18 Years of Victory?

[JackLuis]

A startling trove of documents reveals the truth about Afghanistan

The disclosures are extreme, but, sadly, what we have come to expect of government–across administrations.

The Washington Post obtained 2,000 documents showing that over years, news of U.S. military deployment to Afghanistan was routinely and repeatedly manipulated to reflect a rosier picture than what was happening on the ground. Further, the documents show that there was confusion about military mission and what would amount to success across the 18 years of deployment under the Bush, Obama and Trump administrations.[

“A confidential trove of government documents obtained by The Washington Post reveals that senior U.S. officials failed to tell the truth about the war in Afghanistan throughout the 18-year campaign, making rosy pronouncements they knew to be false and hiding unmistakable evidence the war had become unwinnable,” says the Post, which spend three years seeking the document trove.

The Afghan War was unwinnable from the beginning. Bush left it to the Army to figure out, Obama ignored the drain on our Treasury, and Trump hardly knows where it is! $2 Trillion would pay for a lot of Wall!

 

[rae121452]

everyone with a brain already knew that the afghan conflict was about mineral rights. now, suddenly, people are wondering why we're there fighting a phantom was?

 

[magicalmoments]

Anyone with a brain knew that taking a military invasion into Afghanistan was stupid.

Hell... The Greeks learned that, the British, the Russians and currently the USA.
Only the Romans were bright enough to steer clear of the place.

 

[magicalmoments]

#4 above.
That's only part of it. The really foolish part was much earlier, funding and arming the taliban and al qaeda, and training them, back when the ussr invaded their country. On hindsight you should have left it to the Russians to clean them up, without the USA backing the Russians would have cleaned them out.

 

[JackLuis]

‘Let’s bring Rumsfeld in’: Congressman calls for hearings on US officials who lied to American people about endless Afghan war

Rep. Ro Khanna on Wednesday said that The Washington Post‘s explosive investigation the “Afghanistan Papers” showed the need for a congressional hearing and that former Pentagon chief Donald Rumsfeld should be among the current and former top officials called in for a reckoning before the American public.
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Khanna (D-Calif.) made the comments at a House Armed Services Committee hearing. Hebegan addressing Secretary of Defense Mark Esper by summing up the Post‘s report from Monday.

“The bottom line is that top military officials and civilian officials have known that the Afghan war has been has been unwinnable and have been misleading the American public for 20 years,” Khanna said. “Your predecessor Secretary Rumsfeld was quoted there as saying, ‘I have no visibility into who the bad guys are.'”

In 1964 the McNaughton Papers pointed out the we could not WIN the Viet Nam War if we continued to support the corrupt Diem government. Our government did not care to read and understand this.

Now the WaPo shows us that the Government is not smarter, or more open to reality than it was then.

Elect Clowns and expect a circus!

 

[BotanyBoy]

The Afghan War was unwinnable from the beginning.

Playing by the rules and trying to nation build? Yea...military is the wrong way to win hearts and minds.

After we bombed them back to the stone-age...we should've just left.

If we weren't ready to fully commit to owning that fucker yea....100%.

On hindsight you should have left it to the Russians to clean them up, without the USA backing the Russians would have cleaned them out.

Nah...they Russians had no idea how to fight there and they got their ass beat in nearly every engagement despite having superior numbers, weaponry and air support.

We did shit differently and kicked the fucking dog shit out of them.

If we wanted to own it...we could.

But folks here and in the 1st world don't have the stomach for it, they would rather tuck tail eat the losses than be "bad" guys and win.

 

[dan_c00000]

Nah...they Russians had no idea how to fight there and they got their ass beat in nearly every engagement despite having superior numbers, weaponry and air support.

None of that is true. How do I know this? Because your buddy Ollie North was gun running for the Afghans. Most people would call what North did a war crime but a stupid fucking racist like you would applaud it, I'm sure.

The CIA was also involved with Operation Cyclone and the stinger missiles provided by the US meant that Russia's "superior" anything was gone. It wasn't just US aid but lots of other countries helped. In fact, the number of Russian troops and Mujahideen were roughly equal.

Fuck bot will you really stop posting about history now? It's really fucking embarrassing for you to get owned this hard.

 

[BotanyBoy]

None of that is true. How do I know this? Because your buddy Ollie North was gun running for the Afghans. Most people would call what North did a war crime but a stupid fucking racist like you would applaud it, I'm sure.

The CIA was also involved with Operation Cyclone and the stinger missiles provided by the US meant that Russia's "superior" anything was gone. It wasn't just US aid but lots of other countries helped. In fact, the number of Russian troops and Mujahideen were roughly equal.

Fuck bot will you really stop posting about history now? It's really fucking embarrassing for you to get owned this hard.

None of that has shit to do with what I said LOL

Good job high speed.

 

[magicalmoments]

I think you're underestimating the impact of American weapons and training on the Russians. In fact I think you're completely wrong on this.
The best strategy the USA could have had on Afghanistan was to stay the fuck out of there. Ronnie and Ollies lack of foresight did your country, and ours for that matter, a big disservice.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I think you're underestimating the impact of American weapons and training on the Russians. In fact I think you're completely wrong on this.

You talking to Dan?

Because I absolutely recognized it and said the mujahideen kicked the shit out of the Russians.

The best strategy the USA could have had on Afghanistan was to stay the fuck out of there.

Well with a losing objective no shit.

Ronnie and Ollies lack of foresight did your country, and ours for that matter, a big disservice.

They didn't have shit to do with Operation Enduring Freedom (01-14)

 

[icanhelp1]

Hindsight is 20/20. I thought arming the Mujahedin was separate from Enduring Freedom.

We learned a lot about Russian Doctrine back in the 80s, gave us a heads up on russian tactics in the first gulf war and perhaps saved thousands of american lives. Not everything we do is bad.

Arming the Mujahedin gave us an ally ( Northern Alliance ) on the ground during Enduring Freedom.

 

[dan_c00000]

Ronnie and Ollies lack of foresight did your country, and ours for that matter, a big disservice.

You are completely correct, Ronald Reagan was a terrible President.

I've covered this with dawn/bot before. Reagan was also a huge racist.

 

[JackLuis]

The real outrage of the Afghanistan war papers that no one wants to talk about

The real truth is the war started and Bush converted the ire of the nation to Iraq and left the MIC in charge of the Afghan war to be run by chicken hawks. 18 years later we are still fucking that chicken.

2,300 troops dead and 20,589 wounded in action, only a $1 trillion in the hole.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Hindsight is 20/20. I thought arming the Mujahedin was separate from Enduring Freedom.

We learned a lot about Russian Doctrine back in the 80s, gave us a heads up on russian tactics in the first gulf war and perhaps saved thousands of american lives. Not everything we do is bad.

Arming the Mujahedin gave us an ally ( Northern Alliance ) on the ground during Enduring Freedom.

It was separate, we armed them in the early 80's...OEF started in 01.


Yea, it also got us shot up by our own weaponry from time to time too. That's extra shitty.

 

[BotanyBoy]

The real outrage of the Afghanistan war papers that no one wants to talk about

The real truth is the war started and Bush converted the ire of the nation to Iraq and left the MIC in charge of the Afghan war to be run by chicken hawks. 18 years later we are still fucking that chicken.

2,300 troops dead and 20,589 wounded in action, only a $1 trillion in the hole.

No one wants to talk about it because nobody but the jihadi sympathizers on the left gives a shit.

 

[JackLuis]

No one wants to talk about it because nobody but the jihadi sympathizers on the left gives a shit.

Then why would the RWNJ chickenhawks want to pour more 'Merican money down the rathole if they don't care? Maybe $$$ in their pockets? No one wants to admit that there are no achievable objectives to "Military Nation Building." There is no way to get your ticket punched if there is no war to fight.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Then why would the RWNJ chickenhawks want to pour more 'Merican money down the rathole if they don't care? Maybe $$$ in their pockets? No one wants to admit that there are no achievable objectives to "Military Nation Building." There is no way to get your ticket punched if there is no war to fight.

Read your own article bubba....the piece is a boo-hoo for dead Afghans.

The lack of accurate statistics should bother us, just as the misrepresentation of them should disturb us even more. But the greatest outrage over these numbers is the fact that the United States never seriously considered that they needed to document the loss of Afghan lives in the first place.

We need to stop and pause at this reality because within it is the entire reason why the war has become the disaster that it is today. The United States never cared about counting the bodies of dead Afghans caused by the war they started. They didn’t count the dead, they didn’t count the wounded, and they didn’t count the displaced or traumatized.

They didn’t count the Afghans because the Afghans didn’t count.

Not counting dead Afghans is why the war didn't go very well.

LMFAO!!!! The war went great, we just didn't do anything with it because as a nation weak ass people like the retard who wrote this article are offended by the idea of WINNING.

And yea...the war was about the money.

 

[Rightguide]

Should have went in and killed thousands of Taliban, fucked up their infrastructure, and left.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Should have went in and killed thousands of Taliban, fucked up their infrastructure, and left.

If the point was to send a message yea....just lay fucking waste to the joint and promise to come back and finish the job if they don't fucking behave.

Personally I think for what we put into it we should have TAKEN the fucker and set up shop.

The natural resources would have made it worthwhile.

 

[JackLuis]

If the point was to send a message yea....just lay fucking waste to the joint and promise to come back and finish the job if they don't fucking behave.

How would we have known when it was "Done"? If GW had followed thru with Tora Bora and sealed the Packi border with American troops, rather than our "Afghan Allies", it would have saved a whole lot of time. But NO, he was looking to take out Saddam. Between Clinton not wanting to offend the Saudi's, GW's pussy footing in Tora Bora, and the brass wanting more "Stars" we have a serious cluster fuck.

Maybe the Brass should have read the story of the Brit's first invasion of Kabul and their miserable retreat a few more times?

 

[BotanyBoy]

How would we have known when it was "Done"?

Arbitrary decision.

Between Clinton not wanting to offend the Saudi's, GW's pussy footing in Tora Bora, and the brass wanting more "Stars" we have a serious cluster fuck.

True.

Maybe the Brass should have read the story of the Brit's first invasion of Kabul and their miserable retreat a few more times?

It wasn't the brass that needed to read it, it was the CIC/Congress who needed to do some reading.

 

[JackLuis]

It wasn't the brass that needed to read it, it was the CIC/Congress who needed to do some reading.

Really you expect Congress to read? They didn't read the McNoughton Papers, or the any of the Intel on Iraq or "Progress Reports" on Afghanistan. We need a Constitutional amendment that says if there is a war our "Leaders" are in the first wave of the invasion. We might lose the war, but we'd gain in the long run.

 

[icanhelp1]

#4 above.
That's only part of it. The really foolish part was much earlier, funding and arming the taliban and al qaeda, and training them, back when the ussr invaded their country. On hindsight you should have left it to the Russians to clean them up, without the USA backing the Russians would have cleaned them out.

Arming the Mujahedin was payback for Soviet involvement in Vietnam.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Really you expect Congress to read?

With a citizenry that never holds their congress critters responsible because they think POTUS is some sort of god king???

No.

They didn't read the McNoughton Papers, or the any of the Intel on Iraq or "Progress Reports" on Afghanistan.

Why should they? They won't be held accountable for shit.

We need a Constitutional amendment that says if there is a war our "Leaders" are in the first wave of the invasion. We might lose the war, but we'd gain in the long run.

Nah....just to take education more seriously and include a basic civics and US history in that education.

Oh and start making that lower 47% pay their fair share, get some skin in the game.