China arrests gay fiction writers

[matriarch]

32 women arrested for writing porn on line........could this happen here or where you are??

 

[JackLuis]

32 women arrested for writing porn on line........could this happen here or where you are??

Only under President Gingrich.

 

[popcorn2721]

32 women arrested for writing porn on line........could this happen here or where you are??

I wonder if thirty was on that list. Anyone seen him/her?

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Only under President Gingrich.

Newt loves Gay, his sis is a lezzie. Pick again.

 

[Boxlicker101]

32 women arrested for writing porn on line........could this happen here or where you are??

I'm not worried about it happening in CA, but it might happen in some Bible Belt states. Most of us who write about gay or lesbian sex, whether casual or in a committed relationship, treat it as little different from straight sex. I have never read any other kind of story here, but there might be some who write about self-loathing because of sexual orientation, or converting through prayer, or something along those lines. Personally, I will never write BS like that, but some people might.

This is what gets up the nose of the religious types who would love to ban gay or lesbian sex as immoral or indecent or against God's wishes - the idea that it is normal and acceptable, rather than being some kind of abomination. I believe they are impotent in this regard, but they might get some things changed. Currently, photos or videos of sex involving those under 18 is illegal, but written or drawn depictions are not. Such drawings or writings are banned from Lit. but that is the decision of Management, not a legal restriction. If religious types could outlaw such things, they would, and that might be the thin end of the wedge. From there, they would go on to ban any other "abnormal" kind of sexual depiction, which would definitely include gay and lesbian.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

BOX

Hitler said Gay was dandy with him, till he got elected, then he murdered or imprisoned all he caught.

With the Bible Thumpers you know where they stand all the time. The others are like the wind.

 

[estragon]

George Orwell Got It Right

Repression comes naturally to totalitarian regimes of every sort, be they atheist or theocratic. There's really no difference between the Communist and the Bible-basher (or Q'aran-basher)--they need to have all the answers, they can't stand the thought that anyone questions anything, and they need to control everything.

Most of all, they are men scared to death of female sexuality--so, of course, they must ultimately lose, because Eve goes back 160,000 years and poor old Adam only 90,000 at best.

 

[lovecraft68]

Repression comes naturally to totalitarian regimes of every sort, be they atheist or theocratic. There's really no difference between the Communist and the Bible-basher (or Q'aran-basher)--they need to have all the answers, they can't stand the thought that anyone questions anything, and they need to control everything.

Most of all, they are men scared to death of female sexuality--so, of course, they must ultimately lose, because Eve goes back 160,000 years and poor old Adam only 90,000 at best.

Everyone mentions 1984 and with good reason. There is a movie called V for Vendetta which is not taken too seriously as it was based on a comic book series by Alan Moore. If you have not seen it give it a look. Beneath the over the top action there is a serious message here and we are coming close to this.

 

[Weird Harold]

32 women arrested for writing porn on line........could this happen here or where you are??

It already has, although not on the scale of this Chinese raid:

Usenet veteran "Frank McCoy," a prolific author of written fictional porn stories from the pre-Web days of the 1990s, was arrested January 13, 2007 and charged with "distributing obscene material" involving a porn story posted to alt.sex.stories about 15 years ago. Jan 17, 2008



By John Ozimek • Posted in Law, 29th June 2009 11:22 GMT

A landmark case, which could have led to draconian new restrictions on what UK authors may publish on the internet – and elsewhere – has been dismissed.

Prosecution counsel were due today to open their case against Civil Servant Darryn Walker, aged 35, of South Shields, who was accused of publishing an allegedly obscene story online. Instead, they stood up in Newcastle Crown Court this morning and informed the judge that they would be offering no evidence. A statement may follow.

The story in question was published around two years ago on Alt Sex Stories Text Repository, a US-based archive of erotica which currently hosts around 400,000 stories of every shape, size and interest. Entitled Girls (Scream) Aloud, it focussed on the rape, mutilation and murder of the popular group Girls Aloud for – presumably – purposes of sexual arousal.

The Daily Star reported it to the Internet Watch Foundation (IWF) on the grounds that it could be criminally obscene, and the IWF referred the case to the police. Walker was arrested and charged. His trial was originally set for March of this year, but was delayed as both he and the prosecuting authorities decided to escalate the stakes by briefing top-notch barristers – Queen’s Counsel – to put their arguments.

Note both of those cases involve authors who post on ASSTR.org -- in one case for stories posted before ASSTR turned into a website instead of a usenet forum. That's because I searched for "ASSTR author Arrested" because I new that would pickup at leas tthe Frank McCoy case. I'm sure that there are other arrests to be found that don't involve ASSTR authors, although I don't know offhand of any convictions for written porn alone. (there have been some child-porn convictions involving stories, but the conviction was based on images or other evidence rather than the writings.

This case in China is specifically about Gay Porn, but it could as easily have been about any other porn genre as China prohibits all porn.

 

[lovecraft68]

It already has, although not on the scale of this Chinese raid:

Usenet veteran "Frank McCoy," a prolific author of written fictional porn stories from the pre-Web days of the 1990s, was arrested January 13, 2007 and charged with "distributing obscene material" involving a porn story posted to alt.sex.stories about 15 years ago. Jan 17, 2008



By John Ozimek • Posted in Law, 29th June 2009 11:22 GMT

A landmark case, which could have led to draconian new restrictions on what UK authors may publish on the internet – and elsewhere – has been dismissed.

Prosecution counsel were due today to open their case against Civil Servant Darryn Walker, aged 35, of South Shields, who was accused of publishing an allegedly obscene story online. Instead, they stood up in Newcastle Crown Court this morning and informed the judge that they would be offering no evidence. A statement may follow.

The story in question was published around two years ago on Alt Sex Stories Text Repository, a US-based archive of erotica which currently hosts around 400,000 stories of every shape, size and interest. Entitled Girls (Scream) Aloud, it focussed on the rape, mutilation and murder of the popular group Girls Aloud for – presumably – purposes of sexual arousal.

The Daily Star reported it to the Internet Watch Foundation (IWF) on the grounds that it could be criminally obscene, and the IWF referred the case to the police. Walker was arrested and charged. His trial was originally set for March of this year, but was delayed as both he and the prosecuting authorities decided to escalate the stakes by briefing top-notch barristers – Queen’s Counsel – to put their arguments.

Note both of those cases involve authors who post on ASSTR.org -- in one case for stories posted before ASSTR turned into a website instead of a usenet forum. That's because I searched for "ASSTR author Arrested" because I new that would pickup at leas tthe Frank McCoy case. I'm sure that there are other arrests to be found that don't involve ASSTR authors, although I don't know offhand of any convictions for written porn alone. (there have been some child-porn convictions involving stories, but the conviction was based on images or other evidence rather than the writings.

This case in China is specifically about Gay Porn, but it could as easily have been about any other porn genre as China prohibits all porn.

I think this is apples and oranges. These people in China were arrested for gay porn. This asshole wrote a snuff story it's too bad the case didn't stand up. that's not sexual it's sadism at it's finest.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I think this is apples and oranges. These people in China were arrested for gay porn. This asshole wrote a snuff story it's too bad the case didn't stand up. that's not sexual it's sadism at it's finest.

I wouldn't call it apples and oranges. Maybe peaches and apricots. They're both attempts at government censorship. One might be slightly more justifiable, but they're both censorship. There are people who believe violence, even snuff is okay, but are opposed to depiction of any kind of sex.

 

[estragon]

As to the "Snuff" Genre

I agree. That's why I stopped looking at asstr some time ago. The stuff they posted was so filthy and disgusting I couldn't read it. However, it's a slippery slope; unhappily freedom of speech extends to people I wouldn't let into any civilized company.

However, none of the women mentioned in those stories suffered any direct physical harm. To the extent they personally felt defamed, or suffered emotional harm, as a result of the stories, they have their remedies in court. And I hope they collect a bundle. In the UK they might. In the US post Flynt-Falwell, they might not. A performer puts him/herself in the public eye; actual malice is a high bar to clear, and the attitude of the Flynt-Falwell Court seems to have been "fuck 'im if he can't take a joke."

But the government of the Peoples' Republic of China definitely can't take a joke. Or deal with female sexuality.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I agree. That's why I stopped looking at asstr some time ago. The stuff they posted was so filthy and disgusting I couldn't read it. However, it's a slippery slope; unhappily freedom of speech extends to people I wouldn't let into any civilized company.

However, none of the women mentioned in those stories suffered any direct physical harm. To the extent they personally felt defamed, or suffered emotional harm, as a result of the stories, they have their remedies in court. And I hope they collect a bundle. In the UK they might. In the US post Flynt-Falwell, they might not. A performer puts him/herself in the public eye; actual malice is a high bar to clear, and the attitude of the Flynt-Falwell Court seems to have been "fuck 'im if he can't take a joke."

But the government of the Peoples' Republic of China definitely can't take a joke. Or deal with female sexuality.

None of the people mentioned in snuff fiction suffer any actual harm. That's because they are not actual people, but are characters in stories.

ETA: BTW, the Flint/Falwell case was about libel. Hustler Mag. issued a series of articles titled "The first time I fucked my mother" or some such thing, and they described Falwell as doing it with Mom in an outhouse. The court ruled nobody could possibly take it seriously or believe it, so it was not actionable.

 

[Weird Harold]

I think this is apples and oranges. These people in China were arrested for gay porn. This asshole wrote a snuff story it's too bad the case didn't stand up. that's not sexual it's sadism at it's finest.

Try reading the whole post; which ended with the statement, "This case in China is specifically about Gay Porn, but it could as easily have been about any other porn genre as China prohibits all porn."

Also, Frank McCoy didn't write snuff stories, he wrote pedophile stories. What ties all three examples together is that they are all prosecutions for writing fictional accounts. Not "apples to oranges" or even "peaches to apricots" but Granny Smith to Golden Delicious to Winesap

 

[manyeyedhydra]

I think the Darryn Walker case was thrown out by the judge with a stern bollocking to the prosecutors never to waste court time with anything so flimsy again. Unfortunately the dude lost his job in the process. There's a lot wrong with the UK at the moment, but thankfully common sense won out on this one.

 

[estragon]

Agreed. And Boxlicker, libel and porn are all speech; burdens of proof and necessary pleadings differ, but at the end of the day, it should all be about speech. And speech should only be stopped or punished when it does real harm--"fire in a crowded theatre", if you like. Or Mr Lincoln's, "Must I shoot the poor soldier boy who deserts, and spare the wily agitator who induced him to desert?"

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

And we're so effing silly we cant sort out real from fiction. I mean, its okay to publish non-fiction about old men who eat children (Albert Fish), you can write all the fictional murder you want; MURDER for crying out loud! But God help you if you offend any nervous nellie's feelings about sadism or rape ot whatever the heart attack du jour is.

 

[lovecraft68]

And we're so effing silly we cant sort out real from fiction. I mean, its okay to publish non-fiction about old men who eat children (Albert Fish), you can write all the fictional murder you want; MURDER for crying out loud! But God help you if you offend any nervous nellie's feelings about sadism or rape ot whatever the heart attack du jour is.

You really hit this one on the head. Let's face it these people target erotica because they can. It's porn and bad and sinful. Erotica is also as a industry very paranoid and will cave to anything. These pricks will never go after fiction because everyone reads fiction. You can shut down Selena Kitt but you couldn't even dream of going after Stephen King. There is too much money involved in fiction. Amazon does not accept incest or under age sex in erotica. Funny that V.C. Andrews works are all up there and making them a lot of money hmmm gee what are all good ole VC's books about? Oh yeah incest. Rape, murder, even pedophilia runs rampant in works of fiction and it is fine.
Now correct me if I am wrong is erotica not fiction?

 

[lovecraft68]

I agree. That's why I stopped looking at asstr some time ago. The stuff they posted was so filthy and disgusting I couldn't read it. However, it's a slippery slope; unhappily freedom of speech extends to people I wouldn't let into any civilized company.

However, none of the women mentioned in those stories suffered any direct physical harm. To the extent they personally felt defamed, or suffered emotional harm, as a result of the stories, they have their remedies in court. And I hope they collect a bundle. In the UK they might. In the US post Flynt-Falwell, they might not. A performer puts him/herself in the public eye; actual malice is a high bar to clear, and the attitude of the Flynt-Falwell Court seems to have been "fuck 'im if he can't take a joke."

But the government of the Peoples' Republic of China definitely can't take a joke. Or deal with female sexuality.

You are right or better put you should be right. Freedom of speech should extend to everything. I find the non consent category here deplorable. Solution? I do not read the stories. It should be that simple if you do not like something avoid it. Instead people take it to the level of I don't think it's right therefore no one should enjoy it. People just need to live and let live. snuff is pretty sick and I would be lying if I said that if I knew someone liked it i would be very leery of letting them anywhere near my family but it still falls under their constitutional right to be deviant.