Discussion: Icingsugar

[KillerMuffin]

Here's a little tale from a wonderful author who has recently joined us in the SDC.

From the Author

Yello.
Here is The End of the Ice Age, an erotic romantic story set some 50 years into the future, so I guess it could also count as science fiction.

*Watch out, it's pretty long, and only a bit of nastiness in the last half. Love looong build-ups.
* I've already spotted a handful of typos that my spell checker and manual editing missed. No need to point them out. I got them covered. (I hope)

Apart from your general impressions and nitpicking there are a few things I'd like to get your opinion on:

1. I've taken some liberties with traditional writitng structure and grammar to give some passagaes what I (from my high horses ) would like to think of as a more poetic flow. Did it work, did I flunk, or did I just overdo it?

2. Did the story "work"? Were there logical flaws in the plot, of in the "technical" details, like the time aspects or other such things that I, after staring myself blind at it, can't spot?

3. As a guy, the description if certain female aspects were kind of difficult. Told from a woman's point of view you get to know her quite intimately.

4. There is not a "cock" or "cunt" in sight. Did this make the grunting session too lame, or did the somewhat elaborate workarounds do the job?

Thanks for your time.

/Ice - not from the Ice Age

 

[CWatson]

1. I've taken some liberties with traditional writitng structure and grammar to give some passagaes what I (from my high horses ) would like to think of as a more poetic flow. Did it work, did I flunk, or did I just overdo it?

I didn't even notice. I'm not sure if that's a bad thing or not, but personally, I'd say that means it worked. Unless you're reading Fitzgerald or Shakespeare, you aren't really supposed to notice the language. And the structure of the story made plenty of sense to me.

2. Did the story "work"? Were there logical flaws in the plot, of in the "technical" details, like the time aspects or other such things that I, after staring myself blind at it, can't spot?

Again, it all made sense to me. I loved the little bits of veracity ("What's 9/11? Who's Britney Spears? Whoa, the Gap commercials recognize me by my retina pattern? --Oh, wait, that's Minority Report). In my mind, those make or break a story; they show the writer's investment. Structurally it was sound; emotionally it made PLENTY of sense.

I have just one question, though: after forty years of complete solitude, how come Lori's still sane? She's clearly a strong-willed woman (I think poor Jonathan is half scared of her), but... I'm not sure that's enough. Forty years of Cold Sleep--well, sans the sleep part... Fifty years of Cold _____, with only one's own voice echoing off the walls of one's own mind, changes a person, and Lori... doesn't seem to have changed all that much. Then again, demonstrating that change may be a needless complication; the story right now is neat, simple, and elegant, and there's no reason it oughtn't stay that way. But that's my personal problem spot.

3. As a guy, the description if certain female aspects were kind of difficult. Told from a woman's point of view you get to know her quite intimately.

Sorry, can't help you there. As a guy, I have the same problem. /I/ think it works, but you should probably seek an opinion from someone who doesn't have any Y chromosomes.

4. There is not a "cock" or "cunt" in sight. Did this make the grunting session too lame, or did the somewhat elaborate workarounds do the job?

Considering the way Lori was feeling and talking, I think you might as well have gone with it. (And it's quite strange to saying that; so many people USE those words that I more often get sick of them.) Cock, and to a greater extent cunt, have raw, animal ideas in my mind; but then again, Lori has raw, animal ideas in HER mind too.

You've got fucking and making love and having sex in there. As the story stands, Lori's use of, ah, poetic metaphors are stressing the making-love aspect, but I think The Reader will buy it if you make her more into the fucking part.

All in all, I really enjoyed this story; I love the visionary power of all sci-fi, and your story has that; the characters work well (though I thought Carrie was a little bland--or perhaps blonde--and predictable) and the emotional content is satisfying. If this is your standard quality of work, you have a new fan right here.

 

[Guest]

Sugar, I’ll try to address your concerns, but mostly give you my impressions—as a writer, as a writer of erotica, as a woman, and as a human being. I think you’ll soon see why I’ve delineated these terms.

First and most impressive to me— I wonder if you realize how profoundly you’ve addressed certain aspects of human identity, communication and Love. The huge metaphor that began to fall into place right away was the act of speaking and listening—the power it has between two people if done honestly and with good will. (I can’t help but think of Pedro Almodóvar’s last film “Talk to Her”, which centers around two men with lovers in comas, one of whom spends four years talking to his girl. I won’t go into it here, but if you don’t know the work and are interested I’ll PM you, or better yet, just rent it and watch it.)

Also profoundly expressed (whether you intended it or not, babe) was the notion of realities, not unlike that we experience online in the world of cyber, e.g., cyber friends, lovers, sex, work, etc. But right off, after the reader knows what’s going on plot-wise, you state—merely about Lori’s pleasure in waking up, that for her it is—“A paradigm shift of the consciousness from one universe to the other in a heartbeat.” That was a brilliant line for me, exactly what we do at least once each day. That line accompanying Lori’s first waking up after 50+ years placed the common occurrence anew in my mind and made me realize, as if for the first time what an amazing thing it is to “wake up” each morning.

Later when you state about Jonathan that, “He gave her days”, the reality is extraordinary given the actual stasis in which Lori existed. That’s one of the most exquisitely simple sentences I’ve ever read.

I’ll fault you a bit in a while re. characterization, but right now I want to say how lovely you handled Jon. when he begins to react to the reality of Lori awake. He says, “When they told me that you had been listening, I wasn’t sure how to react. I mean, a part of me always hoped that you could hear.” In my own mundane reality I would be overwhelmed to have a man say that to me. In the fantastic reality of your story it works too, haha. And then—good lord—you have him say, ”You became my own secret diary.” Sugar! isn’t that what lovers are for each other? (Please don’t tell me you weren’t conscious of what you/your characters were really saying.)

And in the same vein, when Lori tells Jon., ”It was only when you were in exactly the right place that I could see what you really looked like. And that happened, like, once maybe?” Phew! Again, not to beat this to a wordy pulp, but in my reality it’s just like that—seeing or hearing someone at a profoundly intimate level is not all that common.

When the two are first lying together in bed Lori enjoys the simplicity of ‘keeping someone company’. I love that simple idea. It’s the essence of companionship whether in love or friendship. You captured it perfectly in such a simple scene and moment. I’m being effusive, Sugar, because your piece has made me connect things—connect life with art, life with fiction, your story’s reality with mine. That’s quite a feat, and uncommon on Lit. IMO.

OK, now for some criticism (come down off that horse, please). Given the real profundities you capture in this story, I really wish the characters were more fleshed out, had been given particularities, e.g., of their histories. It’s great that Lori wakes up and finds out her prince charming is real but we’re told, and would simply imagine the reactions ourselves as readers, about her family and friends being dead. It would have been more believable to have Lori go through this acceptance process (the grief the doctor mentions), or be told she’d gone through it over a period of time, before encountering Jon. and going into a flying fuck. This missing reality is awkward and incredulous for me.

Jon. too—we know nothing about him besides the fact that he lurks in a basement. He turns out to be a nice, considerate guy, why should we think that makes sense given the little we know of him?

I’m sorry I have to say that the sex scenes just didn’t rise to the occasion for me, except in one small part. They read awkwardly compared to the rest of the piece, didn’t have the same flow. Offhand I think the language was too simple, not quite structured enough in the phrasing and whole sentences. I rather wish it had more of the style of the passages in italics.

The climax was the best, really well done. I don’t mean the actual sexual climax but the three paragraphs beginning with “And he did. Lori clung…” and the two following. Superb.

One last compliment, especially for those who don’t like long stories, I couldn’t believe when I got to the end that it was the end. It did not read “long”, not at all. In fact, I daresay you have the core here of a novella, perhaps even a novel.

Regards as ever, Perdita

 

[Icingsugar]

CWatson:

I have just one question, though: after forty years of complete solitude, how come Lori's still sane? She's clearly a strong-willed woman (I think poor Jonathan is half scared of her), but... I'm not sure that's enough. Forty years of Cold Sleep--well, sans the sleep part... Fifty years of Cold _____, with only one's own voice echoing off the walls of one's own mind, changes a person, and Lori... doesn't seem to have changed all that much. Then again, demonstrating that change may be a needless complication; the story right now is neat, simple, and elegant, and there's no reason it oughtn't stay that way. But that's my personal problem spot.

And a very valid point it is. I did try to implement that a bit, but I might have been a little bit too restrictive with that.

The idea was that while regular sleepers did not have to get used to stuff like moving, sensing, eating and walking, (since they, mentally, just went for a short nap), Lori would have to rediscover all those sismall, simple things. Think of a blind person being able to see again. It's overwhelming, but if he have had eyesight earlier in life he'll get the hang of it soon enough.

The point regarding the state of Lori's mind was probably a bit overlooked. What I had meant to portray was that she had indeed gone insane in there, and that it was the company of Jonathan that had brought her back to her senses. That she had gone bonkers and back during those first 40 years should probably had been made clearer.

You've got fucking and making love and having sex in there. As the story stands, Lori's use of, ah, poetic metaphors are stressing the making-love aspect, but I think The Reader will buy it if you make her more into the fucking part.

I was really wondering about that. In fact I did considered...well...cunting up the sex a bit in language and style when it got really sweaty. But my attempts failed rather miserably IMO. So after a while I said 'Oh, fuck it.' and submitted it as-is.

All in all, I really enjoyed this story; I love the visionary power of all sci-fi, and your story has that; the characters work well (though I thought Carrie was a little bland--or perhaps blonde--and predictable)

Yah. 'twas intentional actually. Everyone was too damn serious about everything. I needed a little break from that. So I threw in a threw in a stereotype bubblegum girl just for the heck of it. But an intellegent bubblegum girl, mind.


That was a heap of interresting pointers. Thanks!
/Ice

 

[Icingsugar]

Perdita:

Wow. What can I say? I'm just glad to be read. I guess pepole are pepole, and if the experience of one can be connected with the experience ofanother, well, then my work is done. Seriously, I'm thrilled you liked this little fairy tale of mine.

I can’t help but think of Pedro Almodóvar’s last film “Talk to Her”

Oh yes, I've seen it. Very worthwhile, intellegent movie. As always when it comes to Almodóvar. However, it was an entirely different movie that gave me the idea fo conscious stasis, the corny action fluff of Demolition Man.

you state—merely about Lori’s pleasure in waking up, that for her it is—“A paradigm shift of the consciousness from one universe to the other in a heartbeat.” That was a brilliant line for me, exactly what we do at least once each day.

Thanks! I love to collect little mundane details like that. It's like a hobby, little things mused over while driving, or on the john, or whatnot. Expect more in the future...

(Please don’t tell me you weren’t conscious of what you/your characters were really saying.)

Um. I know what those things could mean. But I didn't read THAT much into it.

OK, now for some criticism.

Thankyouthankyouthankyou!

Given the real profundities you capture in this story, I really wish the characters were more fleshed out, had been given particularities, e.g., of their histories.

Hehe. I have enough fleshing out in my notes for this story to write a bovel on. It would be a slow and boring novel, but it would span into the 70 - 80 000 would count, if I let those characters roam free.

It’s great that Lori wakes up and finds out her prince charming is real but we’re told, and would simply imagine the reactions ourselves as readers, about her family and friends being dead. It would have been more believable to have Lori go through this acceptance process (the grief the doctor mentions), or be told she’d gone through it over a period of time, before encountering Jon. and going into a flying fuck. This missing reality is awkward and incredulous for me.

Well, exactly that was covered in one of the "ice age" italic sections, that she had already, in stasis, understood that she had left all those people behind. But I think you're right, that was passed too briefly, and it would be more beliveable if that loss had come back to haunt her now again.


Jon. too—we know nothing about him besides the fact that he lurks in a basement. He turns out to be a nice, considerate guy, why should we think that makes sense given the little we know of him?

Concerns me too, he seems very much to be just another regular Joe. Growing up, dating girls, behaving normally. And then he sits an hour or two every day in a grey room beside a stasis pod reading the news to it? And being branded a 'loonie' in the process? Thinkingh about it, it doesn't really make sense.

Maybe I should retell this story from the perspective of Jonathan, as a part 2?

I’m sorry I have to say that the sex scenes just didn’t rise to the occasion for me...I rather wish it had more of the style of the passages in italics.

Point taken. Honestly, I havern't seen the difference in style you mention, but that's probably just because I've been staring into the sun for too long, if you know what I mean. I'll go back and ponder that a bit.

In fact, I daresay you have the core here of a novella, perhaps even a novel.

Like I said, writing stories is an elaborate construction work for me. You haven't seen my pile of notes. Pay me by the word and this will be an epos. Itmight suck, but an epos it would be.

/Ice - humbled, thankful, all that jazz

 

[damppanties]

1. I've taken some liberties with traditional writitng structure and grammar to give some passagaes what I (from my high horses ) would like to think of as a more poetic flow. Did it work, did I flunk, or did I just overdo it?

I loved the poetic flow. The first page was an absolute pleasure to read. Apart from the instances Perdita pointed out, some of the ones I liked -

The years were gnawing on her childhood.

Time before him had seen eternal, or like nothing. A week. Or a million years.

Most of the sentences in the story point out to real, everyday life in a very subtle way.

After a while I started counting the kisses. Four thousand. Almost four thousand kisses.

Those lines grabbed me. I could feel her desperation.

2. Did the story "work"? Were there logical flaws in the plot, of in the "technical" details, like the time aspects or other such things that I, after staring myself blind at it, can't spot?

No idea about things technical, but there wasn't anything I noticed. Which means someone else would be better to tell you about that.

3. As a guy, the description if certain female aspects were kind of difficult. Told from a woman's point of view you get to know her quite intimately.

I can't believe they were difficult to write. They came out so wonderfully. I personally loved the italicised passage which started - In the Ice Age she had tried to remember. It was beautiful.

4. There is not a "cock" or "cunt" in sight. Did this make the grunting session too lame, or did the somewhat elaborate workarounds do the job?

It didn't make the sex too lame but it made it more romantic. Now that I think about it, it doesn't go too well with Lori's need to fuck but at that time I didn't think so.

One little hitch I encountered. ...as the pistoning continued. - I don't like the use of 'pistoning' in there. It fills my mind with metal and oil and things I wouldn't want in the middle of a sex scene. But that's just my personal POV, so feel free to ignore it.

Some other comments-
I didn't like Jonathan being called the Boy. Especially as that's the name given to him by Lori. I would have preferred some other word there - Guy perhaps. The problem I have with Boy is that it makes me visualise Jon as a very young (maybe immature) person. And then, in contrast, it makes Lori seem old. I am not sure what age Lori is supposed to be but asking about Britney Spears would mean she's not very old. Young people do not call other young people boys.

Characterisation - I didn't really mind the absence of background for the characters. There's only so much you can do in a short story without making it too long. The problem I have is that I couldn't quite get Jon's character. Even though this is a story about Lori, I wish you'd spent more time with Jon, or the both of them interacting.

A very good read. I'm glad I read it.

 

[Icingsugar]

About a Boy

dp:

I didn't like Jonathan being called the Boy. Especially as that's the name given to him by Lori. I would have preferred some other word there - Guy perhaps. The problem I have with Boy is that it makes me visualise Jon as a very young (maybe immature) person. And then, in contrast, it makes Lori seem old. I am not sure what age Lori is supposed to be but asking about Britney Spears would mean she's not very old. Young people do not call other young people boys.

Ah, you have discovered one of the logical "technical" flaws that I knew had to be lurking around in there. I had mentioned that Lori was 20 years old when she was filed away, but that passage was cut out during editing. I should had put that info in somewhere else though.

The Britney reference is supposed to be that of an adult wondering if that silly starlet that MTV had branded the next Madonna had lived up to the hype (With her and my own personal little wish that she has fallen into oblivion 50 years from now). Maybe didin't work all that well, but was only meant to be a short amusing snippet anyway.

With Lori as 20 (physically) and Jonathan 17 when they first meet, I think calling him a boy would work. First impressions do indeed last. I'm still my mom's little toddler, y'know. Also bear in mind that she is in fact mentally 72 years of age. Although she has not lived 50 of those years in any normal fashion, I think that that should account for some kind of elderly approach. Maybe a reflection when they meet for the first time after her wakeup that her Boy had grown into a Man (and then stuck to that, except in the flashback sections) would had helped?

All of this made Lori really tricky to write. One part just out of her teens with all the boldness and needs of the young ones, one part old and wise albeit not very experienced, and one part just really fucked up, on the brink of collapse from decades of solitude.

I think the last part did not shine through as well as I had intended to.


Btw, "Guy" has almost the same ring to it as "Dude" in my ears. A bit corny for the situation. Dunno, it could be a cultural thing. Like when I recently discovered that you should NOT call an american woman cute, while that works as a compliment in other parts of the world.

 

[damppanties]

Re: About a Boy

With Lori as 20 (physically) and Jonathan 17 when they first meet, I think calling him a boy would work. First impressions do indeed last. I'm still my mom's little toddler, y'know. Maybe a reflection when they meet for the first time after her wakeup that her Boy had grown into a Man (and then stuck to that, except in the flashback sections) would had helped?

Yes. That would definitely help.

Also bear in mind that she is in fact mentally 72 years of age. Although she has not lived 50 of those years in any normal fashion, I think that that should account for some kind of elderly approach.

All of this made Lori really tricky to write. One part just out of her teens with all the boldness and needs of the young ones, one part old and wise albeit not very experienced, and one part just really fucked up, on the brink of collapse from decades of solitude.

I don't agree about Lori being mentally 72. What makes us age mentally are our experiences. While I agree that mental aging is nothing physical, I think that it has to do something with life and our living it. If you have been shut up in a glass box for 50 years, how exactly would you age mentally? Okay, so she's able to think and Jonathan comes and talks to her - but I don't think that would account for much.

While reading the story I felt Lori is somewhere in her 20s (inspite of the 50 year sleep). I still think so. Mentally. Physically. All over. Inside out.

Btw, "Guy" has almost the same ring to it as "Dude" in my ears. A bit corny for the situation. Dunno, it could be a cultural thing. Like when I recently discovered that you should NOT call an american woman cute, while that works as a compliment in other parts of the world.

It might be a cultural thing, but we refer to young men as guys - as opposed to 'MEN' (read over the hill and not at all worth looking at twice).

 

[Pure]

Hi Icing S
First your questions, then some remarks.

1. I've taken some liberties with traditional writitng structure and grammar to give some passagaes what I (from my high horses ) would like to think of as a more poetic flow. Did it work, did I flunk, or did I just overdo it?[/]

I think the deviations in grammar are OK, they work, but as to their content, see below.


2. Did the story "work"? Were there logical flaws in the plot, of in the "technical" details, like the time aspects or other such things that I, after staring myself blind at it, can't spot?

It's unclear to me why the dr. hasn't heard of the volunteers, whereas Andy knows they've been there for years.

If, as you say in a posting, she's supposed to have gone insane, that isn't clear. It seems there were hard times, then loneliness.

The math seems to work. She 'died' at 20. Awakes that way, mentally and physically, 52 years later. He turned up ten years+ ago at, say 17, and so is 27 in the narrative. I partly agree with Damp, however, that having him be the 'Boy' is a bit odd after the meeting, and perhaps his *manliness* and age and her reaction to it (i.e, not having seen it before) could be clearer. In some ways he's in her mind like a late teen.

3. As a guy, the description if certain female aspects were kind of difficult. Told from a woman's point of view you get to know her quite intimately.

Well, you have more female details than male ones. At the same time there is a bashful female-ish narrator.

4. There is not a "cock" or "cunt" in sight. Did this make the grunting session too lame, or did the somewhat elaborate workarounds do the job?

The avoidance of those words could be pulled off, though it's hard to see why 'pussy' makes it through. The workarounds are pretty standard romance stuff of a couple decades ago, and the current more decorous presentday ones.

===

First, let me say I've got a good impression. The writing is excellent, almost professional. But also that I'm not much of a 'popular romance' reader (i.e. enjoyer); I read a few of Charlotte Vale Allen's romances 15 years back (and they were more explicit than you are) and kind of enjoyed them. I've read 'classic romances', novels like Jane Eyre, Wuthering Heights.
So you may take what I say and toss it, if you like.

A popular romance esp. a short story is a genre piece, and hence there's a formula. You've heard the line that 'romance novels' (Harlequines) are to women, what porn is to men. Both are formulaic, and the pulishers have specific guidelines as to what MUST happen. (A friend of mine writes them, and there are even guidelines for the sub genres, like Western romance, historical romance).

So already in love with her 'savior'/reader, she's going to meet him (outside her pod), fuck him and be with him forever.

The question, aside from these main events is the element of reader surprise. That's what keeps them selling. I personally didn't see much of that, although you hook the reader nicely in the futuristic/techie stuff, the 50 year later world, etc.

I do like the SF element; the long time in the pod, is like the long time someone's out of the country, but, handy for you, there's no ageing. I like the 'reading' thing; it's novel, and parallels the letter writing separations (or where one's letters don't get through) of some older, slower romance.

Back to romance. Let's say that's a given. Your narrator is a little coy for my taste, the 'him' and 'himself' for cock or even penis. It's a little less pervasive for her genitals, and I'm not sure why, i.e., pussy, slit. Here's the odd part: the narrator is very much in the woman's mind, privileged access and all that; knowing past and present. But in language the woman is quite direct: "Fuck me" etc. So a coy narrator gives this effect:

//She said, "Fuck me, fuck me, god yes, harder". He pushed *himself*into *her.* She felt *him *inside her.//

Usually a narrator/author is more or equally at home with nasty words, compared to any character.

I'm not sure the solution to this, except in the old books,

/ The reader, it's hoped, will not be offended by a frank account of what she said next:

'Fuck me O God."

But [narrator returns] after that he took her and possessed her in a splendor of light./

If you want my opinion, have the narrator be a little less vague: some of the simpler four letter words, and the latinisms --penis--etc are rife in the romance novels, now.

=====
Since this post is long enough, I'll comment on the sex scen in the following post.

Keep up the good work. Yes, I agree it have novelistic possibilities,and you have the ability, there.

Best,
J.

 

[Pure]

Pt 2, comments, sex scene, some para breaks added.

In case you wish detailed editorial feedback, and an explanation for the middling evaluation (at least one other shares.) Hey, and I realize sex scenes are a bitch; every decent writer finds that!

[verbatim]
He sat down beside her again. And without further ado, continued where he'd left off.

"Nnnngh!" she went, as Jonathan sucked one of her nipples into his mouth, massaged the other one and slid a finger along the length of her slit. Lori bit her lip and shut her eyes as the finger parted her pussy lips {{note the streetwise diction; straight porno talk}}and slowly entered her. It slid in easily, and Jonathan started to move it{{'it' cannot be named; old romance convention; not entirely prevalent now}} in and out of her.

With each movement, a small high-pitched moan escaped Lori's lips. It was really happening. For the first time since a long and cold Ice Age, she had a man inside of her {{change of diction to coy romance}}. And it was Him. And it felt every bit as wonderful as she had thought it would feel. {{The "And" "And" is a little to cutesy for me. "wonderful" is a let-down word. The effect is that the 'romance' is now like a Seventeen story; very innocent.}}
----------
[...]
Now the need to once again find that heaven was burning inside of her. She wanted to cum {prefer 'come'; but why would a coy narrator say it?}}, wanted to remember what it was all about.

"Are you ready, Lori?" Jonathan suddenly whispered in her ear.

"Oh yes! Do it!" she panted, eyes closed, mouth open. {{'mouth open' is superfluous}}

"Do what Lori?"

{{This implicit request --obvious technique--explains the dirty talk, in part; this is a romance formula, get her to acknowledge raw sex, but it's hard to see why it's needed, considering how we know she talks, quite bluntly}}

"No, please don't tease me like that...just...uuh!" she groaned in disappointment as his finger pulled out of her. "Just do it...inside...now. Fuck...is that the magic word? Fuck me, please fuck me, fuck me, fuck me, fuck me..."

{{the words 'in disappointment' and 'of her' are superfluous}}


Her legs were already spread wide and she was slippery wet from the slow fingering. And suddenly Lori felt something {{coy}}pushing, parting, stretching, sinking in. Her eyes shot open, discovering Jonathan hovering above her, resting on stretched arms on each side of her head. She had not even noticed him move.

Loris gaze went down between her legs{{awkward; 'she gazed towards her mound'}}, where she could see how she literally{{meaning?? not figuratively??}} was getting more and more impaled, ever so slowly. But that was nothing compared to the sensations screaming up from her stretching vaginal walls. {{diction very medical, not romantic; "inner" if you want coy; or 'screaming up from her center.' }}

"Oh fuck, it's too much! You're so big!"

"Thanks, but I'm really quite average." he replied with a whisper. "You're just not used to this. It's been a while, remember?" {{second last sentence could probably be deleted}}

Remember? How could she ever forget? {{This is romance type writing: melodramatic}}

Pretty soon she was filled up with everything he had {VERY coy}}, and Jonathan slumped down on his elbows, lying on top of her. His chest pressed down on her breasts, his legs spread hers wide and his face was right above hers. {{lots of 'her' and 'hers'}}

"Are you ok?" he asked.

Lori just {{delete 'just'}}nodded. She tentatively tried contracting herself around the hard, warm rod inside of her. Felling {{feeling}}it stir sent small tingling waves in all directions. Jonathan stoked her cheek, kissed her briefly, before raising himself up on his arms again. Se {{He}} smiled an impish smile down at her. {{smiled a smile}}

"Hold on to something."

"What do you...ooh, fuck!"

Lori didn't get to finish what she was saying before Jonathan showed her exactly what he meant.

{{'Then she saw exactly what he meant'. Concise; we already know she didn't get to finish; you quoted her}}

He began pulling out, much faster than he had been pushing in. The tight slippery sensation of friction between his hardness and her softness was just incredible. {{'incredible' a lazy word}}

He pulled out so that only the head, and maybe another inch {{for the male audience}} was left inside her. Then he stopped, just long enough for Lori to realise that it was much nicer {{nicer?? teen-ish}}with him inside of her than like this.

Letting out a short gasp of his own, he pushed himself into her, before pulling out, even faster this time. It was the most intense thing {'thing' is lazy} that Lori thought was possible. Every push in was a heatwave all through her body. Every pull out a was different sensation, but mostly a wait for the next thrust. As the fucking intensified, she began to clench her buttocks to meet his thrusts.

{{Essentially you are into a pornographic degree of detail, if you're going to enumerate thrusts; a romance would abridge this a bit. --It's mostly guys who want this--e.g. inch by inch.}}

"You like this?" Jonathan asked her.

Wasn't that obvious? She was...fucking. She was being fucked. Fucked! For real!

{{Why does the narrator say 'fuck' a lot, but earlier could only say 'everything he had'?}}

"Yes! I love it. I love you. Don't stop. Don't ever stop!"

"Want more?"

More? Was there more?! {{delete the first 'more'}}

"Oh, god yes. More, anything! Harder...fuck me harder!" [/i]

[end verbatim]
[rather nice climax deleted]
---

Overall, I agree with Perd. Mild-medium hot. It would perhaps be 'hotter' without some of the detail, if you want 'high romantic hotness.'

The main thing is that there is just not much surprise; limited freshness.

The writing is very competent, but has many inconsistencies, here.
Not so good as the earlier pages.

====
Overall, if you're still speaking to me. It's a very well written future-set romance story; you have the required talent and carefulness--with an editor-- to succeed at this.

Best,

J.

 

[CWatson]

Originally posted by Icingsugar
2. Did the story "work"? Were there logical flaws in the plot, of in the "technical" details, like the time aspects or other such things that I, after staring myself blind at it, can't spot?

--Oh yeah!

How exactly does your Cold Sleep work? I ask because the way cryogenic stasis works is this: The human body is slowly lowered to freezing temperature. Everything just freezes in place, perfectly preserved. Certain chemicals are also introduced so that, when all that water in the body freezes, it doesn't expand as much. The body can exist indefinitely if its frozen, but things aren't going to be great when they wake up if ice ruptures every cell.

Can someone REMAIN CONSCIOUS if they're frozen? Certainly nerve impulses would be shut down, because neutrotransmitters would be frozen in place and unable to cross the synapses between nerves. Since consciousness IS nerve impulses (biologically, at least), then... No, cryo-freeze and consciousness seem to be mutually exclusive.

Now, there's a simple way around this: your story doesn't have to use cryogenics, but instead a style of Cold Sleep where the body isn't completely frozen, just... I dunno, kinda slushy. Heck, maybe there was an error in the freezing process and Lori wasn't completely frozen, just 99% so. That would allow her to remain conscious.


~CWatson
(sci-fi geek)

 

[Icingsugar]

Re: Re: Discussion: Icingsugar

How exactly does your Cold Sleep work?

Maybe it is as you said, something went wrong withthe freezing process. However, that would probably mean that the working parts, nerve synapses and brain cells - would had aged, right? Maybe the explanation is somewhat more freewheelin than that, and barking up the New Age tree claiming that her soul was still awake, but still tied to her body.

Thuth is: I haven't got the foggiest.

 

[Icingsugar]

Pure:

It's unclear to me why the dr. hasn't heard of the volunteers, whereas Andy knows they've been there for years.

Carelessness on my behalf. THe fact that it was Andy who mentioned them and not the doctor does not mean that she didn't know about them. Could had been made clearer with a line or two.

If, as you say in a posting, she's supposed to have gone insane, that isn't clear. It seems there were hard times, then loneliness.

and that, for years on end, was what drove her bonkers, along with the realisation that everyone around her might be dropping dead out there while she remained. Also not elaborated enoug in the story.


Your narrator is a little coy for my taste, the 'him' and 'himself' for cock or even penis.

The narrator is a very confues puppy alltthe way through, jumping from opinionless describer to piggybacking of Lori's inner dialog with herself, to positioning itself somewhere in the in-between.

If you want my opinion, have the narrator be a little less vague: some of the simpler four letter words, and the latinisms --penis--etc are rife in the romance novels, now.

Point taken. And notes taken from your second sex-only post. 'twas educational.

 

[Pure]

Hi Icing,

I appreciate your response.

In thinking over the story and issues, I wanted to convey an appreciation, in an overall way, that mentions the real strength of the story, from a romantic pt of view: the long time in the pod, the loneliness, the stories. The connection of souls.

That structure can make for a fine romance, full of longing and fulfillment. That is a nice way in which the sci fi details dovetails with the setting up of the romance.

Following out that logic, the story should NOT, later on, get down to the grunting, so much. The sex scenes should have *less detail and leave more to the imagination-- forget your male porn audience. Emotional details would be more important than 'another inch in'. While the ending is necessarily upbeat, a tiny bit of qualification wouldn't hurt; that he has much to learn about her, for instance. (It's fairly clear that she'd know him far better than he, her.)

Good luck.

J.

PS. It occurs to me, if you want a suggestion for a longer version, draw out the time from awakening, to full mental competence and deliberate fuck. Have her, say, be half better, for a while. Or lapsing in and out of coma-like state and him doing more reading. Let him wonder about the outcome (will she always be a bit of a zombie? will she always have spells of being just 'not there but back in the pod'?). Things just get too clear to her in a hurry (partly a function of the short story).

Now it's sorta like; Ok, I'm back, got all my marbles, if you'll just update me on technology, more current events, and let me work out for a couple days we'll get to fucking like minxes.

 

[champagne1982]

bump!

!