Comments Discussion (moved from review thread)

[ishtat]

It would seem most have already found them, because they have nice comments.

I'll reiterate my disclaimer that I can't spend my life here. But I think some people (who ignore everything not recommended by the New Poems Reviews) might want to check out a couple of poets I don't remember seeing before.

Despite a few technical flaws and an assinine comment by our ever-famous "Anonymous," one of my favorites of SATURDAY was Acompaniment by Nirvanadragoness. I left an additional comment (which I usually do not do) inviting "Anonymous" to allow us to trash her or his own work. It's insensate for a human being to be so biased and so rabid. In my less-than-humble opinion. Go, comment on the poem. It's not a sin to not like it, but give real reasons if you don't (which "Anonymous" did not do, adequately.)

There are many other good poems (despite "Anonymous'" "better than thou" stance) from Saturday. I would say that included in the powerful development stage would be WitchyNiki's poems; yes, all of them. But I particularly liked The Psychopomp

I had a couple of poems up also, but apparently, "Anonymous" depreciated them so much that they didn't even deserve comment.

I have not mentioned other poets, but in general, Saturday was a good day. It's a shame that there was no review.

/tom

Following Foehn2's protest I had a look at "Accompaniment" by Nirvana dragones. The comment by 'Anonymous is indeed unpleasant and achieves nothing. However, are the other comments any more useful. Every one of them is totally and unreservadly complimentary without any attempt to analyse the work at all.

Is this kind of cheerleading comment any more useful or credible than the obvious bile of 'Anonymous'?

 

[Angeline]

Following Foehn2's protest I had a look at "Accompaniment" by Nirvana dragones. The comment by 'Anonymous is indeed unpleasant and achieves nothing. However, are the other comments any more useful. Every one of them is totally and unreservadly complimentary without any attempt to analyse the work at all.

Is this kind of cheerleading comment any more useful or credible than the obvious bile of 'Anonymous'?

Good point. I read her poem, which is a) good and b) does need some editing imo. I didn't comment. I know. I should. I will. (And I saw that "Anonymous" comment. It's cowardly and made me wince.)

I'm always of mixed mind about the commenting. On one hand, if an author allows comments, the commentor should feel free to be honest and offer suggestions for changes as he/she sees fit. On the other hand, I know that many people don't want that sort of honesty. That want to be cheered on. Period. I come down somewhere in the middle: I'll offer a few suggestions for change if I think they're needed, but I won't do a full-scale, picky review unless I a) know the author, and b) know they want that.

PS Hi. Nice to see you.

 

[UnderYourSpell]

Following Foehn2's protest I had a look at "Accompaniment" by Nirvana dragones. The comment by 'Anonymous is indeed unpleasant and achieves nothing. However, are the other comments any more useful. Every one of them is totally and unreservadly complimentary without any attempt to analyse the work at all.

Is this kind of cheerleading comment any more useful or credible than the obvious bile of 'Anonymous'?

I for one don't know how to analyse sometimes I don't even know why I like a poem .. I just do. So do I walk away without saying so? I would far rather cheer someone on whether it's useful or not and hope they will be kind enough to do the same for me

 

[GuiltyPleasure]

I for one don't know how to analyse sometimes I don't even know why I like a poem .. I just do. So do I walk away without saying so? I would far rather cheer someone on whether it's useful or not and hope they will be kind enough to do the same for me

This is pretty much how I felt and, because of criticism of my critiques. I now only vore and rarely leave a comment.

 

[UnderYourSpell]

This is pretty much how I felt and, because of criticism of my critiques. I now only vore and rarely leave a comment.

That's a damn shame and a loss to us all if you ask me ... well not you voting but not feeling you can comment I mean .. tying myself in knots here but sure you know what I mean!

 

[Angeline]

This is pretty much how I felt and, because of criticism of my critiques. I now only vore and rarely leave a comment.

I've always loved your comments on my poems. Just sayin.

 

[GuiltyPleasure]

That's a damn shame and a loss to us all if you ask me ... well not you voting but not feeling you can comment I mean .. tying myself in knots here but sure you know what I mean!

I've always loved your comments on my poems. Just sayin.

Thank you both.

 

[swallowedscream]

This debate,

for lack of a better word, is why I so often keep silent and only vote. I also left a comment on her poem that was not useful, but it was honest. Does that really mean it has less merit than a comment that offers an in depth critique? I think that depends on how the writer feels about it.

For me,I think it's nice to know that someone read my poems at all, like them or not. I appreciate and welcome suggestions and tips. I like knowing what worked for the reader and importantly, what didn't. But I am just as grateful for comments that offer little more than an "I was here and I had fun". So I guess my point is, why should anyone other than the author worry about comments left on their work? Is it not for them to decide what holds value?

Well, that's my two cents on the subject (or was that perhaps, five?) and shall now wander off and NOT worry about comments on other peoples work that I haven't left. Have a great night, folks!

 

[swallowedscream]

Oops

One more thing...let's make it six cents shall we? Haha. I haven't done so with poems as I am not comfortable doing so given my own lack of skills, but I often save (for stories) longer comments and suggestions (particularly if there was something I didn't like) for private feedback while having left a short and perhaps inane to others, comment in the public feedback section.

Okay, I really am all done now. My pockets are empty on this subject. Unless you would like some lint? It's Downy fresh? Ciao!

 

[unpredictablebijou]

I don't disagree with ishtat, but I come to a different conclusion, I think.

Okay, yes, cheerful rah-rahs on a poem are of no more or less use than generic slams. Obviously, most of us enjoy the former more. But I wouldn't say either have that much educational merit.

But as swallowedscream has said, it's just nice to hear that someone was there, had a good time and wanted to say so.

I tend to assume that a poem submitted is sorta "finished" if only because it's sich a pain in the ass to change it after that. If someone really wanted active critique, the PFnD would be a far more efficient place to get it and tweak the various drafts of a piece.

so yeah, by the time it's up in "print" here, it seems more appropriate to just give kudos UNLESS you're actually volunteering as a reviewer. That's the performance stage. The PFnD is the rehearsals.

At least, that's the way I've chosen to use the forum's various tools. But that's just me.

bj

bj

 

[Bill Dada]

This is pretty much how I felt and, because of criticism of my critiques. I now only vore and rarely leave a comment.

I liked you comments and they are missed.

 

[twelveoone]

This is pretty much how I felt and, because of criticism of my critiques. I now only vore and rarely leave a comment.

WTF, one of the best here, and one with an interesting view on things, not leaving comments? Sad.
I'd say grow some balls, but I don't think they would look right on you.

As for your comment, foehn

Let's see some of yours, Anonymous. Let us have a chance to trash *your* drivel.

That is why I always leave my number, so people can trash MY drivel, and they do, but they always do it as "Anonymous" votes, depriving me of the joy of their comments.

And since MET is back anonamouse IS NOT Anonymous.

 

[anonamouse]

Following Foehn2's protest I had a look at "Accompaniment" by Nirvana dragones. The comment by 'Anonymous is indeed unpleasant and achieves nothing. However, are the other comments any more useful. Every one of them is totally and unreservadly complimentary without any attempt to analyse the work at all.

Is this kind of cheerleading comment any more useful or credible than the obvious bile of 'Anonymous'?

re: Psychopomp - I rock, tom.

But I agree with ishtat, if every comment is totally and unreservadly complimentary it is useless and a sure sign of a fan club running amok.

 

[UnderYourSpell]

Got so I am afraid to comment now incase I am accused of following all the other sheep saw one today that I liked but so did everyone else so I guess I will just vote and wander on and make useless comments elsewhere (or even keep them to myself now it's been pointed out to me that's what they are)

 

[Angeline]

Got so I am afraid to comment now incase I am accused of following all the other sheep saw one today that I liked but so did everyone else so I guess I will just vote and wander on and make useless comments elsewhere (or even keep them to myself now it's been pointed out to me that's what they are)

Do what you think is right, no matter what anyone here or elsewhere says.

Everyone appreciates comments. How could we not? It means someone is actually reading what we wrote and is willing to take the time to say what they thought about it. I'm just leery of saying anything too negative to someone I don't know. I will, OTOH, gently make suggestions to anyone if I see something in the poem that needs fixing and I think I can help. Today I left a very negative comment, something I almost never do, to someone I barely know, but the poem is fecking offensive. Yesterday I felt like I was walking in Eve's footsteps because she'd already commented and I agreed with everything she said. Oh well.

 

[Guest]

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[UnderYourSpell]

But is saying I enjoyed that enough? I've loved some of yours but not said so because I've nothing constructive to offer

 

[UnderYourSpell]

Do what you think is right, no matter what anyone here or elsewhere says.

Everyone appreciates comments. How could we not? It means someone is actually reading what we wrote and is willing to take the time to say what they thought about it. I'm just leery of saying anything too negative to someone I don't know. I will, OTOH, gently make suggestions to anyone if I see something in the poem that needs fixing and I think I can help. Today I left a very negative comment, something I almost never do, to someone I barely know, but the poem is fecking offensive. Yesterday I felt like I was walking in Eve's footsteps because she'd already commented and I agreed with everything she said. Oh well.

I said before that I don't mark down .... can I take that back? You're right it's dreadful seems it's not only me that gets hurt by someone who can't learn to STFU

 

[Angeline]

But is saying I enjoyed that enough? I've loved some of yours but not said so because I've nothing constructive to offer

My experience has been that the more you comment, the easier it gets to express more than "I like it." Reading the other comments helps because you begin to understand what makes a good comment. It always helps if you can say why (e.g., good images, line breaks, interesting use of language) or why not (e.g., too much "telling," too many extra words, wrong words, errors). It also helps if you can give suggestions for revisions. But if you can't or don't feel comfortable doing that, that's fine, too. Nothing wrong with just saying "I like it."

 

[unpredictablebijou]

Fuck whoever told you that. Comment on what/whenever however you want. If it's the poet/writer who is the one who isn't appreciative of your time then fuck them too and do as you say by commenting on someone else's stuff.

WORD

bj

 

[Guest]

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[ishtat]

partial change of mind

Actually on reflectionI have changed my mind a bit, I do not think cheerleading type comments are intrinsically useful but looking back at some of my own early comments I didn't then have the confidence or competance to say much more. We all have to start somewhere. So my revised view is that anything which involves people tends towards a better result even if the individual comment doesn't amount to much.

I do not think many of us are too keen on being subject to a full scale critical analysis but for me the most useful comment has come from people I respect and has often been a single point made in different ways by different people. Patrick Carrington for example once spotted a weakness in one piece and Wicked Eve had picked up the almost identical point on another earlier and different submission.

As someone who once was an academic I know what viscious criticism is like and how damaging it can be but I think that for the learners here one of the best threads ever was 'Not for the thin skinned ' started by Patrick Carrington. I contributed next to nothing but learned a lot from it.

Finally, anything which inhibits the delectable Tristesse is obviously dreadful; I like that word, delectable.

 

[WickedEve]

But is saying I enjoyed that enough? I've loved some of yours but not said so because I've nothing constructive to offer

If all you can say is "I like it" then make that your comment. If it's not what the poet wants, he/she will delete it, but I really doubt that would ever happen.
I try to offer helpful suggestions but sometimes I just leave a "I like it" comment, because I want the poet to know that I was there, I read, I liked.

 

[WomanPariah]

distilled to its essence

 

[anonamouse]

Got so I am afraid to comment now incase I am accused of following all the other sheep saw one today that I liked but so did everyone else so I guess I will just vote and wander on and make useless comments elsewhere (or even keep them to myself now it's been pointed out to me that's what they are)

Nobody objects to lame ass comments, per se everyone leaves them. It is only when you leave the same lame ass comments on the the same lame ass poets that things get skewed. Change that to screwed for the better poets.