Can a top be topped?

[entitled]

Just my couple of cents, ignore at will, but...

The best tops i've ever run into and had the pleasure of bottoming for have been topped. Rather extensively. They came into the lifestyle wanting to be tops and were told that they first had to have experience being a sub. Without the experience they wouldn't know what works and what doesn't until it was possibly too late to save a relationship.

That one act, having to sub for an extended length of time (i think one of them said it was six months? maybe longer), taught them both empathy and respect for submissives, and just thinking about having to do it weeded out more egotistical assholes than anything else. Hard to keep the power trip of being a top when you're not a top.

 

[mlady_france]

Okay, I still think of myself as rather new to relationships period and especially the D/s give and take, but here's my two cents.

Knowing the friends I do, almost all of them are either tops or switches. When I read the opening post, two in particular came to mind. Both are tops, no question about it. Both think that they are the most dominate. Oh and yes both live in the same house with one sub and one switch. The two doms, and the switch are male and the sub is female. The sub tends to get caught in the middle of the two doms trying to out dom each other, and I too have found myself in the middle of this on occation, not that either of us mind this. But I'm rambling. Anyway, I started to think about the relationship the two tops have. They are roommates, friends, and coworkers all at once. And while one has true claim and ownership on the sub in the house, they almost share her to a point. I started to think about if, some how these two tried to top each other could I see either of them actually submitting. And the answer is yes, tho i'm not sure which, but I am sure it would happen. Infact I could see either of them being topped all together if the right person came along and "broke" them.(I really hate that term but can't think of a better one). I think the consept is very possible, tho I'm not sure that the out come would always be a favorable one, which I think maybe what you were actually asking. anyway, that's my thoughts

 

[Recidiva]

Just my couple of cents, ignore at will, but...

The best tops i've ever run into and had the pleasure of bottoming for have been topped. Rather extensively. They came into the lifestyle wanting to be tops and were told that they first had to have experience being a sub. Without the experience they wouldn't know what works and what doesn't until it was possibly too late to save a relationship.

That one act, having to sub for an extended length of time (i think one of them said it was six months? maybe longer), taught them both empathy and respect for submissives, and just thinking about having to do it weeded out more egotistical assholes than anything else. Hard to keep the power trip of being a top when you're not a top.

Well, yeah, anybody without any practice, or just someone trying to stroke their own ego, without anything to back it up, will tend to crumble into a frothing lunatic.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Never went through training, but I find the "Slave Days" useful, like I said. Don't think that training is for everyone, but all Doms should try it as a sub at least once, to make sure that they are not switches, for one thing. That's how I know for sure that I'm not a switch. She enjoys the Slave Days more than I do. It helps our relationship, though, to have that, since she is a switch and needs self-expression. Plus, it gives me a chance to show her what it is like to deal with a defiant slave (which she can occasioinally be).

 

[rgraham666]

Well, there goes any chance of me exploring the lifestyle.

Even the thought of being dominated makes me want to throw up. People being in charge of me has been an unvarying source of pain and there's no way on earth I'm going through that again.

Excuse me. Have to go empty my stomach.

 

[siren319]

Tops can be topped easily

Just like there is psychological influences that make a bottom a bottom, sometimes the desire to control another comes from the lack of control in another part of life. My experience is finding someone who is truely a dominant spirit and not someone who who clawing feverishly for any sense of control is difficult. I think in reality there aren't that many true TOPS out there. I prefer submission but for the same reason in reverse. I have so much control and such a dominant aggressive carreer and role in my own life. The pull toward letting go of that is appealing. Finding a Dom who isn't intimidated by me is next to impossible. Yes I know someone will respond with the "hell I can", but only one time have I found a dom that could successfully dominate me without handing over control to me. This "switch" kills the attraction for me because it weakens him and then I want to dominate him, because he obviously isn't worthy of dominating me. Its a death sentence to the ds relationship.

 

[Liar]

http://www.doseuk.com/Images/womens/jpegs/supersexy1.jpg<--- Top..........Bottom ----->http://www.luvcube.com/live-love/images/butt-implant-surgery-results.jpg


Everything else I see as just complicating things. Or over-simplifying them, I can't quite make up my mind about that.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Dying to hear what CharleyH has to say.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Just like there is psychological influences that make a bottom a bottom, sometimes the desire to control another comes from the lack of control in another part of life. My experience is finding someone who is truely a dominant spirit and not someone who who clawing feverishly for any sense of control is difficult. I think in reality there aren't that many true TOPS out there. I prefer submission but for the same reason in reverse. I have so much control and such a dominant aggressive carreer and role in my own life. The pull toward letting go of that is appealing. Finding a Dom who isn't intimidated by me is next to impossible. Yes I know someone will respond with the "hell I can", but only one time have I found a dom that could successfully dominate me without handing over control to me. This "switch" kills the attraction for me because it weakens him and then I want to dominate him, because he obviously isn't worthy of dominating me. Its a death sentence to the ds relationship.

An assertive sub can be fun to dominate. Nice challenge.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I don't know if a top can be topped, but I'd like to cup your cups.

 

[kendo1]

I'm more of a middle.

 

[siren319]

I thought so

An assertive sub can be fun to dominate. Nice challenge.

but in reality most cave under that kind of pressure. Common Dom experience seems to be with subs who give their submission freely without seeing it for the gift that it is. It takes D/s to a new level when a sub consciously makes the dicision to give total control to another. Especially if he/she knows he/she isn't weak.

I have randomly played with doms on occassion, without the possibility of collaring etc. The benefit of this encounter is the ability to discuss freely on an equal level after the encounter about other experiences(I realize many doms do this with their subs, but I have a bit of a goddess complex and only hear this part if it leads to my praise as the best...since there is no emotional involvement in this type of meeting I don't care).

The majority will admit that they usually don't have to work that hard to gain total control. To loosely quote one, he said, "most subs/slaves find comfort in being victimized. They don't realize that in healthy D/s play they are actually the ones in control. They tend to offer themselves up as worthless and beg to be treated in a way that validates this lack of self-worth."

 

[AppleBiter]

can a top be topped? Successfully, I mean? Can one top top another?

If the top being topped is a switch, I don't see why not. Otherwise, I wouldn't think so.

 

[Liar]

Switch ------>http://www.mbelectronics.com/images%5Citems%5C90-36%20small.jpg

 

[impressive]

Top ------>http://www.clipartheaven.com/clipart/international/japan/toy_-_top.gif

 

[Liar]

I liked my top better.



And howevah... I had a serious (abeit implicit) point to make about all that: Are you all (who've replied here) really that theorizing and labelizing when it comes to something as primary as lust?

 

[Recidiva]

I liked my top better.

And howevah... I had a serious (abeit implicit) point to make about all that: Are you all (who've replied here) really that theorizing and labelizing when it comes to something as primary as lust?

Not me, I think labels are something you choose for comfort, and life isn't comfortable.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

but in reality most cave under that kind of pressure. Common Dom experience seems to be with subs who give their submission freely without seeing it for the gift that it is. It takes D/s to a new level when a sub consciously makes the dicision to give total control to another. Especially if he/she knows he/she isn't weak.

I have randomly played with doms on occassion, without the possibility of collaring etc. The benefit of this encounter is the ability to discuss freely on an equal level after the encounter about other experiences(I realize many doms do this with their subs, but I have a bit of a goddess complex and only hear this part if it leads to my praise as the best...since there is no emotional involvement in this type of meeting I don't care).

The majority will admit that they usually don't have to work that hard to gain total control. To loosely quote one, he said, "most subs/slaves find comfort in being victimized. They don't realize that in healthy D/s play they are actually the ones in control. They tend to offer themselves up as worthless and beg to be treated in a way that validates this lack of self-worth."

Easy is nice too. They both have their uses. I don't consider a sub/slave worthless. They are VERY valuable. They are trusting me. That's a big deal, to be trusted not to abuse and mistreat one. That suggests respect and admiration. Not a bad thing. So, no, I don't take it for granted. I value it a lot.

 

[Evil Alpaca]

Is there a middle?

 

[yui]

Is there a middle?

Yes, I believe so.

Hold me.

We will huddle there.

We can be fluffy in the middle.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I came into the scene to be a bottom, and realised that to get the kind of play I wanted, I would have to become the top. So, I characterise myself as a masochistic dominant.

I like to say;
"Bottoms switch once they find out they can- Tops switch the first chance they get"
People's reactions to that statement tell a lot about them- anyone who actually listens to what I said will laugh, tops who don't listen will bridle. Them, I don't play with.

And the best tops I ever played with- yes, they all went through training. Here's an interesting sidelight; the issue of age;
In Chicago there was- and hopefully, still is- a renowned and beloved mistress, who, by the time I met her, was well into her seventies. She was a typical old aldy to anyone who didn't know her. When she walked into the clubs or play parties, however, she was royalty. More proud young bucks and butches than you could shake a stick at, more queenly Mistresses and effete Masters- all would come to pay their respects and introduce their subs to her. Tops I would never expect it from, would say proudly that they'd trained under her.
Me, I never got the chance, and I really do believe I would be a better top if I had!

 

[Liar]

We can be fluffy in the middle.

I think I'll hang with you guys.


Most of the time. In reality, I can be all over the place, depending on mood, partner and situation. But if someone says "Oh, you're a switch then" I'll slap them with a Belgian waffle. (It makes such a delightful little thud on impact, and doesn't sting much. Perfect for a pacifist.) Because that implies that it's a simple this-or-that situation, when it's always anything but. Control is analog.

 

[AppleBiter]

Most of the time. In reality, I can be all over the place, depending on mood, partner and situation. But if someone says "Oh, you're a switch then" I'll slap them with a Belgian waffle. (It makes such a delightful little thud on impact, and doesn't sting much. Perfect for a pacifist.) Because that implies that it's a simple this-or-that situation, when it's always anything but. Control is analog.

Just as it's not an issue for you, to some others, it is a simple this-or-that situation. I'm a bottom, for instance. Can't top, have no desire to top, don't find the idea arousing or appealing in the slightest. My top is strictly a top, as well. Can't bottom, doesn't want to bottom, and finds the idea of bottoming far less than appealing. Everyone has preferences, that way. Some can do both, but others -- believe it or not -- prefer those roles (top or bottom) all the time.

If you don't like or want the title of switch, that's fine. I don't really see it so much as a label, just a definition of preference. But, if you feel that way, I respect that. You don't want to be called a switch, you're not a switch. There.

 

[Recidiva]

It's also completely a component (for me) about the other person's personality and how it clicks or fails to click with mine.

I don't respond the same way to everyone, and rarely the same way twice, so it's completely situational. My responses aren't set ahead of time, so I have been evaluated as being everything under the sun, but people evaluating me usually has more to do with what they think of the behavior they provoked rather than who I am.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Just as it's not an issue for you, to some others, it is a simple this-or-that situation. I'm a bottom, for instance. Can't top, have no desire to top, don't find the idea arousing or appealing in the slightest. My top is strictly a top, as well. Can't bottom, doesn't want to bottom, and finds the idea of bottoming far less than appealing. Everyone has preferences, that way. Some can do both, but others -- believe it or not -- prefer those roles (top or bottom) all the time.

If you don't like or want the title of switch, that's fine. I don't really see it so much as a label, just a definition of preference. But, if you feel that way, I respect that. You don't want to be called a switch, you're not a switch. There.

Yeah, some relationships work out that way. That's cool. That would probably be my relationship, if my slave was just a bottom. Since she is a switch, well, I use it as a reward system, so I maintain some control, even as I temporarily give much of it up for a day or two. And I naturally reassert my authority soon afterward.