavior be completly pandered to.

 

[cloudy]

This is the thing that gets me in all of this. These people trash the hotel and casino, spill there drinks and generally behave teribly because she expressed a political/artistic opinion that they apparently disagree with.

And she is the one in the wrong.

I guess as long as they stay in there miserable codependant mariages and escew the use of birth control and remain prudently prudish about sex, their decorum and maners in public don't really matter. They can still consider themselves to be moral and patriotic. (Personally, I find destruction of property the absolutly best way to expess my good morals and patriotism.)

And because capitalism and free enterprise is the highest ideal of democracy, there bad behavior is simply their way of expressing their dissatisfaction that an entertainer is also an artist who expresses her dissatisfaction with words rather than riot. Forgive the paying customers. Boot the singer.




Those rock stars should be ashamed of themselves.

You disappoint me. I posted a rational, civil answer, and was met with nasty sarcasm.

Sad.

 

[sweetnpetite]

Putting up with asshole customers is an unfortunate but real part of capitalism, which the casino is designed to benefit from.

Ahh, capitalism. The real God of the religious right.

 

[lucky-E-leven]

You disappoint me. I posted a rational, civil answer, and was met with nasty sarcasm.

Sad.

I think that was being written as your post went up, hon.

It's not normally her way to reply back like that.



~lucky

 

[KarenAM]

Sure they have that right.

But I am far more disgusted by the behavior of the customers than that of the artist.

I'm also rather disgusted by people who get mad when artists behave like artists rather than as mindless 'entertainers' entertaining the mindless masses. You don't become an artist or a performance artist if you don't feel strongly and have oppinions about things. And you don't create anything but crap if all you want to do is not offend anyone. Meaning and substance after all are far to controversial.

Also, i think there is a proper way to express your displeasure and unhappyness over some words somebody said. The scorn should be heaped on the consumer, but instead, the almighty buck dictates that their worst behavior be completly pandered to.

I couldn't agree more, SnP. Traditionally the counterweight to customer excesses like these has been morality and values. But since Americans have become so spoiled in the past half-century or so, these things are on the wane here. As a result, instead of the healthy expectation that being a paying customer entitles one to respect and service, many people today feel it entitles them to abuse businesses and more particularly their employees. I wonder if any of the mob considered that the people who would have to clean up their mess were probably earning minimum wage and might not have shared Ms. Ronstadt's opinons about the movie?

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I totally agree with Cloudy. The Casino didn't hire her to be a pundit, they hired her to entertain guests. If one quarter of my guests were offended by her choosing to make a political statement then I would have had her escorted off the premisises too. A lot of people go on vacation to get away from politics and anything else that reminds them of the rat race they deal with most days of the year. Slapping them in the face with it is probably not a wise move for a bussiness that stakes its fortunes on being an escapist fantasy land, as Vegas does.

About half this contry thinks Moore is an anti-american traitor. As a buissness owner it behooves you not to aggravate ANY portion of your customer base. But in a country as polarized as this one is right now, politics should be anathema in places offering entertainement, unless you have a commidian who's schtickt is political commentary.

She exercised her right to free speech, but she did so on the stage the casino provided. The Casino is totally within their rights to remove the stage from her. She is still free to express her views, but will have to find an alternate stage to do so.

-Colly

 

[cloudy]

I couldn't agree more, SnP. Traditionally the counterweight to customer excesses like these has been morality and values. But since Americans have become so spoiled in the past half-century or so, these things are on the wane here. As a result, instead of the healthy expectation that being a paying customer entitles one to respect and service, many people today feel it entitles them to abuse businesses and more particularly their employees. I wonder if any of the mob considered that the people who would have to clean up their mess were probably earning minimum wage and might not have shared Ms. Ronstadt's opinons about the movie?

I'm sure they never thought of it.

I worked in retail management for years (clothing), and I am still appalled at the way customers treat the people working. It's worse than chattel and peons. We existed solely to bow to their every whim, and I wish I had a dime for every time I was told they'd "have me fired" for not managing to pull the correct size, color, etc., out of my ass.

 

[sweetnpetite]

You disappoint me. I posted a rational, civil answer, and was met with nasty sarcasm.

Sad.

Cloudy,

I appologize.

I started typing that 'response' after typing the first post, and before yours appeared. It is honesly a coincidence that we addressed the same points. The sarcams was not aimed at you, and I feel bad that it ended up looking like it was.

PLEASE believe me, I hadn't read your post before typing my second one. My scorn was not meant to be aimed at you. In fact it was probably subconciously directed at my neo-con boyfriend who I am currently mad at about an unrelated topic, but who I know would certainly take the side against singers voicing oppinions. Or agaisnt one of those mean radio personalities he listens too.

I'm sorry. Please forgive me.

 

[cloudy]

Cloudy,

I appologize.

I started typing that 'response' after typing the first post, and before yours appeared. It is honesly a coincidence that we addressed the same points. The sarcams was not aimed at you, and I feel bad that it ended up looking like it was.

PLEASE believe me, I hadn't read your post before typing my second one. My scorn was not meant to be aimed at you. In fact it was probably subconciously directed at my neo-con boyfriend who I am currently mad at about an unrelated topic, but who I know would certainly take the side against singers voicing oppinions. Or agaisnt one of those mean radio personalities he listens too.

I'm sorry. Please forgive me.

No problem. I realized that Lucky was probably right when I read her post.

No apology necessary.

 

[sweetnpetite]

No problem. I realized that Lucky was probably right when I read her post.

No apology necessary.

good, lets have a hug then.

:hugs:

 

[cloudy]

good, lets have a hug then.

:hugs:

*HUG* back.

Things have been a little tense around here lately as far as politics go....people too quick to jump to conclusions, so I apologize, as well.

 

[sweetnpetite]

*HUG* back.

Things have been a little tense around here lately as far as politics go....people too quick to jump to conclusions, so I apologize, as well.

appology accepted.

Let's hug some more

 

[Liar]

I totally agree with Cloudy. The Casino didn't hire her to be a pundit, they hired her to entertain guests. If one quarter of my guests were offended by her choosing to make a political statement then I would have had her escorted off the premisises too. A lot of people go on vacation to get away from politics and anything else that reminds them of the rat race they deal with most days of the year. Slapping them in the face with it is probably not a wise move for a bussiness that stakes its fortunes on being an escapist fantasy land, as Vegas does.

Bottom line as I see itr is very simple.

The artist has the rights to say whatever she wants, but should then face the consequences of the things she says. If she says things that upsets the guests as opposed to entertain them, which she was hired to do, she is not fulfilling the end of her deal with the casino, and can therefore be booted.

The guests however, dod not just complain, they resorted to petty hooliganism, which is embarrassing, unpretty and always wrong.

This reminds me of the Israeli ambassador who vandalised an installation in Stockholm this winter, because he found it antisemitic.

Express your opinions, peeps, but for chrissake, be civil.

#L

*ends speech and watches Cloudy and sweet hugging. Mmm.*

 

[Guest]

Thank you, Liar. The audience reaction was the most disturbing aspect of this news for me; the right or wrong of Rondstadt's comments do not matter in the aftermath. With the roles/actions reversed I cannot imagine throwing my cocktail at someone or tearing down their posters. Imagine two thousand people doing this in a 'civil' setting. That is the U.S. for me.

Perdita

 

[Colleen Thomas]

There will always be lightening rods in any crowd. those few who are not contnt to simply walk away. From what SnP posted it seems most of the folks that reacted simply left.

Unfortuneatly in this country right now the line in the sand has been drawn and people on either side become less open minded, less willing to debate, less tolerant and more prone to revolutionary response with each passing day.

Instigating a response has become dangerous, because there is a mob psycology at work. I have the gut feeling that spilling drinks & tearing down posters may seem extremly minor compared to things that will happen as we gt closer to November.

It is however wise to point out that most who severely disapproved simply left. It is always the most vocal and socially unacceptable fringe minority who get the publicity. The old saying is the squeaky wheel gets the grease, in the case of media coverage in the days leading up to the elction it will be ever more true that the finges will garner the most air time.

-Colly

 

[Guest]

Colly, just fyi, the article I read today said the attendance was 4500; half walked out the other half booed, etc. Doesn't sound like a 'fringe' to me. But yes, it's frightening how this type of action might grow in the next few months. P.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Colly, just fyi, the article I read today said the attendance was 4500; half walked out the other half booed, etc. Doesn't sound like a 'fringe' to me. But yes, it's frightening how this type of action might grow in the next few months. P.

I would think booing is acceptable. If half of 4500 walked that still leaves 2250. I can't imagine it wouldn't have been called a riot if all of them were showing their ass. It seems more likely to me that just a few were acting a fool and the rest simply bystanding. I could of course be wrong, but from experience, it seems to me that's usually the case.

-Colly

 

[Virtual_Burlesque]

. . . Singer Linda Ronstadt was thrown out of the Aladdin casino in Las Vegas on the weekend after dedicating a song to liberal filmmaker Michael Moore and his movie "Fahrenheit 9/11," a casino spokeswoman said Monday. . .

. . . Ronstadt, who had been hired for a one-show engagement Saturday night at the Las Vegas Strip casino, dedicated a performance of "Desperado" to Moore and his controversial documentary, which criticizes President Bush and the U.S.-led war in Iraq. . . .

Firstly, Ronstadt has a right to make any political statement she chooses, however most professionals usually restrict the voicing of their own opinions to times when they are not being paid as a performer. That is, unless voicing those opinions are part of their act. [For example, one might not expect Jon Stewart to refrain from making political jokes, about either party, since that is the basis of his career, nor would one be surprised hearing Barbra Streisand, who has long-held, publically-proclaimed, political opinions, to make no comment.]

I have never heard that Linda Ronstadt was on any cutting edge of political comment. She has a right to her views, but her public came to hear her performance.

On the other hand, she was fairly safe. It was a one-night contract. Even if the incident stopped the show, she would not be risking any loss of revenue.

. . . A statement issued by the Aladdin said Ronstadt had been "escorted out of the hotel" just after her performance and said the performer would "not be welcomed back.". . .

The Casino got its full performance, before tossing out Ronstadt. That "escorted out of the hotel" could just as easily indicate protecting the singer against unruly fans, for which the Casino would be liable. It does sounds much nastier in print, as though she were being ejected.

. . .Before her concert, Ronstadt had laughingly told the Las Vegas Review-Journal that she hoped that the casino performance would be her last.

"I keep hoping that if I'm annoying enough to them, they won't hire me back," she was quoted as telling the newspaper. . .

Even before the performance, Ronstadt was not in an accommodating mood. If her words are to be taken at face value, she was out to sabotage the performance.

It begins to look to me, more like a feud of some sort between Ronstadt’s people and the Casino management. "Fahrenheit 9/11" was chosen as a current flash-point, and it was used to punish the Casino.

Most performers know from exactly what demographic their fans originate. I would not be surprised to learn that Ronstadt's fans are of a more conservative, older, group. This is not a valuable group for a popular singer to look to for success and high earnings.

Quite possibly, this whole hoopla was devised to generate enough publicity amongst a more contemporary demographic. You may be certain, if Linda Ronstadt releases a new album that is much different, and in some ways more contemporary, within the next few months.

I know, it’s terrible to be so sceptical!

http://www.addis-welt.de/smilie/smilie/schild/61.gif

 

[Wildcard Ky]

Entertainers run this risk when they choose to make politics part of their show. They know this, but some still feel the need to do it.

I love John Mellencamp, and have gone to his concerts before. I don't agree with a lot of his politics, but that never comes into play. His shows are about his music. I've never heard him mention anything political at all. I'll gladly pay to see him again. If he starts bringing politics into the show, I won't go back. I don't want politics mixed with my entertainment.

I think the casino summed it up quite nicely with this quote:

"Ms. Ronstadt was hired to entertain the guests of the Aladdin, not to espouse political views," the casino said.

Here's something interesting I found on her. It's an article from the San Diego paper. Apparently she's been doing this tribute to Moore for awhile:

"My career has befuddled other people, and it's befuddled me," admitted Ronstadt, 58, who finds her fans are polarized by her nightly on-stage salute to "Fahrenheit 9/11" filmmaker Michael Moore.

"I've been dedicating a song to him – I think he's a great patriot – and it splits the audience down the middle, and they duke it out," she said.

Now here's the one I found really interesting:

"This is an election year, and I think we're in desperate trouble and it's time for people to speak up and not pipe down.
It's a real conflict for me when I go to a concert and find out somebody in the audience is a Republican or fundamental Christian. It can cloud my enjoyment. I'd rather not know."

I can't believe no one is picking up on this quote from her. If her position were reversed and she said that if she found out her audience was full of Libs and sinners (pick your own "sin" that conservatives don't like), the media would be all over her for being intolerant of others.

Here's a link to the whole article:
sign on San Diego

 

[shereads]

Casino ejects Ronstadt over 'Fahrenheit' praise
Tuesday, July 20, 2004 Posted: 0419 GMT (1219 HKT)


LOS ANGELES, California (Reuters) -- Singer Linda Ronstadt was thrown out of the Aladdin casino in Las Vegas on the weekend after dedicating a song to liberal filmmaker Michael Moore and his movie "Fahrenheit 9/11," a casino spokeswoman said Monday.

Ronstadt, who had been hired for a one-show engagement Saturday night at the Las Vegas Strip casino, dedicated a performance of "Desperado" to Moore and his controversial documentary, which criticizes President Bush and the U.S.-led war in Iraq.

That dedication angered some Aladdin guests who spilled drinks, tore down posters and demanded their money back, said casino spokeswoman Sara Gorgon.

"We had quite a scene at the box office," she said.

About a quarter of the 4,500 people in the audience got up and left before the performance had finished, Gorgon said.

Before her concert, Ronstadt had laughingly told the Las Vegas Review-Journal that she hoped that the casino performance would be her last.

"I keep hoping that if I'm annoying enough to them, they won't hire me back," she was quoted as telling the newspaper.

A statement issued by the Aladdin said Ronstadt had been "escorted out of the hotel" just after her performance and said the performer would "not be welcomed back."

"Ms. Ronstadt was hired to entertain the guests of the Aladdin, not to espouse political views," the casino said.

Ronstadt was not immediately available for comment.

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/07/19/ronstadt.reut/index.html



And the Repbublican party is apparently proud to have a constituancy that behaves so badly.

Good luck with this, sweetie. I won't get involved, except to thank you for bringing this to my attention. I'm sending Ronstadt a congratulatory e-mail. Courage.

 

[shereads]

I can't believe no one is picking up on this quote from her. If her position were reversed and she said that if she found out her audience was full of Libs and sinners (pick your own "sin" that conservatives don't like), the media would be all over her for being intolerant of others.

Maybe not, Wild. The media hardly made a peep over one of the more repellant aspects of the Dixie Chicks episode: a young woman was fired from her job at a record company, for disagreeing with an internal e-mail bashing the Dixie Chicks. Did you hear a lot of media outrage over her firing?