The definition of "Incest"

[Syzoth]

So the category of "Incest" on Literotica has the description "Keep It In the Family".

Obviously, sex with a blood-related relative, ie- parent, son/daughter, sibling, etc... is incest.

I'd even include step-child and step-parent. Agreed?

But what about a relative that's not blood related? Like a cousin, or aunt or uncle, that's only through married? Does that still count as "incest" here?

 

[Thebrowneye]

Pretty sure there is plenty of Aunt and Uncle stories in the directory already.
I think it comes down to the idea of the taboo and what is frowned upon, which transcends solely blood tied stories.

 

[Lumiere_Amie]

I have a stand-alone story and a series focused on relations between a man and his sister in law. They've been well-received by the IT readers.

 

[Rustyoznail]

Aunt/Uncle/cousins push it over into the taboo side of the category.

 

[Tio_Narratore]

In the Western World, the tends to be confounding of inbreeding and incest. Inbreeding - mating with a genetically close relative - is what generally is considered incest, even here on Literotica. Incest, properly, is mating with a proscribed relative. What is a relative, however, is a matter of socio-cultural definition, not biological definition. In a strictly matrilineal society, such as the historic Trobrianders, children were only related through their mother; if a man had sex with his daughter, it was considered improper, but not incest. Among the Pathans of southeast Asia, a strictly Patrilineal society, a man inherited his father's wives, including his own biological mother. He was expected to give her to one of his father's brothers, but until then, she was considered one of his wives. In ancient Egypt, where inheritance was by primogeniture but ownership male, a first born daughter would marry her younger brother to keep wealth and status within the family. Similar situations still are current in the world, and even in some Western regions, rules are different. In New Jersey, for example, any consenting adults can have whatever sex they like; if, however, they are parent and sibling or siblings, they are not allowed to marry. By the way, reproduction between second cousins - people sharing a great-grandparent - differs little genetically from reproduction between strangers.

 

[Syzoth]

Aunt/Uncle/cousins push it over into the taboo side of the category.

That's interesting to me that sex with an uncle/aunt/cousin would be considered more taboo than sex with a parent or sibling.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

At bottom, rules seem based on two general areas, first being genetic and the other perhaps ‘power-balance’. Even that isn’t hard and firm, however. Many nations consider copulation or marriage with a sibling’s spouse, yet in ancient Israel, men were almost obliged to marry their late brother’s widow. These days, every jurisdiction, every religion, seems to have its own rules. Some of them can be almost funny.

In the District of Columbia, for instance, getting it on with your grandson’s wife is good for 12 years playing rock hockey.

Rhode Island forbids the marriage of a whole lot of people, but seems to have no particular penalty for doing so. Moreover, sex between anybody is legal provided both are 16 or older.

Arizona allows first cousins to marry if both are 65+ and can prove that at least one of them is sterile. You can’t make this up!

Incest is on the other hand completely legal in a surprising number of nations.

From a writer’s point of view, I think it’s the ‘forbidden territory’ aspect and that leaves almost anything incestuous under the right conditions.

 

[SimonDoom]

That's interesting to me that sex with an uncle/aunt/cousin would be considered more taboo than sex with a parent or sibling.

I think what he's saying is that taboo is a lesser/broader set of activities. It's not quite incest, but it is taboo.

My take: for purposes of this site and the category, dictionary, legal, and historical definitions are completely irrelevant. The only question about whether it's "incest" is whether readers think it is and are turned on as a result. Here, reader taste is all over the map, but after 20+ years of reading incest stories at this site I'd make the following observations:

1. Generally speaking, the closer the blood relation, the hotter the kink for MOST readers. Not all. Some can't quite take it but will accept less closely related sex. But if you want the maximum reader response, go with full blood incest.

2. A lot comes down to how you write it. If you write a story about a parent and adopted child, or two step siblings, it can be a very hot incest story if you write it that way.

3. I see the category as inclusive, not exclusive. Don't hesitate to put a story with a less taboo family relationship in incest if you want to. You may get some gripes, but there are plenty of readers who will like it.

 

[AwkwardMD]

@BelleCanzuto has a great story about a priest and one of his parishioners.

 

[Syzoth]

I think what he's saying is that taboo is a lesser/broader set of activities. It's not quite incest, but it is taboo.

My take: for purposes of this site and the category, dictionary, legal, and historical definitions are completely irrelevant. The only question about whether it's "incest" is whether readers think it is and are turned on as a result. Here, reader taste is all over the map, but after 20+ years of reading incest stories at this site I'd make the following observations:

1. Generally speaking, the closer the blood relation, the hotter the kink for MOST readers. Not all. Some can't quite take it but will accept less closely related sex. But if you want the maximum reader response, go with full blood incest.

2. A lot comes down to how you write it. If you write a story about a parent and adopted child, or two step siblings, it can be a very hot incest story if you write it that way.

3. I see the category as inclusive, not exclusive. Don't hesitate to put a story with a less taboo family relationship in incest if you want to. You may get some gripes, but there are plenty of readers who will like it.

That makes sense. Thanks!

 

[Rustyoznail]

That's interesting to me that sex with an uncle/aunt/cousin would be considered more taboo than sex with a parent or sibling.

No, not more taboo. Frowned upon though.

 

[lovecraft68]

This topic is slowly approaching its own drinking game.

The category slug is one thing, the category itself is "Incest/Taboo"

Why this seems confusing to so many is confusing to me.

 

[RetroFan]

There always some things which some will say are incest, but others will say are not. I've even had commenters go to the trouble of looking up cousin marriage law in places where some of my IT cousin stories are set and informed me that first cousin marriage is legal in this place and therefore my story is not IT. Weird or what?

However there are some grey areas as follows:

Step Families: For this most part would be IT, but there are varying degrees depending on the circumstances. For example, stepsiblings for the most part raised together as siblings will be IT. But what if two older divorced parents get remarried later in life, one of whom has a daughter and the other a son from their previous marriages, both adults in their mid 30s who live in different cities and they start a love affair? This is much less incestuous than if they had grown up together.

In-Laws: Can fall either way with in-laws who like to 'keep things in the family' so to speak, much like step families. IT fans will scream - 'But it's not Incest Taboo!' if posted there, but post an in-laws story in Loving Wives and the reaction is like disturbing a nest of killer bees.

Threesome (Or More) With No Direct Sexual Contact Between Related Parties: Two pretty sisters have a threesome with a handsome guy they meet on holiday. The sisters are of course naked and performing sex acts with an unrelated guy in front of each other., but have no direct sexual contact with each other. IT fans might not like this, but Group Sex fans would probably be even less impressed.

Cousins Not Directly Related: Mr and Mrs Smith have a son and daughter named Simon and Stacey. Both parents have a sister, Mr Smith's sister marries Mr Jones and they have a son and daughter named John and Jane. Mrs Smith's sister marries Mr Brown and they have a son and daughter named Ben and Brittany. Simon and Stacey's paternal first cousins are John and Jane, and their maternal first cousins Ben and Brittany. If they have sex with any of these cousins it is IT. But what if Ben gets into Jane's panties, or John bangs Brittany? Would coitus between these 'crossover' cousins (not sure of the correct term) be IT or not?

Fetish Themes With No Sexual Pleasure for the Characters: A bride wearing a complicated dress gets taken short with a bathroom emergency at her wedding and is less than a minute away from soiling her panties. Her campy gay brother comes to the rescue of his distraught sister and he helps her to go to the toilet, this assistance extending to him getting toilet paper and wiping his sister's bottom for her as she can't reach around to do it herself. Neither brother nor sister get any sexual pleasure from the experience. Such story themes would appeal in Fetish, but would likely score much lower with a brother and sister in this situation, rather than a bride and her unrelated gay BFF. In IT, the fans would say it should be in Fetish and probably in far stronger terms.

 

[RejectReality]

I think what he's saying is that taboo is a lesser/broader set of activities. It's not quite incest, but it is taboo.

My take: for purposes of this site and the category, dictionary, legal, and historical definitions are completely irrelevant. The only question about whether it's "incest" is whether readers think it is and are turned on as a result. Here, reader taste is all over the map, but after 20+ years of reading incest stories at this site I'd make the following observations:

1. Generally speaking, the closer the blood relation, the hotter the kink for MOST readers. Not all. Some can't quite take it but will accept less closely related sex. But if you want the maximum reader response, go with full blood incest.

2. A lot comes down to how you write it. If you write a story about a parent and adopted child, or two step siblings, it can be a very hot incest story if you write it that way.

3. I see the category as inclusive, not exclusive. Don't hesitate to put a story with a less taboo family relationship in incest if you want to. You may get some gripes, but there are plenty of readers who will like it.

I'll add that you're more likely to get low scores and nasty feedback with incest-lite ( step, in-law, adopted, etc. ) outside the category than you are to get the same for not hitting the blood nuclear family that are the preferred pairings in the category. Plus the people who do enjoy it are more likely to cancel out the low votes through sheer numbers than in most categories.

The rules of least squick and most readers both point the same direction on this one.

 

[UnexpectedLuggage]

I would say any familial ties makes it taboo. Obviously some stuff will be more taboo than others, but there's still the taboo of the fact that they are someone you would call family.

At least that's how I view it.

 

[jaF0]

So the category of "Incest" on Literotica has the description "Keep It In the Family".

There is no such category.

There is "Incest and Taboo" which encompasses all manner of things not normally accepted. Manson called his cult a 'family' though none of them were related.

Get unstuck from individual words and have some fun.

 

[Britva415]

what about a relative that's not blood related? Like a cousin, or aunt or uncle, that's only through married? Does that still count as "incest" here?

I doubt the people who are interested in the Incest category are interested in the non-blood relations.

Relation-by-marriage or by-adoption cuts the taboo in half or more.

These might still be taboo relationships but nowhere near as strongly taboo as close blood relations.

I'm not one of the Incest readers, but I'd be surprised if this got them fired up very much.

 

[Britva415]

So the category of "Incest" on Literotica has the description "Keep It In the Family".

There is no such category.

 

[jaF0]

Now read the rest of the post.

 

[Rustyoznail]

I doubt the people who are interested in the Incest category are interested in the non-blood relations.

Relation-by-marriage or by-adoption cuts the taboo in half or more.

These might still be taboo relationships but nowhere near as strongly taboo as close blood relations.

I'm not one of the Incest readers, but I'd be surprised if this got them fired up very much.

I beg to differ. I had three >10k stories all scoring over 4.6, and not one comment mentioned the lack of a blood connection.

 

[lovecraft68]

I doubt the people who are interested in the Incest category are interested in the non-blood relations.

Relation-by-marriage or by-adoption cuts the taboo in half or more.

These might still be taboo relationships but nowhere near as strongly taboo as close blood relations.

I'm not one of the Incest readers, but I'd be surprised if this got them fired up very much.

Depends how you spin it.

I know I've posted this before, but I'll do a refresher.

The thrill there is taboo, as in things you shouldn't do.

Two examples of a step story, one that probably won't do to well, and one that can do very well.

1-Step mom (but plug in Dad, sister, brother its all the same) Dad remarries when the son is either over 16 or even already a legal adult. Something happens, step mom and son have sex. Big deal, there's no family dynamic there, this is a cougar cub story ramped up a notch because its dad's wife, but not his mom.
Meh...

2-Something happens, divorce, maybe mom passes away (this is the better emotional option no real mom to compete) Dad remarries when the kid is young, maybe five or so where you still really need a 'mommy'. he and the step mom become very close over the years. She raises and loves him as her own, and he truly sees her as his mother. Despite not being blood relation, there is a strong, loving, and familial bond there. Now the son is over 18 and something happens and he sleeps with the step mother

Now you have a taboo situation because this is the woman who you have seen as mom since a child, but now as a sexual woman.

This set up will do much better.

That's of you write step which I never have.

I'm of the school that step stories compared to real incest is like non alcoholic beer, some of the flavor, but none of the bite. But it can be pulled off for those that choose to.