Consent and those "little guys"

[Pure]

original story

http://www.thesundaymail.news.com.au/printpage/0,5942,6242013,00.html

[thanks to ms p for pointing it out]

=====
follow up

http://meltman.com/static/yahoo_castration_doctor.htm
Oddly Enough - Reuters

Castration 'Doctor' Committed No Crime?
Thu Jun 13, 8:37 AM ET DETROIT (Reuters) - A Taiwanese man who claims to have castrated about 50 people and was caught over the weekend with human testicles in the refrigerator of his suburban Detroit home may not have committed any crime, police said on Wednesday.
Lt. Bruce Smith of the Oak Park police department said the 29-year-old man was arrested early on Saturday after he surgically removed the testicles of a Michigan man who was later rushed to a local hospital with severe bleeding. The would-be doctor was released shortly afterwards, however, because his "patient" had asked to be castrated and was a consenting adult, Smith said. [...]

===
information and first hand account:
http://www.geocities.com/sherrylanina/CastrationWhy.html

 

[Johnny Mayberry]

That is just wrong...don't people know you are supposed to go to Mexico for that sort of thing?!?

 

[Ebonyfire]

That is just wrong...don't people know you are supposed to go to Mexico for that sort of thing?!?

Tsk, tsk!

More than that, what will he use to do all his thinking now that his nuts are gone?

 

[Guest]

 

[Ebonyfire]

LMAO...um sorry

Don't be.

I am all in favor for making fun of the stupid!

 

[Guest]

 

[Ebonyfire]

*giggle* isnt that sick...not that I care what gets anyone off
but in his fridge to stay fresh

On one femdom site I post to, there was a rousing discussion (read argument) when one so called submissive posted a plea for information on where he could find a place to gild his balls cause he wanted to give his mistress a surprise by giving his mistress his gold covered balls in a case for their anniversary.

He wanted it to be a surprise.

Oh yeah, it would be a surprise alright!

 

[Guest]

 

[Ebonyfire]

LMAO INDEED

Needless to say the prevailing advice was to

"seek help immediately"

 

[Guest]

 

[AngelicAssassin]

On one femdom site I post to, there was a rousing discussion (read argument) when one so called submissive posted a plea for information on where he could find a place to gild his balls cause he wanted to give his mistress a surprise by giving his mistress his gold covered balls in a case for their anniversary.

He wanted it to be a surprise.

Oh yeah, it would be a surprise alright!

Especially if she had rightfully put them down the trash compactor before his eyes.

Pun intended, or not ... hard to say.

 

[s'lara]

i have a question. Not sure of the answer.

Can a fetish, which is only possible once (like castration) still be considered a fetish?

Merriam's Dictionary defines fetish as:

1 a : an object (as a small stone carving of an animal) believed to have magical power to protect or aid its owner; broadly : a material object regarded with superstitious or extravagant trust or reverence b : an object of irrational reverence or obsessive devotion : PREPOSSESSION c : an object or bodily part whose real or fantasied presence is psychologically necessary for sexual gratification and that is an object of fixation to the extent that it may interfere with complete sexual expression
2 : a rite or cult of fetish worshipers
3 : FIXATION

i was just under the impression that a fetish was somewhat continual in nature. In the case of castration, would the fetish end?

Thanks in advance.

lara

 

[bunny bondage]

oh-for-but-eww-why? *sputters*

i don't even have nuts and i'm squirming like a fish out of water.

 

[Guest]

 

[Ebonyfire]

Especially if she had rightfully put them down the trash compactor before his eyes.

Pun intended, or not ... hard to say.

This guy was for real, the posts and subsequent hoo haa, when on for three weeks.

He was actually upset that people doubted his sanity.

 

[slvjenn]

Call me dumb if you want...

but what are the real affects of this?

Could he still get hard and just not orgasm? could he get hard and orgasm but have little or no desire to? what does this do exatly?

 

[Pure]

Before the amateur analysts run wild with these persons' "insanity", consider those who not only have sexual organs removed/altered but take hormones of the opposite sex. Transgendered, iow. The surgery and drugs amount to castration. Are all transgendered people sick or crazy or 'needing help'? (A certain percent do regret the surgery, of course.)

For the other questioner, the effect is attenuation or extinction of desire. The ability to get hard, might remain. The taking of estrogens (on top of castration), as MTF folks do, would likely take away potency.

The reason for the posting, though, was to focus on 'consent' and indicate the limits of that concept.

J.

PS for lara: yes there's a problem with the one-time fetish, if carried out, not unlike say a fetish for hanging. OTOH, fetish objects like shoes can be imagined, and the images used for gratification; why not images of some of these one time events?
call it an fetish in the imagination.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I agree with Pure fully here although a funny story in itself, the important part here is consent. The castrator has only acted with the consent of the castrati, but he might still be prosecuted for it.

This could have some far reaching effects, what if from now on it is the D.A. who decides if what you do between your sheets is allowed or not. I find this all very disturbing.

The would-be doctor was released shortly afterwards, however, because his "patient" had asked to be castrated and was a consenting adult, Smith said.

"We're waiting for a determination from the prosecutor's office as to what if any charges will be made," Smith said.

As we can see from this statement, the police admit it to be completely consenting and still they want to prosecute. Thank you for pointing this story out to us Pure very interesting.

Francisco.

 

[catalina_francisco]

oops

 

[catalina_francisco]

The ways of the world are disturbing, especially related to crimes of a sexual nature. Also in Brisbane, there is a case going on at the moment (well was still going last week anyway) where a couple have been charged with a female friend's murder, by asphyxiation. Their defense is they never intended to kill her but were fulfiling her request to experience the BDSM practice of breath play she had read about and after tying her hands behind her back, looping the rope around her neck and attaching to a curtain rod leaving her suspended, the male left the room for a drink and stopped to chat on the way back to the room in which time she died. Strange thing is they have a witness who had a similar experience months earlier but survived, and has testififed there was no BDSM element, just this couples desire to kill someone. Nice how people conveniently use BDSM when they want to break the law. http://www.theadvertiser.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,7017465^421,00.html
http://www.thesundaymail.news.com.au/printpage/0,5942,7044077,00.html
http://heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6920227%5E1702,00.html

Unrelated I realise, but no less disturbing to me, is the case yesterday in the UK I think, where a man was sentenced to life for raping another male. The news report I heard on this case also raised the issue of consent in that the victim gave no consent and was forced (I thought that was rape anyway you see it). Now how is it men who are found guilty of raping one or more women, often trying to also kill them in the process, get only a few years at best? Doesn' t this say women are still not considered of equal by the male dominated legal system?

Catalina

 

[Pure]

Hi Golden G,

yes, that stuff about the tupperware in the fridge was quite bizarre; as if the 'surgeon' has a fetish of his own, or had been reading too much hannibal Lector.

there is a website devoted to the cooking up of testicle dishes, but one gathers it's dealing with cattle.

keep in mind many things in SM make one squirm. and then look into it more.

 

[s'lara]

<snip>PS for lara: yes there's a problem with the one-time fetish, if carried out, not unlike say a fetish for hanging. OTOH, fetish objects like shoes can be imagined, and the images used for gratification; why not images of some of these one time events?
call it an fetish in the imagination. [/B]

Sounds like an unsatisfying fetish if it is of the imagination. i see your point though. Most likely safer to have fetishes of this nature (where the act could only be accomplished once) live in the mind.

 

[exiledmaster]

Before the amateur analysts run wild with these persons' "insanity", consider those who not only have sexual organs removed/altered but take hormones of the opposite sex. Transgendered, iow. The surgery and drugs amount to castration. Are all transgendered people sick or crazy or 'needing help'? (A certain percent do regret the surgery, of course.)

For the other questioner, the effect is attenuation or extinction of desire. The ability to get hard, might remain. The taking of estrogens (on top of castration), as MTF folks do, would likely take away potency.

The reason for the posting, though, was to focus on 'consent' and indicate the limits of that concept.

J.

PS for lara: yes there's a problem with the one-time fetish, if carried out, not unlike say a fetish for hanging. OTOH, fetish objects like shoes can be imagined, and the images used for gratification; why not images of some of these one time events?
call it an fetish in the imagination.

In the UK in cases ike this consent is little or no defence, although there might be a defence if there is no sexual content in the act....

 

[Pure]

Good point, EM. It's a dictum of British law that you can't consent to serious bodily harm.

In a way this makes sense, in term of mutilation*; OTOH, I maintain a person has a right to suicide, which is pretty damn harmful.

For lara,
/Sounds like an unsatisfying fetish if it is of the imagination./

Don't knock it if you haven't tried it. Ever read Naked Lunch?


*Who indeed, being sane, would put their eyes out or have them removed (except to stem a fatal spread of cancer, of course.)

 

[s'lara]

Pure,

Ah. The ability to reach the all time pinnacle of satisfaction over and over without fading, without a lessening of intensity and quality - this ultimate satisfaction could only happen in the imagination. Got it.

i haven't read Naked Lunch, but was intrigued enough to look for excerpts online. Goodness. That was a 'sucked into the character and held with horrified fascination' goodness.

From 'Naked Lunch' by William S. Burroughs

'Bradley the Buyer'
(This short tale of an unfortunate narcotics agent is a typical passage from 'Naked Lunch.' It's bizarre and weird and doesn't even make sense, and yet, somehow, it means ... something. And it's funny as all hell.)

'Selling is more of a habit than using,' Lupita says. Nonusing pushers have a contact habit, and that's one you can't kick. Agents get it too. Take Bradley the Buyer. Best narcotics agent in the industry. Anyone would make him for junk. (Note: Make in the sense of dig or size up.) I mean he can walk up to a pusher and score direct. He is so anonymous, grey and spectral the pusher don't remember him afterwards. So he twists one after the other ...

Well the Buyer comes to look more and more like a junky. He can't drink. He can't get it up. His teeth fall out. (Like pregnant women lose their teeth feeding the stranger, junkies lose their yellow fangs feeding the monkey.) He is all the time sucking on a candy bar. Baby Ruths he digs special. 'It really disgust you to see the Buyer sucking on them candy bars so nasty,' a cop says.

The Buyer takes on an ominous grey-green color. Fact is his body is making its own junk or equivalent. The Buyer has a steady connection. A Man Within you might say. Or so he thinks. 'I'll just set in my room,' he says. 'Fuck 'em all. Squares on both sides. I am the only complete man in the industry.'

But a yen comes on him like a great black wind through the bones. So the Buyer hunts up a young junky and gives him a paper to make it.

'Oh all right,' the boy says. 'So what you want to make?'

'I just want to rub against you and get fixed.'

'Ugh ... Well all right ... But why cancha just get physical like a human?'

Later the boy is sitting in a Waldorf with two colleagues dunking pound cake. 'Most distasteful thing I ever stand still for,' he says. 'Some way he make himself all soft like a blob of jelly and surround me so nasty. Then he gets well all over like with green slime. So I guess he come to some kinda awful climax ... I come near wigging with that green stuff all over me, and he stink like a old rotten cantaloupe.'

'Well it's still an easy score.'

The boy signed resignedly; 'Yes, I guess you can get used to anything. I've got a meet with him again tomorrow.'

The Buyer's habit keeps getting heavier. He needs a recharge every half hour. Sometimes he cruises the precincts and bribes the turnkey to let him in with a cell of junkies. It gets to where no amount of contact will fix him. At this point he receives a summons from the District Supervisor:

'Bradley, your conduct has given rise to rumors -- and I hope for your sake they are no more than that -- so unspeakably distasteful that ... I mean Caesar's wife ... hrump ... that is, the Department must be above suspicion ... certainly above such suspicions as you have seemingly aroused. You are lowering the entire tone of the industry. We are prepared to accept your immediate resignation.'

The Buyer throws himself on the ground and crawls over to the D.S. 'No, Boss Man, no ... The Department is my very lifeline.'

He kisses the D.S.'s hand thrusting his fingers into his mouth (the D.S. must feel his toothless gums) complaining he has lost his teeth 'inna thervith.' 'Please Boss Man, I'll wipe your ass, I'll wash out your dirty condoms, I'll polish your shoes with the oil on my nose ...'

'Really, this is most distasteful! Have you no pride? I must tell you I feel a distinct revulsion. I mean there is something, well, rotten about you, and you smell like a compost heap.' He put a scented handkerchief in front of his face. 'I must ask you to leave this office at once.'

'I'll do anything, Boss, anything.' His ravaged green face splits in a horrible smile. 'I'm still young, Boss, and I'm pretty strong when I get my blood up.'

The D.S. retches into his handkerchief and points to the door with a limp hand. The Buyer stands up looking at the D.S. dreamily. His body begins to dip like a dowser's wand. He flows forward ...

'No! No!' screams the D.S.

'Schlup ... schlup schlup.' An hour later they find the Buyer on the nod in the D.S.'s chair. The D.S. has disappeared without a trace.

The Judge : 'Everything indicates that you have, in some unspeakable manner uh ... assimilated the District Supervisor. Unfortunately there is no proof. I would recommend that you be confined or more accurately contained in some institution, but I know of no place suitable for a man of your caliber. I must reluctantly order your release.'

'That one should stand in an aquarium,' says the arresting officer.

The Buyer spreads terror throughout the industry. Junkies and agents disappear. Like a vampire bat he gives off a narcotic effluvium, a dank green mist that anesthizes his victioms and renders them helpless in his enveloping presence. And once he has scored he holes up for several days like a gorged boa constrictor. Finally he is caught in the act of digesting the Narcotics Commissioner and destroyed with a flame thrower -- the court of inquiry ruling that such means were justified in that the Buyer had lost his human citizenship and was, in consequence, a creature without species and a menace to the narcotics industry on all levels.

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