Disaster in the Making

[RobDownSouth]

Turkey's army is a haphazard clutsterfuck at best...

Currently, they are an ambitious lot, but in action, they are Barney Fife
with more than one bullet at his disposal.
They have announced that they will take some territory as a buffer
but the reality is they will send some troops in, set up camp
and pray that the Kurds and others do not push back...

Once again, you haven't been paying attention, Housesquaw.

The United States government supplied satellite recon images and intelligence of EXACTLY where our nominal "allies" the Kurds were located, so that the Turks could annihilate the Kurd armed forces via airstrikes and minimize civilian casualties. They provided this info to Turkey DAYS before Trump threw the Kurds under the proverbial bus.

Trump has shown the world that America is not to be trusted.

 

[Rightguide]

Yay. Look who's back.

Nice to be back and observe the GB's triggered left as they are they are electrocuted in place by a yet another false but short circuited narrative gone haywire.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Nice to be back and observe the GB's triggered left as they are they are electrocuted in place by a yet another false but short circuited narrative gone haywire.

Despite your lengthy service in the Marines, you don't seem to know what a "trigger" is.

 

[Rightguide]

Once again, you haven't been paying attention, Housesquaw.

The United States government supplied satellite recon images and intelligence of EXACTLY where our nominal "allies" the Kurds were located, so that the Turks could annihilate the Kurd armed forces via airstrikes and minimize civilian casualties. They provided this info to Turkey DAYS before Trump threw the Kurds under the proverbial bus.

Trump has shown the world that America is not to be trusted.

^^^
A most gratuitous lie, in toto.

 

[suurfer]

Yet the President is sending a couple thousand more to his friends the Saudis. Cos they’re worth our blood and treasure.

This was such an enjoyable thread to read.

But you guys need to start an "Iran - Saudi Arabia" one too.

 

[LupusDei]

And everyone is going "Trump this Trump that"
But he didn't take that decision by himself.
He likely followed the advice of high ranking military personnel and strategists.

We can't know, but the scandal is so laud in part because he kinda sorta didn't, or so it seems.

I could be wrong, but my logic is:
The potential repercussions of the US defending those kurdish forces against Turkey:

1. Higher casualties (Turkey's army is v. powerful) and war contagion (other nations jumping in)

2. The wrath of the Muslim world, and increase in suicide and knife attacks in Europe and the US.
They might have tolerated US's decision to go after ISIS, but not to intervene in in a regional issue (whoever might be in the right).

With Americans on the ground in the harms way, Turkey wouldn't ever move. It would be insane, even for them. Pulling Americans out was a prerequisite for the operation to be executed, in the first place. Americans had no need to do a thing, fight against or for anyone, just be there, and this wouldn't be happening. It's war of Gods over there. Russians could, and still can do the same, just move in, and Turkey will be forced to stop, because those two wouldn't fire at each other either.

 

[suurfer]

With Americans on the ground in the harms way, Turkey wouldn't ever move. It would be insane, even for them.
Pulling Americans out was a prerequisite for the operation to be executed, in the first place.

Americans had no need to do a thing, fight against or for anyone, just be there, and this wouldn't be happening. It's war of Gods over there.

Russians could, and still can do the same, just move in, and Turkey will be forced to stop, because those two wouldn't fire at each other either.

You're actually making a good point.

 

[phrodeau]

Once again, you haven't been paying attention, Housesquaw.

The United States government supplied satellite recon images and intelligence of EXACTLY where our nominal "allies" the Kurds were located, so that the Turks could annihilate the Kurd armed forces via airstrikes and minimize civilian casualties. They provided this info to Turkey DAYS before Trump threw the Kurds under the proverbial bus.

Trump has shown the world that America is not to be trusted.

How do you know that?

^^^
A most gratuitous lie, in toto.

How do you know that?

 

[bigsly]

Once again, you haven't been paying attention, Housesquaw.

The United States government supplied satellite recon images and intelligence of EXACTLY where our nominal "allies" the Kurds were located, so that the Turks could annihilate the Kurd armed forces via airstrikes and minimize civilian casualties. They provided this info to Turkey DAYS before Trump threw the Kurds under the proverbial bus.

Trump has shown the world that America is not to be trusted.

Actually, that intel was intentionally provided so that the Turks won't strike those DESIGNATED positions, just as the Turks were (and are) intentionally provided current intel on exactly where American troops are positioned. The Turks, the American-allied Kurds, and we ALL clearly understand the swath of northern Syria the Turks intend to clear as a buffer zone between them and the chaos still ongoing in Syria. The "Kurds" know America is providing the Turks with their positions, the Turks fully understand why America is providing them with "Kurd" and American positions - it's called overt accountability, which is why Trump publicly proclaimed what will happen to Turkey if they violate that accountability.

If some faction(s) of the "Kurds" decide to go all Asan Wayne against those understandings anyway, then that's ALL on them and they can have all the fun they want going up directly against the Turks. Let Darwin sort it all out.

Meanwhile, the world still awaits the Turkish "genocide" upon the American-allied Kurds warmongering US socialists/progressives/Democrats and statist/conservative/Republicans have pronounced is inevitable because, like the ignorant wannabe poster quoted above, Trump threw the "Kurds" "under the proverbial bus."

If that "genocide" does, in fact, occur, I'll be the first to admit I'm wrong and be among the first to call for Trump's resignation. But will all the warmongering, blowhard socialists/progressives/Democrats in this thread, so confidently assuring the world that "genocide" is inevitable, admit they're wrong when it doesn't happen?

Right.

 

[cowslinger64]

Nice to be back and observe the GB's triggered left as they are they are electrocuted in place by a yet another false but short circuited narrative gone haywire.

Thankfully, there were plenty of right wing stupid asses to fill in during your incarceration.

 

[icanhelp1]

I’m shocked! Shocked I say, that you misconstrued what was written and argued against facts!

Well, not really. It’s what everyone expects from you.


My original post, the one you felt compelled to jump in on and try to turn into a Left vs Right thing, was that ISIS was formed well before 2010, like ican’thelp claimed.

Fact. The Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, founded 1999, would back this up. You and can’tbehped tried again, so hard, to spin this into a Left vs Right thing.
Silly and sad, but completely expected from the likes of you.

Where did you see my “hyper-partisan principal free position on war”?

Was it where I pointed out that the US played a huge part and bears tremendous responsibility for the instability and lives lost in the region?

Again, these are only facts that you are arguing against.

Saudi funding, mujahideen, Al-Qaeda, ISIS, The destabilization of Syria, regime change in Iraq... not just down to Trump, not just down to Obama. Not left or right.

The US is involved, up to its elbows and has plenty of blood on it’s hands. Trump’s latest gaffe only adds to it.

I followed up with your statement that I was in total agreement with what you wrote and adjusted my comment to explain and clarify that my point was the Caliphate vision of al Baghdadi began in 2010 and was allowed to expand under the Obama admin. I was answering how some lunes on this site ( nobbydownsouth and zipperhead ) pulling back from Syria was a Trump cluster fuck and Iwas revisiting history to remind those instant pro war socialist " orange man bad " fucktards where was their outrage when Obama pulled back and allowed thousands to die at the hands of ISIS. I was pointing out the hypocrisy and double talk and not trying to give a history lesson The instability in the ME pretty much started shortly after the establishment of Israel. I could've sat on a google button and provided an instant history lesson and mention all those names that no one could ever remember to make myself look smart. I did a research paper in college on the MUJAHEDIN the soviet expansion. Also the influence the US had past and present to include the rising star Osama bin Laden and his roots in Saudi as a businessman working for his father's construction company. I have no dispute with you.

 

[zipman]

We can't know, but the scandal is so laud in part because he kinda sorta didn't, or so it seems.




With Americans on the ground in the harms way, Turkey wouldn't ever move. It would be insane, even for them. Pulling Americans out was a prerequisite for the operation to be executed, in the first place. Americans had no need to do a thing, fight against or for anyone, just be there, and this wouldn't be happening. It's war of Gods over there. Russians could, and still can do the same, just move in, and Turkey will be forced to stop, because those two wouldn't fire at each other either.

Bingo - on both comments.

And let's put to rest the idea that this was a spur of the moment move by Turkey. It takes time to plan and execute an invasion.

 

[icanhelp1]

We can't know, but the scandal is so laud in part because he kinda sorta didn't, or so it seems.




With Americans on the ground in the harms way, Turkey wouldn't ever move. It would be insane, even for them. Pulling Americans out was a prerequisite for the operation to be executed, in the first place. Americans had no need to do a thing, fight against or for anyone, just be there, and this wouldn't be happening. It's war of Gods over there. Russians could, and still can do the same, just move in, and Turkey will be forced to stop, because those two wouldn't fire at each other either.

I'm not so sure Turkey would back down from the Russians. They shot down an SU 24 in 2015. The Russians couldn't afford a protracted war with anyone.

 

[zipman]

I followed up with your statement that I was in total agreement with what you wrote and adjusted my comment to explain and clarify that my point was the Caliphate vision of al Baghdadi began in 2010 and was allowed to expand under the Obama admin. I was answering how some lunes on this site ( nobbydownsouth and zipperhead ) pulling back from Syria was a Trump cluster fuck and Iwas revisiting history to remind those instant pro war socialist " orange man bad " fucktards where was their outrage when Obama pulled back and allowed thousands to die at the hands of ISIS. I was pointing out the hypocrisy and double talk and not trying to give a history lesson The instability in the ME pretty much started shortly after the establishment of Israel. I could've sat on a google button and provided an instant history lesson and mention all those names that no one could ever remember to make myself look smart. I did a research paper in college on the MUJAHEDIN the soviet expansion. Also the influence the US had past and present to include the rising star Osama bin Laden and his roots in Saudi as a businessman working for his father's construction company. I have no dispute with you.

I'm not prowar at all you dumbfuck. The point is that if Trump had just left the troops there Turkey wouldn't have dared to invade and fire on them.

The clusterfuck has just begun, but hey, the dumbass president you worship knows more than all the Generals, right?

 

[DeluxAuto]

You gotta love the wanna be warhawks here pontificating upon Turkey's military.

 

[suurfer]

/....../

 

[LupusDei]

I'm not so sure Turkey would back down from the Russians. They shot down an SU 24 in 2015. The Russians couldn't afford a protracted war with anyone.

This is a site for fictional sex stories, right? Then let's imagine this as pretext for joint Turkish-Ukrainian invasion in Crimea.

Back in the real world, they're kinda sorta trying to be allies for now. That incident was interesting, and put Russians in place a bit, but Crimea was a fresh wound then.

(For context, there's significant Crimean Tatar emigration in Turkey, both since Soviet repressions, and fresh after the latest takeover.)

 

[suurfer]

This is a site for fictional sex stories, right? Then let's imagine this as pretext for joint Turkish-Ukrainian invasion in Crimea.

Back in the real world, they're kinda sorta trying to be allies for now. That incident was interesting, and put Russians in place a bit, but Crimea was a fresh wound then.

(For context, there's significant Crimean Tatar emigration in Turkey, both since Soviet repressions, and fresh after the latest takeover.)

Speaking of:
Hey, Turkey was starting to become such a cool country after ww2 and before Erdogan came to power. Maybe the influence of the neighboring Soviet power, but it's religion was becoming increasingly secularized.

And btw: you mentioned that a powerful middle class is the best antidote for religious totalitarianism (be it Communist, Christian, Islam).

I would exclude orthodox Christianity from that.
Unlike countries like Britain, Spain or such, theirs was the religion of the oppressed, it enabled them to resist either Soviest/communists, or Ottomans.

As to modernity: the biggest modern culprit for me is not Catholicism, but Protestantism, with it's rationality and protestant work ethic.

 

[Emerson40]

Not at all. It's a solid projection though.

No, that's something you're just wrong about.

No, I'm not.

Dragging progressives for their hypocrisy isn't arguing against any facts.

Making fun of the "Orange man BAD!" party for suddenly being all about endless/pointless war isn't arguing against any facts.


Trumps latest isn't a gaffe outside of the "orange man bad" brigade and those who support endless and pointless war in the ME.

Ever the true-blue solider boy.

https://66.media.tumblr.com/ce84f345de39c7acf4849f64f210f514/b170376857a9e3c0-2c/s1280x1920/843479178d8a3ad1c2241e135ed1cf8e4520937e.jpg

I followed up with your statement that I was in total agreement with what you wrote and adjusted my comment to explain and clarify that my point was the Caliphate vision of al Baghdadi began in 2010 and was allowed to expand under the Obama admin. I was answering how some lunes on this site ( nobbydownsouth and zipperhead ) pulling back from Syria was a Trump cluster fuck and Iwas revisiting history to remind those instant pro war socialist " orange man bad " fucktards where was their outrage when Obama pulled back and allowed thousands to die at the hands of ISIS. I was pointing out the hypocrisy and double talk and not trying to give a history lesson The instability in the ME pretty much started shortly after the establishment of Israel. I could've sat on a google button and provided an instant history lesson and mention all those names that no one could ever remember to make myself look smart. I did a research paper in college on the MUJAHEDIN the soviet expansion. Also the influence the US had past and present to include the rising star Osama bin Laden and his roots in Saudi as a businessman working for his father's construction company. I have no dispute with you.

Thanks for clarifying and your reply.

A rarity 'round these parts, these days, and much appreciated.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I followed up with your statement that I was in total agreement with what you wrote and adjusted my comment to explain and clarify that my point was the Caliphate vision of al Baghdadi began in 2010 and was allowed to expand under the Obama admin. I was answering how some lunes on this site ( nobbydownsouth and zipperhead ) pulling back from Syria was a Trump cluster fuck and Iwas revisiting history to remind those instant pro war socialist " orange man bad " fucktards where was their outrage when Obama pulled back and allowed thousands to die at the hands of ISIS. I was pointing out the hypocrisy and double talk and not trying to give a history lesson The instability in the ME pretty much started shortly after the establishment of Israel. I could've sat on a google button and provided an instant history lesson and mention all those names that no one could ever remember to make myself look smart. I did a research paper in college on the MUJAHEDIN the soviet expansion. Also the influence the US had past and present to include the rising star Osama bin Laden and his roots in Saudi as a businessman working for his father's construction company. I have no dispute with you.

Fuck Que.

Trump alone holds primary responsibility for this clusterfuck.

The Kurds aided the United States against Saddam Hussein.
The Kurds aided the United States against Al Queda.
The Kurds aided the United States against ISIS.

Trump repaid them by sending Turkey satellite recon images of Kurdish positions and withdrawing American troops.

And if you want to talk about the Al Queda Construction Company, I suggest you talk to Bellasaurius (nee Ishmael). He sold military supplies to the construction company for years until 1999, when he realized they were, in fact, evildoers. Ish collected quite a bit of blood money in bonuses for his sales.

In summary, go fuck yourself and anyone who looks like you.

 

[suurfer]

You think he's a Que alt?
That would be disturbing, but I don't think so. His politics might coincide with Que's, but he doesn't seem to think like Q.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Yet the President is sending a couple thousand more to his friends the Saudis. Cos they’re worth our blood and treasure.

I don't think anyone here said they were.

He’s right..you really should just shut the fuck up. You're a fuckin moron and hellbent on making sure you constantly prove yourself.

Ohhhh name calling from the semi-literate internet tough guy!!!

LOL

Ever the true-blue solider boy.

Reduced to name calling in what, 3 posts? Getting better than the usual, head and shoulders above the likes of Cowtits64 and RacistDownSouth.

 

[RobDownSouth]

You think he's a Que alt?
That would be disturbing, but I don't think so. His politics might coincide with Que's, but he doesn't seem to think like Q.

Please don't confuse the issue by using the words "Que" and "think" in the same sentence.

 

[Emerson40]

Reduced to name calling in what, 3 posts? Getting better than the usual, head and shoulders above the likes of Cowtits64 and RacistDownSouth.

Name calling?

You should take it as a compliment, to your steadfast loyalty.

That’s certainly how I meant it.

 

[Rightguide]

We can't know, but the scandal is so laud in part because he kinda sorta didn't, or so it seems.




With Americans on the ground in the harms way, Turkey wouldn't ever move. It would be insane, even for them. Pulling Americans out was a prerequisite for the operation to be executed, in the first place. Americans had no need to do a thing, fight against or for anyone, just be there, and this wouldn't be happening. It's war of Gods over there. Russians could, and still can do the same, just move in, and Turkey will be forced to stop, because those two wouldn't fire at each other either.

They won't do much now either.