Reflections on Gentleman Doms

[All_4_Love]

I think that women sometimes forget how much trust is necessary for a man to allow himself to become lost in his own power.. Just as it takes trust for a woman to allow herself to become lost in her own surrender.

My heart just skipped a beat.

 

[GiggLeGasm]

My heart just skipped a beat.

(lol.. you can't say that to a nurse!)

 

[elli1]

I consent to that if I choose to submit. I consent to knowing that he will more than likely make me do things that I don't want to do. But, if it pleases him, then it pleases me. And, if that makes me a victim of abuse, then I guess I am consensual to being abused. *shrug*

see?
and, yes, forcing someone to do something without their consent is abuse.

 

[may_I_please]

Perhaps, this is where I always hit a wall. If D/s is not a total exchange of power, what is it?

It is what YOU want it to be in communication with your partner

But your particular desire for your relationship doesn't define the kink

IMO you have the right to set hard and soft limits. No Dom should consciously push a hard limit

You have the right to be submissive in some or all aspects of your relationship. That is the submissives choice.

Dominance can be employed only during the sexual act or your Dom could take charge of every single decision

If I do not give my partner control over what I wear, eat, how I spend my time but when we shut the bedroom door you'll find me tied to a bed or on my knees, bending to his will how would you describe that relationship?

 

[All_4_Love]

see?
and, yes, forcing someone to do something without their consent is abuse.

Yes, I see. I just don't see it as my being forced to do something without my consent. I am giving my consent to be non consensual.

 

[elli1]

Yes, I see. I just don't see it as my being forced to do something without my consent. I am giving my consent to be non consensual.

exactly

 

[All_4_Love]

It is what YOU want it to be in communication with your partner

But your particular desire for your relationship doesn't define the kink

IMO you have the right to set hard and soft limits. No Dom should consciously push a hard limit

You have the right to be submissive in some or all aspects of your relationship. That is the submissives choice.

Dominance can be employed only during the sexual act or your Dom could take charge of every single decision

If I do not give my partner control over what I wear, eat, how I spend my time but when we shut the bedroom door you'll find me tied to a bed or on my knees, bending to his will how would you describe that relationship?

Then it's not D/s.

It's a vanilla relationship with wonderfully kinky sex.

ETA: My apology for stating things as fact and taking such a stubborn position here. I have not ever been in a healthy D/s relationship. I have no room to take such a strong position. Again, I apologize.

Thank you for the thought provoking conversation, though.

 

[Deleted member 1306910]

My problem with so many subs is that they mistake things that they have been programmed to believe in for truth.

That a real man is a certain way. That he looks, dresses, and acts in a manner as prescribed by a certain idealized tradition.

That a Dom doesn't show vulnerability, or need. That we're always confident and in control, commanders of all situations. That we have to be brutes.

Sure, I get off on spanking women, or handcuffing them to the bed and fucking them till they beg me to let them cum. But I also have a soft side that wants to be let out. I like kids, and animals.

And guess what? I'm not always in control. Or even have any clue what the hell I am doing! I can be a basket case too. I have more issues than Cosmo and they show. Sometimes I just want a partner who might have some of the answers that I don't have myself. I don't WANT a little girl who needs to be told what to wear and what to cook. And take off the motherfucking stilettos once in a while, before you ruin your goddamned feet!

How can I feel comfortable wearing my raggedy old sweats when you are constantly looking like you are about to do a porno shoot? Dress down!

I hate the conventions that keep us from being real.

 

[LusterMunky]

I consent to knowing that he will more than likely make me do things that I don't want to do. But, if it pleases him, then it pleases me. And, if that makes me a victim of abuse, then I guess I am consensual to being abused. *shrug*

Get your act together.

 

[elli1]

Then it's not D/s.

It's a vanilla relationship with wonderfully kinky sex.

again, i disagree.
their's not just one way D/s can be lived out. every D/s relationship is different, because everyone likes different things. and other reasons people have already pointed out...

 

[Pervy_Sage]

My problem with so many subs is that they mistake things that they have been programmed to believe in for truth.

That a real man is a certain way. That he looks, dresses, and acts in a manner as prescribed by a certain idealized tradition.

That a Dom doesn't show vulnerability, or need. That we're always confident and in control, commanders of all situations. That we have to be brutes.

Sure, I get off on spanking women, or handcuffing them to the bed and fucking them till they beg me to let them cum. But I also have a soft side that wants to be let out. I like kids, and animals.

And guess what? I'm not always in control. Or even have any clue what the hell I am doing! I can be a basket case too. I have more issues than Cosmo and they show. Sometimes I just want a partner who might have some of the answers that I don't have myself. I don't WANT a little girl who needs to be told what to wear and what to cook. And take off the motherfucking stilettos once in a while, before you ruin your goddamned feet!

How can I feel comfortable wearing my raggedy old sweats when you are constantly looking like you are about to do a porno shoot? Dress down!

I hate the conventions that keep us from being real.

Good job, Nevyn. I concur.

 

[Wild_Honey_66]

okay folks, I have to go for a while. sexy MILFy tasks are calling my name.

I really appreciate everyone sharing and making the effort to continue the conversation even when they disagree.

if it gets too tense, please feel free to go outside and walk around for a bit in the fresh air until you feel calm again.

maybe Masher can get Janey to pop in with her vanilla incense sticks.

please be nice, or elli will snitch on you and I will whoop your butt.

got it?

 

[may_I_please]

Then it's not D/s.

It's a vanilla relationship with wonderfully kinky sex.

ETA: My apology for stating things as fact and taking such a stubborn position here. I have not ever been in a healthy D/s relationship. I have no room to take such a strong position. Again, I apologize.

Thank you for the thought provoking conversation, though.

No apologies required it's a discussion we seem to be coming from opposite sides

It doesn't matter if you view me as in a vanilla relationship because that's how the outside world views me ..as I said up thread I'm a motherfucking princess until that bedroom door closes

Maybe I'm not a submissive, maybe I'm just kinky

Yay

 

[elli1]

maybe Masher can get Janey to pop in with her vanilla incense sticks.

vanilla? really?

 

[MSH2]

vanilla? really?

I do have the Spanky Sword

 

[All_4_Love]

My problem with so many subs is that they mistake things that they have been programmed to believe in for truth.

That a real man is a certain way. That he looks, dresses, and acts in a manner as prescribed by a certain idealized tradition.

That a Dom doesn't show vulnerability, or need. That we're always confident and in control, commanders of all situations. That we have to be brutes.

Sure, I get off on spanking women, or handcuffing them to the bed and fucking them till they beg me to let them cum. But I also have a soft side that wants to be let out. I like kids, and animals.

And guess what? I'm not always in control. Or even have any clue what the hell I am doing! I can be a basket case too. I have more issues than Cosmo and they show. Sometimes I just want a partner who might have some of the answers that I don't have myself. I don't WANT a little girl who needs to be told what to wear and what to cook. And take off the motherfucking stilettos once in a while, before you ruin your goddamned feet!

How can I feel comfortable wearing my raggedy old sweats when you are constantly looking like you are about to do a porno shoot? Dress down!

I hate the conventions that keep us from being real.

My boyfriend is a delightfully beautiful masculine man. And, he is vulnerable. He lays his head on my chest sometimes, and I kiss him on his forehead and play with his hair. I see him start to lose control in certain situations, and it is that very moment that I kiss him gently and smile at him.

He is real. He is a real human being. He is also the love of my life. I would submit to him anytime, anywhere.

 

[may_I_please]

My problem with so many subs is that they mistake things that they have been programmed to believe in for truth.

That a real man is a certain way. That he looks, dresses, and acts in a manner as prescribed by a certain idealized tradition.

That a Dom doesn't show vulnerability, or need. That we're always confident and in control, commanders of all situations. That we have to be brutes.

Sure, I get off on spanking women, or handcuffing them to the bed and fucking them till they beg me to let them cum. But I also have a soft side that wants to be let out. I like kids, and animals.

And guess what? I'm not always in control. Or even have any clue what the hell I am doing! I can be a basket case too. I have more issues than Cosmo and they show. Sometimes I just want a partner who might have some of the answers that I don't have myself. I don't WANT a little girl who needs to be told what to wear and what to cook. And take off the motherfucking stilettos once in a while, before you ruin your goddamned feet!

How can I feel comfortable wearing my raggedy old sweats when you are constantly looking like you are about to do a porno shoot? Dress down!

I hate the conventions that keep us from being real.

*nods*

Any true relationship, no matter the kink or vanilla needs to be supportive from both sides

C'n I wear yoga pants instead of sweats though

 

[elli1]

I do have the Spanky Sword

i don't believe you, luv had no idea what i was talking about when i asked him how it feels

 

[DesEsseintes]

Perhaps, this is where I always hit a wall. If D/s is not a total exchange of power, what is it?

(I'm going to try to use whole words first, before moving onto acronyms, because I'm aware this is, in part, an educational discussion thread, in which we are all learning: all following the same river, but using different tributaries and at different speeds.)

My understanding is that a Master/slave (M/s) relationship is indeed about a Total Power Exchange (TPE). I don't see how it could be called M/s otherwise. But for me M/s is a form of Dominance/submission (D/s). I don't see it as a peak or goal towards which all forms of D/s are striving. Perhaps one peak among many in a mountain range.

Now the key word in the recent discussion, I suspect, is 'dynamic'. That implies change, movement, kineticism: not a prison cell, concrete and static but a rope joining two people. Sometimes the rope will be taut - other times loose as the two bunch together. In most aspects of life the Dominant will be leading, but he may well desire his submissive to lead in certain agreed and discussed areas, depending on relative strengths and weaknesses.

After all - relationship is cognate with 'relational'. Think of a melody. It can be written down exactly, with tempo and dynamics strictly set out. Or, it can be transposed into a different key - or even changed more fundamentally but with the gaps between the notes remaining constant. The space between a Dom(me) and his/her submissive is a playground in itself (sic). Not a barrier which can never be breached.

I agree that total power exchange can be wonderful - I have been fortunate enough to experience it once and it was profoundly liberating. It is true in a way, too, to say that the sub's/slave's feelings are not the goal in such a relationship. But that is only true if the Dominant's feelings are not the goal either. After all, 'slave' is an analogy, not an exact facsimile. The goals may mostly, or even entirely, be set by the Dominant, but they should be joint goals which aim at deepening and enriching the relationship. The relationship itself becomes the third party in such situations, and it is the purpose of both partners to nurture it according to their role.

It is important to remember, however, in all this understandable talk of discussion and agreement, that although such things are vital they do not necessarily have to be ongoing. What stops a TPE or M/s relationship from abuse is that both parties must always be free to step away (even if such a choice is made difficult by being final), and that the discussions and agreements have taken place at some point. How often such discussions take place is down to the individual relationship - I suspect that All4Love would rather not have to think about each individual change or decision at all once the great decision to relinquish autonomy has been made. For others such as Honey, it seems that mutual agreement is an ongoing process, and that a prior agreement does not necessarily imply subsequent agreement. Both are fine, of course.

But given the range of opinions here, it does make me think that the old fashioned D/s ideal of a contract, though often derided and sometimes justifiably, makes sense in terms of making expectations and roles very clear indeed.

Goodness me, what a ramble. I am sorry.

 

[Wild_Honey_66]

I do have the Spanky Sword

YES!!

elli, hand the man my crown.



i'll be in touch. *snickers*

 

[MSH2]

YES!!

elli, hand the man my crown.



i'll be in touch. *snickers*

 

[Wild_Honey_66]

vanilla? really?

fucking hell.

fine, you be Mistress of Candles and Other Light-y, Smell-y Things.

cinnamon, maybe. or apple pie.

bye.

 

[Deleted member 1306910]

*nods*

Any true relationship, no matter the kink or vanilla needs to be supportive from both sides

C'n I wear yoga pants instead of sweats though

Yoga pants = long, slow assfucking. Just letting you know. But feel free to wear what you like darling.

 

[elli1]

YES!!

elli, hand the man my crown.



i'll be in touch. *snickers*

*hands over honey's crown. looks at masher with his boa, crown, and spanky sword*
impressive!

 

[MSH2]

*hands over honey's crown. looks at masher with his boa, crown, and spanky sword*
impressive!

you know you want some *smugface*