Am I the only one disturbed by this?

[Rowan]

I'm transfering this from the "How to..." section onto the General Board (I hope this is okay). This board seems to get the most comments.

A brief synopsis:

A man posted his concerns regarding the suspicion that his wife was cheating on him. He gave several for-instances on what made him think this and also asked for opinions on what might be tell-tale signs of a cheating mate.

Gary1 made the following comment:

What is it with the jealousy thing. Jealousy is founded in ownership.
Damn ... since when do people own other people. A wedding contract is just a contract... it is not an ownership paper... it is not a paper of bondage or slavery. Jesus H. Christ ... grow up and get a life... If she comes home and you love her ... what the hell else do you want from a marriage. She came home... she came home for something...obviously you are not giving her something ... or she wouldn't be looking in all the wrong places for love. And even if you are ... last I checked ... freedom is still a guarantee in the good ole US of A. If she is lookin somewhere else ... let her look. But, quit this destructive game of ownership and trying to catch her at cheatin. Grow up and get on with life. Worry about something that is worth worrying about.
And get rid of the archaic ownership game.

My opinion is this:

I'm a bit disturbed by your comments, Gary1. Okay, perhaps *more* than a bit.

Marriage is just a contract? Yes, it is, in the extent that it's on a paper filed at a courthouse, but it's also a vow, before God, that people make to be faithful to each other. Forgive me if I sound corny, but I take such a vow seriously.

If an "open" marriage is what the couple wants, then let them be honest about it with each other. Sneaking around and cheating is
definitely wrong. Just because we live in such "modern" times is no excuse, in my humble opinion.

What can be more unfair than a marriage where one person takes the vow to mean something, and the other thinks it's just words to
disregard anytime they feel like it?

The ideas of marriage should be discussed before two people are married. If one partner expresses ideas that are similiar to yours, and the other has my ideas concerning what a marriage should be, then the two should not be married.
If a couple does this and comes to an agreement, and that agreement is broken, don't you think the slighted person has a reason for anger and hurt?




[This message has been edited by Rowan (edited 04-17-2000).]

 

[Laurel]

Marriage is just a contract? Yes, it is, in the extent that it's on a paper filed at a
courthouse, but it's also a vow, before God, that people make to be faithful to each
other. Forgive me if I sound corny, but I take such a vow seriously.

Ah, but what about those who don't believe in God?

I know that sounds nit-picky, but recently here in Southern California we had a bill defeated which would have provided protection for gay couples, and those against the bill mainly focused on how this bill would "pervert" marriage, which was "a covenent before God". I think we need a distinction between legal marriage and personal marriage, and to allow that if two people decide to marry, that they may not consider it a convenant before any God but instead between each other, and that agreement is as binding and true as any other made.

Other than that. I agree with what you said. Why people get married so they can lie and cheat each other is beyond me. I've personally know a few philanderers in my ime, and I think it comes down to character weakness on their part. When you talk to them about their cheating, they blame it on their wife or husband ("he/she doesn't do enough to satisfy me"), but when you delve deeper you find that he or she isn't exactly doing all that much to satisfy THEM, nor have they confronted their spouse with their unhappiness... No relationship is red-hot all of the time, and there are those who use any small quarrel or disagreement as an excuse to cheat. There are many unhappy couples in which no one cheats, and their are "happy" couples (or so one partner thinks) where one or both fool around.

Bottom line: don't lie or cheat the person you claim to love. If you're both swingers and thus both aware of each other's extramarital sex, fine. Not my cup of tea, but as long as you're loving and honest I have no problem with it. But for chrissake, don't screw around behind your spouse's back, hurting them deeply and making them look stupid in the process. I can't think of a worse way to treat someone.

 

[MADDOG]

Why is love such a laughable emotion that people rush off and have sex or a sexually motivated emotional relationship with someone other than their partner at every available opportunity? I'm not talking about swinging. If that floats both your boats, then that's up to you. I mean, why can't two people be in a loving commited relationship without the need to look elsewhere? Am I just a romantic, or has the meaning of the word "forever" changed?

MADDOG

 

[Popi]

I personally think marriage is a joke. Who says you need to take vows to show that you love someone?

 

[MADDOG]

But if you make those vows, shouldn't you honour them? And if you love someone, shouldn't they be the ONLY one?

MADDOG

 

[Lasher]

Good point, Maddog. No one says you have to go out and get married in this day and age. And with all the problems associated with marriage, if you are not able to make a commitment of that magnitude, then you should not do it. I lived with my wife for almost 4 years before we got married, and I spent most of that time explaining to her why we shouldn't get married. There's not a reason that any of you could thing up that I hadn't already thought of and explained to her.

But then one day I woke up and I realized that my wife is a person that I can spend the rest of my life with, and that we are both strong enough people to make a complete mental, physical and spiritual commitment to each other. Because that's what it takes. And it's something that most people should not even attempt.

If it wasn't after 5 am I'd go into this more in depth, I'm just not gonna make a whole lot of sense right now.

 

[Bossy Aussie]

Originally posted by popi:
I personally think marriage is a joke. Who says you need to take vows to show that you love someone?

No one says you need to. And nobody's making you do it. If you get married, it is most likely your CHOICE. So...if you're going to choose to do that, at least take it seriously, yeah?

Bossy's never getting married, in case anyone cares.

 

[MADDOG]

Oh sure Bossy! You say that now, but you haven't met me yet!

No but seriously, why not? I'm no SNAG but I sure as hell want to find the one and settle into married life. Why would you not?

MADDOG

 

[Bossy Aussie]

Lots of reasons, MADDOG. I'm scared that I would be a horrid wife, I'm scared that he would, at some point want a divorce, I'm scared of it eventually feeling like a jail...just paranoid things like that!

Bossy

 

[Flashlight7.5]

My wife and I lived together for a while before we got married. We had some rough years during college in which I fooled around. I asked her to marry me when I realized that I couldn't imagine my life without her. She was the one I wanted to marry.

Does that mean she is the only one I love? Not necessarily. I took vows with her, and respect every one of them. However, after our marriage, we came to the realization that she was bi and that we were both polyamorous.
Uh oh! Did our vows go out the window? No. We are the primary loves in our life. We had our first threesome experience last year with a dear friend. We stayed two nights with her, and on the first night, our friend and I could have had wild sex with each other while my wife slept off the jet lag. I gave our friend a massage and teased her a bit, but nothing else. There was plenty I wanted to do, but didn't.

Where am I going with this? The fact is that before my wife and I opened up our hearts and minds and voices to each other, I would've jumped right into the sack with our friend without hesitation and not cared about the consequences. I would've lied about it and made up horrible excuses and continued on with my cheating behavior.

However, since we had discussed and discussed our sexuality and desires, I knew that to do this with our friend without my wife's permission and/or participation would be wrong. We all played together the next day, and our love grew STRONGLY from this experience.

I know many people who have divorced over sex. One man I work with met his second wife while cheating on his first. He then cheated on his second wife also, and she couldn't understand why. There are none so blind as those who won't see. I blame his second divorce on both of them. She couldn't see the train coming, and he has serious issues with intimacy.

I know another couple in which the female half really wants to explore her sexuality, and it nearly tore the marriage apart thanks to her not discussing it with her husband.

Polyamory is NOT for everyone. It greats great love, trust, and communication to make it work, and it is just like any other relationship. All sides must work together to make it work.

I have nothing against monogamy. In fact, we're monogamous right now! We don't have any lovers in the area, and I don't see us finding any in the near future. That's okay. You have to be flexible.

 

[Budokan]

Marriage is as important (or unimportant) as either partner in the relationship believes. If one thinks it is important, and the other less so, then the marriage, or union, or committment, has less value. Whenever one person in a committment believes that relationship is less important, then no matter what the other wants, it IS less important. The only way a relationship can mean something is when both members agree on where they stand.

 

[Never]

Though I never consider marriage for myself, I don't have anything against it. I feel the need to point out though that people change. Relationships sour and sometimes trying to keep that promise of 'forever' is less romantic and more tragic.

Secondly, I think whomever started this post took Gary's words a bit too literally. He seemed to be complaining about the husbands conduct. A relationship founded on trust and honesty doesn't hold together well without the trust. Going on a bulletin board and posting 'I think my wife is cheating, what are some signs?' doesn't scream trust to me. In addition, it occurs to me that Gary didn't say sleeping around, he said 'looking around' that implies looking elsewhere for friendship, companionship but not having sex. Rowan cropped several parts of what Gary said so I don't think it's quite clear enough for me to judge.

An no, it doesn't scare me.

 

[dee_cole]

Your words ring true. But....

Rowan I feel your pain and I want you to realize that whatever happened in your marriage ... It's not your fault.
It's not your fault. I repeat - It's not your fault.
Seriously though, some people take marriage as a contract of convienience. Others truly understand the meaning of the union.
If you treat your wife good and she repays you with loyalty and honor then you my friend have a good wife. If you treat her good and she repays you by giving some other guy head and fucking him once a week while you sit at home watching the kids... then you my friend have married a hooker. And everyone knows that you can't turn a hooker into a housewife. Bottom line!
No sense preaching about how wrong it is.

 

[Angelique]

Re: Your words ring true. But....

And everyone knows that you can't turn a hooker into a housewife. Bottom line!

Any bets that there are better odds on turning a hooker into a housewife than there are in turning an "average horny fellow" into someone intelligent?

Btw, wasn't "Pretty Woman" based on a true story?

 

[Siren]

Angel Baby you are so right

 

[Jeff726]

Hey Bossie you're back. cool

[Edited by Jeff726 on 07-24-2000 at 11:20 PM]

 

[Lasher]

LOL.....

If you look closely, Jeff, Bossy Aussie's post on this thread was 3 MONTHS ago. Some shithead resurrected it, but apparently was too stupid to realize another thread went with it. It doesn't make any fuckin' sense without the other thread.

 

[Jeff726]

im sorry

If you look closely, Jeff, Bossy Aussie's post on this thread was 3 MONTHS ago. Some shithead resurrected it, but apparently was too stupid to realize another thread went with it. It doesn't make any fuckin' sense without the other thread.

Sorry about that Lasher. I am having a suddenly really bad night and am not exactly able to think straight. Please forgive.

Jeff

 

[Lasher]

Don't worry about it...

I wasn't taking about you, Jeff. I can understand someone missing the dates on posts on what looks like an active thread. I was talking about the moron who brought this post back from the dead... He knows who he is, and it definitely wasn't you, Jeff. So don't sweat it.

 

[Bigdog]

Note to Newbie's

You're supposed to READ the old posts, not give them CPR!

Grrrrrr

 

[Gingersnap]

For what it's worth Lasher and Laurel I really liked what you said.

 

[dee_cole]

Siren and Angelique -A hooker is...

A hooker is just slang term for ho...get it. Ho as in whore, slut, trollip, tramp,.... GET IT. You cant turn a hooker into a housewife simply means - once a slut, always a slut. The same rings true for men, so I am not female bashing. The married women that I am currently fucking, were always little sluts. Its just that they didn't show that side to their husbands. And not that there's anything wrong with that!
So don't let your guilt bring you out of the closet. If you've been fucking around on your men then you are sluts, but it's legal so what the fuck.

 

[Angelique]

Re: Siren and Angelique -A hooker is...

A hooker is just slang term for ho...get it. Ho as in whore, slut, trollip, tramp,.... GET IT. You cant turn a hooker into a housewife simply means - once a slut, always a slut. The same rings true for men, so I am not female bashing. The married women that I am currently fucking, were always little sluts. Its just that they didn't show that side to their husbands. And not that there's anything wrong with that!
So don't let your guilt bring you out of the closet. If you've been fucking around on your men then you are sluts, but it's legal so what the fuck.

EXCUSE ME???? Me...feeling GUILT? This is the typical bullshit attitude that just screams for a beating!

Where the HELL do you get off in assuming that because I'm an opinionated female who finds YOU to be rude, obnoxious, and tasteless (along with a few other choice words), I've got the skeleton of a hooker hanging out in my closet?

Your level of intelligence (or lack of) has been displayed on numerous threads...several of which I find to be offensive. And ya' know what? You're entitled to post anything your little heart desires...however, might I suggest you THINK before you post! Going off on a tangent about stupid shit like implying that I'm feeling guilty because perhaps I'm a "slut" is not the way to earn brownie points here bub!

So in response to your post, I'm going to refresh that tiny little memory of yours and offer specifics on what the definition of a hooker is.

According to Webster, a hooker is: Slang. A prostitute.

And to further that definition, I’ll even go so far as to define prostitute for “da man”.

Prostitute: One who solicits and accepts payment for sex.

Hmmm...see the difference between a hooker and someone who simply enjoys a lot of sex, perhaps with many different men?

I, personally, don't judge people based on what they do in their spare time...anyone who wishes to take up this kind of lifestyle, more power to them.

BUT DON'T FUCKING IMPLY THAT IT'S THE LIFESTYLE I LEAD, BOZO!!!!!

On a final note, your comment about once a slut, always a slut, is a little off base as well. Ya' see, if I took up that kind of thinking, then it would be fair for me to say "once an ignorant asshole, always an ignorant asshole". GET IT???

 

[Savage Kitten]

I personally think marriage is a joke. Who says you need to take vows to show that you love someone?

for people who don't take it serious it is a joke. and a lot of people get married too quickly.. thinking what they feel is 'LOVE' when they don't have the slightest clue what love really is. marriage is a two way street and unless both people go into it with the same ideas of what it should be and the course it will take the it is destined to fail. Some people get caught up in the moment. they don't stop to realise that marraige is suppose to be for a life time and in this day and age that could mean 50, 60 yrs, or more. there are a lot of gives and takes in a marriage.. a lot of backing down and compromising.. by both people. people who love each other should want to make the other happy and secure. you should be able to trust your spouse with your money, life, and best friend. if there are any doubts about any of these things then there should never be a marriage or commitment.

it's very well that i may be wrong, may be expecting too much. But even so, if it means i will never marry 'again' for the rest of my life, before i do marry i will be sure my partner believes the same as i

 

[Endlessly]

If I ever get married and my husband insists on a premarital agreement, I'm going to agree-- and insist on a contract marriage, ie. one that has a huge amount of failsafes and requirements before divorce is granted.

I vehemently agree in the institution of marriage, especially as it was concieved of in the bible.. But my future husband may not.

(Not to get non-believer's panties in a bundle, but I recently read a survey that said the divorce rate among american couples was 1 in 2.. but the divorce rate among american couples who pray together is 1 in 40,000. Food for thought.)