Canadian Government at its best!

[SensualCealy]

Im not sure of how many have heard or read this, but, in Canada, the government is no longer draping coffins of soldiers KIA when they arrive back into Canada.

As well, our government use to drop their flags to half mast in respect for the people who get killed in the line of duty protecting our freedom. Now, they say, since they dont do it for any other line of work, they can not do it for the soldiers.

Once a year we have a day in which all work place fatalities are acknowledged and flags go half mast across Ontario- possibly the country.
What do you guys think about Canada's treatment of their soldiers killed in action?

My thought is, its disrespectful. Not many other jobs do you dart bullets, land minds, grenades, and suicide bombings on a regular basis. I know it was the choice of the individual to serve our country, but still, what does it take to lower the flags?

The reason behind no longer drapping the flags over the coffins, is for privacy they say. I dont think thats the case at all. My brother works at an airport, and he said, military personel come in to Canada by way of Military transportation. Are we going to paint all our Military vehicles grey, blue and white to blend in with the tarmac and the sky and clouds so they cant be spotted either?

If by chance the coffin has to be flown in by regular transit, they do it privately. An Honour Guard is present to accept the coffin and their proceedures are done on the QT.

I think our government is just tired of paying for flags and the people to pull the cords to lower them!!

C

 

[R. Richard]

You must understand that many here in Canada do not agree with war and killing and the goons who do this. As a measure of our displeasure we are . . .

What? The huns are attacking Canada!

Get the brave boys out there. Tell them they are a "thin red line of 'eros!" Tell them to die to the last man to protect our Canada! Tell them that Canada is depending on them, our wives and children, doncha' know!

 

[rgraham666]

Cealy, draping their coffins, lowering the flags to half-mast, those were things the Liberals did.

By definition, anything liberals do is evil and wrong. Ergo, our Conservative government must do the opposite.

Simple, once you understand the reasoning behind it.

 

[BlackShanglan]

I'm not sure about Canada, but here in the States one can't help but suspect that such measures would be designed to divert attention away from the casualties. "Privacy" certainly was a convenient excuse for declining to allow the returning coffins to be photographed; that it's impossible to violate someone's privacy when no one has the slightest idea whose remains are in the coffin has not stopped the government from advancing this justification, any more than has the fact that, unlike with Viet Nam, thus far the public has been largely reverential of our servicemen and women. Similarly, were we to lower our flags to half-mast for a day each time a soldier perished, they'd be at half-mast most of the time right now, and I think that our leaders are less than keen on that idea. Even the command that Reagan be mourned for a month was cut back to two weeks. At the time there was much bewailing of our society's short attention span, but now I suspect they are glad of it.

Here in the States, though, you couldn't make much hay out of the liberal/conservative issue Rob suggests. The American left has for so long set itself counter to the military that it's very difficult for them to paint themselves as supportive. Indeed, I'd hazard the guess that only a Republican government could have gotten away with the limitations they've imposed without it appearing to be a slight to the armed forces.

Shanglan

 

[Straight-8]

I didn't know about the draping of the coffin issue so I can't comment - seems a bit strange.

But I think it is correct not to lower the flap for each soldier killed. This was not the tradition and, it is true the liberals brought it in only a few years ago, but, of course, that is no reason to abandon it if it is a good idea. I don't think it is.

Unfortunately, in a war, military personel are being killed regularly. In the second world war there probably wasn't a day the flag would have made it to the top of the pole. Part of the government's job is to keep the morale up and not act like a country in mourning all the time. Of course it is important to respect the sacrifices of the individuals, but most of them wouldn't want their sacrifice to undermine support for their mission or comrades. They made the sacrifce because they believed in the mission. Whether the flag at half mast would or would not tend to undermine that support is a difficult call but, overall, I think it is important to grieve as a nation annually and simply to respect the private losses in the meantime without undue fanfare.

Next, how do we judge who is deserving of having the flag at half mast? If a guy/gal dies in an MVA in the middle east - does he/she qualify? What if she/he was on leave? What about somebody killed in a training excercise in Ontario?

I think the tradition of Remembrance Day is there to honour our military and the sacrifices of the troops. If you have ever been to a legion you should also realize that the tradition is to honour the war dead at the setting of the sun each day.

 

[SensualCealy]

Good thoughts by all.
I understand why they no longer drap before the actual funeral, privacy should be acknowledged and respected. I would hope that the families agree with the changes.
As for the flag lowering, to be honest, we don't have the number of service people dying like other countries, so I dont understand the big issue with lowering it. And so what if its down for an entire year, thats one more year we could walk freely in our country.
However I guess that would take the 'specialness' out of dropping it to half mast.

Liberal/ PC, shouldn't matter, if Im not mistaken there are likely alot of Liberals and PC's and oh lets throw in some NDP's to boot , that are fighting for our freedom!

I know its one party against another, and as usual, someone gets caught inbetween.

C

 

[Katyusha]

Good thoughts by all.
I understand why they no longer drap before the actual funeral, privacy should be acknowledged and respected. I would hope that the families agree with the changes.
As for the flag lowering, to be honest, we don't have the number of service people dying like other countries, so I dont understand the big issue with lowering it. And so what if its down for an entire year, thats one more year we could walk freely in our country.
However I guess that would take the 'specialness' out of dropping it to half mast.

Liberal/ PC, shouldn't matter, if Im not mistaken there are likely alot of Liberals and PC's and oh lets throw in some NDP's to boot , that are fighting for our freedom!

I know its one party against another, and as usual, someone gets caught inbetween.

C

Partisan practices are alive and well in Canada too, I see. Ugh.

I agree with the above quote, that as usual, someone gets caught in between the parties...unfortunately during wartime it's usually the soldiers out in the field. The only thing we can do, though, is show our individual support of our fighting men and women, no matter what country we're from, no matter what our feelings about the war are.

Here in the States I think it's up to the families whether or not the coffin of a fallen soldier remains draped with the flag at the funeral; I say that because there have been several funerals here where I've seen the coffin draped, and several where I haven't (some of these funerals end up in pics because of protesters on the grounds). Lowering the flag to half-staff however, happens on Memorial Day and Veteran's Day, as those days serve as a remembrance of all U.S. soldiers who've fallen defending our freedom over the years. Canada has a Remembrance Day (if I'm correct), for the same purposes.

I think that our respective governments are worried about appearing to be in mourning 100% of the time. Ever notice how special certain kinds of gifts or gestures can be when they're done once in awhile, but start to lose their meaning if they're done all the time? It's possible that our governments feel the same about the flags being at half-staff; that by lowering the flag every time a soldier dies, it could start to lose its meaning.

 

[cantdog]

Indeed, I'd hazard the guess that only a Republican government could have gotten away with the limitations they've imposed without it appearing to be a slight to the armed forces.

Shanglan

They haven't gotten away with it. It is a slight to the armed forces.