Discussion: Citadel

KillerMuffin

Seraphically Disinclined
Joined
Jul 29, 2000
Posts
25,603
We have a newer member with us today, one that's very articulate about what sorts of things to look for!



Citadel said:
Hello,

I was, to say the least, happy that my first attempt at an erotic story was accepted. I would like to nominate it for discussion....in fact, to be honest, dissection.

It is the first of 5 parts (the second now written and submitted but the last 3 only in planning) and I have two specific favours to beg:

1) Comment on the general story, use of English etc

2) The story is going to become much, much more dark before the protagonist is defeated by his own loss of control. At what point does horror overcome erotica (if any)....and can a story which begins as "mind control" continue as such if it moves into horror?


http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=93899


Thank you for taking the time to comment, as I hope to now on some of the other threads within this one.

Citadel
 
Citadel,

Congratulations on your first post. It’s an imaginative read. Those were the warm fuzzies. Now for the cold pricklies.

IMHO (in my humble opinion), your story needs a lot of nuts and bolts, technical work. The biggest problem I noticed concerned POV (point of view) shifts. POV is a tough item for even experienced writers to master but it’s vital.

As for your story, IMHO, it might be a good idea to spend more time introducing and describing Sam, who appears to be both your protagonist and narrator.

I only had time to cover about half the story. With luck, that’ll be enough to give you a feel for what I’m talking about. Other, better, critiquers will probably come along and give you some clearer and more useful information.

Remember, everything I’ve written is strictly my opinion, not the gospel of writing. If you decide some of it may be useful, great. If not, well, as I told Dr. Mabeuse, at least the price is right.

Rumple Foreskin

--

It had started with a coffee cup 8 (EIGHT) years ago.

A casual thought that he hated the pattern (OF WHAT?) had caused it to shatter and, through his shock, he realised he had somehow caused it. It took a lot of practice to make his ability focused, (TO FOCUS HIS ABILITY?) to move from spontaneous manifestation to well-honed tool, but over the summers Sam had mastered it. (THERE’S NOTHING WRONG, TECHNICALLY, WITH ENDING A SENTENCE WITH AN “IT”. HOWEVER, IT’S USUALLY BEST TO END SENTENCES WITH ANOTHER WORD WHENEVER POSSIBLE, ESPECIALLY IF, AS WITH THE FIRST SENTENCE, “IT” ENDS ONE SENTENCE AND THEN BEGINS THE NEXT ONE. THE LAST “IT” IN THE PARAGRAPH MIGHT BE AVOIDED SEVERAL WAYS, HERE ARE TWO SUGGESTIONS. “…OVER THE SUMMER, SAM HAD MASTERED THE ART.” AND “…BUT SAM MASTERED IT OVER THE SUMMER.”)

At school it had been all juvenile pranks. The exploding pen on a friend, the slight move of an enemy's foot to make them fall down the step. Always self-serving, mildly sadistic, but limited by the imagination of a youth too caught up in acne to dream of his potential. (IMHO, THE LAST TWO SENTENCES ARE INCOMPLETE. IT’S NOT FATAL AND YOU CAN PROBABLY GET AWAY WITH IT, BUT SOME READERS, AGENTS, AND EDITORS MAY ASK, “WHERE’D THE SUBJECT GO?”)

Things change and of course so did he. Today he's the well-built but average-looking man she barely noticed as she sat down on the train, her mind numbed by the fatigue of yet another commute to the office and (SILENTLY MAKING?) yet another resolution to find a better job. He noticed her and that was all that mattered.

She was twenty, or there about, same as him if her looks were any indication. They may lie about her age but they were clear about one thing, she was an understated beauty. Her eyes were about to be opened to new horizons but even now they shone with a potent cocktail of curiosity, intelligence and compassion.

Her white shirt was too tight to conceal even her tiny breasts and he could see they made an impression not only on her clothing but also on the man sitting opposite. Noted for future use.

A respectable, office-length black skirt guarded her legs from all but the briefest exposure. It could not shield her rear when she had walked on board, however, and he knew from the panty-line that she was wearing skimpy underwear. He had a closet rebel and that appealed to him more than anything her blonde, short hair or other physical charms could invoke. She was perfect because she less than pure herself, though he wondered where the guilt came from sometimes, given that he felt so little and thought so much.

The train set off and the commuters engaged in their ritual sleeping, chatting and vacant looks out of the window. There were many pointless stops en route but he knew that office girls only ever (OMIT “ONLY EVER” ADD “ALWAYS”) went to Lexington, in fact it was the only city that still seemed to be hiring, so he had all the time he could want.

He closed his eyes and saw the carriage clearer. (MIGHT ELABORATE. CLEARER THAN WITH HIS EYES?) His arms were crossed under his jacket (THIS MAY BE A UK/US THING, BUT THAT IMAGE ESCAPES ME.) and his hands were free to roam - as the feet under the swan or the lambs to the slaughter. (HUH?)

She felt a soft current of air pass over her chest (UNLESS THERE’S SOME EXPLANATION GIVEN ABOUT HOW HE KNOWS, “SHE FELT A SOFT CURRENT…,” IT WILL SEEM LIKE A POV SHIFT FROM HIM TO HER SINCE IT TELLS US WHAT SHE’S FEELING.) as he felt her nipples harden in response. Under his jacket his hands were working now, as feet to the swan, as lambs to their ultimate slaughter.(YOU USED ESSENTIALLY THE SAME LINE IN THE LAST PARA. AND IF STILL CONFUSES ME.) She continued to read her paper so he knew he had the pressure just right, enough but not too much so that it could not be explained by normal convection. He had built himself a special place to enjoy and his erection pleased him.

The man opposite her was easily in his fifties and practised at not letting his attraction to strangers become apparent. It showed only to the expert (“THE EXPERT” IS THE NARRATOR, I’D SUGGEST CHANGING “THE” TO “AN”) at the covert study of others and it gave him an idea.

Sam focused on her skirt that had rode (RIDDEN) up a little as she crossed her legs. She held he thighs together to shield her modesty but it was the flash of calf that had attracted her admirer. The train rocked from side to side and Sam timed himself with the motion, peeling her hem back minutely with ever movement (OF THE TRAIN?).

Her admirer noticed and became less discreet despite himself. He could not see up her skirt but at this rate she may just expose herself for a microsecond when she uncrossed her legs. It was the kind of sexual-tension he loved at the office, he needed to survive his own sex-poor marriage and he desired just because he could. (ANOTHER POSSIBLE POV SHIFT PROBLEM. IF THE NARRATOR DOESN’T KNOW ALL THIS ABOUT THE OTHER GUY, IT’S A POV SHIFT. IF HE DOES KNOW, HOW DID HE GAIN THE KNOWLEDGE? YOUR OPENING SEEMED TO BE IN THIRD PERSON LIMITED BUT NOW IT READS LIKE THIRD PERSON OMNISCIENT. POV IS A TOUGH NUT TO MASTER. WHEN YOU DO, GIVE ME SOME POINTERS.)

The paper shielded her (IS SHE HOLDING THE PAPER IN FRONT OF HER LEGS? THAT SEEMS AWKWARD.) but even if she had seen how her skirt had moved up she would have had no concern. She knew that man was eyeing her up and she had the situation well in hand, (NEW SENTENCE) in fact she loved the power she felt in transfixing (AS SHE TRANSFIXED) him. Had he been younger and cuter maybe she would have played along but this guy was not worthy.

Sam waited until she uncrossed her legs and then added just a tiny extra pressure to her inner thighs. It was all over in a second and she felt nothing but embarrassment at her failure, (TO DO WHAT?) quickly slamming her thighs together again and focusing on her paper with renewed earnest(NESS). Damn the train, she thought.

Her admirer had struck gold. That brief flash of white panties, moulded around her pussy lips, would be the subject of masturbation for days to come. He would elaborate on that small moment, creating a fantasy that would allow him to use his wife as a surrogate and have this woman again and again. He chuckled inside at his victory whilst Sam chuckled at the erection he saw in the man’s pants.

Share and share alike, Sam thought. She was composed again but still began to watch the man opposite…had he seen or not? It was hard to tell from his face but her pride wanted to know. The train rocked and she noticed that the zipper on his pants was undone. He seemed too engrossed in his book to have noticed and, in fact, he was so intent on maintaining this (OMIT “THIS” ADD “A”) poker-face facade that he hadn't.

His sensible, wifely underwear made her giggle inside. He was no big-boy either, judging from the size of the bulge now exposed, and she pitied the poor woman who had to suck on that just to keep the kids happy. (PROBABLY ANOTHER UK/US THING, BUT THAT’S A NEW PHRASE TO ME.) She relaxed, even, and (OMIT “EVEN, AND”) proud to know that (OMIT “THAT”) she could turn men on without trying. As if that idiot could ever get his hands near me, she thought.

Time passed and Lexington was only 12 minutes away by now. Sam had been looking at his lack of reflection in the window, or maybe that was his lack of reflection on the man he saw in the window? Whatever, it was not like he was going to be judged.

His thoughts turned to her again. Both her and her (“HER” THREE TIMES IN SIX WORDS) admirer were now back to their commuter routine and he had given them a couple of minutes to settle into the tedium. Then he put his arms inside his jacket again and closed his eyes.

He saw her skirt, covering her crotch, as clearly as is he had been knelt (KNEELING) before her. The skirt may (MIGHT) prevent him seeing (WHAT?), at this stage, but no barrier could shield the contents from his mind. No audio, no visual and no smell aided him but slow, steady and perfect precision allowed him to place his tongue between the skirt and her panties.

Inside his mouth he pushed his tongue slightly further into his right cheek and he (OMIT “HE” SORRY ABOUT BEING DENSE, BUT WHAT DOES HIS TONGUE BEING IN HIS RIGHT CHEEK HAVE TO DO WITH HIM FEELING HER PANTIES YIELD?),felt the panties yield before him. He watched with satisfaction as he saw her freeze (OMIT “HE SAW HER FREEZE” ADD “SHE FROZE.) THEN DO A LITTLE RE-WORDING AND BEGIN A NEW SENTENCE.) and then pressed just a little more, moving his tongue up and down her clitoris. (HOW? HIS TONGUE IS IN HIS CHEEK.)

At first she thought her panties had dug into her but now the only thing she knew was that she felt like she was being licked between her legs. (“SHE” IS USED FOUR TIMES IN THAT TWENTY-NINE WORD SENTENCE, “HER” THREE TIMES.) She looked down quickly but could see nothing but herself, (NEW SENTENCE) that man was still over there and (OMIT “AND” BEING NEW SENTENCE) this was getting scary now. Was she having a fantasy or a seizure? What the hell was she meant to do now?

--
 
First, this was a very hard read, invovling alot of going back and re-reading. In fact I didn't feel comfortable commenting until I had had a good nights sleep on it.

Comments in caps, since that seemed the asiest way to do it after seeing it done that way :)
**********************

It had started with a coffee cup 8 years ago.
OK A BIT OF MYSTERY IS OK BUT THIS IS A LITTLE EXCESSIVE. 'IT' I RE READ THIS TWICE BEFORE REALIZING IT WAS BEST TO JUST READ ON A BIT. ALSO IT IS A FLASHBACK THINKG THAT COULD PROBBALY BE HANDELED BETTER PLACED A LITTLE FARTHER INTO THE STORY WITH MORE OF HIM REMEBERING OR MAYBE JUST ALOT LESS OF THE RECOLECTION OF HISM FIRST DISCOVERING THE POWER LEFT OFF


A casual thought that he hated the pattern ON THE COFFEE CUP? had caused it THE CUPto shatter
THIS NEEDS A MORE FULL BREAK THAN CONTINUEING ON INTO WHAT HE THOUGHT IF YOU ASK ME

and, through his shock, he realised he had somehow caused it. It took a lot of practice to make his ability focused, to move from spontaneous manifestation to well-honed tool, but over the summers Sam had mastered it.

TOO MUCH IT, SERIOUSLY ITS VERY CONFUSING. NOW THE WEIRD THING WHY JUST THE SUMMERS? FIRST i'M HTINKING HE CAN ONLY DO IT DURING THE SUMMER THEN i THINK YOU MEANT OVER THE YEARS THEN i'M STILL NOT SURE

At school it had been all juvenile pranks. The exploding pen on a friend, the slight move of an enemy's foot to make them fall down the step. Always self-serving, mildly sadistic, but limited by the imagination of a youth too caught up in acne to dream of his potential.

Things change and of course so did he. Today he's the well-built but average-looking man she barely noticed DIDN'T SEEM TO NOTICE? as she sat down on the train, her mind numbed by the fatigue of yet another commute to the office and yet another resolution to find a better job. He noticed her and that was all that mattered. SEEMS LIKE HEAD HOPPINH MAYBE MORE LIKE SHE SEEMED LIKE JUST ANOTHER COMMUTTER CAUGHT UP IN ETERNALHUNT OF R A BETTER JOB AMOUNGST THE BOREDOME OF THE DAILY GRIND? SOMETHING TO KEEP IT FROM BEING HEAD HOPPING?

She was twenty, or there about, same as him if her looks were any indication. They may lie about her age but they were clear about one thing, she was an understated beauty. Her eyes were about to be opened to new horizons but even now they shone with a potent cocktail of curiosity, intelligence and compassion.

THEY THEY THEY .. IT MAKES IT HARD TO READ AND THATS A HECK OF ALOT FOR SOME MOIST MEMBRANE TO BE SHOWING IF YOU ASK ME.

Her white shirt was too tight to conceal even her tiny breasts and he could see they made an impression not only on her clothing but also on the man sitting opposite. Noted for future use.

NOTED FOR FUTURE USE. IN ADDITION TO BE ING A JARRING FRAGMENT IT JUST, i DON'T KNOW, I REALLY DISLIKE IT THOUGH

A respectable, office-length black skirt guarded her legs from all but the briefest exposure. It could not shield her rear when she had walked on board, however, and he knew from the panty-line that she was wearing skimpy underwear. He had a closet rebel and that appealed to him more than anything her blonde, short hair or other physical charms could invoke. She was perfect because she less than pure herself, though he wondered where the guilt came from sometimes, given that he felt so little and thought so much.

ISN'T THAT READING ALOT INTO PANTY CHOICE? AND WHAT EXACTLY IS OFFICE LENGTH? MY EXPERIENCE SAYS AROUND THE KNEE, AND THAT DOES SHOW OFF LEG SO THIS KINDA HUNG ME UP.
The train set off and the commuters engaged in their ritual sleeping, chatting and vacant looks out of the window. There were many pointless stops en route but he knew that office girls only ever went to Lexington, in fact it was the only city that still seemed to be hiring, so he had all the time he could want.

He closed his eyes and saw the carriage clearer. His arms were crossed under his jacket and his hands were free to roam - as the feet under the swan or the lambs to the slaughter.

SERIOUSLY i DON'T GET THE SWAN AND LAMB THING AND IT DOES NOTHING BUT CONFUSE ME. AND THE ARMS UNDER THE JACKET THING, i THINK AFTER READING IT ABOUT 5 TIMES THAT i KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN ... IF I AM RIGHT ITS SOMETHING MORE LIKE, HE PULLED HIS ARMS WITHIN HIS JACKET, HIDING ALL MOVEMENT OF HIS HANDS AND FINGERS FROM THE PRYING EYES OF THOSE AROUND HIM.

She felt a soft current of air pass over her chest as he felt her nipples harden in response. Under his jacket his hands were working now, as feet to the swan, as lambs to their ultimate slaughter. She continued to read her paper so he knew he had the pressure just right, enough but not too much so that it could not be explained by normal convection. He had built himself a special place to enjoy and his erection pleased him.

THE LAST SENTENCE CONFUSES ME AND i CAN'T FIGURE OUT WHAT EXACTLY IS MEANT


The train pulled into the station as she composed herself once more. Apart from the confused, delighted and totally awake face she wore she was once more just a commuter amongst the mass. Sam had cum all over his underwear again but hey, what else was not news?

He had withdrawn from her but nor before he took a loose strand of pubic hair into his mouth. He had decided that she was worth stage two and hair was the key to unlock that level, so he chewed it and felt her DNA enter his stomach.

UMM FELT HER DNA ENTER HIS STOMACH?

Sam left and entered the business world


*********
Sorry I meant t comment more on specifics, but a general thing is bugging me. Sometimes on a short story it gets way to hard to have too many characters. given the whole telekenetic/tele prescience/whatever thing, I think that might be ambitious enough of a hting without working in the observer.. He brought alot of awkwardsness and mind hopping into his mind, like the sexless thing, and all he really seemed to do for the story was increase thepronouns. Unless if I am wrong, he is not a re-occuring character, and basically disposable.

Personally this is not my cup of tea, probably one of the reasons it took a few reads, but it is an interesting idea, I just think its way toon confusing as is.

Also you say this is part of a 5 part seris? umm, it's only a lit page long, it might be better to write the whole thing if all the pieces are going to be comperable in length, that should work out to about 4 lit pages. a little long, but not too bad. I think 5 chapters for a relativelt not long work is a little over kill.

If the observer is cut out, that would make this section even shorter. Or maybe break it into less pieces, if the chunkcs aren't over a page, I don't really think they need to be broken, although somepeople will have a 42 chapter story made up all of 3/4th lit page chapters, which is just silly if you ask me.

Alex 756
 
It had started
This is fine. It's the beginning of a story. It starts, the story starts, the incidents depicted start...
with a coffee cup
And as that's the topic it's clear what 'pattern' and 'it' refer to in the next sentence. No need to change this (apart from '8' to 'eight').

had caused it to shatter and ... he had somehow caused it
The first 'it' is the cup, but the second 'it' is the shattering. Using 'caused' in front of both is misleading.

The 'summers' are fine. That's when he has time. The incomplete sentences are fine. They don't lack anything essential.

there about thereabout

They may lie about her age but they were clear about one thing, she was an understated beauty.
I don't follow this. They were clear... women were clear about one thing? Women are habitually clear about being understated beauties?

they shone with a potent cocktail
Cocktails don't shine: mixed metaphor, of shining eyes and a potent mixture. Her eyes can shine with intelligence etc. or they can have or show or contain a potent cocktail of etc., but as you have it it strains two images.

He had a closet rebel He was... Wait, no it isn't, but it reads like a typo. Try 'He had a closet rebel here'.

blonde, short hair short blonde hair

She was perfect because she less than pure herself, though he wondered where the guilt came from sometimes, given that he felt so little and thought so much.
(Missing 'was'.) What guilt? Her guilt, his? Guilt for what we haven't seen him do yet? How would feeling more increase guilt?

The feet of a swan move invisibly, like his hands, but they don't move far away, or hither and thither. Lambs move around and mill over things, but they don't do it for their advantage, and they're guided by someone else. Neither of these similes is right for what you mean, even individually, much less together and repeated.

The man opposite her was easily in his fifties Isn't he less than eight years out of school? You've been using 'he' and 'she' so often, neglecting his name Sam, that by this time we can assume it's a he-and-she story, and 'the man opposite her' is a variation on 'he'. So the age pulls us up short. and it gave him an idea It gave the man opposite an idea? You can't shift to a different 'him' without making it clear that you have.

had rode had ridden

If there's a 'flash of calf' then she's hardly in any danger from the hem minutely riding up, is she? No matter how long or short the hem was when it started. And if she's reading a newspaper she must be curled up into a fetal position or hunched over on her knees for it to shield her.

POV. It's okay to be omniscient and know what each character is thinking, but this doesn't come out that way, impartially; it reads like Sam's thoughts and plans and intentions: so he seems like a mindreader to know about the other man's marriage and fantasies, and her job-seeking and feelings of power over men.

and, in fact, he was so intent on maintaining this poker-face facade that he hadn't. Was so intent (on doing something) that he hadn't seen it? Ambiguous construction. You meant 'the facade that he hadn't seen it' was what he was intent on maintaining; but you maintain a pretence, or an impression. - And a facade is redundant, a face of a building.
 
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Ctd...

Now a fourth person enters the story. Some woman is mentally mocking an old man for whatever of his underwear she can see and the smallness of his erection. Where is she sitting in relation to the woman whose eyes held intelligence and compassion?

Darn these pants, what a faux pas! This interior monologue of the older man comes on the end of a paragraph that started with her as a subject, and showing her thoughts. It just doesn't come across as an omniscient narrator switching neatly between POV. And those words make him sound about 150, when in fact he's of the hippie and free love generation.

whilst his tongue and finger continued and looked at her admirer Whilst his finger looked at her admirer? Not wishing to be frivolous, but that's how it reads if you write two verbs next to each other in the same tense and joined by 'and'. Then we realize it can't be the finger looking, so have to go back in the sentence to figure out what the subject of 'looked' is.

The skirt though, it still protected her from being seen again by him!
It protected her from being seen; or it prevented him from seeing her.

Resourcefulness was another trait Sam like about her, it made her special and so much more interesting. (Missing '-ed' on 'liked'.) He sees one brief and insignificant instance of resourcefulness, but can't possibly yet see it as part of her personality. Nor therefore can you make it the topic of the sentence, as if it's an established thing. 'He liked her showing resourcefulness like that', perhaps.
 
Hiya Citadel,

This may be a bit late so I hope you don't mind some additional comments.

Basically I like the premise, and thought that it holds a lot of promise, i.e. lots of future stories/events/situations. I can't comment on the grammar since I'm not good at it.

The first line caught me, then the subsequent paragraph lost me for a while. I'd to read it several times to get the gist. (English is not my first language). It took me on the second read to realize that Sam hated the pattern on the coffee cup enough for him to manifest his powers and shatter the cup. Yeah, yeah, I'm slow lol.

The jump to the train ride was logically, but I thought it happened *snapping my fingers* just like that. This is just me because I like slow transitions. I like the descriptions about her eyes and the way she was clothed. It may sound clichéd but I do see a lot of that on my daily commutes as well. Classic office wear, and yet somehow one knows that the women are trying to catch someone's eyes.

The build up and pause in the middle worked for me. Sort of enticing, yet the line had not been crossed. It allowed for some anticipation of the next move. The mind scene, as I refer it, was good. Bet she wasn't expecting a nice and fuzzy wakeup call. Which was how I saw it, a wakeup call. She was like so many others, a dazed, half-asleep commuter. Then wham…

You used a lot of jargon, and like Rumple Foreskin, I didn't and still don't grasp the contextual use of the phrase, "…as the feet under the swan or the lambs to the slaughter…" Like I said, I'm slow.

This premise have a lot potential like I had mentioned earlier. I'm curious to see what else Sam has in store. Sorry I could not comment on the grammar.

Z
 
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