A Question for Lesbians

[Tonnelier]

I've only been coming to this site for a couple of months, so I don't know a lot about it. I was wondering if the "Lesbian Sex" section was full of bisexual stuff, because the "Gay Male" section is knee-deep in it. I'm a guy who's probably a 5.99 on the Kinsey scale. I've French kissed a couple of girls, but I've never made it with a girl and don't really want to. Of all the lesbians I've known over the years, most of them feel the same way about men.

Are the "Gay Male" and "Lesbian Sex" sections on Literotica mainly for straights who want to take a walk on the wild side? Or is everyone on Literotica bi? Maybe Literotica is the web site for the English-speaking chapter of Bisexuals of the World (BoW).

On most of the other story sites, the stories in the "Gay Male" section are just about gay men, and they also have sub-categories. But you have to wade through a lot of crap. (People who don't even use spell check.) On Literotica, the writers are actually literate!

I don't mean to offend anyone, but I'd just like to know. Thank you.

 

[Night_Jasmine]

Honestly, you'll find a good mix. Straight up gays, lesbians, and bisexuals, as well as transgendered.

 

[nici]

Lit is not geared for gay issues. It is an erotic story site with a predominately het male readership. Gay male sex is too extreme and lesbian sex excludes them. GLT erotic literature is just a byproduct as far as the majority of readers see it.

When you've read enough on the site, you will find your writers that you like and when they post you'll read them. (And, there are some very good gay writers on the site.)

 

[Etoile]

You're right about the gay male section being mostly full of bisexual and first-time experiences. I am a dyke who likes gay male porn (there are a lot of us, I was part of a study once!) and I have often been disappointed by the contents of the gay male section on Lit. I honestly don't know about the lesbian section because I've never spent much time in there. I much prefer www.nifty.org for queer porn.

 

[BitterIchor]

I am a dyke who likes gay male porn (there are a lot of us, I was part of a study once!)...

There are a lot of you? Fascinating. I have never before heard of this phenomenon. I would love to dissect the psychological details of that particular deviation from the subcultural norm. It would make a fine essay.

 

[nici]

There are a lot of you? Fascinating. I have never before heard of this phenomenon. I would love to dissect the psychological details of that particular deviation from the subcultural norm. It would make a fine essay.

I think I’ll agree with Etoile. Well, not that that is my thing too… it’s not, but the scene slang “Fag Hag” doesn’t come from nowhere.

Psychologically speaking though, I doubt you would find a singular reasoning behind the fag-hag syndrome. There’d be just too many variations in not only the reasoning, but also in the historics of women associating with gay males.

(Disclaimer: I am in no way intending the term fag-hag to be negatively understood. Even though historically, it does have negative meanings, it’s not necessarily always so. Example: If I say, “She’s a hot dyke,” I mean exactly that and totally… really, really in a butterfly/tummy tingling positive sense. Sometimes it’s not the words you use, but their context that is important. )

 

[nici]

OMG nifty.org!

I'd completely forgotten about them!

 

[Etoile]

There are a lot of you? Fascinating. I have never before heard of this phenomenon. I would love to dissect the psychological details of that particular deviation from the subcultural norm. It would make a fine essay.

Yeah, I filled out this huge questionnaire from somebody who was doing a study on lesbians who enjoy gay male porn. (The phrase was used so many times that it was shortened to GMP.) I don't think I ever received a copy of the final report, though I had asked to get one...this was maybe three years ago or more.

 

[BitterIchor]

I think I’ll agree with Etoile. Well, not that that is my thing too… it’s not, but the scene slang “Fag Hag” doesn’t come from nowhere.

I actually did some digging on the "fag hag"-phenomenon a few years ago. Apparently, the term most often applies to straight women. They latch on to gay men because they generally possess many qualities that straight men lack. More "advanced" personal hygiene and slightly different interests and behaviour. There was also a significant percentage that pursued it simply because there would be no reciprocation from the male. Most likely stemming from fear of intimacy.

Also, there is no reason that straight women would not find a gay man attractive. Lesbians generally don't find men attractive at all. So it's the contradictory nature of a lesbian finding sex between two (or more) men sexually stimulating that is the interesting part.

 

[succubi-tamer]

I much prefer www.nifty.org for queer porn.

Etoile, as a straight-ish guy who loves stuff like Belladonna's girl-girl stuff (see www.enterbelladonna.com), I relate to the penchant for queer porn And to speak to the original poster's question, I guess the bi stuff is more hot for me than the *outright* gay male stuff, though it's all sort of hot. But nifty.org has truly mediocre lesbian fiction. Lit has nifty beat for clit lit The gay male stuff, on the other hand...

 

[nici]

I actually did some digging on the "fag hag"-phenomenon a few years ago. Apparently, the term most often applies to straight women. They latch on to gay men because they generally possess many qualities that straight men lack. More "advanced" personal hygiene and slightly different interests and behaviour. There was also a significant percentage that pursued it simply because there would be no reciprocation from the male. Most likely stemming from fear of intimacy.

Also, there is no reason that straight women would not find a gay man attractive. Lesbians generally don't find men attractive at all. So it's the contradictory nature of a lesbian finding sex between two (or more) men sexually stimulating that is the interesting part.

I do not know. I feel you are looking at the definitions hetero and homosexuality as too absolute. In application of Kinsey’s theory on bi-sexuality, we all are in some form bisexual. Absolutes in either direction would be deviant.

My experience in the gay/lez scene and my personal life seem to agree with this thesis. Many who profess being lesbian (absolute queer) have bisexual tendencies. Some more some less, but they do have them. (“A good dick is just too hard to find.”)

Therefore, I do not find it unusual for both straight and queer women to find in male homosexuality an ability to express a part of their personal and sexual emotions. Voyeuristically, a straight could find a safe route to express her bi/homosexuality, the same as a queer her heterosexual tendencies… without leaving their comfort zones.

The only contradiction that I see is between their cognitive and intuitive thinking processes. (A very normal occurrence.)

Your explanation of the term fag-hag, I feel, though commonly used, is a justification and not a reason. “More "advanced" personal hygiene and slightly different interests and behavior,” are symptoms and too simplistic to be reasons. They are only perceived as reasons.

 

[BitterIchor]

I do not know. I feel you are looking at the definitions hetero and homosexuality as too absolute. In application of Kinsey’s theory on bi-sexuality, we all are in some form bisexual. Absolutes in either direction would be deviant.

Doesn't the Kinsey scale go from 0 (strictly heterosexual) to 6 (strictrly homosexual)? I know that you place yourself on the scale throught different parts of your life, but there is nothing in Kinsey's studies that precludes people from placing on number 6 (or number 0) throughout their entire life.

My experience in the gay/lez scene and my personal life seem to agree with this thesis. Many who profess being lesbian (absolute queer) have bisexual tendencies. Some more some less, but they do have them. (“A good dick is just too hard to find.”)

Interesting theory. I don't agree with it, but it does have some valid aspects.

Your explanation of the term fag-hag, I feel, though commonly used, is a justification and not a reason. “More "advanced" personal hygiene and slightly different interests and behavior,” are symptoms and too simplistic to be reasons. They are only perceived as reasons.

I realize my two "reasons" were very simplistic and were not meant as an in depth analysis. I just grabbed them out of the air as an indication towards a bigger point. Which was what I said just before that part, that many gay men possess qualities that straight men generally lack. Qualities that many straight women constantly whine about when it comes to men. I'm sure you know what I mean.

 

[Tonnelier]

Doesn't the Kinsey scale go from 0 (strictly heterosexual) to 6 (strictrly homosexual)? I know that you place yourself on the scale throught different parts of your life, but there is nothing in Kinsey's studies that precludes people from placing on number 6 (or number 0) throughout their entire life.

Yes, the Kinsey scale is 0 to 6, and I can attest to the fact that--at 45--I have been a 6 my entire life. From early childhood. I've always loved women as friends and respected them, but I have absolutely no interest sexually.

There are a lot of women who enjoy the company of gay men, but to me, a "fag hag" is a woman who tries to get gay men in bed. I had a woman in a clothing store stick her hand down my pants once to "see if they fit properly." I can laugh about it now, but at the time, I was mortified. What's funny about it is that straight/bi men would be lining up for that kind of attention!

Back to my original question. I'm inclined to agree that Literotica seems to be designed for the straight/bi crowd. Nifty writers have great ideas, but some of them are such poor writers that their stories are almost impossible to read. Sometimes I just have to click the "Back" button and look for something else. I often wonder if some of them suffer from hypergraphia (the overwhelming urge to write). Or maybe they're just hacks. Whatever. I wish the gay stories on Lit were more gay, because they are so well written.

 

[TheDivineMsM]

There are a lot of you? Fascinating. I have never before heard of this phenomenon. I would love to dissect the psychological details of that particular deviation from the subcultural norm. It would make a fine essay.

although i am not a full blown dyke...though i could be given a chance
I have loved gay porn for years...though i didnt know others did too till i found this site...
yeah its HOT

 

[nici]

Yes, the Kinsey scale does show absolutes in the context of there being a zero for pure heterosexual behavior and a six for pure homosexual behavior. Still, there will always be greater differences between a perceived and subjective (self) and a clinical or objective (3rd person) analysis.

Self-analysis is always extremely hard to do correctly, because in doing so we are dealing with our perceptions, desires and wishes.

How much of one’s own behavior is intuitive and how much is cognitive? At one time in my life, I considered myself an absolute six, a gold star with all intentions on limiting my contacts to males (even social and business) to a minimum. I had all intentions, socially, politically, and physically, on living in a womyn’s world. That was my honest perception of myself, at that time.

From early childhood. I've always loved women as friends and respected them, but I have absolutely no interest sexually.

Which proves my point. Between cognitive and intuitive thinking, you have formulated a system of behavior fitting to your personality and needs. Yet, you can socially conduct yourself with women. You have instinctually that aptitude.

Sexual behavioral instincts do overlap considerably with social behavioral instincts. They are innately tied together. We all have some het and queer behavior and instincts in us so that we can conduct ourselves in a social environment with others. Without these variances, we would truly be deviant in nature and unable to conform to our own social needs.

Kinsey’s scale has only 7 points, which fits quite well for social definitions. Yet, in evaluating “true behavior” the 7 points are just too restrictive and too limited. So socially, with your lifestyle, you could easily be a 6.0, but analytically anywhere from a 5.0 to a 5.9.

For the person themselves, the difference is so slight that it doesn’t matter. Only in the “academic” evaluation of the why and wherefore of social, sexual and human behavior does this difference, make a difference.

There are a lot of women who enjoy the company of gay men, but to me, a "fag hag" is a woman who tries to get gay men in bed. I had a woman in a clothing store stick her hand down my pants once to "see if they fit properly." I can laugh about it now, but at the time, I was mortified. What's funny about it is that straight/bi men would be lining up for that kind of attention!

Let’s not forget the “hot bi-chick nymphomaniac/ lesbians are so sexy/ girl-girl sex is hot syndrome” of heterosexual males. “The grass is always greener on the other side.” In a sadistical way, what happened to you made me chuckle. Welcome to the club.

I’ve had though little experience of being around fag-hags, so I really can’t say if they are trying to “get gay men into bed”. I always considered that they were in some ways seeking a “safe” option for associating with males. Other than transsexuals, the lez scene really doesn’t have anything to correlate.

I will agree with you. Nifty has a lot more queer orientated stories, but quite a bit is poorly written and often times so deviant, even psychopathic, that they are unreadable. I just look at it this way; Nifty is queer, Lit is het. Nifty has some het too, just as Lit has some queer, but in both cases, there’s a lot of garbage to be dug through. Both are clearing houses for online literature.

 

[Etoile]

I think I'm a 5.35 on the Kinsey scale. Because there is the fact that I want to have Ian McKellen's babies, so I can't be totally 6, even if he's gay.

 

[Shagly]

although i am not a full blown dyke...though i could be given a chance
I have loved gay porn for years...though i didnt know others did too till i found this site...
yeah its HOT

Yikes!

I watch lesbian porn sometimes and I'm straight.

What would Sigmund Freud think if he was here?

 

[IrezumiKiss]

Sexuality is always a fluid thing. I always think that there is a dominant base inside you that remains fixed and then everything else just peacock feathers away out of that base.

I'm a straight male who doesn't mind looking at or reading gay and lesbian erotica. I vibe off of sexual energy, so if what I'm looking at is good, well-drawn or well-written, then I can definitely appreciate it. Maybe mostly because I'm an erotic artist myself, I like seeing what I can crib from the minds of others to fuel my own muses.

 

[pmaverick123]

whether its bi-sexual, staright gay, staright lesbian.......they are all over the discussion forum and mixes quite well with overall feel of the thread.......

 

[bananakiss]

The only phenomenon or unlikely trend I find in the lesbian sex category is that there are a fair number of male authors there. I've known many lesbians to get a little manic over this, but I have found worthwhile lesbian erotica written by male authors and couldn't care less. I've read a fair amount of submissions there, and am having trouble recalling even one story that featured a male character during the sex. They're usually accessory/support characters.

I've not read all that much in the gay male category, but if you're looking for good gay male stories (note: not exclusively stroke) you might try an author by the nick of carsonshepherd.

 

[Etoile]

There's a book called Switch Hitters: Lesbians Write Gay Male Erotica and Gay Men Write Lesbian Erotica - I've never actually read it but it is out there.

 

[south_florida_bicur]

I much prefer www.nifty.org for queer porn.

Etoile - I totally agree wtih you about Nifty.org. It is a great site. I've been on it for yrs.