So a friend of mine who's new to Lit...

[Comshaw]

Decided he'd check out the forums and dared to venture into AH, even though he doesn't write here.

While he enjoyed some of the topics that pertain to literary endeavours, he also sent me this gif, as it was his overwhelming impression of the interpersonal dynamics of the forum.

Ouch?

https://tenor.com/view/fritz-the-cat-learning-is-a-big-thing-gif-5395501

Ouch? No sad. Why sad? Let's take the meme your friend cited:

"You think learning is a really big thing and you become this big fucking intellectual and sit around trying to out intellectual all the other big fucking intellectuals."

From the above, I deduce your friend doesn't think learning is something to strive for, that it isn't a "big deal". Also, that once you have some knowledge under your belt and decide to share some of it in a discussion, you automatically become a "big fucking intellectual". The meme uses that term in a derogatory manner, with an attempt to denigrate anyone who wants to share their experience and any knowledge they have. .

It's sad. The first reason being, at one time, way back in my youth, I shared that mindset. In the intervening years, I have discovered that learning is a big deal. Without it I am and will stay ignorant of what was and can be.

As for an intellectual, ain't no way I'm even close to being that. If adding my experience and opinion to a discussion on writing stories (specifically erotic ones) is being a BFI, then the other discussion groups I'm in for my other hobbies must be the same, yeah? A discussion on navigating a decreasing radius curve at speed? Or which bait to use for halibut? Or the pros and cons of using a .204 Ruger as opposed to a .220 Swift for varmint hunting? I've seen just as many animated, opinionated, literate posts on those as I see here on stories.

I will cop to and admit at times I do tend toward the verbose, especially when someone stimulates the bit of gray matter that still functions for me.

BH, did you give him a tour of the GB and PB just to show the contrast. His comment on those would probably burn paper.

Having been a denizen of the GB/PB for a number of years and having survived it with most of my hide intact, if he wants the full experience, I would suggest he starts his very first post with an "orange man bad" or "Biden sucks" comment. Asbestos underwear is recommended though.

This place isn't nearly as bad as other forums at this Site, and for that matter many other forums I've seen elsewhere.

Disagreement isn't the same thing as rancor. Disagreement isn't a bad thing. It's predictable and unsurprising that in a forum among authors of erotic stories you'd see a huge range of opinions and a lot of disagreement.

I think that's a good thing. It only gets bad when it gets personal. There's no reason to get personal.

I personally don't mind if somebody tells me I'm wrong about something and they know more about the subject than I do or they point to something specific that proves me wrong. It happens more than I'd like, but it keeps me on my toes and I learn something.

I would not be part of a board or social structure where everything was homogenous and bland. Disagreement is the thing that forces me to look at different opinions, look at things I would normally not see because of my own bias.

Of course, that can be taken to an extreme. The GB/PB is a prime example of it. Disagreements don't have to turn into a boot pissing contest.

I think it's true we get a substantial amount of pontificating in here, and so very many people are Rhodes scholars, apparently. As for the other forums here on the DB, I don't really venture into them.

I asked him if I fell into the category represented by his Fritz gif, and he says 'No, you're a terminal goofball who happens to write smut. If you pontificated like THAT, we wouldn't be friends.'

Funny part? He won't read my stuff here on Lit, because he doesn't want to know where my mind takes me, and, secondly, he generally can't deal with my sense of humour and thinks my erotica will be jammed full of it. He's right. Even The Great Khan has my humour in it, and it's a grisly war story with gore, plunder, humiliation, and rape.

But I like you guys, so hopefully I don't spend my time trying to out-intellectual all you big fuckin' intellectuals.

Pontificating? Really? Sure there is, but among all that verbosity, most times lays a nugget, one that is worth the wade through the rest.

Rodes scholars? Let's talk about that as it applies to me:
I was a high school drop out. After being drafted, I was forced to test for my GED. I scored high enough on the test that my state transmuted the GED certificate to a High School diploma. I spent 6 years in the active army, another 7 in the National guard. I drove a garbage truck and ran a septic truck for 3 years when I got out of the army. After that I worked as a heavy equipment mechanic/welder/fabricator, first for a Port authority that shipped logs, then a cement business, then for a small municipality. I worked for the municipality for 31 years, as a mechanic, then the Lead mechanic, then the Fleet Manager.

My total formal education is high School and 68 credits toward an AA degree. There were a few other industry specific things I could put under that heading, like having taken the test for and being certified as a Fleet Manager. Or certification as a Master auto and truck Mechanic, or my EVT (Emergency Vehicle Technician) certification, or my structural welding certification, but that, as I said is industry specific and has little to do with writing stories.

As I've said before, I am dyslexic, a terrible speller, a two (sausage) fingered typist who tries and somewhat succeeds, in writing acceptable erotic stories. I know there are others out there like me. People who want to write, try to write, so when I post something here it isn't as a "Rodes Scholar" or just because I want to hear my own voice, but because it worked for me and maybe will work for someone else.

I do get frustrated with those anal individuals who can find a single misspelled or misused word in a 20,000-word story, who delight in telling me how educated they are and how that tiny little mistake destroyed the enjoyment they might have derived from the story. The frustration comes from two directions, the fact that each and every one of them are from "anonymous" without any verification of the degrees and titles claimed, and from the fact that I allowed it to slip past me to be found. The latter is always more frustrating than the former by the way.

(snip)
Plus there's the whole moral dimension to writing erotica, and that's where the arguments really kick off...

Morality, in the context of erotica and sexual gratification, is an individual thing. It ain't mine, never was nor never will be, to tell someone else what should be considered "moral" sexual conduct. As long as it harms no one else, I'll stay out of their rice bowl, if they stay out of mine. It's as simple as that.


Comshaw

 

[SimonDoom]

I gotta say, I just don't see it. People get out of hand, sometimes, and people, including me, in particular, get long-winded at times, but on the whole the tone of this particular forum is not overly nasty and not overly pretentious.

People share what they know, based on their backgrounds and experience, and that's a good thing. There's no cause to be intimidated or resentful because somebody else knows something you don't. Plenty of people here know things about which I'm totally incompetent or ignorant. And that makes me glad. I learn from that. it makes me a better writer and more knowledgeable person.

The thing that bothers me about a thread like this is the risk that somebody might hold back from commenting, thinking, "Is somebody going to disapprove of my comment or think I'm pontificating?" My attitude is, as long as you're not being an asshole to somebody, let it rip. Say your piece. You may be totally full of shit, and somebody may tell you that you are. But the more exchange the better.

 

[ElectricBlue]

For a bunch of perverts and wankers who have got nothing better to do than read and write smut, the denizens of this place are some of the finest folk I've ever had discourse with. Sure, there are several twats, but Ignore is your friend, so use it.

The drive-through pontificators are always fun, with more proclamations and nails than Luther, but those new religions either don't last or they settle down and say, "Gee, these guys do know what they're on about, sometimes." Even most times, depending on your tolerance and open-mindedness.

Cheers to good company. Now fuck off and start writing .

 

[gordo12]

Decided he'd check out the forums and dared to venture into AH, even though he doesn't write here.

While he enjoyed some of the topics that pertain to literary endeavours, he also sent me this gif, as it was his overwhelming impression of the interpersonal dynamics of the forum.

Ouch?

https://tenor.com/view/fritz-the-cat-learning-is-a-big-thing-gif-5395501

It seems to me your friend is doing a little (lot) of pontificating himself

<Pontificating>Lit is a microcosm that you must be immersed in to appreciate the flavour. You need to be immersed in the writing, the people, and the advice to appreciate what goes on here. A lot of things discussed here are related to issues involving Lit itself.

I've learned a lot here and give full credit for the experience to AH & the readers.

Hell, even our two resident trolls have taught me things.

I've never found anything else like this board. Anywhere!</Pontificating>

 

[Stillrandy]

Perhaps a one word/acronym to summarize people's opinions/reactions to things they find on Literotica:

YMMV

 

[windar]

I think this forum is fine. I've seen better and I've seen worse. I can't figure out all the point of all those word game/post office threads, but some people seem to enjoy them, so whatever floats their boat.

There's much that could be done to improve the story side of the site, but I've said my piece on that.

 

[MrPixel]

... I can't figure out all the point of all those word game/post office threads, ...

I can't speak to the other threads, but I enjoy and participate in the "word chain" as exercise for vocabulary building or refresh. It's helped quite a bit.

 

[AlinaX]

Morality, in the context of erotica and sexual gratification, is an individual thing. It ain't mine, never was nor never will be, to tell someone else what should be considered "moral" sexual conduct. As long as it harms no one else, I'll stay out of their rice bowl, if they stay out of mine. It's as simple as that.

Which misses the point. We, as authors, are in no position to say what people can or can't fantasise about, and I guess we're all sex positive in the sense that so long as the sex is between consenting adults we don't have issues with the morality of it.

Far more interesting is the morality of our own actions as authors. For example, by writing about futanari, am I appropriating Japanese culture or contributing to the fetishisation of trans and intersex people? By writing so many tales of incest and non-consensual sex, am I contributing to the normalisation of potentially unhealthy relationships and behaviours?

Perhaps all these questions may be easily dismissed... but perhaps not. This is not a question of being stuck-in-the-50s, as lovecraft68 might put it. It's the same question that gets asked of violent video games and mainstream porn and any recreational activity that targets the brain's pleasure centres. For 99% of players/viewers/readers it's a non-issue, but what of the 1%? Are we responsible?

We do not exist in a vacuum. Our words are read by thousands of people. We can choose to ignore the moral dimension of what we do, but it's still there, and my point was that these questions do spill over into the Forum from time to time, and of course we will end up arguing over it.

 

[windar]

Which misses the point. We, as authors, are in no position to say what people can or can't fantasise about, and I guess we're all sex positive in the sense that so long as the sex is between consenting adults we don't have issues with the morality of it.

Far more interesting is the morality of our own actions as authors. For example, by writing about futanari, am I appropriating Japanese culture or contributing to the fetishisation of trans and intersex people? By writing so many tales of incest and non-consensual sex, am I contributing to the normalisation of potentially unhealthy relationships and behaviours?

Perhaps all these questions may be easily dismissed... but perhaps not. This is not a question of being stuck-in-the-50s, as lovecraft68 might put it. It's the same question that gets asked of violent video games and mainstream porn and any recreational activity that targets the brain's pleasure centres. For 99% of players/viewers/readers it's a non-issue, but what of the 1%? Are we responsible?

We do not exist in a vacuum. Our words are read by thousands of people. We can choose to ignore the moral dimension of what we do, but it's still there, and my point was that these questions do spill over into the Forum from time to time, and of course we will end up arguing over it.

I don't dismiss them, but I don't see them as applying uniquely to erotica. Many, perhaps almost all, mystery novels try to present "the perfect murder", one that stumps everyone but the supernaturally brilliant detective who stars in the book. Is that an instruction manual for someone desiring to eliminate a rival/spouse/boss/whomever who is likely to face only an average ordinary constabulary?

I would bet you that anything you or I come up with has already been done in real life and likely worse, so anyone looking for inspiration for evil is better off consulting their daily fish wrap than looking here. I speak from personal experience, because I once wrote a story that I beiieved was way too far fetched to ever happen, only to find out some time later that it already had, though I was unaware of it when I wrote it.

 

[XerXesXu]

Many, perhaps almost all, mystery novels try to present "the perfect murder", one that stumps everyone but the supernaturally brilliant detective who stars in the book. Is that an instruction manual for someone desiring to eliminate a rival/spouse/boss/whomever who is likely to face only an average ordinary constabulary?

Apparently, Agatha Christie sells well in Chicago.

 

[lovecraft68]

Which misses the point. We, as authors, are in no position to say what people can or can't fantasise about, and I guess we're all sex positive in the sense that so long as the sex is between consenting adults we don't have issues with the morality of it.

Far more interesting is the morality of our own actions as authors. For example, by writing about futanari, am I appropriating Japanese culture or contributing to the fetishisation of trans and intersex people? By writing so many tales of incest and non-consensual sex, am I contributing to the normalisation of potentially unhealthy relationships and behaviours?

Perhaps all these questions may be easily dismissed... but perhaps not. This is not a question of being stuck-in-the-50s, as lovecraft68 might put it. It's the same question that gets asked of violent video games and mainstream porn and any recreational activity that targets the brain's pleasure centres. For 99% of players/viewers/readers it's a non-issue, but what of the 1%? Are we responsible?

We do not exist in a vacuum. Our words are read by thousands of people. We can choose to ignore the moral dimension of what we do, but it's still there, and my point was that these questions do spill over into the Forum from time to time, and of course we will end up arguing over it.

I grew up in the 80's and remember how Dungeons and Dragons was seen as Evil, and caused suicide. IN the later 80's it was the infamous Washington Wives led by Tipper Gore with the whole metal/rock music should be censored for a variety of reasons.

Matrix was blamed for Columbine. Let's go way back to the days of the "devil's lettuce" and everything else that has been blamed for 'corruption' or bad behavior.

Moralizing in the form of trying to say music, movies, video games etc has always been and always will be.

But its interesting its not universal. Has Thomas Harris ever been accused of promoting Cannibalism? They take the same topics, heavy music, porn in any form, and anything that doesn't conform to what at the end of the day does fall under out dated conservative type ideals hence my 50's comment because that's what it reminds me of.

If someone will commit an act because of a story or song or game, that person was on the edge of it already and maybe it was he final trigger, but isn't the reason.

If as you said hundreds of thousands of people can play a video game, and 10 people somehow thing its reality...then it's the game?

I write incest and have for years and I admit that when I get a particularly twisted feedback I have a moment of "am I fueling this?" then figure they obviously were like this way before me or any other author they read, and most of it(I hope) is smoke blowing.

All the things I mentioned fall under witch hunts, the mob loves them some self righteous judgement...just spend some time on Twitter for proof of that.

We're not responsible for the actions of people who read our stories, and on a personal level, I don't believe an American writing about Futanari is appropriating anything, that's just something the professionally outraged 'woke' concocted for something else to cry about.

To me, its a homage and have you looked into Japanese pop culture? They take everything from us. Are they appropriating? Of course not, they think its cool so they get into it. This was the case for everything before it became trendy to start yapping about how evil we all are.

We live in a free speech country(for now) which means we are free to write as we will, and people are free to think about it what they will. If someone reacts poorly to some story or song, or movie, that's too bad. That person needed help they either never sought or sadly weren't given and that's that.

There are also no rules about what you can write about in fiction (other than copyright type things or platform's personal rules) and there is far worse things written in mainstream fiction than what we come up with here.

We're not allowed to write underage here because the site worries who it might bring to the site. Asshat King wrote about a bunch of 12 year old boys running a train on a 12 year old girl.

Good times there, though, right?

Weinstein went to jail as he should have. Tarantino admits openly he knew what was happening, did nothing and kept letting women be raped. People flock to his movies.

Maybe when the morality police show conviction and go after everything uniformly I'll take it more seriously, until then they can piss off.

 

[BiscuitHammer]

Maybe when the morality police show conviction and go after everything uniformly I'll take it more seriously, until then they can piss off.

Policing one's cultural apparatus for wrongthink is a job best left to people with small minds and no lives, people who live in fear. Hugh Hefner said his mother defined a puritan as a person who was terrified that somebody out there might be having a good time.

Every generation produces a cadre that demand conformance with their morals. They're best ignored, since they just happen to be a loud minority. But they're nothing new.

I'm willing to bet my friend looked at threads where people were mauling one another. Old hat for we denizens, I guess. I have plenty of threads I've steered clear of. That's just how public forums work. I don't like something, I scroll on. If nobody's being (literally) hurt, I keep going. I avoid reddit and the chan boards for the same reason.

Besides, who doesn't love Fritz the Cat?

 

[AlinaX]

I always love the way lovecraft68 bows out of conversations...

ps. I'm proudly woke, and find myself unable to enjoy Tarantino's films the way I used to.

 

[LongDraw]

Okay, I'm going to start off by saying I didn't read all the replies here, mostly because I'm going to try to narrate a chapter for audiobook at 1AM while wife is already sleeping.

Here is my take though as a fairly new registered user to Lit, though I've been reading the stories for years.

There are a few users here who I will not mention by name, because I'm not that kind of a-hole, who do have an ego so large that it threatens to explode their brain case. Some are accomplished authors, others are simply a doofus and don't realize it.

The wonderful insight though that I have discovered in my quite varied career working as a contractor most of my life is this.

It is the capacity and the will to learn that defines not just your intelligence, but your wisdom as well.

Now, this is not a quote from any individual or group that I am aware of, nor do I claim that this is a secret of the universe. It is simply insight I have gained through experience. Take it as you will.

 

[xelliebabex]

Decided he'd check out the forums and dared to venture into AH, even though he doesn't write here.

While he enjoyed some of the topics that pertain to literary endeavours, he also sent me this gif, as it was his overwhelming impression of the interpersonal dynamics of the forum.

Ouch?

https://tenor.com/view/fritz-the-cat-learning-is-a-big-thing-gif-5395501

I see what you did here, BH! Hahaha!

Congrats BH you created a thread to prove your friend correct! And they all came out to play

I'm not pointing the judgy finger I can pontificate with the best of them, but I found this so satisfyingly funny I had to weigh in.

 

[jsmiam]

I see what you did here, BH! Hahaha!

Congrats BH you created a thread to prove your friend correct! And they all came out to play

I'm not pointing the judgy finger I can pontificate with the best of them, but I found this so satisfyingly funny I had to weigh in.

I tend to agree - The gif wasn't exactly an insult, it possessed a dash of humor, it had grains of truth to it (including myself), particularly if you look at the big picture, and it didn't trigger my need to defend my honor. It was chuckle worthy, and that was about that. I'll guess that was even part of the person's intent.

Compare this to the once-a-month character who shows up in a blaze of crazed glory fighting with everybody here about everything then vanishes, to return with a new screeen name next month. They are offensive. Speaking of which, it's about time for them to return, isn't it?

BH, suggest to your friend to make an account and post. (Or, even better: @BH's friend, I know you're secretly watching, and that you read all BH' stories too! Join the forum, don't identify yourself, just say something like "I want to write a story about my friend CookieMallet's wife, is that allowed?," and go from there.

 

[lovecraft68]

I always love the way lovecraft68 bows out of conversations...

ps. I'm proudly woke, and find myself unable to enjoy Tarantino's films the way I used to.

I don't bow out, I lose interest. That and ADD dictates I move to something else then forget about whatever discussion was going on.

One person sent me a PM a few weeks ago, saying I made a hell of a "mic drop" post and left off with it.

I didn't even remember the post or thread.

I'm in the minority of people who never took to Tarantino, the popularity eludes me other than for many its trendy to like him. But after his announcement I'll make it a point to never watch one. I gave up the NFL after being a fan for years over their rape and abuse culture and how its a joke...then they squeal about racial justice to look good, when victims of their players get no justice.

So I can give up an over rated shitstain of a director.

 

[BiscuitHammer]

BH, suggest to your friend to make an account and post. (Or, even better: @BH's friend, I know you're secretly watching, and that you read all BH' stories too! Join the forum, don't identify yourself, just say something like "I want to write a story about my friend CookieMallet's wife, is that allowed?," and go from there.

Thank Sanguinius I don't have a wife, then...

 

[Comshaw]

I see what you did here, BH! Hahaha!

Congrats BH you created a thread to prove your friend correct! And they all came out to play

I'm not pointing the judgy finger I can pontificate with the best of them, but I found this so satisfyingly funny I had to weigh in.

It is always interesting to me that, like the parable of the three blind men and the elephant, each person reading a post can derive a different vision of what was said, while missing the view of the whole.


Comshaw

 

[SimonDoom]

It is always interesting to me that, like the parable of the three blind men and the elephant, each person reading a post can derive a different vision of what was said, while missing the view of the whole.


Comshaw

That expresses my thought on the subject perfectly.

Sometimes I think people are looking for rancor where it doesn't exist. This forum has a bunch of people with different opinions, as is to be expected. So?

 

[lovecraft68]

Policing one's cultural apparatus for wrongthink is a job best left to people with small minds and no lives, people who live in fear. Hugh Hefner said his mother defined a puritan as a person who was terrified that somebody out there might be having a good time.

Every generation produces a cadre that demand conformance with their morals. They're best ignored, since they just happen to be a loud minority. But they're nothing new.

I'm willing to bet my friend looked at threads where people were mauling one another. Old hat for we denizens, I guess. I have plenty of threads I've steered clear of. That's just how public forums work. I don't like something, I scroll on. If nobody's being (literally) hurt, I keep going. I avoid reddit and the chan boards for the same reason.

Besides, who doesn't love Fritz the Cat?

I went on reddit a couple years back to see if it was as bad as everyone says. I guess like anywhere else it might depend where you're looking and what you're looking for, but I found it to be worse than I expected.

There's an expression things are what you make of them, or the other you get out what you put in, but those are defied by the internet because the people who made those expressions never saw coming a time where countless keyboard warriors who can attack and hate with no repercussions whatsoever

The boards here, even the politics forum(which probably only has 12-15 posters who all have a dozen alts each), are tame compared to what's out there.

 

[KeithD]

It's not being pretentious if you have the training, skill, and experience to weigh in where you do. It's pretentious if you do so with only a half-baked understanding of what you're posting about and want to pose as a topic guru.

 

[8letters]

My main beef with the AH (and by implication the Story Feedback forum) is how few authors try to use it to improve their writing. When I have a problem with something I write, I post it here to get help. Tad Overdon did that once. I can't really remember anyone else doing that.

 

[KeithD]

My main beef with the AH (and by implication the Story Feedback forum) is how few authors try to use it to improve their writing. When I have a problem with something I write, I post it here to get help. Tad Overdon did that once. I can't really remember anyone else doing that.

You have a beef about what another writer choses to do with their own writing file experience here--completely separate from yours? This isn't a critique site, so I don't see any reason why a writer here should have to be here to enlist strangers to do anything with their own writing techniques.

 

[AlinaX]

I suck at taking criticism. Why would I invite it?