BBC NEWS | Europe | Pope rejects condoms for Africa

[Wolfman1982]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4081276.stm

Pope rejects condoms for Africa

The spread of HIV and Aids in Africa should be tackled through fidelity and abstinence and not by condoms, Pope Benedict XVI has said. Speaking to African bishops at the Vatican, the Pope described HIV/Aids in Africa as a "cruel epidemic".

But he told them: "The traditional teaching of the church has proven to be the only failsafe way to prevent the spread of HIV/Aids."

More than 60% of the world's 40m people with HIV live in sub-Saharan Africa.

In South Africa alone, 600-1,000 people are thought to die every day because of Aids.

Pope Benedict, who was elected to succeed John Paul II in April, has already signalled that he will maintain a strictly traditional line on issues including abortion and homosexuality.

Before being elected pope, Benedict served as head of the Vatican's doctrinal office.

These were his first public comments on the issue of Aids/HIV and contraception since taking office.


It is of great concern that the fabric of African life, its very source of hope and stability, is threatened by divorce, abortion, prostitution, human trafficking and a contraception mentality
Pope Benedict

He was addressing bishops from South Africa, Botswana, Swaziland, Namibia and Lesotho, who had travelled to the Vatican for a routine papal audience.

Some Catholic clergymen have argued that the use of condoms to stem the spread of the disease would be a "lesser of two evils".

The Pope warned that contraception was one of a host of trends contributing to a "breakdown in sexual morality", and church teachings should not be ignored.

"It is of great concern that the fabric of African life, its very source of hope and stability, is threatened by divorce, abortion, prostitution, human trafficking and a contraception mentality," he added.

The virus "seriously threatens the economic and social stability of the continent," the Pope said.

The UN estimates that without new initiatives and greater access to drugs, more than 80 million Africans may die from Aids by 2025 and HIV infections could reach 90 million, or 10% of the continent's population.

If you ask me, then the pope is a fucking cunt and an asshole. And for once I don´t care if I offend any pope lovers.

 

[Wolfman1982]

Pope Benedict XVI: condoms make Aids crisis worse

here is an added part of the pope fuckers statement.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...edict-XVI-condoms-make-Aids-crisis-worse.html

Pope Benedict XVI said that the distribution of condoms 'aggravates' the Aids crisis, as he embarked on his first trip to Africa. While en route from Rome to his first stop, Cameroon, the Pope said that the condition was "a tragedy that cannot be overcome by money alone, that cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems."

Speaking on board his official plane, the pontiff insisted that the Roman Catholic Church is in the forefront of the battle against Aids, advocating sexual abstinence and fidelity within marriage as a way of fighting the disease. During the seven-day visit, which will take Benedict to Cameroon and Angola, he said he would address the continent's "grave problems and painful wounds".

Africa is crucial to the Vatican because of its growing number of believers. Within 15 years around a sixth of the world's Catholics, or 230 million people, are expected to be African. The continent also produces a large proportion of the world's Catholic priests.

But it also presents huge challenges for the Pope, including tension with Islam in some countries, competition from evangelical churches and opposition to the Church's ban on condoms in countries where Aids is rife.

Pope Benedict, who has mostly confined his travels to Western countries during his four-year papacy, will first visit Cameroon during his week-long trip, and then Angola.

His only previous visit to Africa was to Kinshasa in 1987 when he was a cardinal.

He will appeal to rich countries which are grappling with the global financial crisis not to forget Africa's acute needs.

An estimated 800 million Africans suffer from chronic hunger and the crisis is already affecting the level of remittances sent from abroad as African immigrants in Europe lose their jobs.

Although he will only visit two of Africa's more than 50 countries, he hopes that his visit will "embrace the entire African continent", he said on Sunday during his weekly blessing in St Peter's Square in Rome.

He referred to Africa's "ancient cultures and its difficult path of development and reconciliation, its grave problems, painful wounds and enormous potential and hopes",

He is expected to meet African bishops, Muslim imams, politicians and women's advocacy groups.

The six-day tour will be the 81-year-old pontiff's 11th foreign trip.

He is scheduled to visit Israel and Jordan in May.

 

[emap]

Shoot me now I'm going to sorta agree with the pope.

Condoms are dangerous to use as protection from anything when used poorly. I've never seen a guy ready and very willing to go able to do much of anything right. Especially when you are talking a guy who is under 24. Handing condoms to them is almost the same thing as handing them a loaded revolver and telling them to point it at their head and pull the trigger twice.

Which of course does not mean handing out condoms would not help, would halve the growing population of HIV/AIDS positive persons in Africa. Course the pope is catholic, a condom is a mortal sin, I wouldn't really expect him to say anything but. Along with abortion is wrong, you just gotta consider the source.

 

[Wolfman1982]

emap: I don´t know what part of the world you are from (well it maybe says in your profile). But thanks to good sexual (or former good sexual ) education in Denmark then all (or quite a fucking lot) knows how and where to put the condom on. So that excuse is just even more fucked up. But about the catholic part .. well that is true and I don´t give a rats arse about that answer. But the reason why there are more gets a sexual transmitted illness , is because there are NOT really much focus on the dangers of unprotected sex in Denmark. Such as ads and what not like there used to be. And also HIV/AIDS is not looked upon as a deadly illness (which is pretty much fucked up in my mind) but it is looked upon as a chronic illness which is just insane.

So could you please think once more you babble out like that. Since Denmark is NOT USA , when it comes to sexuality and what not. And Danish gay couple (both genders) can now adopt thanks to a law that was voted yes yesterday.

And second of all, when it comes to things you can do in Denmark when it comes to age is coming right up.

15, then you have the sexual age of consent (all genders and sexualities), and you can go to prison if you commit a felony harsh enough (no matter what UN says or doesn´t say) . 16 then you can buy alcohol (and stores and so forth but not pubs and so forth) and buy porn and buy cigarettes, 18 then you can vote marry your partner with your parents consent and you can buy (and drink) alcohol at pubs and what not, legally and you get a drivers license . 21 there you can do all the above and get married without your parents consent.

 

[emap]

Denmark means what in reference to Africa?

In Africa most of the continent is still listening to shamans or medicine men or what the slightly older guy down the road says. Condoms are not a basic taught thing there. Except in the big cities maybe, which there are not that many in relation to the landmass.

Course i know you don't care what the catholic church says about anything, but then again, you apparently are not catholic, the pope happens to be catholic and by definition the most ardent follower of the teachings of the catholic church. To him any catholic using a condom is damned to hell, anyone not catholic is likewise damned to hell. Consider the source, he's the pope, he's catholic, he's not going to go against what the teachings are, in certain respect's he may, for the most part he won't. All part of being religious, which I assumed you understood.

Course heck I assumed you were thinking of what things are like in Africa, not Denmark, apparently your not capable of that either.

 

[Wolfman1982]

emap: I believe we have crossed swords in the past. So I will leave it at that. I think you are most of the time in the GB, and every now and then. You go here to piss people off. So you are duly noted. Or what ever the fuck it is called. But emap, why I said some of it about Denmark. Was that you mentioned, that almost every man who is younger than 24 can´t figure out how the fuck a condom works. So again, that is why mentioned Denmark.
But about the pope, yes he is a catholic. But still he is probably one of the most fucked up ones , they have had in recent periods. And no I am not a catholic, heck I am not even Christian in the common sense of the word. So go figure out that one, and if we haven´t crossed blades before in anger. Then sorry about my assumption. Since I am man enough to check if I fuck up.

 

[DarkBee]

Something I just read (translated from Dutch):

"If you don't play the sport, don't comment on the rules."

 

[Wolfman1982]

Something I just read (translated from Dutch):

"If you don't play the sport, don't comment on the rules."

oh well at least I know the rules

 

[infinity706]

emap: I believe we have crossed swords in the past. So I will leave it at that. I think you are most of the time in the GB, and every now and then. You go here to piss people off. So you are duly noted. Or what ever the fuck it is called. But emap, why I said some of it about Denmark. Was that you mentioned, that almost every man who is younger than 24 can´t figure out how the fuck a condom works. So again, that is why mentioned Denmark.
But about the pope, yes he is a catholic. But still he is probably one of the most fucked up ones , they have had in recent periods. And no I am not a catholic, heck I am not even Christian in the common sense of the word. So go figure out that one, and if we haven´t crossed blades before in anger. Then sorry about my assumption. Since I am man enough to check if I fuck up.

Even here in America there are condom problems despite them being available at any drug store. I've even hooked up with 70 year old guys that didn't even have condoms, nevermind know how to put them on.

 

[John Doe]

emap: I believe we have crossed swords in the past. So I will leave it at that.

You take the Internet way too fucking seriously.

 

[Wolfman1982]

You take the Internet way too fucking seriously.

Yeah, I do. But then again I am tired of fucking bullshit, and what not from those who has a postcount, that looks more like a fucking genocide of posts in comparison.

 

[alaskabibear]

Well, I think I'm going to have to go along with the majority here and say that the attacks on the Pope are at best a waste of ammunition.

Just saw a documentary (think on PBS - but can't remember the program?) - Anyway, while condoms may sound like a good idea to someone not on the ground in Africa, in actuality there are social stigmas and beliefs that make their use not very effective. Not only is the ignorance of how to use them a factor, as has been mentioned above, there is great resistance among the men to use one at all. In general, it seems that the men are raised to believe that "taking" a woman is their manly right. It doesn't matter so much what she wants. Further, the imparting of the man's seed is part of the machismo of the act. There are even some who are taught to believe that having sex with a virgin will cure them of the HIV/AIDS they already have. Obviously these cultural beliefs run counter to the use of condoms.

Also, one shouldn't forget the fact that until just recently the government of South Africa insisted there was no such thing as an HIV/AIDS problem and refused the wide spread use of modern drugs. This attitude appears to be changing. I'll grant that education is of key importance, but that education has to be culturally relevant and start at block one in order to make any significant inroads into the ignorance of the population regarding sexual issues. To willy-nilly hand out condoms as one might in Denmark or San Francisco is to misunderstand the issue.

Thus, I guess the Pope is following the course of the Church which in this issue is to stay the course regarding sexual promiscuity and to reiterate that abstinence is the best practice. In my opinion, it would behoove those who do not understand the Church to refrain from expecting the Pope to suddenly wake up one day and say, "Dayum! I guess we have it all wrong!"... To expect the Church to suddenly change is to simply cause oneself unfruitful frustration...and I like what DarkBee said above; "If you don't play the sport...then don't comment on the rules." (being translated to; "If you're not a Catholic...then don't assume you understand enough to comment on their beliefs.")

 

[Wolfman1982]

Screw the rules. basically when you use a condom. Then basically if you have any kind of penetration and you do not mix blood. Then you are home free from getting HIV/AIDS from sex. And if you are concerned about the condom breaking, then put two condoms on. And what South Africa does is just a load of BS, since OF COURSE they have a fucking AIDS/HIV problem. Then government has just become more fucked up. And me not being a catholic doesn´t do squat. Since it is one of many fucked up fanatic Christian faiths, that makes me stand aside. Heck it is no wonder I am not a Christian in modern sense, with all that fucking mess. put two condoms if you are afraid of getting HIV. But then again the pope we have now is one BIG joke. On one side, he is advocating against any kind of non procreative hanky panky , and on the other the catholic church has shares in the industry so it is filled with double standardised bullshit. So I say fuck them !

 

[DarkBee]

I'd rather go to hell because I used a condom than go to heaven because I've died from AIDS (not that I believe in either afterlife).

 

[alaskabibear]

Screw the rules. basically when you use a condom. Then basically if you have any kind of penetration and you do not mix blood. Then you are home free from getting HIV/AIDS from sex. And if you are concerned about the condom breaking, then put two condoms on. And what South Africa does is just a load of BS, since OF COURSE they have a fucking AIDS/HIV problem. Then government has just become more fucked up. And me not being a catholic doesn´t do squat. Since it is one of many fucked up fanatic Christian faiths, that makes me stand aside. Heck it is no wonder I am not a Christian in modern sense, with all that fucking mess. put two condoms if you are afraid of getting HIV. But then again the pope we have now is one BIG joke. On one side, he is advocating against any kind of non procreative hanky panky , and on the other the catholic church has shares in the industry so it is filled with double standardised bullshit. So I say fuck them !

Sometimes I'm not sure if it's just a language barrier problem or what???Because about 9/10's of the stuff you say doesn't make much sense?

Perhaps you should go over to Africa and straighten all those heathen boys out about how, why and when to use a condom - after all you do make it all sound so simple. And when you get that all wrapped up maybe swing by the Vatican on your way back to Denmark and see if you can't explain to the Pope how he's missed the boat on his understanding Christianity. I mean the world does need someone who can take charge and get this simple stuff knocked off the list - no?

 

[Wolfman1982]

alaskabibear: I am a rambler, and I am a long way from home. But no, we do not have a language barrier. And I know the pope is a dogmatic asshole. But then again condoms are a part of solution against AIDS, not the cure. But the pope just steps on only real thing we have against getting it. and yes I know about the stuff about raping a virgin and what not, is going on in that continent. But it just makes it worse, when popey begins to go out and fuck it up. Okay ?

 

[none2_none2]

"...condoms are a part of solution against AIDS, not the cure. But the pope just steps on only real thing we have against getting it..."

Wolfman, your two sentences don't make sense together. Yes, condoms are part of a solution against catching AIDS. However, condoms are not the only thing we have against getting AIDS. There is also abstinence and there is monogamy between non-infected individuals.

I have been in a monogamous relationship for more than 6.5 years. I think it is great that there are people out there who use condoms. However, to negate other alternatives is just as wrong as the pope rejecting condoms.

You also have to realize that condoms aren't for everybody. First of all, as a man gets older erections aren't quit as stiff as they are in youth -- with the exception of the blue pills. Condoms are not as easy to work with if you aren't completely erect. Likewise, skin to skin contact always involves stronger sensations. Even the thinnest condoms in the world cannot compare to the sensations of skin on skin.

Again, I am not condemning condoms. I'm simply stating that they are other alternatives.

 

[Wolfman1982]

none2_none2: I agree with you when two people who are tested and monogamous and they love each other. And they have only sex with each other. But perhaps it is a personal experience (actually my first) that is why I am pro condom, and so anti pope . But I was tested three months after my first love, and the test was negative. But I had learned a lesson, that is why I am so pro condom.