What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

[JohnnySavage]

The amount of student loans taken out last year crossed the $100 billion mark for the first time and total loans outstanding will exceed $1 trillion for the first time this year. Americans now owe more on student loans than on credit cards, reports the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

 

[unregistered]

 

[koalabear]

Reid's true Democrat motivatrion:


Reid signals government jobs must take priority over private-sector jobs
By Pete Kasperowicz - 10/19/11 10:16 AM ET


Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) on Wednesday indicated Congress needs to worry about government jobs more than private-sector jobs, and that this is why Senate Democrats are pushing a bill aimed at shoring up teachers and first-responders.

"It's very clear that private-sector jobs have been doing just fine; it's the public-sector jobs where we've lost huge numbers, and that's what this legislation is all about," Reid said on the Senate floor.Plus it has the tax increase tied to it.

More here:

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-acti...s-must-take-priority-over-private-sector-jobs

Great bill, pushes the same ole bailout for the same jobs they already bailed out before. It doe not create sustainable jobs.

 

[koalabear]

Economic fears, Apple hit stocks

Updated: 10/19/2011 04:23 ET

http://data.moneycentral.msn.com/scripts/chrtsrv.dll?Symbol=$us:INDU&width=300&height=200&E1=0&D4=1&Legend=0&AF=2&Banner=5&palette=2&C1=3&E8=1​

DOW 11,504.62 -72.43
NASDAQ 2,604.04 -53.39
S&P 1,209.88 -15.50

 

[mercury14]

Reid's true Democrat motivatrion:


Reid signals government jobs must take priority over private-sector jobs
By Pete Kasperowicz - 10/19/11 10:16 AM ET


Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) on Wednesday indicated Congress needs to worry about government jobs more than private-sector jobs, and that this is why Senate Democrats are pushing a bill aimed at shoring up teachers and first-responders.

"It's very clear that private-sector jobs have been doing just fine; it's the public-sector jobs where we've lost huge numbers, and that's what this legislation is all about," Reid said on the Senate floor.

More here:

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-acti...s-must-take-priority-over-private-sector-jobs

Yeah maybe. Or maybe it's the function of government to provide education and first-responder services to the nation? Of course you also bitch up a storm whenever the Senate focuses on private sector jobs too. And you bitch when the Senate does nothing.

Doesn't matter what they do. You will always bitch about the actions of the Democratic Senate, even when you agree with them.

 

[unregistered]

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

What is Congress really supposed to do to create private jobs? How to save a public job is very simple, you fund it, how to save a private or create one is considerably more difficult.

 

[mercury14]

Reid proves that Democrat government believes itself to have more of a right to exist than the the private sector from whom it draws its consent to govern.

His statement, his very existence, in the United States Senate is repugnant to the legacy of limited government left by those who've gone before us.

Obama, Biden, Reid, and Pelosi, represent the most demonstrable pathological liars in American history.

Are you going to mention to your stoolie there that it's not the purpose of government jobs to be self-sustainable? Unless you all want the police to send you a bill in the mail when their presence keeps you from being robbed?

Helping states keep their teachers and first-responders onboard doesn't mean anyone thinks they have more of a right to exist than the private sector. You're against private sector bailouts, no? Start acting like it.

 

[mercury14]

What is Congress really supposed to do to create private jobs? How to save a public job is very simple, you fund it, how to save a private or create one is considerably more difficult.

Welcome to Vetteman's world. He bitches when Congress helps the private sector and also when it doesn't. Both options are the wrong move in his view.

Unless Republicans are in power or we're talking about the Republican House. Then it's okay.

 

[eyer]

A Long, Steep Drop for Americans' Standard of Living

Think life is not as good as it used to be, at least in terms of your wallet? You'd be right about that. The standard of living for Americans has fallen longer and more steeply over the past three years than at any time since the US government began recording it five decades ago.

Bottom line: The average individual now has $1,315 less in disposable income than he or she did three years ago at the onset of the Great Recession – even though the recession ended, technically speaking, in mid-2009. That means less money to spend at the spa or the movies, less for vacations, new carpeting for the house, or dinner at a restaurant.

In short, it means a less vibrant economy, with more Americans spending primarily on necessities. The diminished standard of living, moreover, is squeezing the middle class, whose restlessness and discontent are evident in grass-roots movements such as the tea party and "Occupy Wall Street" and who may take out their frustrations on incumbent politicians in next year's election.

What has led to the most dramatic drop in the US standard of living since at least 1960? One factor is stagnant incomes: Real median income is down 9.8 percent since the start of the recession through this June, according to Sentier Research in Annapolis, Md., citing census bureau data. Another is falling net worth – think about the value of your home and, if you have one, your retirement portfolio. A third is rising consumer prices, with inflation eroding people's buying power by 3.25 percent since mid-2008.

more @

http://www.cnbc.com/id/44962589

 

[unregistered]

 

[koalabear]

It's not government's job to create private sector jobs, they need to shrink the size and scope of government if they want to help the private sector,, so they can create jobs. Reid flat out lied.

According to the Twinkies brothers, all teachers and public service should become federal employees.

 

[unregistered]

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

It's not government's job to create private sector jobs, they need to shrink the size and scope of government if they want to help the private sector,, so they can create jobs. Reid flat out lied.

With the exception of regulations, we can debate over regulations on a case by case bases. Just saying regulation is bad is at best short sighted. At worst its dangerous but other than that the size of the government has very little to do with the private sector creating jobs.

6.5 million unemployed private sector workers, 392,000 government workers unemployed, and under Obama another 63,000 have been added. Adding government workers does nothing to help problems in the private sector, it's a dead liability on the private economy. Besides the country is broke, government needs to downsize, and stop borrowing 42 cents of every dollar it spends. Reid flat out lied.

These numbers for starters mean nothing. It's not like the number of public employees were equal or even close to equal to the number of private employees in the country.

Adding government workers DOES do something to help the private sector. It creates one more consumer with a goddamn job. Which increases demand, and it lowers the number of people looking for employment.

If those two advocates of bovine government have their way, all of us will be government employees. Hard to imagine how they could hate their freedom so much.

God I hope not. Sadly it may come to that in the not too distant future since a good chunk of our population is getting redundant in a hurry and nobody is asking the question of how do we intend to create more jobs when innovation is killing jobs hand over fist. And we don't want innovation to stop, the stupidest thing we could possibly do is outlaw upgrades because they force people out of work but. . .yeah. How much longer are we gonna be able to keep this going?

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

No it doesn't. It puts private citizens out of work and adds to the burden of an already oppressed private economy...which creates all wealth and represents the source of all government revenue. Something you'll never understand.

I don't understand it because you just made something up. The only way a public employee puts a private one out of work is if they are in direct competition. Something that rarely happens. As much as I hate the DMV there isn't a private licensing business that they ran out of business or a private firm certifying people to drive. (Perhaps there SHOULD be but as of present there is not)

The private sector only creates all wealth if you're stuck on this concept that it's not wealth until you can touch it. The computer boom pretty much throws THAT part of your theory straight out the window. So what you're left with is the concept that police and fire fighters and Marines and traffic lights don't add value simply by preventing the loss of value when it's stolen, burnt, or you crash because of no traffic lights. Or if we had signs (still government but who cares) the amount of lost value just because of time.

Besides you MUST have spent some time state side as a Marine or in Germany where they don't want us to leave, not because they're afraid of Russia but because it turns out that 18 year olds with fairly large (when you factor in that they aren't paying half their money in food and rent) make for a decent little economy.

So wrong again.

 

[mercury14]

Vette thinks that it the federal government laid off 2 million workers, removing 2 million consumers from the economy and crushing consumer demand, that businesses would start magically creating jobs. They'd literally go out and hire more workers and build more factories due to the fact that people are buying a lot less of their stuff.

And for some dumb reason that Vette can't even explain to himself, when the government hires a Marine, that Marine not only doesn't count as having a job but he actually nets a negative job (wtf?).

And also he just said that the private sector is the source of all government revenue... Meaning in his whacked-out world military members do not have taxable income or property taxes. And they magically do not pay sales tax. Nevermind that Vette was a Marine and paid income tax the whole time. It suddenly never happened.

 

[unregistered]

 

[mercury14]

These are just too dumb to address, except to say, the government produces nothing for sale, so it is in fact a dead liability on the economy regardless of necessity. In our society government is not a stand alone operation, it must absorb financial resources from the private sector that would otherwise be used to expand the economy, and better the lives of private citizens as they pursue the happiness guaranteed to them by the Constitution. If you can't see this simple truth you need an education.

*long pause*

Nobody suggested otherwise....

 

[cebalrai]

These are just too dumb to address, except to say, the government produces nothing for sale, so it is in fact a dead liability on the economy

You really can't think of any ways that the government is more than a dead weight on the economy? Is your understanding of economics really that limited?

By the way Mr. Vette, I have a business degree and own my own small business. And I started my MBA last month. If you would like assistance thinking of ways that the government is (or can be) a boon to the economy just let me know. We can work together to come up with a nice long list okay?

 

[cebalrai]

Lol wut? 428 pages?

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

The whole "living wage" argument is such a bunch of bunk. Here in MoCo, a certain percentage of apartments in a given complex have to be set aside for low income tenants and the rent adjusted. A standard 2-bedroom "low income" apartment is $1500 a month (without utilities). $7.50 an hour doesn't even pay the rent, let alone pay for food, electricity, and transportation to work.

The minimum wage is nothing but feel good legislation to make the rich feel good about patting the poor on the head and has no practical value.

I'd go even further than that stating that the unseen consequences are actually damaging to our economy and the mindset of potential landlords...

But then, you already know that.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

The amount of student loans taken out last year crossed the $100 billion mark for the first time and total loans outstanding will exceed $1 trillion for the first time this year. Americans now owe more on student loans than on credit cards, reports the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

I've spoken several times on the education bubble.

I've been kicking myself in the ass for years for not saving an article penned by a former East German intellectual bemoaning Capitalism. Under Communism, everyone she knew had an education and a government job. Thanks to government they had 100% full employment and as her lament for the good ol' days went on, it became clear that she had no idea as to why that sort of model would be unsustainable...

We see that economic thinking in play in this thread, in the Democrat (and elite Republican) party, and in the OWS crowd.

"A government job is just as good as a private sector job!

"Maybe even better, because teachers, cops and regulators add value to your life!

"It's the 'multipliers!'"