Are they Real ?

[Handley_Page]

Westboro is at it again:-

http://www.military.com/news/article/westboro-protests-seal-funeral-procession.html?ESRC=airforce-a.nl

I don't get it. In the UK we have "bye-laws" (enacted locally for and by the local residents), which can control this nonsense.

I'd love to know who's funding this case:-

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703735804575536571427160514.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

Perhaps some kind soul would explain this matter in small, simple step for me?

 

[Boota]

They have a Constitutional guarantee to go around acting like jackasses. The US Supreme Court is looking into the matter, but I don't think there is anything that can be legally done to stop them.

 

[cloudy]

Actually, they said on the news this morning that they're a chance that the SC might rule in the plaintiff's (not W.Baptist) favor.

 

[Stella_Omega]

That second article does explain the issue in small, simple, steps. Not the steps I would like it to take, but that's life.

 

[Boota]

The Westboro Baptists may be the most repugnant slugs on the planet, but I don't like the idea of silencing them in this manner. It sucks and they're horrible people, but it's an actual slippery slope with this issue. (Everyone uses the slippery slope argument, but in this case it's real.) I wonder how the Supreme Court will get around the inherent conflict concerning their Freedom of Speech.

 

[cloudy]

The Westboro Baptists may be the most repugnant slugs on the planet, but I don't like the idea of silencing them in this manner. It sucks and they're horrible people, but it's an actual slippery slope with this issue. (Everyone uses the slippery slope argument, but in this case it's real.) I wonder how the Supreme Court will get around the inherent conflict concerning their Freedom of Speech.

I think they're looking at it from this angle:

Although freedom of speech IS protected, there's nothing in our constitution that gives people the right to picket/protest individuals, as opposed to businesses, etc.

Their freedom of speech is infringing on another's right to mourn privately.

 

[TheeGoatPig]

I have said many times (not just here, other places as well), that it will take "vigilante justice" or a stupid accident to stop them.

Of course that won't stop some other group of idiots from being a bunch of loudmouth, blathering bigots across the country.

 

[Boota]

I think they're looking at it from this angle:

Although freedom of speech IS protected, there's nothing in our constitution that gives people the right to picket/protest individuals, as opposed to businesses, etc.

Their freedom of speech is infringing on another's right to mourn privately.

I think that's a great exception to have, as long as it stops there. Sounds perfectly reasonable, I just hope it doesn't lead to further sanctions against free speech. It's dangerous to eliminate any unpopular speech.

When they protested a funeral here in my hometown they were very disappointed. Everyone pretty much ignored them and the funeral home was separated from the road so the family couldn't see them. That probably damaged their egos a bit.

 

[oggbashan]

In the UK they could be repeatedly and successfully sued for libel.

They would probably be arrested and prosecuted for public order offences every time they appeared.

Og

 

[SeaCat]

The Supreme Court is thinking about how far one may carry the "Freedom of Speech".

In this case I have to side with (shudder) the Westboro Baptists as much as I find them repulsive. (I would love to meet up with one or several of them in a back alley.)

According to our rights here in the United States they can say what they want as long as they don't infringe on the rights of others or endanger them. They have done neither. (Although I am surprised groups like the A.C.L.U. haven't taken them to court about some of their signs.)

Cat

 

[Stella_Omega]

I recollect that Cat once found a pressing need to turn on his lawn sprinklers, despite the gathering of Phelpses right there. Tsk.

As I recall it was already raining, too. Tsk Tsk.

AS I further recall, the lawn system was hooked into a sewage recyling system which imbued a certain amount of scent in the water...

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

HAAAAHAHAHA!

 

[LaRocha]

They're pretty random in their funeral picketing. Ronnie James Dio, soldiers, college kids who die, Michael Jackson, some guy who was killed on a bus in Canada. I don't think the First Amendment was designed to protect what they're doing. There's no right to harass individual citizens in the Constitution, the rights are about government harassment of citizens. But there are plenty of laws preventing citizens from harassing each other, plenty of infringing on the rights of others going on here.

KKK usually gets permission to protest from the town or city, then they have their rally with police protection, there's a counter rally and it's over. Or someone writes and distributes anti-holocaust or anti-government pamphlets through the US postal service. No problem with that stuff, it's not the immediate harassment of going to someone's funeral service and shouting. American courts are mostly sickening in their interpretation of law. If someone stood in the street in front of my house and called me a faggot for serving, I'm pretty sure the cops would come and make them leave. This doesn't make sense to me, why the cops in whatever town didn't just tell them to leave and arrest them if they resisted.

 

[favoritesgoddess]

I'm pretty sure there's a special place in hell for Pastor Phelps and his flock.

 

[Handley_Page]

I'm pretty sure there's a special place in hell for Pastor Phelps and his flock.

Can you imagine the signs and protests at his funeral ?

 

[SeaCat]

I recollect that Cat once found a pressing need to turn on his lawn sprinklers, despite the gathering of Phelpses right there. Tsk.

As I recall it was already raining, too. Tsk Tsk.

AS I further recall, the lawn system was hooked into a sewage recyling system which imbued a certain amount of scent in the water...

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

HAAAAHAHAHA!

Yep, you remember correctly.

Like I said, I defend their right of free speech, but I don't have to like them. (I personally find them to be without honor as well as repuslive and ignorant and would love to meet a couple of them in a dark alley.)

Cat

 

[TE999]

The WBC's 'congregation'...mostly members, relatives and in-laws of the Phelps family...are hate-filled bigots of the lowest order. The truly appalling thing is they are convinced they're doing "The Lord's Work'. How anyone who's that twisted can call themself a Christian boggles my mind.

Here's Wiki's article on the WBC:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church

 

[cloudy]

Christianity has a long, bloody history of hate.

 

[Loring2]

They're pretty random in their funeral picketing. Ronnie James Dio, soldiers, college kids who die, Michael Jackson, some guy who was killed on a bus in Canada. I don't think the First Amendment was designed to protect what they're doing. There's no right to harass individual citizens in the Constitution, the rights are about government harassment of citizens. But there are plenty of laws preventing citizens from harassing each other, plenty of infringing on the rights of others going on here.

KKK usually gets permission to protest from the town or city, then they have their rally with police protection, there's a counter rally and it's over. Or someone writes and distributes anti-holocaust or anti-government pamphlets through the US postal service. No problem with that stuff, it's not the immediate harassment of going to someone's funeral service and shouting. American courts are mostly sickening in their interpretation of law. If someone stood in the street in front of my house and called me a faggot for serving, I'm pretty sure the cops would come and make them leave. This doesn't make sense to me, why the cops in whatever town didn't just tell them to leave and arrest them if they resisted.

The First Amendment has nothing to do with harassment or anything else other than the freedom of speech and that no matter how despicable the speech... and this speech is about as vile and despicable as it can get.

... and yes, I sure that if a group stood on the street and shouted to call you a faggot for your military service that the police would intervene but not because of First Amendment prohibitions or limitations.

The First Amendment guarantees free speech and if you want to change that than why not begin a petition to amend the First Amendment. That's the legal way.

Loring

 

[Boota]

I can't wait for the KKK to rally here again. I want to go down and get my picture taken with Klansmen in the background while I'm holding a "KILL WHITEY" sign. I just want that picture for myself, but it may end up on the back of a book or an album cover.