advice for wannabe swingers?

This may not be exactly how to, but here goes: I would like to hear your opinions on a couple adding other people to their sex life. Should a couple who have a very hot, passionate sex life between the two of them seriously consider the notion of occasionally inviting another person or a couple into bed with them, if they both like the idea? Can it be done without causing damage?

This is an oft explored topic so doing a search may provide you with a lot of feedback.

That said, sharing your most intimate encounters with another or others is a tricky animal indeed. It can be many things, good and bad.

First, the way you make love (or even have raunchy sex) with your SO is different than how you do it with a stranger or a new partner. Sex with someone you care about is very open and honest and vulnerable. And that should definately be a major consideration. I mean seriously think about all the intimacies expressed during sex. From tender love making to fantasy exploration to that quick-damn-we're tired-just need to get off-and sleep-sex. All express many things that may make you uncomfortable with someone else whom you haven't before shared these things. I bring this up as a first point because often people find the reality is something all together different from the fantasy.

Second, is the emotional involvement. I guess this kind of ties into my first point but then all these things are intertwined aren't they? Anyway, in my humble opinion, anyone who says multi-partner sex doesn't involve emotions is either: a) Not emotionally attached to one of the participants, b) Emotionally out of touch with themselves, or c) A liar. It is emotional if you know yourself and care for your SO. In fact you may experience a whole range of emotions before, during, and after the act. And many of them you may not have expected. Now, those emotions can be very good or they can be very bad or they can be anywhere in between. Be as prepared as possible and DO NOT surpress the emotions! And keep in mind the "other" person's or persons' have emotions too. This isn't all about you, or your SO, or you and your SO. That is a fact that I think is all too often overlooked.

Third, is the actual act. Well before hand you and your SO should have a strong understanding of what it is you desire, want, and expect from the encounter. Bi explorations, straight sex, just watching, etc. Limits and boundaries should be well discussed and understood. This isn't just important to feel comfortable but to also make sure you're pleasing yourself and your SO. Now, can those boundaries shift during the session? Of course. You can have a word or phrase pre-established so your SO and you can communicate that you're willing to "re-negotiate" what you'd originally expressed. Or maybe (and hopefully) you're close enough to just know. But no matter what, never exceed boundaries that you or your SO do not VERY willingly want to exceed. See point one

Fourth, COMMUNICATION! Between you and your SO and the other/s. You have to open and honest and directive and expressive. Verbally and physically. What is good is good, what is not good must be avoided.

No, this is not a laborious science project and I don't mean it to sound that way. Most of what I've said should come very natural. If doesn't, I'd say you're not ready.

For some, multi-partner sex is a wonderfully warm, exciting, and even strengthening experience. For others it is fun but wasn't what was expected or fantasized about and could be taken or left. And for others, it is a disaster that never should have happened.

There is VERY little I have not explored sexually and the vast majority of it has come with my loving wife. So I'm trying to speak from experience I guess.

In my experience, sex with close friends isn't a very good idea. We've been there done that with both a man and a woman. While we were fortunate enough that in both cases everything worked out and we're still close to them, the reality was it could have easily been bad. We ALL realized we could have lost something much more special than those brief moments of pleasure brought. And it wasn't all that great. Too much baggage I guess. What would have blown mine or her mind with someone else just seemed kind of flat.

But sex with strangers isn't always the best option either. I would say our best multi-partner sexual encounter was with a couple we grew to know over the internet. And when I saw "grew to know" I mean names of pets, asshole bosses, and so on. Folks we felt comfortable with and who felt comfortable with us.

My wife and I share some multi-partner sex desires and differ on others. Some things that turn her on don't necessarily turn me on and vice versa. And so we explore and talk. Inviting others into our sex life is a very serious thing and it happens VERY rarely. In fact, I've had the hankering lately for a very specific encounter but the situation just hasn't developed in a way that makes me or her feel comfortable. Anything this important deserves more than a cursory glance.

Oh and if anyone involved has to be drunk or stoned when it happens, walk away and forget it. A few drinks to loosen up is one thing but needing to get blitzed is a sign of trouble ahead.

Can sharing this with others be a wonderful experience? Absolutely. Can it be a disaster in the making? Damn right.

This is your life you're talking about, not a porn movie or a still image on your computer screen. Sex should be about who you are and all that you want to be. I guarantee there are a lot of people walking around who've done all kinds of crazy sexual things that don't feel complete. And who wouldn't have any of those images spring to mind as "most memorable."

It is not an easy thing to answer this question. It is all about you, your SO, and your choice of partner/s. I guess in the end it all comes down to trust, honesty, and desire.

Wow did I ramble or what? Hope something in this tirade makes at least a little sense.

Hugger

Wow, thanks for the very thoughtful advice, all of which makes a lot of sense. This is a topic that I am sure the two of us will spend a whole lot more time talking about before any decision is made. There's absolutely no pressure on either side, either to do it or not to do it. And hey, talking about it can be lots of fun even if it doesn't happen! We certainly don't need to do it for variety's sake -- we are pretty varied in our tastes without any outside assistance.

You're welcome Fille. This is something that I enjoy talking about and think is very important.

And you are soooo right about the talking. I know just what to say about this topic that can make my wife squirm and pant. I know what she wants and when the mood strikes and the dirty talk flows...woosh...look out!

As always, feel free to ask away. I'm very open and honest (or atleast try to be). And not much shocks me.

Hugger

Oh and just one more quick point that my experience has shown. It is usually the males that have the most emotional turmoil in these situations. Seems a bit strange given the stereotypes I guess. But our encounters have taught me that it was either my or the other man's emotions that were far more a factor than the lady's.

Maybe it's because when a woman gives herself over sexually she's already explored herself and men all too often just act on urges. I don't know exactly.

That is a surprising point. In our case it could be a toss up. I have never done anything of the kind before, but feel like I am probably prepared to do it. He has done it, but never with a person he was in love with. I suspect that could make things very, very different.

He is giving excellent advice....

We are new to this lifestyle too, and have gone through a few things 'Limb mentioned.

It is not for everyone and chances are it wont be as good as it is in the mind. It can be very good with the couple too.
Make sure the cpl has the same general 'ideas'as you both do too. One cpl we were with it was awful the cpl we have been with lately has been alot of fun.

Good luck..

do you feel that it has changed anything between the two of you?

Yes. The good and bad experiences have brought us closer.

That's good to hear.

"Without causeing damage?"

Yes, in theory.

In practice, it often can't.

The one thing I told DH from the beginning was that I needed him to consistently let me know that I was the love of his life and the best he ever had and that while sex with others was enjoyable, no one would replace me. He realized that I did need the reassurances from him and it has worked very well. Totally agree with limbhugger, communication is key. (and I also feel that DH and I have gotten closer through our experiences).

Limbhugger would you care to elaborate on the turmoil? If this is to personal and you would rather not go into detail i fully understand.

thx for some great insight!
-miles

Thanks, HGG -- it's good to hear a female perspective on this. That's also one of the things we have discussed. I don't feel particularly insecure about the whole thing NOW, but I know I probably will if the event actually occurs. He says that whatever we get involved in, his number one role will be to tell me how much he loves me, how beautiful he finds me, and how he is 100% mine.

Oh, y'all, I just noticed that I am no longer a virgin! Sounds funny, doesn't it? I'm so excited.

LOL, Fille --
I totally understand the thrill of losing the "virgin" label; just got there myself!

DH and I have shared another couple and a few derivatives of that (DH and I with the other wife; myself alone with the other DH and his wife) as well as few other swinging experiences. Each time (particularly in the beginning) DH watches me. We actually set up a signal so that if I was becoming unhappy or wanted us to leave, I could give our private signal without having to reply to his "How are you honey?" with "I am horrible and jealous and unhappy and just want to leave" which might be a real damper on future relations with the other couple. LOL. Truly, our swinging experiences have made our relationship better in that I have learned to be truly open with him in how I feel about things.

Good luck in whatever you do!

fille said:

do you feel that it has changed anything between the two of you?

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The first time we did it...we had sex ALOT over the next couple of days. The afterglow for us is great.

At times I felt it has brought us closer together.
We both know that we do not have to cheat to 'scratch the itch'
You have to separate LOVE from LUST and it can be done.
We like to be together during at all times...we do not full swap..did it once and we both did not enjoy it. So we are into a group situation more than a swap.

HGG, I think the signal is a great idea. I don't think I can predict with certainty how I am going to feel in the situation. My husband would definitely be in the room at all times whether or not he participated.

How did those of you who have tried this get in contact with the people you became involved with?

a swingboard website

One suggestion I saw on a similar thread that I really liked was to ease your way into swinging. The poster suggested going to a strip club together, then getting a table dance. Talk about how each of you felt about that experience. Perhaps a next step might involve some soft swinging-- where you can make out with others, but not have intercourse. My gf and I get very turned on by the idea of having sex together in the same room with another couple. (Plays to both swing and exhibition fantasies!) You might also explore how you feel about playing strip poker or twister with other people. Spin the bottle?

Regardless of what intermediate steps you take, they give you a brief taste of what the full swing experience may be. It's a lower risk opportunity to explore how arousing something is and how jealous each of you becomes.

I like your suggestion, DL. We have already planned some of the easier stuff, like the strip club.

Miles_Cassidy said:

Limbhugger would you care to elaborate on the turmoil? If this is to personal and you would rather not go into detail i fully understand.

thx for some great insight!
-miles

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Miles,

In my experience it is usually one of the stereotypical two: jealousy and/or inadequacy. We men are often much more fragile creatures than we like to admit. Of course women figured that out centuries ago.

We had a nice situation going with a couple. We got together twice and I really enjoyed every part of it. And there were a LOT of every part of it. Completely uninhibited and raw and good. My wife learned that she would prefer not to have the male with her. It didn't turn her off it just didn't really do anything for her. I have to admit it did a lot for me. But since she isn't into it I doubt we'll do that again.

I strayed sorry. At any rate, that situation came to a strange halt and we haven't heard from them in two years. I strongly believe and the female more or less confirmed that it was because her husband couldn't handle it. He liked every part of it except her and I together. Which ironically did a lot for my wife. Maybe we're just a couple of perverted voyuers...lol. Anyways, she very much digged me and our sex and he hated it. Couldn't get passed the jealousy and feelings of inadequacy.

Too bad, I think it could've become something really, really special.

Hugger

I do think it's often true that men suffer from more or deeper insecurities about their sexual prowess than do women. There are so many artificial pressures placed on men -- how big is your cock, how long can you keep it up, do you kiss well, say the right things at the right times, know exactly where and how to touch and lick her, big biceps, washboard abs, Lord I don't know how you ever take your clothes off. Although it is certainly, in reality, just as important for a woman to be a good and thoughtful lover, and although there seems to be more attention in the media, at least historically, to women's physical appearance, the truth is we have it much easier. At least when it comes to expectations and prospects. It's not too hard for just about any woman to find a willing sex partner. And though she should try just as hard as he does to please her partner, quite a few men will be satisfied if she just lets him.

LH, when you first said that it is more likely to be the man who has problems I was surprised by it, but now that I've had the chance to think about it, it makes perfect sense.

Does anyone have an opinion on 1 to 1 encounters before everyone gets together?

For example, MF want a MFM. She find someone, lets them know she wants MFM. First she has a FM tryst alone with #2 some afternoon, and then all get together some later evening for the MFM date.

Or, she goes off with #2, and #1 goes separately and gives them 30 - 60 minutes together alone before joining them.

The idea is that she and #2 have a way to get comfortable together and reduce some of the performance anxieties. Also she can tell/ teach/ demonstrate/ fantasize/ brief #2 what she wants to happen with they are all together, and he can learn her "buttons" and how her body responds.

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Or how about the guys getting together beforehand and working out some details about how to start and what to do to make her experience be what she wants?

I've talked with some people who have done it that way but the majority of people do not play alone.

For most people I've met the point of bringing another person into their sex life is not simply to go off and have sex with another person alone but to involve their partner as well and have a sexual experience that all people have fun in whether that be a MFM or just the male partner watching his female partner with another male.

If you are looking for your first experience I would tend to recommend not doing a one on one. You are communicating that it is ok for two people to get together by themselves, you want everyone to have a good time but it is inappropiate for the other person to form a relationship type bond with her. By being in the room you are also available to her should she change her mind or need something or if something should go terribly wrong (after all, you don't know these people extremely well). Being there can also give her a sense of security even if nothing wrong does happen she knows that if she changes her mind you are right there to help her.

It seems to me that any benefits from a 1 on 1 can just as easily be obtained through a non 1 on 1 encounter, just slow down and let things progress normally.

If you are contemplating bringing another person or people into your sex lifes hopefully she is comfortable enough to talk about it with the people you are planning on involving.

One couple told me how they did it was go to lunch or dinner with the other person or couple, and have a nice meal, and maybe a movie with no possibility of playing that night at all.

Then each party could think about if they wanted to play with no pressure, if they did they would get back together to play. This has the added benefit of everyone knowing why they are there instead of the possibility of them feeling uncomfortable leaving after the meal.

I would recommend getting the book Considering Swinging (it is available for download as well) or Together Sex if you are inexperienced.

It can be a very enjoyable experience(s) but you need to make sure that both of you are in a place where you find it exciting and your relationship is in a stable place with excellent communication.

I have not talked to anyone involved in the lifestyle where at least 1/2 of the couple did not have some issues at some point, the difference between the ones that are either out of the style or divorced or the ones that are still together and/or still in the lifestyle is they have a very fundamental respect for eachother, excellent communication, a lasting love, and an otherwise strong relationship.

You need to think it through and analyse how you think you would feel, set the rules before the encounter and don't break them, at least that time. Not breaking the rules and guidlines you have set in the heat of the moment gives you the opportunity to think more about breaking them and decide if that is something you truly want to do.

I believe it is ok for guys to get together and talk about it only if the only halfs are open to the idea. You should not scheme to make something happen that your partner does not know about. On the other hand if you decide that a MFM or other arrangment is desirable for both of you but she would like you to bring it up thats another story. If you want to impart wisdom to him like how she likes particular things done that is ok but just because she likes it one way wont mean she also doesn't like it another way, you don't want to take the variety out and have the other person be identical to the person they are already with!

I wouldn't say guys are necessarily more emotionally sensitive than females (everyone is different) but they are at least as sensitive. You need know what you and what her are comfortable with.