Can the Republic survive this election?

[SEVERUSMAX]

I mean....seriously? I don't think that it can if Trump wins, and I'm not one percent sure that it can survive much of Hillary, but at least it has a fighting chance with her. With Trump, I think that we'll see unmitigated calamity and a constitutional crisis that will imperil the Union's very existence.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I mean....seriously? I don't think that it can if Trump wins, and I'm not one percent sure that it can survive much of Hillary, but at least it has a fighting chance with her. With Trump, I think that we'll see unmitigated calamity and a constitutional crisis that will imperil the Union's very existence.

Trump will burn the house down, after that it's a crap shoot.

Hillary will continue the same old shit. The rich getting richer, and fuck everyone else until the country becomes Detroit/Chicago.

Rip the band-aid off and give it a good scrub or let it be so the infection can continue to fester...those are our options.

 

[1sickbastard]

Pfft.
The elections are tantamount to asking a child which clothes will be worn to some inane social event: The choice isn't whether the kid is going to said event (the choice that matters) but the wardrobe (which matters little if at all).

That being said, the congress and senate will remain, essentially, gridlocked, so nothing of import will be accomplished.

In other words, the system will continue to function as designed.

 

[Setanta84]

People who compare Trump to Hitler or say he's going to end everything are just blatantly trying to terrorize you into voting for the Democratic nominee.

Notice that we hear how powerful and scary the President of the United States is during presidential election years and how limited his/her power is when people are pressuring the Executive for what they want?

The only way we get into a Hitler situation with Trump is if he somehow amends the Constitution to give himself the kind of power Hitler had under the German constitution. (The Weimar constitution was very democratic but had provisions in it to suspend democracy in a time of crisis and Hitler used those provisions to pull a Caesar/Emperor Palpatine.)

Outside of that, we're just looking down the barrel of having a very unpopular and bad pro-corporate president no matter who wins. (And I think Trump is actually the lesser of the two evils in this regard. The MSM makes the case pretty strong with how hard they are signalling that they favor Hillary over him. Hillary will make them money. Trump might cost them money. So, Hillary = Good, Trump = Bad.)

 

[sr71plt]

None of the above. It will survive if either of them is elected.

 

[underguy1]

I think there is a serious danger of La Clinton (and her band of neocon groupies) starting WW3.

The anti-Russian rhetoric and actions are extremely incendiary. These people are not sane. They seem to think that they can win a nuclear war with Russia.

Or fight a war with Russia without ICBMs being fired.

Niether is a credible scenario.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

Trump is Hitler, but Hitler did miracles for many years. Trunp's problem, like Hitler's, is: He's the smartest guy in the room and wont suffer your opinion. HRC wont either.


If you elect HRC the NSA will devour her with scandalsous leaks that paralyze the government. The NSA hates her.

If you elect Trump Warren Buffet will stop all the trains and boats and planes, and Rupert Murdoch will put HRC and Mitt Romney in charge of FOX.


Youre so fucked and don't even know it.

 

[about_average]

I think there is a serious danger of La Clinton (and her band of neocon groupies) starting WW3.

The anti-Russian rhetoric and actions are extremely incendiary. These people are not sane. They seem to think that they can win a nuclear war with Russia.

Or fight a war with Russia without ICBMs being fired.

Niether is a credible scenario.

Possibly.

But considering that trump needs a translator for nearly everything he says, even to English speakers, it's quite likely he'll insult some foreign leader to the point of war.
Then there's the fact he's a conspiracy theorist, probably not a good thing for a president.

On the other hand Reagan's activities were planned around what Nancy's psychic said, and we survived him.

 

[oggbashan]

The US has survived worse.

Read the political machinations that wrecked the US's initial response to the War of 1812. US politicians betrayed their own forces by complete incompetence.

As many people have said "America is an idea". Even politicians can't destroy that.

 

[BotanyBoy]

None of the above. It will survive if either of them is elected.

It will survive sure, but it might not be recognizable.

What am I saying? It's already a joke....I find it hard to believe so many people still give a shit.

Possibly.

But considering that trump needs a translator for nearly everything he says, even to English speakers, it's quite likely he'll insult some foreign leader to the point of war.
Then there's the fact he's a conspiracy theorist, probably not a good thing for a president.

On the other hand Reagan's activities were planned around what Nancy's psychic said, and we survived him.

It could happen but there is a good chance he could talk his way out of a lot too.

Clinton never talks unless it's totally scripted and with people she knows will have their tongues firmly up her ass the entire interview.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

None of the above. It will survive if either of them is elected.

Ah, an optimist. Then again, I think that, as one of my customers recently said, "Murphy (the guy who devised Murphy's Law) was an optimist." That pretty much sums up my eternal pessimism.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

The US has survived worse.

Read the political machinations that wrecked the US's initial response to the War of 1812. US politicians betrayed their own forces by complete incompetence.

As many people have said "America is an idea". Even politicians can't destroy that.

Granted that they were bad. Still, this isn't about incompetence. It's about a country full of people already at each other's throats. One wrong move and it's civil war. And a civil war in a country with nuclear weapons.....frightening prospect. Just imagine it happening in Russia or China, the former having been a real danger in the past.

America as a nation will probably survive.....but the constitutional Republic that we have in its present form is teetering on the brink and about to fall into the chasm. In the past, people didn't regularly deny the legitimacy of a President or Congress from the opposing party. Now they do consistently. Enter Trump, and if he does something brazenly authoritarian, the Left will revolt. If Clinton does any kind of gun control, the Right will revolt, too. What a fucking mess!

 

[TheOlderGuy]

Either way, we're headed for a Second Civil War (and that's assuming you don't count the slaughter of the Native Americans as the first Civil War)before we get to WW3.

But, this time it will not be north vs. south, nor rich vs. poor, or Natives vs. invaders.

It will be heavily armed white men who want to once and for all put an end to anything they deem different from themselves vs. a disorganized majority who are just praying that the days of cheap oil and 365 choices for shampoo will soon return.

Trump has inflamed an ember of hate and bigotry that some may have thought died decades ago. HE isn't actually the problem. His followers are the problem. He just has a knack for manipulating them, and giving them the illusion of being more powerful than they are. I'm not sure that who gets elected will have much effect on the inevitability of war on our own soil, but this election has created a potent force for disabling what little democracy we had left in us.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Either way, we're headed for a Second Civil War

That is a distinct possibility should a few key things go down.

It will be heavily armed white men who want to once and for all put an end to anything they deem different from themselves vs. a disorganized majority who are just praying that the days of cheap oil and 365 choices for shampoo will soon return.

I disagree.

I don't think it will be as racial as some folks think, I don't think the white male hates minorities and women as much as the (D) crowd likes to portray it. Notice none of the fuckin' twats who bitch about how evil and horrible western culture and white men are live in Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iraq or Somalia. You know were it's SOOOOOOOOOO much more inclusive, feminist and diverse. IDK it could be a race war.


But I think the biggest part of it will be those who want the government deciding who gets to make money and who has to be a wage slave. And those who are sick and tired of being told they aren't allowed to make money for themselves because the rich/cool kids club said no.

War gets dressed up in a lot of costumes but at the end of the day it's always the money.

 

[underguy1]

Possibly.

But considering that trump needs a translator for nearly everything he says, even to English speakers, it's quite likely he'll insult some foreign leader to the point of war.
Then there's the fact he's a conspiracy theorist, probably not a good thing for a president.

On the other hand Reagan's activities were planned around what Nancy's psychic said, and we survived him.

A term used by people lacking in reasoning skills.

 

[TheAnswerMan]

That is a distinct possibility should a few key things go down.
...
But I think the biggest part of it will be those who want the government deciding who gets to make money and who has to be a wage slave. And those who are sick and tired of being told they aren't allowed to make money for themselves because the rich/cool kids club said no.

War gets dressed up in a lot of costumes but at the end of the day it's always the money.

It's not the government making those decisions. If angry Republican rank and file would ever figure that out, then real change could be possible. It's the filthy rich, who have purchased the government and use it to keep the rest of us fools in line, that is the problem. There could be a political revolution that takes that power away from the 1%, if only fewer people bought the bullshit being fed to them that it's the poor, and people of color, and Islamists and Mexicans who are taking away their jobs and their shot at being rich themselves. Look, Spot! SQUIRREL!!!

 

[BotanyBoy]

It's not the government making those decisions.

Really? I'm pretty sure they are the ONLY ones with the authority to throw people in prison for operating a business without the consent of the cool kids club.

If angry Republican rank and file would ever figure that out, then real change could be possible. It's the filthy rich, who have purchased the government and use it to keep the rest of us fools in line, that is the problem.

If you honestly think that's a Republican only trait you're chugging way to much Kool-Aid.

There could be a political revolution that takes that power away from the 1%, if only fewer people bought the bullshit being fed to them that it's the poor, and people of color, and Islamists and Mexicans who are taking away their jobs and their shot at being rich themselves. Look, Spot! SQUIRREL!!!

Nobody except a micro minority of dumbshits that don't really matter think it's the poor, people of color or Islamist that are destroying the economy and the upward mobility of the average American citizen. The poor/ethnic minority/Islam community doesn't send out letters or officers to lock up people trying to make a better living for themselves or the licenced people that are getting too big for megacorp comfort.

The Government does it all day every day.

Mexicans (and other illegals) do to some extent take jobs, the shot at being rich however is denied nearly entirely by the government, state generally far more than federal. But the Feds are fans of keeping the poor down and making them even poorer too. Look how the Obama admin has gone

Hillary will be more of the same. More Monsanto protection acts....more 'regulation' for little guys, more money for the 1%.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

Either way, we're headed for a Second Civil War (and that's assuming you don't count the slaughter of the Native Americans as the first Civil War)before we get to WW3.

But, this time it will not be north vs. south, nor rich vs. poor, or Natives vs. invaders.

It will be heavily armed white men who want to once and for all put an end to anything they deem different from themselves vs. a disorganized majority who are just praying that the days of cheap oil and 365 choices for shampoo will soon return.

Trump has inflamed an ember of hate and bigotry that some may have thought died decades ago. HE isn't actually the problem. His followers are the problem. He just has a knack for manipulating them, and giving them the illusion of being more powerful than they are. I'm not sure that who gets elected will have much effect on the inevitability of war on our own soil, but this election has created a potent force for disabling what little democracy we had left in us.

True. I wanna wade thru fields of Democrat bodies.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

That is a distinct possibility should a few key things go down.



I disagree.

I don't think it will be as racial as some folks think, I don't think the white male hates minorities and women as much as the (D) crowd likes to portray it. Notice none of the fuckin' twats who bitch about how evil and horrible western culture and white men are live in Saudi Arabia, Syria, Iraq or Somalia. You know were it's SOOOOOOOOOO much more inclusive, feminist and diverse. IDK it could be a race war.


But I think the biggest part of it will be those who want the government deciding who gets to make money and who has to be a wage slave. And those who are sick and tired of being told they aren't allowed to make money for themselves because the rich/cool kids club said no.

War gets dressed up in a lot of costumes but at the end of the day it's always the money.

Sure we do. Cleanse the colleges and ghettos and prisons, and put the survivors on sugar plantations.

 

[richmondman]

The US will be just fine. The nation is very resilient.

There won't be a civil war.

 

[Hard_Rom]

It can survive this election... probably. If Billy's wife wins then it will be status quo with a slight shift to left. If Trump wins then the 'probably' bit comes in. He certainly will not be good for the US. Economics and international relations will do downhill. Il Donald would have to become Il Duce to do any real damage to the Republic itself. Not unforeseeable to have civil unrest bordering on civil war, states thinking about going it alone, demonstrations and riots. He could play nice for first 4 years and sucker the US, then go mental in his final four years.

If Il Donald got the US involved in a foreign war, likely if someone disses him, and then tries to act all CinC and interfere with the military prosecuting the war, he could do major damage to the Republic with a possible hostile standing army.

A bit far fetched but this is a guy who admires authoritarian oligarchies, is isolationist and wants to build walls ala Iron Curtain but in reverse. How he will get Mexico to pay for it is dangerous. That could cause military conflict with Mexico if he imposes sanctions and seizes assets.

There is no real upside to Trump. An ignorant populist and a bigot.

 

[BotanyBoy]

It can survive this election... probably. If Billy's wife wins then it will be status quo with a slight shift to left.

LOL what an idealistic dumbshit.....more like a slight shift back towards Wall St.

 

[patient1]

The US has survived worse.

Read the political machinations that wrecked the US's initial response to the War of 1812. US politicians betrayed their own forces by complete incompetence.

As many people have said "America is an idea". Even politicians can't destroy that.

Yes, you're right, Ogg, it has survived worse.
But maybe you've put your finger on the issue- My idea of America is not an Oligarchy. I fear that the election of Clinton will lock us into that. My idea is more egalitarian.

I would prefer that the presidential pool be broader than the Ivy League educated, or Yale & Harvard especially. I would prefer that they not be sponsored by, or formerly employed by, or married to somebody who works for Goldman Sachs.

Well, that's the thrust of it, while others may see anybody can be president now, including blacks and women, I increasingly see it as open to only those with the right family & social connections.

 

[sr71plt]

Ah, an optimist. Then again, I think that, as one of my customers recently said, "Murphy (the guy who devised Murphy's Law) was an optimist." That pretty much sums up my eternal pessimism.

No, I'm not Chicken Little about such things. I think the situation is actually better that an obvious destructive and anti-American ideals force in Trump is running in the election than if someone more subtly insidious like Cruz had gotten the nod. I think it's unfortunate that Clinton has the baggage she does--some of it of her own making, some the result of long-term Swiftboating--but I have no doubt at all that, once in the job, she'll be more presidential and steady at the helm than would have been anyone else of either party running for or suggested for the job. And it looks, with each passing day, that she's going to win the election.

 

[about_average]

A term used by people lacking in reasoning skills.

Right, it's definitely reasonable for Trump to believe:
Obama has a super secret past and that he wasn't born in the US
Obama actively supported AQ in Iraq
The only way he can loose the election in PA is if there is voter fraud
That Bush deliberately lied about WMD in Iraq
Rafel Cruz was involved in JFK's assassination
Just to name a few

People who don't believe all those lack reasoning skills.