Antonym for progressive

LIBERALS

•"In every American community you have varying shades of political opinion. One of the shadiest of these is the LIBERALS. An outspoken group on many subjects - ten degrees to the left of center in good times, and ten degrees to the right of center if it affects them personally." --Phil Ochs
•"A LIBERAL is someone who has just changed their mind." --Morton Thompson
•"A LIBERAL is a man too broadminded to take his own side in a quarrel. --Robert Frost
•"A LIBERAL is a RADICAL with a wife and child." --Anon.
•"A RADICAL is a CONSERVATIVE out of a job." --Richmond News Ledger
•"A PACIFIST is one who fights with everybody but the enemy." --Anon.
•"COMMUNISM is the exploitation of the strong by the weak." --P.J. Proudhom
•"COMMUNISM doesn't work because people like to own stuff." --Frank Zappa
•"SOCIALISTS suffer from an overwhelming compulsion to believe what is not true." --H.L. Mencken
•"SOCIALISM is a system which is workable only in Heaven, where it isn't needed, and in Hell, where they've got it." --Cecil Palmer

“ Sure, once I was young and impulsive,
I wore every conceivable pin,
Even went to the socialist meetings,
Learned all the old union hymns,
But I've grown older and wiser,
And that's why I'm turning you in,
So love me, love me, love me, I'm a liberal.
--Phil Ochs”

CONSERVATIVES

•"A CONSERVATIVE is a man who is too cowardly to fight and too fat to run." --Elbert Hubbard
•"A CONSERVATIVE is one who admires RADICALS a century after they're dead." --Leo C. Rosten
•"CONSERVATIVES say government doesn't work, and then get elected and prove it." --P.J. O'Rourke
•"All CONSERVATISM is based upon the idea that if you leave things alone you leave them as they are. But you do not. If you leave a thing alone, you leave it to a torrent of change." --G.K. Chesterton
•"CONSERVATIVE: a statesman who is enamoured of existing evils, as distinguished from the LIBERAL, who wishes to replace them with others." --Ambrose Bierce
•"Reform is affirmative, CONSERVATISM negative; CONSERVATISM goes for comfort, reform for truth." --Ralph Waldo Emerson
•"The CONSERVATIVE is a businessman's candidate, hovering around the status quo like a sick kitten around a hot brick." --William A. White
•"A CONSERVATIVE is one who believes that nothing should be done for the first time." --Alfred E. Wiggam
•"CONSERVATIVES are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are CONSERVATIVES." --John Stuart Mill
•"We CONSERVATIVES do not believe it necessary, and even if it were, we should oppose it." --Quentin Hogg
•"A CONSERVATIVE is someone who makes no changes and consults his grandmother when in doubt." --Woodrow Wilson
•"Suppose you were a heartless bastard, and suppose you were a CONSERVATIVE, but, .....I repeat myself." --Mark Twain
•"A CONSERVATIVE is a man who will not look at the new moon out of respect for that ancient institution, the old one." --Douglas Jerrold
•"A shiver ran through the CONSERVATIVES, frantically looking for a spine to run up." --Oliver Brown

ULTRA-CONSERVATIVES

•"A FASCIST is someone who kills because he can't argue." --Anon.
•"FASCISM is Capitalism plus murder." --Upton Sinclair
•"Fascism is corporatism." --Benito Mussolini
•"FASCISM means war." --John Strachey
•"The ANARCHIST is responsible only to himself; the FASCIST is responsible only to the state." --Anon.
•"FASCISM is a religion; the twentieth century will be known in history as the century of FASCISM." --Benito Mussolini
•"A FASCIST is any person whose politics elevates the importance of one's nation, or Fatherland, above all humanist values such as television and Spring Break." --Anon.

LIBERALS vs. CONSERVATIVES

•"When CONSERVATIVES ruin the environment, destroy the supply of affordable housing, and wreck the industrial infrastructure, at least they make a buck off it. LIBERALS do these things just for fun." --P.J. O'Rourke
•"The LIBERAL Arts are those studies necessary to be a free person. The opposite of LIBERAL is not CONSERVATIVE, but ENSLAVED." --Anon.
•"A RADICAL is a man who has both feet planted firmly in the air... A CONSERVATIVE is a man with two perfectly good legs who has never learned to walk." --F.D. Roosevelt
•"LIBERALS like Big Government, as long as it helps people. (Social programs, etc.) CONSERVATIVES like Big Government, as long as it kills people. (Cops, armies, etc.) --Anon.
•"I never dared be RADICAL when young / For fear it would make me CONSERVATIVE when old." --Robert Frost
•"Every COMMUNIST has a FASCIST frown, every FASCIST has a COMMUNIST smile." --Muriel Spark
•"A SOCIAL DEMOCRAT believes that all men are equal, as long as they are union members, while a CHRISTIAN DEMOCRAT believes that all men are equal, as long as they are Catholics." --Anon.
•"I'm a staunch Independant. Every time I think I am a Republican, they do something greedy, and every time I think I am a Democrat, they go and do something stupid." --Jay Leno
•"The difference between REPUBLICANS and DEMOCRATS is like the difference between Syphilis and Gonorrhea." --Barbara Jordon
•"The smart woman will fuck a LIBERAL but marry a CONSERVATIVE." --Anon.

“When asked why he was a Democrat, the Southerner replies, "Because my father was a Democrat and my grandfather was a Democrat." The Northerner countered, "What if your father was a horse thief and your grandfather was a horse thief, what would you have been then?" The Southerner's reply: "In that case, I guess I'd be a Republican." --Theodore Roosevelt”

TELLING THE DIFFERENCE

•An American who wants to protect the environment is a Tree-Hugging LIBERAL, unless they hunt animals, in which case they're CONSERVATIVE.
•An American who supports the right to keep and bear arms is CONSERVATIVE, unless they belong to the Black or Brown or Yellow Panthers, in which case they are dangerously RADICAL.
•An American who opposes large military forces and expenditures is LIBERAL, unless they lived before 1940, in which case they were CONSERVATIVE.
•An American who wants religious faith to be prominent in public life is a staunch CONSERVATIVE, unless they aren't a Judeo-Xian-Muslim believer, in which case they are an air-head NEW-AGE RADICAL.
•An American who wants government oversight of private decisions is LIBERAL, unless they oppose abortion, in which case they are religious RIGHT-WING RADICALS.
•An American who wants lower income-tax withholding is CONSERVATIVE, but one who wants lower social-security withholding is LIBERAL.
•An American who supports equality for women is a LIBERAL Feminist, unless they're a Republican campaign consultant who wants their candidate to win, in which case they're a Pragmatic CONSERVATIVE.
•An American who supports their local police is CONSERVATIVE, unless the local police are dealing drugs, in which case they're LIBERTATIAN.
•An American who believes "the least government is the best government" is either a LIBERTATIAN CONSERVATIVE or a RADICAL ANARCHIST, depending on their dress and income.

GENERALIZATIONS

•Those who care about people before they are born are CONSERVATIVES; those who care about people after they are born are LIBERALS.
•Those who believe in a strong military are PATRIOTS, unless they've personally avoided military service, in which case they are CHICKENHAWKS.
•Those who want strict limits to immigration are CONSERVATIVES, unless they want to exclude your particular ethnic group, in which case they are RACISTS
•Those who want unlimited immigration are LIBERALS, unless they want cheap labor to exploit, in which case they are CONSERVATIVE CAPITALISTS. Or if they want purple cows to inflate, in which case they are SURREALISTS.
•Those who want to display the Ten Commandments in public places are CONSERVATIVES; but different sects can't agree on just which version to use. And then there are those who want the QURAN or DIAMOND SUTRA or NECRONIMOCON posted...
•Those who believe in a corporate state are FASCISTS, unless they back the current administration, in which case they are PRAGMATISTS.
•Those who disagree with you are COMMUNISTS, unless you're a COMMUNIST, in which case they are FASCISTS. Or unless you're an ATHEIST, in which case they're RELIGIOUS FANATICS. Or unless you're a VEGETARIAN, in which case they're CARNIVORES. Et cetera.

“The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary. —H.L. Mencken”
 
Since when was government control over an entire industry ever not socialism??
USA military is totally socialist. Live with it.

EDIT: Y'all apparently didn't read my prior post. To summarize: GOPs are gutless fuckards and Dems are witless fuckrards. GOPs are evil; Dems are merely stupid. My Green membership makes me totally irrelevant. Boo hoo.
 
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Liberal, progessive, socialist, conservative. Just words and labels.

I support gun prohibition and UHC. I'm Canadian. Those two things are about the only thing we have over the Yanks. They deal with those two issues and our abject superiority over them will be severely dented. The racial thing is sorta moot in the GWN. No fairly big visible minority to discriminate against. Not country wide anyway. Not near enough natives for to actually be able to lay any blame on them for shit. I'm sure we would if we could. Some areas do.

Law and order will be helped by the gun prohibition. A good government will offer the peace to raise a family or just live in but it requires a fair bit of order.

UHC could very well push the US past Canada on the socialist side of western social democracies. The poor really benefit by it and their health increases. It is not anymore expensive than private systems.

A conservative police state which promotes liberal socialist ideas.

The whole Apple fight. Privacy concerns are not usually discussed up here. Not amongst general population. The fact Canadian banks in the US charge far lower service charges than they do up here. Bitched about but as long as the reputation for stability our banks enjoy is intact. It's just bitching.

Order and stability (long run societal shit)
 
USA military is totally socialist. Live with it.

EDIT: Y'all apparently didn't read my prior post. To summarize: GOPs are gutless fuckards and Dems are witless fuckrards. GOPs are evil; Dems are merely stupid. My Green membership makes me totally irrelevant. Boo hoo.

This is not true.

It is one of the few true responsibilities of government: defense of the Constitution.
 
I support gun prohibition and UHC. I'm Canadian. Those two things are about the only thing we have over the Yanks. They deal with those two issues and our abject superiority over them will be severely dented. The racial thing is sorta moot in the GWN. No fairly big visible minority to discriminate against. Not country wide anyway. Not near enough natives for to actually be able to lay any blame on them for shit. I'm sure we would if we could. Some areas do.

Law and order will be helped by the gun prohibition. A good government will offer the peace to raise a family or just live in but it requires a fair bit of order.

UHC could very well push the US past Canada on the socialist side of western social democracies. The poor really benefit by it and their health increases. It is not anymore expensive than private systems.

A conservative police state which promotes liberal socialist ideas.

The whole Apple fight. Privacy concerns are not usually discussed up here. Not amongst general population. The fact Canadian banks in the US charge far lower service charges than they do up here. Bitched about but as long as the reputation for stability our banks enjoy is intact. It's just bitching.

Order and stability (long run societal shit)

In other words, to go back to my earlier post, which passed by without comment, you seem to be in favor of the government (tribal) ownership of the individual over the idea that government defends liberty and property.
 
This is not true.

It is one of the few true responsibilities of government: defense of the Constitution.

It's "defense of the nation", but let's not quibble.

Now then, if "providin' for the common defense" (i.e. Teh Military) is NOT socialistical because it's one of the "few true responsibilities of government", why doesn't health care fall under the same umbrella, since it's "promotin' the general welfare"?

Hmmmm?
 
The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few and even the one.

A good government recognizes the individual. We are not talking totalitarianism like Nazi Germany or Communist Russia. Both who required the individual to suborn themselves to either the state itself or the people as represented by the state. They were not good governments. Both were flawed economically in the long run and required violence to be maintained. They brought order and that was it. No peace and no good government.

The state does not decree the individual suborn some of their rights and privileges. The individual grants them to a good government in exchange for the peace and order required to raise a family or live free.

It is not the governments job to grant life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Too utopian. The good government creates the conditions that allow the people, the individual to pursue happiness. That requires peace. And peace usually goes along with a degree of order.
 
The socialists I know don't want me to have a gun, use salt, or drink soda. If that's the kind of freedom you have - what the socialists allow - you can keep it.

So you'd gladly move to Flint Michigan and enjoy teh "Freedom Water" up there? :rolleyes:
 
The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few and even the one.

A good government recognizes the individual. We are not talking totalitarianism like Nazi Germany or Communist Russia. Both who required the individual to suborn themselves to either the state itself or the people as represented by the state. They were not good governments. Both were flawed economically in the long run and required violence to be maintained. They brought order and that was it. No peace and no good government.

The state does not decree the individual suborn some of their rights and privileges. The individual grants them to a good government in exchange for the peace and order required to raise a family or live free.

It is not the governments job to grant life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Too utopian. The good government creates the conditions that allow the people, the individual to pursue happiness. That requires peace. And peace usually goes along with a degree of order.

I understand the argument. However, when you say that, then while the rest of what you say is "Liberal/Libertarian," none of it matters, because it is then boilerplate, for what your original statement, unless I get your wrong, and if I do, please correct me, is that the individual always owes his allegiance to the group/tribe/nation. In this one proclamation, you say that you owe to the government your life (even if it is just a portion).

When you say that their needs are more important than mine, in the context of government, which is, to borrow a phrase, not eloquence, but force, then after that it is only a matter of degree how much of your life they can confiscate by decree...

;) ;)

There is black and white, and if you refuse to believe that, then you will accept grey and let me tell you gray tends to black for when you say ∃ of anything is a good function of government then ∃ is everything ¬∀ and while you may be able to advocate for ∃ you won't be allowed to define it and in this manner its limit will be ∀ for ∑f(∪∃)i [i=from you to the total population] will never tend to ∅ by definition so it is easy to see that it is, indeed, an ∀ or ∅ when it comes to government. (Now, the ∑f(∩∃)i [i=from you to the total population] will tend to ∅ but that is politically unattainable for the obvious reason that the more ∃ is defined, the smaller the ∩∃ becomes.)
A_J, the Stupid
 
the individual always owes his allegiance to the group/tribe/nation.

That's what makes us a social creature. How does the honey bee fair on her own. The lone wolf. The ant. Why fight in the defence of your country? Roll over and life will go on. Why have any ideas that pertain to anything but yourself.

The group. How about family. What is more important your life or your family's? Intercede in an attack on a senior? Why? You have some allegiance to a society that protects the weak? Are any laws inviolate then?

We are social animals. We form groups, tribes and nations. For communal support and protection. We chose governments to organize trade and facilitate services.

The best groups are run on consensus. You may object to the majority but you go along. Or you leave the group. That is the usual outcome unless you like being unpopular. Or hold to your principles that tightly.
 
This is not true.

It is one of the few true responsibilities of government: defense of the Constitution.

Yes it is.

The US's defense industry is socialism on pretty much every fucking level possible. And the military itself is as close to pure communism as it gets. Absolute total government/bureaucratic control over every fucking second of your existence. No better or worse than anyone else in the same pay grade with the same time in service and as much individualism run out of you as possible.

Just because it's socialism you approve of doesn't magically make it not socialism.
 
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