Are women real?

[peterpan]

Thats a title that can be misconstrued as a little contentious.

Oh well.

People always joke about guys pretending to be women on the internet. The first woman I ever spoke to on the internet was a transexual so I assume both are actually pretty common. I am not really sure what I think about it. On one hand it almost does not seem to matter, like the old "if a tree falls in the wood, does it make a sound."

Then there is ICQ. Barely a day goes by without someone called cindy or mandy or sally inviting me to look at her amateur webcam. I actually do not know what is on the other end of those links because I just assumed it would go to a site that is selling something. It would be cool to discover that, once they feel they have a safe environment, women do in fact blossom into these incredible perverts just like me.. Hell, if I had a nice pair of breasts that the law forces me to hide in public I would be bound to just email them around the place anonymously: "Ha-Ha! look what I've got Nyah-Nyah!"

What is your take on it?

 

[riff]

yes they are real.

Here. Smell my finger.

 

[Andreina]

*pinching myself* ouchies Yes, I'm real.

Halo - 4 real

 

[MunchinMark]

If you're disinclined to trust the persona that people use online, how could you ever know? If someone was pretending to be a woman online (i.e. not telling the truth) then when you ask if the women online are really women, the actors (not necessarily a malicious lie you see) aren't that likely to say 'no I'm a six foot tall bricklayer called John'.

Come to think of it some of the real women might be inclined to say that though.

 

[peterpan]

I can understand you being very proud, riff, but sooner or later you will have to wash your hands.

Little Devil, I pinch myself all the time and I am not real.

Didn't quite get your point, munchkin. You are affirming that it is impossible to know, but adding the mild implication that any discomfort in the matter is earned by having a distrustful personality. This is also probably true. Do you mean that your take is of the "tree falls in the woods" variety?

 

[KillerVanity]

damn it

MTF transsexuals are women. They aren't "pretending" to be women, they are "REAL" women. In their minds and hearts they are female, so why can't people respect that? If she was born with or still has a penis, that doesn't make her any less of a lady. GRRR.

 

[cymbidia]

peterpan...
well, well, well.

You've been gone a good long time, haven't you?
Are you back now or just popping in to say hello?

 

[Tim1]

Tough question

Let me ask my left hand......Hand says yes they are real.

 

[MissTaken]

Well, my breasts hurt, I am eating chocolate like crazy and want to cry at the drop of a hat.

Yep, I am all woman!


Oops! This isn't the Menstrual Hut.

I must have taken a wrong turn at Kansas City

 

[patient1]

text tinier than tinkerbelle's ta-tas

Well Peter Pan, Women are real, but only if you believe & clap your hands together 3 times.

 

[BlondGirl]

I think there are only 3 other women here besides myself that are real. Really Old Lady, KillerMuffin, and Marxist.

 

[cymbidia]

BG?
BeeeeeeeeeeeeeeGeeeeeeeeeeeeee?

I'm real too, right?
Right?
Can't i be real along with you and Muff and ROL and Marxist... MARXIST?

If Marxist is a real woman then i'm damn sure a real woman, too!

 

[Samuari]

BG?
BeeeeeeeeeeeeeeGeeeeeeeeeeeeee?

I'm real too, right?
Right?
Can't i be real along with you and Muff and ROL and Marxist... MARXIST?

If Marxist is a real woman then i'm damn sure a real woman, too!

Well we know that he is offeneded if you think that he is gay... so?

 

[peterpan]

peterpan...
well, well, well.

You've been gone a good long time, haven't you?
Are you back now or just popping in to say hello?

Hi cymbidia,
Yes I just sort of collapsed for a while. I have perfected the forwards (vanilla) collapse, the reverse collapse, and the half-pike-turn then-collapse. Been doing other stuff too. I came back originally because I just wanted to spill out some corny space-opera somewhere, and hung around to be opinionated.

 

[peterpan]

Hey I think y'all misunderstood

I am not asking people to confirm that they are women, its not really my concern.

I am just wondering how you personally deal with not knowing. eg does it simply not bother you, and if so is this because you are bisexual or because this is the internet and it does not matter; alternatively, does it bother you?

 

[peterpan]

Re: damn it

MTF transsexuals are women. They aren't "pretending" to be women, they are "REAL" women. In their minds and hearts they are female, so why can't people respect that? If she was born with or still has a penis, that doesn't make her any less of a lady. GRRR.

KillerVanity, these issues of semantics bore me slightly. If you have another word other than real that makes me think "Oh, that is less ambiguous" then I will probably use it. But I am not going to start calling women that are not transexuals "permanently phallicly disadvanaged." The first purpose of language should be to be understood, not to be appropriate or polite.

Choice of partner is something that you are allowed to be sexist about. You must accept that to most men it is very important whether their date has a penis or not. At least in real life. On the internet, well that is what I am asking.

 

[KillerVanity]

somebody has to defend transsexual rights around here

KillerVanity, these issues of semantics bore me slightly. If you have another word other than real that makes me think "Oh, that is less ambiguous" then I will probably use it. But I am not going to start calling women that are not transexuals "permanently phallicly disadvanaged." The first purpose of language should be to be understood, not to be appropriate or polite.

Choice of partner is something that you are allowed to be sexist about. You must accept that to most men it is very important whether their date has a penis or not. At least in real life. On the internet, well that is what I am asking.

If you want to be cock or cunt oriented, fine. Women may have one, or both, or have been born with one and now have another. It's really not an issue if you state, "I would like a cunt." However, that means that you could also get somebody who appears to be male.

You don't need to be so damned condascneding, either. It is not just being "polite" to call transsexuals women, it is correct. I wouldn't call them male any less than I would call myself female.

 

[MissTaken]

Re: Hey I think y'all misunderstood

I am not asking people to confirm that they are women, its not really my concern.

I am just wondering how you personally deal with not knowing. eg does it simply not bother you, and if so is this because you are bisexual or because this is the internet and it does not matter; alternatively, does it bother you?

Sorry, was just having a little fun with the question, peterpan.

I have met men on line who wanted me to send them a voice message before even getting to know me.

I think these men have been burned badly by misrepresentation.

As for the people I meet, this may sound callous, but they aren't "real" to me for some time. When they become "real", friends or whatever, I have chatted with them or posted with them enough to recognize that they are not likely to be anything other than what and whom they say they are.

I am pretty quick about picking out inconsistencies and half truths that would make me believe someone isn't being honest.

I am friendly to all, but their gender doesn't really matter in the beginning. After all, how many hundreds, perhaps thousands of people do we meet on line and how many remain our friends?

The sampling is so small as to make me not care or get too involved in the beginning.

 

[MunchinMark]

Yes Peter Pan, that is pretty much what I was saying. If they aren't telling you the truth then they aren't going to admit it. You aren't likely to meet them (especially if they're lying) so you might as well believe that everyone is the gender that they say they are.

And if a tree falls in a forest, somewone will always be there to hear, even if it is a squirrel who is wondering why everything is flying upwards.

 

[peterpan]

The point that reality is earnt is a good one. Unfortunately I suspect I would not know myself. You could say that what you don't know won't hurt you.. but I wish I could use the internet to learn how women feel, in an environment where they feel safe to express their feelings and therefore I feel safe to ask about them.

KillerVanity I am not hung up about the use of the term "Real Woman." I don't consider myself a "Real man." This to me is semantics. The point that transends semantics is that to use a word (that for the sake of argument is correct) to a person that you know will misunderstand it, is a lie. A lie is in many cases acceptable by my morality, eg a lie to protect your privacy from impertinant interrogations. However a lie to gain intimacy from someone whos feelings (however irrational to you) you have dismissed is a betrayal.

 

[peterpan]

Yes Peter Pan, that is pretty much what I was saying. If they aren't telling you the truth then they aren't going to admit it. You aren't likely to meet them (especially if they're lying) so you might as well believe that everyone is the gender that they say they are.

I think the thought that I find most upsetting is the possibility that a personality that you have confided in suddenly reveals itself to never have been genuine in any affection it expressed. This could be a guy playing a joke, a transexual that values your intimacy only as a trophy, or a woman doing either of those things. Just an insecurity that I have.

I would prefer not to open up to a transexual honestly seeking intimacy, but I guess finally it is nice to give anyone pleasure, and I would still have had the experience of opening my heart. In that case the feeling would be more one of "Rats. Oh well."

 

[KillerVanity]

KillerVanity I am not hung up about the use of the term "Real Woman." I don't consider myself a "Real man." This to me is semantics. The point that transends semantics is that to use a word (that for the sake of argument is correct) to a person that you know will misunderstand it, is a lie. A lie is in many cases acceptable by my morality, eg a lie to protect your privacy from impertinant interrogations. However a lie to gain intimacy from someone whos feelings (however irrational to you) you have dismissed is a betrayal.

The only reason I brought it up is because you specifically used transsexuals as an example of somebody "pretending" to be a woman in the original post. It would be different if you had said that the first person you talked to on the Internet claimed to be a woman but later confessed to actually be male.

Honestly, I don't know what kind of answer you're looking for here. It seems like the entire world is on the Internet, so your chances are pretty good that you'll be talking to a female who, in reality, is female (biological or not). Also, there's always the aspect of fantasy. A man who just wants to play around and say he's a woman, enjoying the attention he gets from it, but then get bored and reveal himself to whomever he had been talking to. Is that really such a crime?

 

[KillerVanity]

what. the. fuck.

Originally posted by peterpan
I think the thought that I find most upsetting is the possibility that a personality that you have confided in suddenly reveals itself to never have been genuine in any affection it expressed. This could be a guy playing a joke, a transexual that values your intimacy only as a trophy, or a woman doing either of those things. Just an insecurity that I have.

I can't believe what a fucking transphobic you are. I really should have known better, by the way you danced around my explanations about why transsexuals ARE women.

You're acting like just because a person takes the RISK to tell you that she wasn't born with female body she's making a joke at your expense. It takes courage to tell somebody that -- even on the Internet, where anonymity rules. Did you ever think that she was actually valuing you as a friend and confidante, and not just playing with you?

 

[peterpan]

Um sorry KillerVanity, I think you really did misinterpret that one. I did not imply that it is common behavior for a transexual or that a transexual telling a man that they are a transexual demonstrates that they only valued that man's affection as a trophy. I really don't claim to have the experience to know. Well actually I have had exactly one previous experience and that is how it went. Apparently. There is obviously much room for confusion here.

But yes, I guess I am dancing around the definitions. We don't agree on the meanings of words and my feelings insult you so, as much as is possible, I am keeping them to myself.

Hey, I often wish I was a woman myself. As a guy all I do is offend people.

 

[Natalie Nessus]

I think it is women who know who are not women? It is the men that can not tell, perhaps