An age issue in fiction?

[Sateema Lunasi]

I am curious, and please know that this is not a complain and does not have to do with Lit, but I am curious...

In published fiction, I have read many novels which deal with an underage (under 18) person (usually the female) having sexual relations with an older man (often in his 30's or 40's) and these novels are accepted as mainstream literature, in fact most are Best Sellers. I will use an example, the novel Belinda, by Anne Rampling (Anne Rice) has a fifteen year old girl having explicit sexual relationship with a 45 year old man, and the relationship even turns out abusive with no moral ending. The girl stayed with the guy and it is all glamour and romance. How is it that Belinda, which has scenes as explicit as the stories in Lit, is accepted in mainstream fiction, but one cannot write a story involving a 17 year old on Lit?

My question is not a Lit issue, keep in mind. It is simply a curiosity. And I am not condoning underage sex in stories...I am just baffled at the legal double standard.

Any commentary?

 

[MaxSebastian]

I think it's something to do with the literature vs pornography debate. Do you classify the stories here on literotica as literature or pornography? You see those in the know would say that 'literature' should never be censored or limited in any way, so writers who are producing literature go on challenging the boundaries and so on. Nabokov's Lolita is the classic example - if anyone wanted to ban that, the culture vultures would be out in force citing freedom of speech issues and so on.

But pornography is a different matter - it is an exploitative term, which is why many writers here on literotica don't like it - and having underage characters associated with such a term is a big no-no. No one would get out there campaigning for pornographers to be able to use underage subjects.

Literotica as a site has the 18 rule for simplicity sake more than anything, I think. No legal guys can come calling here saying there's underage characters involved in pornography here, whatever the debate as to literature vs pornography.

Anne Rice can get out there and publish whatever she likes and can call it literature. When you're a mainstream widely published writer, you can do anything and call it literature. There are different guidelines for people like that.

 

[KillerMuffin]

In a phrase "John Ashcroft."

Call it hypocracy. No matter how old you are, you can go check out Anne Rice or a romance novel, all with explicit underage sex in it, at your local library, but oh my gawd if you see the same thing on the web it's porn and kids might see it.

I think Laurel picked 18 cause the age of consent in the US is generally 18 and it feels a lot safer for the time the powers that be decide crusading against "porn" is the way to go. Nevermind that they engage in it themselves.

 

[MysteryWriter]

I think therefore I am

It is an owner's choice kind of thing I am sure. I can think of at least three or four other lit sites without this prohibition. They have others even more restrictive in some cases. It is my guess that the rules are dictated more by the owner's feelings, than existing laws concerning the written word.

I appreciate the place to post my humble efforts. I try to live by the rules of the site where I post, whatever they might be. A story may not be suitable here but somewhere else on the net it is fine. It just takes a little bobbing and weaving to place them all in their best place.

I actually got ran off one site because my work wasn't pornographic can you imagine that. rofl It couldn't have been my personality.

 

[Sateema Lunasi]

Like I said, I am not talking about Lit. I am just baffled at why the hell a 14 year old can buy Anne Rice's Sleeping Beauty Trilogy (I bought them when I was 14) which has a fifteen year old Beauty giving head to a pack of soldiers, getting anal, doing lesbian three ways and doing heavy bondage scenes, but if you put the same thing on the internet, you'd be a pervert, no matter what site you put it on. (sigh)

As for porn VS literature on Lit, here is my opinion. Most of the stories on Lit are porn. But if you sift through them, you find some that are literature. Good literature.

I think literature, or just the basic word story, is a piece that actually has a story, and not just a scene of someone getting banged. But there is literature here if you look for it.

 

[Axeltheswede]

Age Issue in Fiction

First, I agree you can have a beautiful love story between a man in his forties and a girl of 15. By the way, Max, Lolita has been on countless banned books lists in the U.S. since it was first published, and still is.

I think the issue here on Lit is when you lower the age limit for a story in Erotic Couplings you also lower it for every other category. The result would be underage characters in Non-Consent, Incest, etc. I agree with where the line is drawn. We all would like to have the widest possible audience. The 18 rule is inclusive for a large majority of erotica readers.

On the porno vs erotica debate, the arguments are endless. We all know porno when we see it. Coming up with a definition even two people could agree on is tough.

I'm glad you brought up this question. I am interested to see what other authors say on this issue.

 

[MysteryWriter]

Of two minds...

(1) Some things with people underage are pretty disgusting...
(2) How many people do you know who made it to 18 as virgins...

 

[MaxSebastian]

Re: Age Issue in Fiction

By the way, Max, Lolita has been on countless banned books lists in the U.S. since it was first published, and still is.

And so are books like The Origin of the Species by Charles Darwin, but that's just the ker-rayzee messed up way it is in some parts of the liberty-lovin' US of A!

Remember, folks, we were put here by evolution.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrggggggggghhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!

The horror! The horror! Quick... someone get me the Bible... and a shotgun...

 

[Axeltheswede]

Age Issue in Fiction

C'mon now Max, thought we weren't going to use cheap alliteration like Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhh!!!!

Just had to take that little shot. All in good fun old bean.

Censorship is just a pisser. Catcher in the Rye, Slaugherhouse Five, Judy Blume for pity sake. Then they go after Mark Twain and F. Scott.

No shortage of nutjobs on this side of the pond, Max.

 

[KillerMuffin]

Garrison Keillor said something like: Our ancestors came over from England because they didn't have enough religious freedom to opress everyone.

 

[MaxSebastian]

There's far too much oppression (or even repression) in England for religion to get a look in, that's why.

p.s. Axel, AAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!
isn't alliteration as far as I can tell, cheap or otherwise

 

[Starblayde]

Re: Of two minds...

(2) How many people do you know who made it to 18 as virgins...

*Raises hand nervously*

 

[Axeltheswede]

Age Issue in Fiction

OK, Max. Alliteration is the occurance of the same letter or sound at the beginning of several words in succesion. So you are right Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh is not alliteration - so what is it. Do you have a term that comes closer to describing what the hell that is?

 

[MysteryWriter]

it is okay star...

It is absolutely nothing to be ashamed off... (Wicked smile)

 

[MaxSebastian]

Re: Age Issue in Fiction

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh is not alliteration - so what is it. Do you have a term that comes closer to describing what the hell that is?

Yeah, sure I do, it's called 'lousy writing' - but hey, it's a bulletin board so sue me.

 

[Axeltheswede]

Age Issue in Fiction

Gee Max, sorry I asked.

 

[MaxSebastian]

Kidding, Axel, only kidding!

 

[MysteryWriter]

ah oh

Just a BB you in trouble now.. rofl

 

[Uther_Pendragon]

An age issue in fiction

Like I said, I am not talking about Lit. I am just baffled at why the hell a 14 year old can buy Anne Rice's Sleeping Beauty Trilogy (I bought them when I was 14) which has a fifteen year old Beauty giving head to a pack of soldiers, getting anal, doing lesbian three ways and doing heavy bondage scenes, but if you put the same thing on the internet, you'd be a pervert, no matter what site you put it on. (sigh)

Well, the problem with the question in the way it is
phrased is that the important facts are totally
misrepresented.
I've been reposting some of my stories on Literotica.
All of these stories were first posted on the Internet.
About half of the stories I've written have characters
who don't meet the Lit age criteria.
Literotica has certain rules. To attribute those rules to
the entire Internet is ridiculous.
To ask *why* those are the rules of the entire Internet
is to pose a question comparable to "Why are all mice green?"
It is awfully hard to answer either question.
Not all mice *are* green. Not all Internet erotica
involve people over eighteen.