Democrat Weakens!

[JackLuis]

'Hard to overstate how big this is': Joe Manchin signals openness to reforming filibuster

As support for abolishing the legislative filibuster outright continued to grow inside the Senate Democratic caucus, Sen. Joe Manchin of West Virginia signaled Sunday that he would be open to reforming the archaic rule to make it "more painful" for the minority to wield as a tool of endless obstruction.

While reiterating his opposition to completely eliminating the filibuster—which is currently standing in the way of a sweeping expansion of voting rights, immigration reform, climate legislation, and other priorities of the Biden White House—the West Virginia Democrat noted Sunday morning that in recent years the filibuster has evolved to a point of requiring virtually no effort to deploy beyond sending an email.

Is he just tired of being the bad guy and wants to put it on Sinema?

 

[RobDownSouth]

'Hard to overstate how big this is': Joe Manchin signals openness to reforming filibuster



Is he just tired of being the bad guy and wants to put it on Sinema?

"Reforming" the filibuster is firing a cannon shot at the Republicans. Manchin realizes how easy it currently is for the dwindling Senate Republicans to obstruct any and all legislation. Tyranny of the Minority.

What he suggesting, which will strike fear into Republicans hearts...is if you want to filibuster, you actually HAVE to filibuster, i.e. stand in the Senate well, and voice your objections verbally. When you're done speaking, THEN they voite.

None of this "indefinite filibuster" garbage that Mitch McConnell used to hamstring the Obama administration.

 

[JackLuis]

Chris Wallace busts Joe Manchin: 'Are you enjoying your position of power a little too much?'

Fox News host Chris Wallace on Sunday called out Sen. Joe Manchin (D-WV) for enjoying his "position of power a little too much."

During an interview on Fox News, Wallace noted that Manchin had become a key vote when it comes to preventing Democratic nominations and legislation from moving forward in the Senate.

"Do you like being the most powerful member of Congress, the swing vote in a 50/50 senate? Do you like that, sir?" Wallace asked.

"No, I do not and I did not lobby for this, did not seek it out," Manchin insisted.

He's just a blue collar Redneck, apparently?

 

[coati]

It's bad enough that we have an American version of the archaic House of Lords, where a quarter of the States control half of the decision making process for federal legislation and judicial appointments.

But then, when you add the filibuster rule, which wasn't even part of the Constitution, you effectively destroy democracy.

Sinema and Manchin continue to sanctimoniously "reach across the aisle" to extreme right-wing autocrats, in the appeasement tradition of Neville Chamberlain, while various right-wing states continue to undermine democratic principles. Nobody with a brain is buying the crap that those two are selling.

Plus, Manchin now has the distinction of screwing unemployed people out of a hundred bucks a week during a pandemic. And yet he sees himself as a working man's hero?

 

[BluesDriver66]

'Hard to overstate how big this is': Joe Manchin signals openness to reforming filibuster



Is he just tired of being the bad guy and wants to put it on Sinema?

The reality that the Democratic party has to crawl on it's knees to beg and ass kiss a Democrat not to continuously vote with Republicans is fucking absurd.

It's no wonder a complete fucking moron like Trump, with no political experience, out smarted the entire Democratic party and won a presidential election.

 

[Lazaran]

The reality that the Democratic party has to crawl on it's knees to beg and ass kiss a Democrat not to continuously vote with Republicans is fucking absurd.

It's no wonder a complete fucking moron like Trump, with no political experience, out smarted the entire Democratic party and won a presidential election.

You do realize that there verrrrrry easily could have been a republican senate majority this year; right???

You do realize that the House of Representatives is vulnerable in 2022 if Democrats alienate even a small number of moderate voters; right???

Trump didn't outsmart the Democratic Party; he outsmarted the Bernie Bros in 2016 by playing to their grievances against the Democratic Party, resulting in many of them boycotting the election and basically handing Trump the presidency. Trump tried it again in 2020, but thankfully enough progressive's understood his game the second time around and participated in defeating him.

The right is still trying to fracture the Democratic coalition by peeling off moderate voters with issues like immigration, while promoting discontent among progressive by spreading divisive propaganda about Democrats not really caring about progressive priorities.

Solidifying the Democratic coalition is THE top priority for Democrats in 2021, and that happens by passing a $1.9 TRILLION stimulus package, competently handling Covid vaccinations, partnering with business to promote green energy and manufacturing, expanding healthcare coverage with an ACA public option, and strengthening diplomatic relationships with traditional and emerging allies.

The progressive wing of the Democratic Party is no more OR less important than the other wings of the coalition, and hopefully it has accepted that moving their agenda forward within the framework of the Democratic Party will require compromise and cooperation. We shall see.

Signed: A pragmatic progressive.

 

[BluesDriver66]

You do realize that there verrrrrry easily could have been a republican senate majority this year; right???

You do realize that the House of Representatives is vulnerable in 2022 if Democrats alienate even a small number of moderate voters; right???

Trump didn't outsmart the Democratic Party; he outsmarted the Bernie Bros in 2016 by playing to their grievances against the Democratic Party, resulting in many of them boycotting the election and basically handing Trump the presidency. Trump tried it again in 2020, but thankfully enough progressive's understood his game the second time around and participated in defeating him.

The right is still trying to fracture the Democratic coalition by peeling off moderate voters with issues like immigration, while promoting discontent among progressive by spreading divisive propaganda about Democrats not really caring about progressive priorities.

Solidifying the Democratic coalition is THE top priority for Democrats in 2021, and that happens by passing a $1.9 TRILLION stimulus package, competently handling Covid vaccinations, partnering with business to promote green energy and manufacturing, expanding healthcare coverage with an ACA public option, and strengthening diplomatic relationships with traditional and emerging allies.

The progressive wing of the Democratic Party is no more OR less important than the other wings of the coalition, and hopefully it has accepted that moving their agenda forward within the framework of the Democratic Party will require compromise and cooperation. We shall see.

Signed: A pragmatic progressive.

Trump did not win against Sanders. He won against Hillary Clinton and her moderate do nothing Democratic policies. You can't rewrite history. He out smarted the entire Democratic party with absolutely zero political experience.

Turn off moderate voters? You mean people who would vote for Trump? We can't advocate real solutions facing the nation because some Trump voters might not like it? Democrats need to appease "Trumptards" to win Congress?

 

[JackLuis]

You do realize that there verrrrrry easily could have been a republican senate majority this year; right???

You do realize that the House of Representatives is vulnerable in 2022 if Democrats alienate even a small number of moderate voters; right???

Trump didn't outsmart the Democratic Party; he outsmarted the Bernie Bros in 2016 by playing to their grievances against the Democratic Party, resulting in many of them boycotting the election and basically handing Trump the presidency. Trump tried it again in 2020, but thankfully enough progressive's understood his game the second time around and participated in defeating him.



Signed: A pragmatic progressive.

Don't blame Bernie Bro's for loss in 2016. That was all on the "Moderate WIngs" unflinching support of Hillary, Who was one of the least liked Clinton's. THe fatc that enough people would vote for Trump vs a Democrat with "MOre Expierence", as Pilot puts it , is a fact. Bernie would have kicked Donni's ass in '16, but the DNC Dino's couldn't allow the Progressives to lead.

And the Biden team is allowing the Rethuglicans to fuck up the Senate , AGAIN! Why not play hardball against them? No fucking filibuster, no fucking Dino's Don't support "moderate" in Kentucky when there are real grass root Democrats leading the race. Supporting weak sisters is just a way to excuse the Dino's not being able to get things done .

 

[CornusKousa]

And the Biden team is allowing the Rethuglicans to fuck up the Senate , AGAIN! Why not play hardball against them? No fucking filibuster, no fucking Dino's Don't support "moderate" in Kentucky:

Because one day in the not so far flung future, you guys won't be the majority.

Do you REALLY want to eleminate the one defense the minority has?

Or were you just planning on screaming "buh buh FASCISM!!!!" when it came time for th RW majority crams whatever they want through and you can't do anything about it?

 

[Lazaran]

Trump did not win against Sanders. He won against Hillary Clinton and her moderate do nothing Democratic policies. You can't rewrite history. He out smarted the entire Democratic party with absolutely zero political experience.

Turn off moderate voters? You mean people who would vote for Trump? We can't advocate real solutions facing the nation because some Trump voters might not like it? Democrats need to appease "Trumptards" to win Congress?

Reading comprehension is obviously not your strong suit.

Hillary won the popular vote by 3 million, and, IMHO, would easily have won the electoral college if the Bernie Bros had compromised their rigid principles, and held their noses at the polls. They didn't, and Hillary lost.

The sad part is that the Bernie Bros acted like no other faction in the Democratic Party has ever had to grudgingly support the eventual nominee. The fact that they refused to do it in such a consequential election is tragic.

The turn out for Biden shows that the votes were there, and Biden is "the same" as Hillary, so what was the difference??? Hmmm....

I'm actually over the Bernie Bros disastrous strategy, and am solely focused on maintaining the fragile coalition that provided the majorities necessary to advance SOME progressive priorities.

You are obviously out to destroy the democratic coalition and that makes you an adversary.

Unfortunate , but manageable.

Susan Sarandon was wrong.

 

[CornusKousa]

Trump did not win against Sanders. He won against Hillary Clinton and her moderate do nothing Democratic policies. You can't rewrite history. He out smarted the entire Democratic party with absolutely zero political experience.

Turn off moderate voters? You mean people who would vote for Trump? We can't advocate real solutions facing the nation because some Trump voters might not like it? Democrats need to appease "Trumptards" to win Congress?

Yes, the Democrats are going to have to start appealing to someone other than the "woke" communist if they want to hold on to power.

I'm hoping they go full bore with their anti-civil right plans and absolutely max out their racism.

 

[JackLuis]

Lazaran:
Reading comprehension is obviously not your strong suit.

It wasn't Bernie Bros that lost the election for '16 it was the DNC's unswerving support of Princess Hillary, who was so disliked by the Red States and lots of others that some thought it was a good idea to get a non-establishment type in the White House.

Hillary took for granted a lot of states and lost them, from not showing up to do her ground work. Blaming Bernie is just a DNC deflection from their own Dino-esque posturing.

What really boggles my mind is that people thought Trump was qualified to be a dog catcher! DId n't 20 years of his fuck ups register in their minds?????

 

[KeithD]

Well, no, it was the Electoral College's added leverage provided to the smaller, rural/conservative states that did the trick. Hillary Clinton won the popular vote--by lots. Bernie didn't have an edge in smaller rural/conservative states that either Hillary or the Republicans didn't have.

You Bernie Bros are delusional about what really makes things happen with the U.S. electorate. It isn't someone who can be smeared in "radical socialist" mud as easily as Bernie can be, whether justifiably or not. You're just being delusional and don't seem to care about actually getting some progressive agenda accomplished (as Biden's team incrementally is managing to do).

 

[jomar]

Trump did not win against Sanders. He won against Hillary Clinton and her moderate do nothing Democratic policies. You can't rewrite history. He out smarted the entire Democratic party with absolutely zero political experience.

...

Don't blame Bernie Bro's for loss in 2016. That was all on the "Moderate WIngs" unflinching support of Hillary, Who was one of the least liked Clinton's. THe fatc that enough people would vote for Trump vs a Democrat with "MOre Expierence", as Pilot puts it , is a fact. Bernie would have kicked Donni's ass in '16, but the DNC Dino's couldn't allow the Progressives to lead.

...

Bernie wasn’t a viable winner in 2016...too progressive for mainstream Dems. But Laz is basically saying the Bernie bros pouted and stayed home and that’s why trump won by a razor thin 80,000 votes. But Hillary didn’t do a great job campaigning either, agreed.

Basically the same reason trump’s musing about running in 2024 as third party scares the shit out of republicans...third party dilutes the vote.

 

[Lazaran]

Lazaran:
Reading comprehension is obviously not your strong suit.

It wasn't Bernie Bros that lost the election for '16 it was the DNC's unswerving support of Princess Hillary, who was so disliked by the Red States and lots of others that some thought it was a good idea to get a non-establishment type in the White House.

Hillary took for granted a lot of states and lost them, from not showing up to do her ground work. Blaming Bernie is just a DNC deflection from their own Dino-esque posturing.

What really boggles my mind is that people thought Trump was qualified to be a dog catcher! DId n't 20 years of his fuck ups register in their minds?????

Did you vote for Hillary???

If you did you're a fraud; and if you didn't then you support my argument.

The hate for Hilaary was largely manufactured, helped in no small part by Bernie & Bros.

There was more than a little misogyny involved, and accusations that went beyond slander. Comey's late October surprise went beyond the pale.

Would Bernie have won in 2016??? I have no idea, but if his had been the Democratic nominee's name on the ballot I would have pragmatically voted for him despite whatever reservations I had about some of his policies.

I DID vote for the Democrat's name on the ballot in 2016 AND 2020 despite my reservations about some of their policy decisions in the past.

I live in a progressive stronghold in a swing state, and I personally know MANY "progressives" that not only didn't vote for Hillary, but actually voted for Trump, in some kind of sick fuck you to the DNC. Many cited Susan Sarandon's rationale as their reason. I tried to talk them out of it, but they were too angry to listen. They still stubbornly think they were right in doing so, despite the right wing SCOTUS appointments, and all the other damage wrought by the Trump administration. They are as fanatical as Trump supporters in their own way.

SAD!!!

 

[KeithD]

The hate for Hilaary was largely manufactured, helped in no small part by Bernie & Bros.

This, from the Bill Clinton administration days. The Republicans had a Swiftboating vendetta going against her for years. She isn't the sweetest person around, but who in the hell has ever used that against a competent male politician? She has received the Swiftboating (with Bernie Bros jumping on for the same reason) because she's so highly competent in national management that she scares the shit out of the opposition. What the Trumpettes and the Bernie Bros are doing on this board in response to the Biden administration's competence coming out of the gate is just in the same vein as the Swiftboating of Hillary--but not as intense as he's not the danger to them that she was.

The Bennie Bros are just continuing in the mode of "everything we want, even in the face of the American electorate not being there, or nothing at all." They are so delusional that they can't understand the pie being served by piece as those holding the power are willing to let it be (or can't prevent it being) served in digestible increments. Just politically naive in their doctrinaire brinkmanship.

 

[Lazaran]

This, from the Bill Clinton administration days. The Republicans had a Swiftboating vendetta going against her for years. She isn't the sweetest person around, but who in the hell has ever used that against a competent male politician? She has received the Swiftboating (with Bernie Bros jumping on for the same reason) because she's so highly competent in national management that she scares the shit out of the opposition. What the Trumpettes and the Bernie Bros are doing on this board in response to the Biden administration's competence coming out of the gate is just in the same vein as the Swiftboating of Hillary--but not as intense as he's not the danger to them that she was.

The Bennie Bros are just continuing in the mode of "everything we want, even in the face of the American electorate not being there, or nothing at all." They are so delusional that they can't understand the pie being served by piece as those holding the power are willing to let it be (or can't prevent it being) served in digestible increments. Just politically naive in their doctrinaire brinkmanship.

Exactly.

Nuff said.

 

[BluesDriver66]

Bernie wasn’t a viable winner in 2016...too progressive for mainstream Dems. But Laz is basically saying the Bernie bros pouted and stayed home and that’s why trump won by a razor thin 80,000 votes. But Hillary didn’t do a great job campaigning either, agreed.

Basically the same reason trump’s musing about running in 2024 as third party scares the shit out of republicans...third party dilutes the vote.

You'll have to peddle that horseshit somewhere else. You know who wasn't a viable candidate? Hillary Clinton. She lost to a circus clown, game show host with no political experience.


USA TODAY/Ipsos poll: For voters, Bernie Sanders outranks other Democrats

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...crats-trump-likability-ipsos-poll/4754500002/


Regular Democrats Just Aren’t Worried About Bernie

Many in the party elite remain deeply skeptical of the Vermont senator, but rank-and-file voters do not share that hesitation.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/a...-arent-least-bit-worried-about-bernie/606688/


Polls show most Democrats, many Americans back key Bernie Sanders' policies

Polling consistently shows that most Democrats approve of key parts of Sanders’ economic agenda, including single-payer health care, the Green New Deal, tuition-free college, student debt forgiveness, a $15 minimum wage, breaking up big banks, and paid family leave.

https://www.politifact.com/factchec...show-most-democrats-many-americans-back-key-/

 

[BluesDriver66]

Reading comprehension is obviously not your strong suit.

Hillary won the popular vote by 3 million, and, IMHO, would easily have won the electoral college if the Bernie Bros had compromised their rigid principles, and held their noses at the polls. They didn't, and Hillary lost.

The sad part is that the Bernie Bros acted like no other faction in the Democratic Party has ever had to grudgingly support the eventual nominee. The fact that they refused to do it in such a consequential election is tragic.

The turn out for Biden shows that the votes were there, and Biden is "the same" as Hillary, so what was the difference??? Hmmm....

I'm actually over the Bernie Bros disastrous strategy, and am solely focused on maintaining the fragile coalition that provided the majorities necessary to advance SOME progressive priorities.

You are obviously out to destroy the democratic coalition and that makes you an adversary.

Unfortunate , but manageable.

Susan Sarandon was wrong.

It's not the responsibility of voters to elect candidates. That's only what lazy, unlikable, loser candidates with shitty, loser, public policies say. It's the responsibility of candidates to earn the votes of their constituents through sound moral character and sound public policy that serves the needs of average Americans. Something Hillary sorely lacks to this day.

I can't believe this blaming of voters for shitty campaign strategy and shitty candidates is the best Democrats can do. In no other aspect of the real world can service providers get away with blaming consumers for rejecting products or services that do not meet their needs.

 

[Lazaran]

.
I actually agree with BD66 that Bernie was a viable candidate in 2016, largely due to the fact that true Democrats would have loyally supported the nominee, despite some reservations about his policies, and knowing that legislation requires support from a coalition of voices.

However, Hillary was obviously a viable candidate in 2016 also, as evidence by her 3 million popular vote advantage and her narrow electoral college defeat. The only difference was that the Bernie Bros had no loyalty to the party. Not surprising when you consider that many are young, entitled, and demand instant gratification. Bernie's open hostility towards Hillary, and him being an independent didn't help matters either.

I WOULD like to thank all the progressive's who matured over the past four years and helped elect a flawed but worthy man in Joe Biden, though I will never understand why they couldn't have found that level of ideological flexibility four years earlier.

What was different???

Hmmmm.........

 

[jomar]

You'll have to peddle that horseshit somewhere else. You know who wasn't a viable candidate? Hillary Clinton. She lost to a circus clown, game show host with no political experience.

...

Peddle what shit? It’s like your starting an argument with yourself, lol.

 

[BluesDriver66]

.
I actually agree with BD66 that Bernie was a viable candidate in 2016, largely due to the fact that true Democrats would have loyally supported the nominee, despite some reservations about his policies, and knowing that legislation requires support from a coalition of voices.

However, Hillary was obviously a viable candidate in 2016 also, as evidence by her 3 million popular vote advantage and her narrow electoral college defeat. The only difference was that the Bernie Bros had no loyalty to the party. Not surprising when you consider that many are young, entitled, and demand instant gratification. Bernie's open hostility towards Hillary, and him being an independent didn't help matters either.

I WOULD like to thank all the progressive's who matured over the past four years and helped elect a flawed but worthy man in Joe Biden, though I will never understand why they couldn't have found that level of ideological flexibility four years earlier.

What was different???

Hmmmm.........

What the living fuck? Party loyalty? What the fuck is this? North Korea? Fuck you, the horse you rode in on, and anyone else who suggest "Party loyalty" for the American electorate. Fuck that shit and anything that resembles it.

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/M0PXMG/propaganda-poster-celebrating-the-anniversary-of-the-foundation-of-M0PXMG.jpg

 

[BluesDriver66]

Peddle what shit? It’s like your starting an argument with yourself, lol.

This horseshit..."Bernie wasn’t a viable winner in 2016...too progressive for mainstream Dems."


USA TODAY/Ipsos poll: For voters, Bernie Sanders outranks other Democrats

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ll/4754500002/


Regular Democrats Just Aren’t Worried About Bernie

Many in the party elite remain deeply skeptical of the Vermont senator, but rank-and-file voters do not share that hesitation.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...bernie/606688/


Polls show most Democrats, many Americans back key Bernie Sanders' policies


Polling consistently shows that most Democrats approve of key parts of Sanders’ economic agenda, including single-payer health care, the Green New Deal, tuition-free college, student debt forgiveness, a $15 minimum wage, breaking up big banks, and paid family leave.

https://www.politifact.com/factcheck...ans-back-key-/

 

[Lazaran]

Peddle what shit? It’s like your starting an argument with yourself, lol.

Baby Blues is challenging your assertion about Bernie not being a viable candidate in 2016.

Would you have voted for Bernie vs Trump in 2016???

If not, then maybe Bernie wasn't as viable as many, including myself, think he was.

2020 kinda supports the notion that Bernie's vision for America isn't as universally supported as some like to portray it.

He definitely has moved the Democratic Party in a more progressive direction, and for that he deserves major props. A powerful voice in the Democratic party despite being an independent.

 

[Lazaran]

What the living fuck? Party loyalty? What the fuck is this? North Korea? Fuck you, the horse you rode in on, and anyone else who suggest "Party loyalty" for the American electorate. Fuck that shit and anything that resembles it.

https://c8.alamy.com/comp/M0PXMG/propaganda-poster-celebrating-the-anniversary-of-the-foundation-of-M0PXMG.jpg

You do realize you're going full BoBo with your hyperbole and histrionics right???

You even went so far as to conflate loyalty to the Democratic Party with loyalty to a totalitarian regime, and inserted a standard BoBo image for added over-dramatic effect.

You and BoBo have a lot in common.

How sad for you.