God

[eyer]

Need I carry on? I can if need be

Yes, please do...

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Religious people are funny. We should keep them tamed in a big fun park like an aquarium of zealots.

"Mommy! Mommy! I want to see the Stigmata tank first! Can I Puhleeeezzzzeee???"

 

[Tryharder62]

Whatever...

...you and your Joel Osteenesque "Christianity" are back on iggy, harlot.

(You may want to research the Word's take on harlot as it applies to God's people...

...that is, if you ever use the internet for anything else other than to bring shame upon your husband by soliciting other men online.)

You don't fool me. I'm getting to you. You can put me on ignore, I have no problem with that, but I'll still keep you in my prayers.

 

[fair_warning]

The Bible is not the only thing full of inconsistencies.
Religion as a whole is merely a delusion.



How might we prove that God is imaginary? One way would be to find a contradiction between the definition of God and the God we experience in the real world.

What would happen if we get down on our knees and pray to God in this way:

Dear God, almighty, all-powerful, all-loving creator of the universe, we pray to you to cure every case of cancer on this planet tonight. We pray in faith, knowing you will bless us as you describe in Matthew 7:7, Matthew 17:20, Matthew 21:21, Mark 11:24, John 14:12-14, Matthew 18:19 and James 5:15-16. In Jesus' name we pray, Amen.
We pray sincerely, knowing that when God answers this completely heartfelt, unselfish, non-materialistic prayer, it will glorify God and help millions of people in remarkable ways.
Will anything happen? No. Of course not.

If the Bible is literally true, then something is seriously amiss. Simply look at the facts. In Matthew 7:7 Jesus says:

Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!

If "every one who asks receives", then if we ask for cancer to be cured, it should be cured. Right? If "our Father who is in heaven gives good things to those who ask him", then if we ask him to cure cancer, he should cure it. Right? And yet nothing happens.

In Matthew 17:20 Jesus says:

For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.

If "nothing will be impossible to you", then if we ask to cure cancer tonight, cancer should disappear. Right? Yet nothing happens. Note that if we take the Bible less-than-literally here, the statement "nothing will be impossible to you" becomes "lots of things will be impossible to you," and that would mean that Jesus is lying.

In Matthew 21:21:

I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.

If "you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer", then if we ask to cure cancer tonight, cancer should dissappear. Right? Yet nothing happens. Note again that there is not a non-literal way to interpret "you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer", unless you replace "whatever" with "nothing" or "little."

The message is reiterated Mark 11:24:

Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

If God says, "believe that you have received it, and it will be yours," and if we believe in God and his power, then what should happen if we pray to cure cancer tonight? It should be cured. Either that, or God is lying.

In John chapter 14, verses 12 through 14, Jesus tells all of us just how easy prayer can be:

"I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it."

Look at how direct this statement is: "You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it." This is the "Son of God" speaking. Have we taken him "too literally?" No. This is a simple, unambiguous statement. Have we taken his statement "out of context?" No - Jesus uses the word anyone. Yet Jesus' statement is obviously false. Because when we ask God to cure cancer tonight, nothing happens.
We see the same thing over and over again...

In Matthew 18:19 Jesus says:

Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

In James 5:15-16 the Bible says:
And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective.


And keep in mind that this is Jesus talking here. These are not the words of human beings. These are not the words of "inspired" human beings. These are supposedly the words of God himself, incarnated in a human body. Jesus is supposed to be a perfect, sinless being. And yet, it is obvious that Jesus is lying. What Jesus says is clearly incorrect.

Need I carry on? I can if need be

I'm sure there's some kinda disclaimer for unanswered prayers.

Otherwise, what you're saying here is to be prepared to be disappointed - big time.

 

[Tryharder62]

Religious people are funny. We should keep them tamed in a big fun park like an aquarium of zealots.

"Mommy! Mommy! I want to see the Stigmata tank first! Can I Puhleeeezzzzeee???"

If we must then I want to be Shamu! Have you been to Sea World? It is amazing. I just love that place.

 

[phrodeau]

(edited)
People claim to reject God’s existence because it is “not scientific” or “because there is no proof.” The true reason is that once they admit that there is a God, they also must realize that they are responsible to God and in need of forgiveness from Him (Romans 3:23, 6:23). If God exists, then we are accountable to Him for our actions. If God does not exist, then we can do whatever we want without having to worry about God judging us. That is why many of those who deny the existence of God cling strongly to the theory of naturalistic evolution—it gives them an alternative to believing in a Creator God. God exists and ultimately everyone knows that He exists. The very fact that some attempt so aggressively to disprove His existence is in fact an argument for His existence.

http://www.gotquestions.org/does-god-exist.html

That is what you wash hogs with.

If there was a God, I would hold Him responsible for making me and so many others non-believers. He has no grounds on which to judge me.

(edited)

The difference is that Jesus Christ was the One sacrifice that satisfied all of the sins that occurred before and all that would occur after Him. Was there bloodshed in the Bible, yes. Were there wars? Yes. Was there all kinds of sin? Yes. So much is written about that in the pages of the Bible. It was not a perfect world then, and will never be. The people who commit those sins you mentioned, are now covered by the blood that Jesus Christ shed when He died on the cross (and then rose again).

Another bogus claim.

What kind of sacrifice gets up afterwards and walks around free and easy? Maybe Jesus atoned for the sins of all mankind for three days, but he's all done with that now. He's sitting at God's right hand. Which other blood sacrifices got a mansion in Heaven?

 

[sethp]

I read a lot. I mean a lot. I have a lot of experience with Christianity. It all boils down to this regarding the bible. You need to throw away the Old Testament ...all of it. Keep the four gospels. Add those few other gospels that they didn't include. Get rid of the rest of the New Testament and there you have it ...Christianity without the bullshit ...pure and simple.

 

[Exquisition]

I'm sure there's some kinda disclaimer for unanswered prayers.

Otherwise, what you're saying here is to be prepared to be disappointed - big time.

The unanswered disclaimer is always "I have Faith, such things are lessons to test my faith, it is not my place to question God's will, it just is, God tells us so."

I note that there's not too many zealots queing up to come back on the 'cancer' post.

 

[Exquisition]

That is what you wash hogs with.

If there was a God, I would hold Him responsible for making me and so many others non-believers. He has no grounds on which to judge me.
Another bogus claim.

What kind of sacrifice gets up afterwards and walks around free and easy? Maybe Jesus atoned for the sins of all mankind for three days, but he's all done with that now. He's sitting at God's right hand. Which other blood sacrifices got a mansion in Heaven?

Ah, except according to the Gospel of Philip he didn't die and rise again, it was the other way around. For some reason they didn't want Philip in the edited version of the Bible at the 1st Council of Nicaea.

"Those who say that the Lord died first and then rose up are in error – for He rose up first and then died.

And Philip was a personal Disciple of Jesus.

 

[Oo_Bugsy]

I read a lot. I mean a lot. I have a lot of experience with Christianity. It all boils down to this regarding the bible. You need to throw away the Old Testament ...all of it. Keep the four gospels. Add those few other gospels that they didn't include. Get rid of the rest of the New Testament and there you have it ...Christianity without the bullshit ...pure and simple.

Oh if only it were that simple...

The dictionary defines Superstition as;

An irrational belief that an object, action, or circumstance not logically related to a course of events influences its outcome.

Lets examine the Prayer system shall we.

God is imaginary. It is obvious.
Yet, if you talk to actively practicing Christians, they ignore all of this evidence. They will tell you that God certainly does exist and that he is answering prayers for them every day. Christian bookstores and Christian magazines are filled with stories of answered prayers. Christians believe that God is reaching down out of heaven and answering billions of prayers on Earth for Christians.

Therefore, the question arises: If there is all of this evidence showing that God is imaginary, and if there is certifiable, undeniable scientific evidence showing that God never answers prayers, then why do Christians insist that God is real and that God is answering prayers for them on a daily basis? What would prompt Christians to make these statements despite all the contrary evidence?

Christians might choose to believe that God is answering their prayers, despite the evidence that "answered prayers" are nothing more than coincidences, because it is a huge boost to the ego. This explanation works both for big "miracles" and small ones. Imagine this: Imagine that you have cancer, you pray to God for a cure, you undergo surgery and chemotherapy, and the cancer does go into remission. What cured you? The surgery and chemo -- all evidence indicates that this is the case. If God was going to cure you, you would have been able to skip the surgery and chemo. Yet, as a Christian, it is a huge ego boost to believe that the all-powerful creator of the universe cured you. It means he has "big plans" for the rest of your life.
Or imagine something much smaller: you pray that God remove a stain from your favorite blouse when you wash it, and after you wash it the stain is in fact gone. It is the detergent that removed it. But a Christian interprets the event differently. What it means to a Christian is that the all-powerful creator of the universe has reached down from heaven to specifically hear and answer a prayer. If you selectively ignore all the prayers that God does not "answer" with the statement that "it is not part of his plan", then the idea that God is listening to and responding to you individually can be tremendously satisfying to the ego. It means that you are special in God's eyes. The entire thing is an illusion that is created in the mind of the Christian to stroke the ego.

 

[fair_warning]

I note that there's not too many zealots queing up to come back on the 'cancer' post.

Oh baby, don't even go there with that....I have a friend who is fighting, tooth and nail, the tragic certainty that her 6 year old will die very soon from a rare childhood cancer. But God gave us free will....so this shit happens - oh yeah right, fuck off.

 

[julybaby04]

Cancer as well as any sickness (or anything that is not considered "good" and "fun") is hard to deal with. It is not a punishment from God, nor is it a result of "free-will". Cancer and everything else that happens in this world is from the simple fact that we live in a very sin-filled world. Bad things happen...and yes, even to "good" people.

As far as being a follower of Christ is only to stroke one's ego, you could not be more wrong. To choose to truly follow Christ is the most humbling thing one will ever choose to do.

To make the decision that God is more important than anything or anyone else, including myself....is not easy. This world, with every thing you hear from media, music, movies, magazines, etc, tells you that you can have everything you want....and SHOULD have it because you are the most important thing and your desires are more important than anyone else. Following Christ is knowing that others are much more important.

Following Christ is understanding that yes, God made us and loves us, but because of sin, He cannot be with us as He is perfect. We are all sinful people (me very much included). Knowing that we are worshipping the LIVING God (which is why He rose again after 3 days...He defeated death) and knowing that having a faith that transcends all understanding (the reason it is called faith) we know absolutely that after this life is over, we will have an eternity with God.

God did not make anyone an unbeliever......that is completely each person's choice. Just because one does not understand every single thing, does not make that person unable to choose God.......it truly is all about faith.

As far as the Old Testament and those who wish for it to go away.....there is much prophecy spoken of about the Messiah to come (Jesus Christ). The book of Daniel, in particular.

Prayer is the vehicle where the relationship between the believer and God flourishes. For those who do not believe in God, or choose not to believe, there is no way that person could possibly understand what prayer truly is. Just as the sanctification of a believer means nothing to the non-believer, prayer seems to be a very selfish thing. Prayers are always answered....and sometimes that answer is no. That is not always a fun thing.....but it is always the best thing.

 

[julybaby04]

Ah, except according to the Gospel of Philip he didn't die and rise again, it was the other way around. For some reason they didn't want Philip in the edited version of the Bible at the 1st Council of Nicaea.

"Those who say that the Lord died first and then rose up are in error – for He rose up first and then died.

And Philip was a personal Disciple of Jesus.

...a little info on that gospel of phillip....

http://petragrail.tripod.com/GospelPhilip.html


....the phillip who wrote this was NOT Phillip who was a disciple....he had already died.

 

[Oo_Bugsy]

Many believers will try to rationalize Jesus' absence by pointing to his famous statement in the Bible, "Happy are those who have not seen yet still believe."

If you think about this statement, what you realize is that it creates the perfect cover for a scam. Let's say you are Jesus, you are a normal human being, you realize that you are going to die and you want to cover for this fact. Here is what you would say: "Happy are those who have not seen yet still believe." What you are saying is, "I exist, and the way I am going to show you that I exist is by not showing that I exist." For every other object in the universe, the way that we know it exists is because the object provides evidence of its existence. If there is no evidence for an object's existence, we call it imaginary (e.g. Leprechauns). But with Jesus, the lack of evidence is turned into evidence. Quite clever, but obviously a scam.

You simply need to look at the evidence and accept what it is telling you. If the resurrection were true, then Jesus would be answering prayers as he promises in the Bible. He would also appear when people pray to see him. The fact is that there is definitive evidence that prayer accomplishes nothing. It is also obvious that Jesus is not appearing on earth today.

While we are on the topic of the resurrection, have you ever thought about how odd the whole crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human being right down to the nanosecond level for all eternity. If I didn't like how it was going to turn out, I could have simply changed them when I created them. And since I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them...

So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me. That will, finally, make me happy. Yes, sending mself down and having the humans crucify me -- that will satisfy me. I feel much better now.

It makes no sense, does it? Why would an all-knowing being need to have humans kill himself (Jesus is God, after all) to make himself happy? Especially since it is a perfect God who set the whole thing in motion exactly the way he wanted it? The story of the crucifixion is absurd from top to bottom if you actually stop to think about it. By combining the crucifixion story with the resurrection story, you can see the truth -- "God" is a mythological creature just like every other human god. The entire religious domain is make believe.

 

[hogjack]

Nipple-chafing.

No one talks about it in a normal, every-day conversation but I find it fascinating.

 

[Tryharder62]

Nipple-chafing.

No one talks about it in a normal, every-day conversation but I find it fascinating.

We have got to get you that bra I talked about earlier. I don't have a problem with nipple chaffing but there is a product called Soothing Care by Monistat - yes it is in the women's section but my dad who was a bicyclist used it- It's a Chafing relief powder Gel. It relieves chafing from moisture, movement, and shaving. Can be used in the inner thigh and bikini area.

See Christians know other stuff too.

 

[Tryharder62]

I love this song so in response to the above posts I just want to say a few lines of it.

He lives, He lives, Christ Jesus lives
today!
He walks with me and He talks with me
Along life's narrow way.
He lives, He lives, salvation to impart!
You ask me how I know He lives:
He lives within my heart.

You know some Christians claim to have audibly heard the voice of God. I have never had that happen. I can also not adequately explain the difference of a lost soul before Christ and the soul I have after the Holy Spirit came to live in me. I do feel different, not empty. I wonder why bad things happen. My mother was sick for so many years, my father dieing horribly of cancer, some of the abuse that I have gone through. Sometimes praying for years it would end. I do know that I have used those experiences in my work. The thing is this world is not my home. I'm just passing through. This world is screwed up by the choices we make. I feel all we can do is to do our part to try to ease the suffering and help those in pain. There can also be many blessings in this life. I think about those who post on the boards and it seems like some are so angry. I think that more than anger at God they are just hurting. I was angry at God too. I let him have it a couple times. He can handle it. I know that he loves me anyway.

 

[Exquisition]

If I were to go all religious it would have to be Buddhism.

Truth and happiness comes from within, the self. It doesn;t rely on ficiticious superstition and an imaginary external source to take responsibility for the actions of the individual.

 

[Tryharder62]

If I were to go all religious it would have to be Buddhism.

Truth and happiness comes from within, the self. It doesn;t rely on ficiticious superstition and an imaginary external source to take responsibility for the actions of the individual.

I can respect that. For me though "within" was a very scary place!! LOL

 

[julybaby04]

Many believers will try to rationalize Jesus' absence by pointing to his famous statement in the Bible, "Happy are those who have not seen yet still believe."

If you think about this statement, what you realize is that it creates the perfect cover for a scam. Let's say you are Jesus, you are a normal human being, you realize that you are going to die and you want to cover for this fact. Here is what you would say: "Happy are those who have not seen yet still believe." What you are saying is, "I exist, and the way I am going to show you that I exist is by not showing that I exist." For every other object in the universe, the way that we know it exists is because the object provides evidence of its existence. If there is no evidence for an object's existence, we call it imaginary (e.g. Leprechauns). But with Jesus, the lack of evidence is turned into evidence. Quite clever, but obviously a scam.

You simply need to look at the evidence and accept what it is telling you. If the resurrection were true, then Jesus would be answering prayers as he promises in the Bible. He would also appear when people pray to see him. The fact is that there is definitive evidence that prayer accomplishes nothing. It is also obvious that Jesus is not appearing on earth today.

While we are on the topic of the resurrection, have you ever thought about how odd the whole crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human being right down to the nanosecond level for all eternity. If I didn't like how it was going to turn out, I could have simply changed them when I created them. And since I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them...

So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me. That will, finally, make me happy. Yes, sending mself down and having the humans crucify me -- that will satisfy me. I feel much better now.

It makes no sense, does it? Why would an all-knowing being need to have humans kill himself (Jesus is God, after all) to make himself happy? Especially since it is a perfect God who set the whole thing in motion exactly the way he wanted it? The story of the crucifixion is absurd from top to bottom if you actually stop to think about it. By combining the crucifixion story with the resurrection story, you can see the truth -- "God" is a mythological creature just like every other human god. The entire religious domain is make believe.

I hear everything you are saying....and I understand why you believe what you are saying......because you do not believe in God. Got it!

But I do believe...very much so. The people in the Old Testament offered sacrifices to God (in the forms of animals) knowing that they had sinned against God and were repenting for their sins. Jesus was sent as the most perfect...and LAST sacrifice that would be needed for those who believed.

Jesus was fully man and fully God. He knew what was before Him and willingly let it it happened (which He could have stopped at any moment). He did that for you and for me.......because God does not hate us....He loves us more than anyone could possibly imagine.

Until such a time that God chooses to soften your heart where the understanding of Him will penetrate it.....this conversation does not matter. You will never understand or believe who He is .....because you choose not to...even though you have heard who God is.

 

[Exquisition]

I hear everything you are saying....and I understand why you believe what you are saying......because you do not believe in God. Got it!

But I do believe...very much so. The people in the Old Testament offered sacrifices to God (in the forms of animals) knowing that they had sinned against God and were repenting for their sins. Jesus was sent as the most perfect...and LAST sacrifice that would be needed for those who believed.

Jesus was fully man and fully God. He knew what was before Him and willingly let it it happened (which He could have stopped at any moment). He did that for you and for me.......because God does not hate us....He loves us more than anyone could possibly imagine.

Until such a time that God chooses to soften your heart where the understanding of Him will penetrate it.....this conversation does not matter. You will never understand or believe who He is .....because you choose not to...even though you have heard who God is.

Yup but we evolved, the Earth is more thna 6500 years old and the Bible is full of untruths, mistranslations and interpreted in a gazillion ways by the individual and branches of Christianity.

You might say "so what? I believe!" That's great, good luck to you, but what is it you believe in? How do you know your interpretation is the "one true interpretation?"

Seems like it could be a gazillion different things depending on how you want to interpret the superstitions of people living 2000 years ago.

 

[Exquisition]

and Julybaby - should you follow the word of God when he says "An eye for an eye"

or do you prefer to "turn the other cheek?"

Both the word of God, both just as valid.

 

[Oo_Bugsy]

If you believe the story of Jesus, Jesus clearly knew that he is God. In John chapter 14, verse 8 we find this:

Philip said to him, "Lord, show us the Father, and we shall be satisfied." Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet you do not know me, Philip? He who has seen me has seen the Father."

So it makes you wonder about Jesus' famous lamenation in Matthew 27:46:
About the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"—which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"
Since Jesus is God, what he really must have meant is: "Myself, myself, why have I forsaken me?" Which of course makes absolutely no sense.

It doesn't matter how many things you try to argue against there is always an answer.
You say you have faith, science says you have faith in nothing more than a bedtime story.

 

[KRCummings]

So it makes you wonder about Jesus' famous lamenation in Matthew 27:46:
About the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"—which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"
Since Jesus is God, what he really must have meant is: "Myself, myself, why have I forsaken me?" Which of course makes absolutely no sense.

.

You know He's quoting Psalms there, right? Yes, of course you do.

 

[richard_daily]

As far as being a follower of Christ is only to stroke one's ego, you could not be more wrong. To choose to truly follow Christ is the most humbling thing one will ever choose to do.

Wrong. Your belief that you have all the answers was chosen purely for your own ego.

It's completely arrogant to claim and assume that you have the mysteries of the universe all figured out, and that it can be attributed to one imaginary being.