Stuffing the ballot box?

Dear Friends,

Okay, I'll admit it. I watch my vote totals and averages .

When a story I recently posted (which shall remain nameless) has an average rating that drops more than a third of a point (-.39) in the space of three votes, that has to mean that, after getting mostly 4s and 5s, someone or some people gave it a string of low numbers. Somehow I can't believe that my literary effort changed quality so drastically.

I know this sounds like a whine. But I left another story site because I was tired of being what I perceived to be the target of votes designed simply to lower my score, and until now I didn't see that happening here. Or does it happen here, and am I just being naive? Thanks for any enlightenment, Ken

Ken Nitsua said:

I know this sounds like a whine. But I left another story site because I was tired of being what I perceived to be the target of votes designed simply to lower my score, and until now I didn't see that happening here. Or does it happen here, and am I just being naive? Thanks for any enlightenment, Ken

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There are people who will vote multiple times in order to lower your score, I cannot say whom nor can I say why; perhaps other authors, hoping to win the monthly contests, perhaps just a reader who took offense with your writing.

The system here does appear to work fairly well, and the contest winning stories are usually well deserving of their placing. Consecutive strings of low votes are normally wiped out in the periodic troll sweeps, so you may see the vote count drop and the score rise again.

Welcome to the wonderful land of Trolls... they are a part of life on any site you go to..

Feedback is the real sourse of how good a story is and even then Mr/Mrs/It Anonyamous will have their say....

The owners of this site sweep the crap as often as they can...

Voting

Hi Ken

It happened to me too, and I think it's happened to most authors on here.

Part 3 of my last story " All I Want Is You" had a 19 votes of 5 placing it at No.1 on the top story lists and then all of a sudden after 3 more votes it dropped to 4.74 and out of the lists completely...

Now it has stabilised at 4.70. I posted a long whine at the time but now
I'm philosophical about it...

I think the general idea is that feedback is more important, but I'd like some of that as well!

janiexx

ken: by any chance, is it a loving wives story? some folks refer to what you've described as "1-bombing".

ed

Ken Nitsua said:

Dear Friends,

Okay, I'll admit it. I watch my vote totals and averages .

When a story I recently posted (which shall remain nameless) has an average rating that drops more than a third of a point (-.39) in the space of three votes, that has to mean that, after getting mostly 4s and 5s, someone or some people gave it a string of low numbers. Somehow I can't believe that my literary effort changed quality so drastically.

I know this sounds like a whine. But I left another story site because I was tired of being what I perceived to be the target of votes designed simply to lower my score, and until now I didn't see that happening here. Or does it happen here, and am I just being naive? Thanks for any enlightenment, Ken

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I still watch 'em and I've been putting up stories for almost two years.

There are people, as Tx noted, who are locally called trolls.

I don't believe most of them even bother to read your stuff. They just go to the vote page, vote one, and then come here to the boards and wait for their victim to squeal.

It's an odd form of sadism. Don't take it personally.

In some categories, such as Loving Wives, readers are divided into vicious opposing camps and assiduously one-bomb stories that belong to the other camp. No matter what you submit to Loving Wives you're going to make two out of three readers unhappy.

But this site does make frequent and concerted efforts to do troll sweeps. Votes regarded by the site management to be illegitimate are deleted.

The feedback is your best indicator of how good the story is. Wallow in that. I do.

Thanks for the information and advice

I appreciate the advice from those of you who've been around longer than me. To the person who asked, the story of mine that got slammed is not a Loving Wives story. I find the notion that there are reader "camps" in some categories fascinating. Just what are the camps as far as "Loving Wives" is concerned, and why do people get so bent out of shape about that category?

Best, Ken

rgraham666 said:

I still watch 'em and I've been putting up stories for almost two years.

There are people, as Tx noted, who are locally called trolls.

I don't believe most of them even bother to read your stuff. They just go to the vote page, vote one, and then come here to the boards and wait for their victim to squeal.

It's an odd form of sadism. Don't take it personally.

In some categories, such as Loving Wives, readers are divided into vicious opposing camps and assiduously one-bomb stories that belong to the other camp. No matter what you submit to Loving Wives you're going to make two out of three readers unhappy.

But this site does make frequent and concerted efforts to do troll sweeps. Votes regarded by the site management to be illegitimate are deleted.

The feedback is your best indicator of how good the story is. Wallow in that. I do.

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Ken Nitsua said:

I appreciate the advice from those of you who've been around longer than me. To the person who asked, the story of mine that got slammed is not a Loving Wives story. I find the notion that there are reader "camps" in some categories fascinating. Just what are the camps as far as "Loving Wives" is concerned, and why do people get so bent out of shape about that category?

Best, Ken

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In Loving Wives, so I've been given to understand, there are three camps.

There are those who like stories about loving wives.

There are those who like stories about wives that cheat, get away with it and like it.

And there are those who like stories about wives that cheat, don't get away with it and suffer for it.

None of them like the other two.

Plus there are a number of pregnancy fetishists in each camp as well.

Note: Not speaking from personal experience. But I've heard often enough from others about the taxonomy of the genre.

rgraham666 said:

The feedback is your best indicator of how good the story is. Wallow in that. I do.

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I enjoy my feedback too. Just wish the anonymous wankers would include an email addie so I could send them nasty abuse like they send me.

Ken Nitsua said:

Dear Friends,

Okay, I'll admit it. I watch my vote totals and averages .

When a story I recently posted (which shall remain nameless) has an average rating that drops more than a third of a point (-.39) in the space of three votes, that has to mean that, after getting mostly 4s and 5s, someone or some people gave it a string of low numbers. Somehow I can't believe that my literary effort changed quality so drastically.

I know this sounds like a whine. But I left another story site because I was tired of being what I perceived to be the target of votes designed simply to lower my score, and until now I didn't see that happening here. Or does it happen here, and am I just being naive? Thanks for any enlightenment, Ken

Click to expand...

I thought it was impossible to vote multiple times.

Love those trolls...not

I think it has happened to us all. Its the worst when we particularly like a story of ours and it does terribly. It happened to me under my story Cajun Lightning-was about a 4.36 at one point and I was appalled but then it went to 4.95 and now at about 4.83. People are just goofs, for lack of a better word. One gripe I WOULD like to make is about those people who post feedback that is NOT CONSTRUCTIVE at all, just a way to see their opinion in print.

Personally I dont mind negative feedback when it is valid and a suggestion is offered along with it. Sometimes I see where the person is coming from and I even did a rewrite once based on some fedback that was helpful. But what I do not like at all is people who will nitpick on some non-detrimental part of the story, then give you terrible feedback like, "well you said she made this much money a year and compared her to Martha Stewart and that threw me off for a while..." Mind you, has NOTHING to do with the story-just a funny quip. Or the ever loved, annonymous feedback where silly criticisms are offered and often times, it is simply because the person didn't read all the way through. Just burns my bacon.

All I ask is people, not everyone is going to love every story or every genre. We all have our faves and that is fine. But like we learned in elementary school-If you cannot say something nice and useful, just hush. On the same note, if someone does offer a suggestion, authors, don't get huffy. I've done it too, but usually try not to let it bother me bcause it is just a suggestion. Ultimately, I have the power to say yea or nay and that also means I can be gracious. We are all here because we enjoy reading and writing and in order to be more creative, we need to feel comfprtable. I'm not asking for us to hold hands and sing kumbaya, but some mutual respect is key.

-gets off her soapbox and hands it to the next guy-

That said, happy creating to all and to all a good night!

J

rgraham666 said:

In Loving Wives, so I've been given to understand, there are three camps.

There are those who like stories about loving wives.

There are those who like stories about wives that cheat, get away with it and like it.

And there are those who like stories about wives that cheat, don't get away with it and suffer for it.

None of them like the other two.

Plus there are a number of pregnancy fetishists in each camp as well.

Note: Not speaking from personal experience. But I've heard often enough from others about the taxonomy of the genre.

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Now you mustn't forget out the wimpy husbands. Some like them, others hate them. Some like it when the wimpy husband gets a backbone and kicks them all out. It is actually interesting to read a series of comments on a story where they are fighting between the two.

I've never understood the pregancy fetishes myself.

artisticannonymity said:

Or the ever loved, annonymous feedback where silly criticisms are offered and often times, it is simply because the person didn't read all the way through. Just burns my bacon.

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"This feedback was sent by: Anonymous

Comments:

Noxiousblonde,

Ever take the long long road to no where? I just arrived fresh off that road.
Writer, why do you keep embarrassing yourself?"


I think I can smell my bacon burning too. Can anyone help me out by translating wtf this anonymous wankrag is trying to say cos quite frankly, I'm blonde and its beyond my tiny powers of deduction.

Oh thanks for the 1 too Mr/Miss Anonymous Tosspot!

Lordmikel said:

Now you mustn't forget out the wimpy husbands. Some like them, others hate them. Some like it when the wimpy husband gets a backbone and kicks them all out. It is actually interesting to read a series of comments on a story where they are fighting between the two.

I've never understood the pregancy fetishes myself.

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Ah. I had forgotten about that particular wrinkle in the Loving Wives collective neurosis. Thank you.

Don't take it personal, noxious. There is no sense to be made. The troll is trolling. They can't help it anymore than a dog can avoid pissing on a fire hydrant.

Glad I found this thread. I could not understand why my number of votes went from something like 28 to 24 and the score increased on my story!

On other sites where you vote in polls, there are methods of locking people from voting twice (you have to be logged in generally). That would be one way, or, maybe having to have cookies turned on and detecting whether a story has already been voted on. (I think that's possible.)

Would having to be logged on to vote and send messages be a good idea? I suppose there are thousands of unregistered people who vote at the moment. It wouldn't stop people reading stories of course.

That sort of thing really pisses me off as well, I got one person commenting on my story and they said:

I wonder how many guys actually stick their dicks into someone elses shit filled hole?

The idea that they might does nothing to make a girl want that same dicky inside of her.

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Which I was completely baffled by considering there wasn't anything remotely close to anal in the story at all.

And of course, they voted a zero as well

I have no problem with negative comments on my work but at least have some clue what you're talking about. Lameass trolls

It'd be nice if there was no option for anonymous feedback as well, I bet they wouldn't be as quick to do their bashing if they had to admit who they are.

Interesting. Since posting on this thread I've noticed I've had two more votes and the story's average has gone down a fair bit.

This got me wondering, so working backwards from what it was to now it means I got a one and a two vote. How would the owners actually know what was a troll vote and what was someone who genuinely thought my story was a bag o' shite?

DiBosco said:

Interesting. Since posting on this thread I've noticed I've had two more votes and the story's average has gone down a fair bit.

This got me wondering, so working backwards from what it was to now it means I got a one and a two vote. How would the owners actually know what was a troll vote and what was someone who genuinely thought my story was a bag o' shite?

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HA, You just want us to read your story. We're onto you.

kbate said:

HA, You just want us to read your story. We're onto you.

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Good grief, no. Especially if you're just going to vote it down!

Joking apart, not my intention. I'm far too unnassuming for that. I'm faintly embarrassed it came across like that.

Ah, sweet clarification

I was wondering exactly what was with the recent rise and fall of votes and scores. Thank you for offering explanation, one and all.

I've been a bit concerned about the story I posted recently, since one has to read past the first page to realize what is going on (I know, I know, I made the fatal mistake of not having sex in the first three lines. Bad me.) I have been taking the lack of votes as a lack of interest. Bless the one person who commented! (and I don't even KNOW her!)

I almost wish that voting REQUIRED commenting. There's no way to know what goes on in a teeny little mind otherwise!

Literotica is a somewhat specialized venue, but not atypical. I find fascinating the constant play of people to make sure their particular ideas are at the forefront -- could it be that this kind of behavior creates the desired results (more of whatever one group wants?)

As for the "trolls". I've met their ilk elsewhere in the world. Small, wizened creatures are they, seeking power via the misery to others they can cause. Makes one wish for a good length of leather, doesn't it?

Posts that make me crazy

I'm not going to slam anybody (I'm afraid to). I was lucky enough to tread the Loving Wives category with a minimum of damage with my first full story. I made sure to nicely email everyone who made an interesting or constructive comment. I really appreciated all the feedback (positive and negative). I even left the one up that didn't say anything about my story, but called me a "Mother-Fucking Asshole". Whatever.
My question is how long is too long on a response? The board seems to be here if you want to break apart a story, but I had several extremely long posts (about the same length as my story...Ok, that's exaggerating a little). I don't mind, but what about the people who posted short, concise points. Their stuff gets pushed off the front page almost immediately. I'm sure many people like to see their comment stay up there for a while.
Also, it only happened once, but someone got in a mini-argument with another poster about something, and negatively rated my story twice. I'm all for free speech, but when you give a low score to the same chapter twice, just so you can fight with another poster (who had an email address listed), I think that goes over the line.
There wasn't much guidance for me in the instructions about dealing with posts other than to remove URL's or email addresses. Is there any rule of thumb other authors go by? I'd really like to see a word limit on comments (maybe something that allowed the author to move the bulk of the comment to this board). I'm not trying to punish people who want to cut up the story. I'm a new author, I'm fully aware there was a lot to pick apart. I'd just like people to be able to go through the comments without needing bathroom breaks.

Just curious...

because I really don't know. Can you log a vote for your own story on Literotica? I've been a participant in sites that did not permit this. Best, Ken

Ken Nitsua said:

because I really don't know. Can you log a vote for your own story on Literotica? I've been a participant in sites that did not permit this. Best, Ken

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You must be able to as you can vote without being logged in. Therefore how does Lit know it's you voting?!

S-Des said:

My question is how long is too long on a response? The board seems to be here if you want to break apart a story, but I had several extremely long posts (about the same length as my story...Ok, that's exaggerating a little). I don't mind, but what about the people who posted short, concise points. Their stuff gets pushed off the front page almost immediately. I'm sure many people like to see their comment stay up there for a while.

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I stay away from Loving WIves because the category seems to attract a lot of readers with real emotional problems. A posted comment that's almost as long as the story is the sign of obsession, and many of these LW readers seem to be obsessed, as if they're trying to work out their own personal problems though your story. It's creepy. You see people spewing real venom and bile over some of these stories, and it's scary.

We've got quite a few kinds of trolls around here. There are Status trolls who automatically one-bomb any story that makes the top ten, playing a kind of King of the Mountain. Because Lit sweeps stories with some algorithm that looks for votes way beyond the mean (if your story has a 4.5 rating with 50 votes and suddenly receives two 1's, chances are those 1's will be erased during the sweep), trolls now bomb with 2's and 3's which are harder for the algorithm to detect.

Then there are Flasher Trolls who just try to flame you and make you feel bad, sending off "You suck, asshole!" emails. They most likely don't even read the stories. They're just like the flashers who open their coast and show you their dicks, getting off on the shock in your face. If the comment seems to have nothing to do with your story, that's probably because the guy never read it. He just wants to show you his dick. Femnale authors get this kind of thing a lot, and if you have a personal picture posted, it's even worse.

But don't forget that people also get 5-bombed, although no one complains. Most of us have fans and firneds here we inform when a new story goes up, and they run over and vote it a 5 whether they really liked it or not. That's why your initial score is almost higher than where it finally ends up. Your friends read it first, and then the regulars come in. As I said, no one seems to complain about 5-bombs.

Voting twice on a story from the same computer is not allowed. Lit has cookies on your PC, and can tell when you're multiple-voting and will remove the extra votes. Apparenlty there are ways around that though, to judge from some of the chicanery I've seen during contests--stores hovering around 4.00 till just before the voting closes and then shooting up to 4.95 in a matter of minutes.

Thanks for that imput

Thank You Dr Mabeuse,
I posted two stories in that category, And like the others it started out well then dropped off the face of the earth.
But it seems my stories all revolve around that subject, as for I do love my wife, and we do have great sex.
I like writing stories about this...It beats the incest crap, rape, girls to young to even think about sex...no less doing it, and other garabage that seems to get high ratings, and not only on this site either!.
Is there anyway to post a loving wife story and have it get high ratings?
Or where to put it outside that category without it getting slammed?
Your imput would help us folks that do like to write about are loving wives.
Doc.