Trump fucks up again. Ukraine negotiation goes sideways

[Fuzzy1975]

In 100 days, Trump has cionducted a masterclass in how to project weakness, destroy American credibility on a world stage and sever ties with pretty much every ally and friend we have.

As an add-on extra, he's killed US military equipment export sales and ensured that in any future conflict, America will have to go it alone.

How to go from THE world superpower to an irrelevancy and a distraction in 3 months.

Oh! And ensure a rash of nuclear proliferation as a bonus.

Genius move! Brilliant! Winning all the way!

View attachment 2528998

Now given this,do you think he can do any better at reducing government waste, fixing the illegal immigration issues or the economy? Also remember, the Republican party 100% supports him in these failed policies.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Now given this,do you think he can do any better at reducing government waste, fixing the illegal immigration issues or the economy? Also remember, the Republican party 100% supports him in these failed policies.

My take:

Govt waste - good idea, being handled chaotically. DOGE is a good idea but it needs a few senior govt bureaucrats with a rocket up their ass to actually get it done effectively. NOT Musk. I don't see any real culling going on in the FBI and DOJ and the ATF still exists... as for Defense, hmmmm, now THERE is real waste. Don't see much of a plan for what depts get closed down either. There's a LOT that should go. USAID was a good start, and cutting UN and WHO funding should have been done years ago. Waste of our money. We have 35 trillion in debt to pay off.

Illegal immigration: a lot of noise but far too few deportations. We need to be hittimng 30k a day and that needs a large support organization in place, including special courts, judges, holding camps and personnel. None of that is being out in place which means they are restricted to the numbers they can currently handle. THAT means it's all for show and they're not that serious about solving the problem, which is we have 30,000,000 illegals, most of whom need to go. If they are needed for farmwork or whatever, they should also have a process in place to issue them work permits and make them legal as temp workers. They also need to look at the ones that are genuine refugees.

And for FFS stop deporting Brits and Aussies and Canadians seemingly at random. Anyone doing that should be fired for being too stupid even for a Fed.

Economy? Well, I think with the tariff's we all know whats going to happen there. Slectively applied to encourage on-shoring = good idea. The way it's being done? Moronic at best. Deliberate sabotage at worst.

Good policies, piss poor implementation.

And as for Ukraine, well, you already know my views. I'm sure everybody here already knows my views on that. LOL. The rest doesn't matter. Assuming Vance gets the nomination for 2028, I'll vote for whoever runs against him solely on what he and Trump are doing to Ukraine. Heck, I'll vote for AOC if she emerges as the candidate and Fuck Vance. Its an issue I feel that strongly about.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

My take:

Govt waste - good idea, being handled chaotically.

Right, and who did tackle government waste? Clinton,and there were no Government service reductions.

DOGE is a good idea

Doge is a fucking stupid idea. 100% asinine. The path Clinton used was the correct way.

u Waste of our money. We have 35 trillion in debt to pay off.

Correction with the bond yield climbing by .5%, that debt just grew by almost a Trillion dollars...overnight.

Illegal immigration:

Right, and there was a bi-partisan bill that would have tightened up the rules, enforcement and whole bunch of other shit, that Trump killed so he would have a campaign platform to fool the gullible like you (were).

Good policies, piss poor implementation.

It's not like the Democrats were ignoring them, you just didn't like the speed of action. Well I'll let you in on a little secret, things move slow at the government level for a reason. That way if you make a policy mistake, it doesn't cripple the economy....

And as for Ukraine, well, you already know my views.

Yes,and I appreciate the passion.

and Fuck Vance. Its an issue I feel that strongly about.

hmmm fucking Vance...that's a disgusting thought.....lol just teasing....

 

[ChloeTzang]

Right, and who did tackle government waste? Clinton,and there were no Government service reductions.

Doge is a fucking stupid idea. 100% asinine. The path Clinton used was the correct way.

LOL. Clinton was elected about the time I was a twinkle in my daddy's eyes. I really vaguely remember the tail end of his presidency but that's about it. I really have no idea about anything he did except for Monica.

Correction with the bond yield climbing by .5%, that debt just grew by almost a Trillion dollars...overnight.

Yeeeepers.

Right, and there was a bi-partisan bill that would have tightened up the rules, enforcement and whole bunch of other shit, that Trump killed so he would have a campaign platform to fool the gullible like you (were).

LOL. RINO's. That bill would have opened the floodgates and let the ones already here stay. Good thing it was killed. It needed a stake thru the heart as well.

It's not like the Democrats were ignoring them, you just didn't like the speed of action. Well I'll let you in on a little secret, things move slow at the government level for a reason. That way if you make a policy mistake, it doesn't cripple the economy....

Ohhh the Democrats were enabling them. Notice everyone has stopped screaming about USAID now? They're all keeping quite opeining the DOJ and FBI won't do too much digging and expose all the scams that were going on. That said, these closures, layoffs and downsizing need to be handled a little more professionally.

Yes,and I appreciate the passion.

hmmm fucking Vance...that's a disgusting thought.....lol just teasing....

LOL. Not at all. It is.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Unsurprising. After all, Trump has completely reneged on thw agreement, and by coercing Ukraine to cede territory and extort mineral concrssions they are breaking it just the same as Putin is, making them equally at fault. This is probably Elon's DOGE doggies saving costs on internet traffic because why host a document everyone wants to re-read but nobody plans to uphold?

So much for signing treaties with America, world. To be fair, we didn't robustly enforce the memorandum under the Biden administration either, and that's partly why we are where we are.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Good point

 

[ChloeTzang]

No news here.
Let's look at why Donald Trump cannot end the war in Ukraine, despite his bold promises.

The war began because Vladimir Putin believed he could use military force to subjugate Ukraine—to install a puppet government, impose a new political order, erase the country’s national identity, and eliterally exterminate the Ukrainian leadership, intelligentsia, members of the armed forces and police. They came prepaed with lists of people to execute and mobile cematoriums to dispose of the bodies. This was Putin’s war of choice. The Ukrainians didn’t choose this war—it was forced upon them. Ukrainians resisted because they had to.

Trump’s approach to “brokering peace” started with trying to persuade Ukraine to stop fighting, give up its territories occupied by Russia, abandon its defence, accept a change in government, and sign a ceasefire deal that would give Russia most of what it wanted—in exchange for no guarantee of American security support once the fighting stopped. Does that sound appealing? Not to most Ukrainians.

Zelensky doesn’t have the political space to agree to surrender. Ukrainian society simply wouldn’t accept it even if Zelensky wanted to. And as for Trump sitting down with Putin—he came to the table with no cards in hand. The only thing he could offer Putin was a promise to pressure Ukraine into capitulation, lift sanctions, and entertain vague talk of future cooperation. But the sanctions that hurt Russia the most are European sanctions, and Europe sees Russia as a growing threat—especially if it succeeds in Ukraine. So no, Europe won’t help Trump force Ukraine to surrender. Quite the opposite. Europe will help Zelemsky push back at Trump.

There is only one credible path to ending this war: sending a clear signal to the Russians that Putin will not win. And that means supporting Ukraine’s defense, not undercutting it. Anyone with real-world experience of this war understands that. It’s foreign policy 101.

But the Trump team hasn’t even gotten that far—so the war will go on.

Based on the latest talking points, Trump will blame Zelensky and Ukraine for the lack of progress, he will walk away from Ukraine, lift sanctions on Russia and blame the war on Biden.

Not quite sure what Trump thinks he's going to get from this, apart from making sure that the USA looks weak, ensuring we lose all our allies, destroying our military equipment export market, personally looking like a blustering buffoon, and exposing the incredible incompetence of his Administration. I hinestly thought it would be impossible to make the Biden Administration look great, but Trump is managing.

And it was so simple.

All he had to do was support Ukraine by SELLING them military equipment and ammo, NOT sabotage NATO and Europe, and NOT start a trade war with the entire world. Simple stuff, really.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Ohhh the Democrats were enabling them. Notice everyone has stopped screaming about USAID now?

Actually the pain is starting to hit now for the farmers who had contracts. I can't find the interview link on a Bee farmer I watched on this, I'll see if I can dig it up. But this forecast in the link is bang on.

https://moneywise.com/news/economy/...onyear-of-products-from-them-where-do-they-go

Also Trump's MO has always been to keep creating havoc. When you do, yesterday's fuck up is topped in the news cycle by today's fuck up.

You may not like, or agree with Democrats policies when they were in power ,but you then lived in a Democracy. The voters chose Biden.

Question? Are you/ USA better off now, than under Biden?

 

[ChloeTzang]

THIS is the US representative? Cringe

 

[ChloeTzang]

Trump hopes Russia, Ukraine 'make a deal this week,' promises 'big business' with US​

Russia and Ukraine will be able to "do big business" with the United States if they secure a peace deal in the next week, U.S. President Donald Trump wrote in a social media post on April 20. Trump's comments come shortly after he threatened to pull U.S. support from the peace process altogether if either Russia or Ukraine caused negotiations to stall.

Totally crass and a complete mis-reading of the room. Putin's goal remains unchanged, he wants Ukraine, he hates Ukrainians and Zelensky, and "big business with the US" means nthing to him. Just as it means nothing to Ukraine in comparison to restoring their borders and defeatung Russia. Somebody in his circle should explain to Trump that there are morre important things than money, but I doubt he would understand.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/worl...36458bb46c4834f12a1c1aeefdf9c2&ei=22#comments

 

[ChloeTzang]

 

[Lazaran]

Trump hopes Russia, Ukraine 'make a deal this week,' promises 'big business' with US​

Russia and Ukraine will be able to "do big business" with the United States if they secure a peace deal in the next week, U.S. President Donald Trump wrote in a social media post on April 20. Trump's comments come shortly after he threatened to pull U.S. support from the peace process altogether if either Russia or Ukraine caused negotiations to stall.

Totally crass and a complete mis-reading of the room. Putin's goal remains unchanged, he wants Ukraine, he hates Ukrainians and Zelensky, and "big business with the US" means nthing to him. Just as it means nothing to Ukraine in comparison to restoring their borders and defeatung Russia. Somebody in his circle should explain to Trump that there are morre important things than money, but I doubt he would understand.

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/worl...36458bb46c4834f12a1c1aeefdf9c2&ei=22#comments

It is quite likely that DonOld is making an appeal to some greedy Ukrainian sociopathic / psychopathic "businessmen" like himself who might assassinate President Zelenskyy, etc, to realize their dreams of vast riches from some "deal" involving the U.S.



DonOld obviously is NOT talking to President Zelenskyy and his inner circle with those remarks, because they know damn well that no “peace deal” is achievable while Putin and his cabal are in power.

And the remarks certainly are NOT directed at (or would be received by) anyone inside Russia, because they (Russia) only realize the spoils of their war if they take everything (all of Ukraine). They (Russia) are in too deep to share the spoils with anyone - let alone splitting things three or more ways.

DonOld is acting like a mafia boss trying to angle for an advantage, but, in this case, everybody knows the game. It’s like when Vito Corleone sent Luca Brasi on his "covert" mission. How did that work out???



We. Told. Them. So.

 

[dmallord]

Trump has a deep grudge against Zelensky - but he’s now taken it further than ever before

Trump’s victim-shaming of Ukraine is ugly and symptomatic of something more dangerous.
world affairs editor Sam Kiley
Tuesday 15 April 2025 14:17 BST

What could possess Donald Trump to victim shame Ukraine’s president and endorse the actions of an indicted war criminal by backing Vladimir Putin? Personal hatred of Volodymyr Zelensky? A near-demented obsession with personal sleight? A radical strategic vision that’s upended world affairs? Something worse?

Probably.

Soon after the massacre in Sumy, where two Iskander missiles slammed into the provincial Ukrainian capital killing 35 people, including two children, Trump sloughed off the atrocity by claiming it had been a Russian mistake. Shocking, but not surprising, as Trump has consistently taken the Russian side at every opportunity this year. Before most of the bodies could be collected from the city morgue, though, he had gone on the offensive by doubling down on his efforts to pin Ukraine’s suffering on its president. “When you start a war, you got to know you can win,” he said of Ukraine’s leader.

Zelensky was not president when Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014. He was elected by a landslide in 2019. Russia launched its attempt to kill him, capture Kyiv, and colonise Ukraine in February 2022. He didn’t start the war with Russia – and wasn’t president when Ukraine enshrined the goal of Nato membership in its 2018 constitution. Zelensky did, however, earn Trump’s anger by being a disloyal recipient of America’s largesse, mostly financial aid, for failing to open an investigation into Hunter Biden’s business deals in Ukraine in July 2019. Joe Biden was the likely Democrat candidate in the election of 2020. Back then, Trump was impeached by congress over his alleged threat to withhold $400m in US military aid to Ukraine unless Zelensky helped with the Biden campaign, and other anti-Democrat operations. Trump was cleared by the senate but the damage had been done. He bears a deep grudge against Zelensky.

But Trump was already a Russian strategic partner. His relationship with Moscow goes back to 1987 when he made his first trip to the capital of the Soviet Union to scout for investment opportunities. He didn’t ever do any deals in Russia. But Russian bankers have backed some of his enterprises since. Trump has always been sloppy with state secrets since his first term in office. His own top intelligence staff have risked easy penetration by foreign spies because they’ve been using their personal phones for top secret communications. So it is reasonable to assume that America’s adversaries, like Russia, have deep knowledge and understanding of every aspect of the 47th president’s life – and have done for decades.

His support for Russian G7/8 membership, his refusal to put tariffs on Moscow this month, he has adopted every one of Russia’s initial negotiating principles as his own when it comes to Ukraine and said that he thought that the country may anyway “be Russian one day”. He wants to get back into doing business with Russia too. But he goes further into the realms of bully-backing with his statement on Monday that “you don’t start a war against someone 20 times your size and then hope that people give you missiles”.

Again, Zelensky didn’t start the war. The US, UK, Russia and Ukraine did sign a memorandum in Budapest guaranteeing Kyiv security after Ukraine gave up its nuclear missiles in 1994. France and China backed the Budapest memo with their own document. Ukraine, a western democracy with ambitions to join the European Union, is a sovereign nation that Putin has said he wants to bring back into the post-Soviet Russian empire. Putin has also said he has designs on the Baltic states, Moldova and Romania. Support for Ukraine is a necessary condition of Europe’s defence. America’s network of allies in Nato and beyond have been the weft of Washington’s tapestry of alliances that have made it a global super power.

To Trump, though, it’s getting in the way of turning the world into spheres of influence in which the US, Russia, and China carve up the planet. That’s also, by the way, Putin’s vision. “I believe, sadly, (that) Russian narratives are prevailing in the US," said Zelensky at the weekend in an interview with CBS. “How is it possible to witness our losses and our suffering, to understand what the Russians are doing, and to still believe that they are not the aggressors, that they did not start this war? This speaks to the enormous influence of Russia's information policy on America, on US politics and US politicians.”

That may cost him dearly. When Trump ranted at Zelensky in March during the Ukrainian president’s official visit to the Oval Office, Trump reiterated how deeply loyal he felt to Putin because the Russian president had been accused of backing his candidacy in 2016. “Let me tell ya, Putin went through a hell of a lot with me – we went through a phony witch hunt when they used him and Russia, Russia, Russia, Russia,” Trump raged, as he got increasingly incoherent during the White House attack on Zelensky. “That was a phony Hunter Biden, Joe Biden scam. Hillary Clinton, shifty Adam Schiff, it was a Democrat scam. And [Putin] had to go through that. And he did go through it. We didn‘t end up in a war. And he went through it.” This gobbledygook makes little sense. It does, however, reveal the depth of his feelings for Putin who, at least since 2016, he has seen as sharing a trench with The Donald in the wider campaign to undermine the American oligarch.

Trump soon suspended military aid and then intelligence sharing with Kyiv after the Oval Office row, which coincided with Putin’s campaign to free the Kursk region captured by Ukraine in Russia last year. Trump has turned America’s system of alliances with the west upside down and inside out. His evisceration of America’s security establishment with ideological purges, attacks on the US judiciary, federal bureaucracy, education system and the Constitution itself have been combined with a wholesale trashing of Washington’s soft power and humanitarian operations. This all serves the interests of the Kremlin. It’s Making Moscow Great Again.

A former KGB chief, Putin has reinforced his relationship with Trump by stroking his vanity. He’s relentless in his cultivation of the US president. In his most recent effort he sent a portrait of the US president painted in Russia to the White House in the care of Steve Witkoff, Trump’s chief Ukraine negotiator. Witkoff said his boss thought he painting was “beautiful”.

The bad news is that Trump’s narcissism is Russia’s greatest strategic asset.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...raine-russia-zelensky-blame-war-b2733530.html

Note to the Intelligence team: Dismantle the painting and look for bugs and don't for sure hang it anywhere secrets are discussed. [It might have Russian laser beams from Italian satellites lip reading the contents of those discussions. Reminds me of the Russian 'offering' in the US embassy that was found to be bugged.

 

[ChloeTzang]

The view from Ukraine......

 

[ChloeTzang]

Ukraine clearly communicated their red lines to the US negogiating team. Witkoff ignored these and the US is apparently proposing Russia keeps Crimea. Ukraine has responded.....

So whaever proposal reiteratig Putin's demands that Trump's team has put together is pretty much dead in the water before it starts - as expected, because the US has essentially just formalized Putin's initial demands

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Ukraine clearly communicated their red lines to the US negogiating team. Witkoff ignored these and the US is apparently proposing Russia keeps Crimea. Ukraine has responded.....

So whaever proposal reiteratig Putin's demands that Trump's team has put together is pretty much dead in the water before it starts - as expected, because the US has essentially just formalized Putin's initial demands

View attachment 2530670

Zelenskyy should offer to sell the Crimea to Trump. It's a much nicer place to build his resorts than Gaza.

 

[PersonalFavors]

Zelenskyy should offer to sell the Crimea to Trump. It's a much nicer place to build his resorts than Gaza.

Obama already gave it to Putin.

 

[Politruk]

Obama already gave it to Putin.

Only in the sense that he did not start a war over Crimea.

Of course not. Like there could ever be a Crimean War! The very idea!

 

[Lazaran]

Obama already gave it to Putin.

Shrub Bush saddled President Obama with a collapsed economy, Iraq, AND Afghanistan (and the task of eliminating Osama bin Laden.)

Starting a war with Russia over Crimea at that point in time was a yuuuuuge ask for our economy, our military, and our alliances.

President Obama getting out of the economic collapse (and eliminating Osama bin Laden), and President Biden getting us out of Afghanistan, allowed for a renewed focus on Ukraine, etc.

Hope that ^ helps.





Also:

We. Told. Them. So.

 

[ChloeTzang]

A major meeting in London aimed at bringing about an end to Russia’s war in Ukraine has been downgraded after US Secretary of State Marco Rubio said he would skip the summit, escalating a clash between Washington and Kyiv over the future of Russian-occupied Crimea. Rubio had been expected to take part in the discussions with Ukrainian, UK and European officials, but State Department spokesperson Tammy Bruce said Tuesday that he would no longer attend due to “logistical issues.” London’s Foreign Office then confirmed on Wednesday that the meeting had been postponed. “Official level talks will continue but these are closed to media,” the department said in a message to journalists. And US Vice President JD Vance, during a visit to India on Wednesday, told reporters: “We’ve issued a very explicit proposal to both the Russians and Ukrainians, and it’s time for them to either say yes or for the US to walk away from this process. We’ve engaged in an extraordinary amount of diplomacy, of on the ground work.” President Donald Trump’s special envoy for Ukraine and Russia, Keith Kellogg, will represent the US in London instead, Bruce said. The talks follow a meeting in Paris last week in which officials from the US, the United Kingdom, France and Germany discussed a US framework for a ceasefire. The proposal includes recognizing Russia’s control of Crimea, the southern Ukrainian peninsula illegally annexed by Moscow in 2014, an official familiar with the framework told CNN. It would also put a ceasefire in place along the front lines of the war, the official said.

Ukraine’s President Volodymyr Zelensky made clear Tuesday that he was open to talks with Russia, but that Kyiv would not accept a deal that recognizes Moscow’s control of Crimea. “Ukraine will not legally recognize the occupation of Crimea,” he told reporters. “There is nothing to talk about. It is against our constitution.” Rubio said in a post on X that he had a “productive conversation” with British Foreign Secretary David Lammy, who is hosting Wednesday’s meeting, and that he “(looks) forward to following up” with the United Kingdom and Ukraine at a later point.

In other words, the Trump Administration's "explicit proposal," which merely reiterates Putin's demands, is dead on arrival. The USA is not mediating. They gave the farm away up front and are trying too force the surrender that Russia wants in the illusory hope of financial gains from Russia and predatory access to Ukrainian resources. When you look at what's laid out, Ukraine seems to be required to give, while Russia is taking. That's not exactly how it works when Ukraine is slowly winning this war. On top of that, the USA includes it's extortion and provides no security guarantees and expliciy excludes NATO membership, menaing Putin can resume his attack as soon as he feels ready, without any risk of US involvement. Trump has positioned this so that if Ukraine declines, he can walk away, drop assistance for Ukraine and lift US sanctions on Russia.

In all honesty, the best thing for Ukraine would be for the US to stop mediating, because they are so openly biased it's a farce that even the EU will be forced to recognize (in the politest possible way). The US has not been this weak internationally for decades. In addition to the fact that they are trying to force Ukraine to give up its sovereign territory (after they forced it to give up its nuclear arsenal in exchange for empty words in the 90s) to the aggressor russia, they are also threatening to withdraw from the negotiations.

Trump does not have that much influence here: most of the sanctions were imposed by Europe, they are (were?) Russia's largest market. In addition, China will not give the US the opportunity to tear russia away given Trump's Trade War on China, although there is an oportunity here for Xi to step in, aligned with the EU and act as a deal-maker (with rather more influence over Russia than Trump has).

And any lifting of US sanctions will not change Russia's international position as an aggressor and terrorist country. This will only strengthen Europe in defense and economic terms, because they will increasingly distance themselves from the US as a strategic partner and guarantor of security. As a result: the US will cease to be of relevance to everyone, they will become largely peripheral to Europe, and the EU and China will increasingly push the USA out of the international political arena, something Xi will relish and which is being assisted by Trump's Trade Wars, which are ensuring the USA no longer her friends.

https://edition.cnn.com/2025/04/23/europe/rubio-russia-ukraine-ceasefire-talks-intl-hnk/index.html

 

[ChloeTzang]

Macron puts an end to illusions: Europe no longer depends on the United States.

Macron is speaking in a way no European leader has since World War II. No euphemisms, no illusions, no hope in Washington. From now on, France sees the reality: the U.S. may no longer be Europe's ally, Russia is preparing for a new war, and the future of the continent depends on its willingness to fight. "Peace cannot be Ukraine's capitulation" — these words from Macron are a final nail in the coffin for those who dream of making deals with the Kremlin. The Minsk Agreements proved: Russia cannot be trusted. The only argument Moscow understands is strength. And France is ready to show it.

Next week, Paris will gather military leaders from countries ready to guarantee peace in Ukraine — not with papers and negotiations, but with actual forces on the ground. Europe is no longer toothless.

This is not just about Ukraine. It’s about a new world order. France has officially brought up nuclear deterrence for the entire continent. Macron is clearly hinting: if Trump’s America abandons Europe, the French nuclear shield will remain. This is unprecedented in modern history. But the most interesting part is yet to come. While Macron prepares the army, another heavyweight is rising in Berlin — Friedrich Merz, the new Chancellor of Germany. Tough, cold, direct. For the first time in decades, Europe has a tandem of leaders who will not hide behind America’s back. Merz came to power just as Trump’s U.S. no longer wants to hold Europe’s hand. And he understands this. “Europe must become independent from America” — this is not just a phrase, it’s a new strategy. He wants to shift the decision-making center in the EU. Paris, Berlin, Warsaw, London — this is now the core of the new order.

Europe will no longer be a continent afraid of its own shadow. It is arming itself, investing in its own security, and preparing for any scenario. And Ukraine in this process is not an object — it is a key ally.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Obama already gave it to Putin.

I agree with you, this whole Russia conquest could have ended if Obama had the balls to enforce his red lines. But I suspect if had, you'd have been the first screaming, "black man bad!!!"

 

[PersonalFavors]

I agree with you, this whole Russia conquest could have ended if Obama had the balls to enforce his red lines. But I suspect if had, you'd have been the first screaming, "black man bad!!!"

Obama is a pussy. He did nothing as there wasn’t anything in it for him except for his VP already on the grift.

 

[ChloeTzang]

“Yes or we’re done.” JD Vance tells Ukraine and Russia to swap land now​

Vice President JD Vance has announced that the US has presented a “very explicit proposal” to Russia and Ukraine aimed at ending the war, which would involve freezing battle lines near their current positions. “The current lines, somewhere close to them, is where you’re ultimately going to draw the new lines in the conflict,” Vance told reporters in India on Wednesday after touring the Taj Mahal. He added that both Ukraine and Russia would need to cede territory they currently control.

This arrangement would require a far greater sacrifice from Ukraine, which has sought to reclaim all territory seized by Russia since 2014, including Crimea and areas taken during the full-scale invasion that began in February 2022. According to previous reports, the US is prepared to recognize Russia’s control over Crimea and ease sanctions on Moscow as part of a potential agreement. However, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy stated on Tuesday that Ukraine would not recognize the Russian occupation of Crimea. “There’s going to have to be some territorial swaps,” Vance said, emphasizing that to stop the fighting, both sides need to “put down their weapons, freeze this thing and get on with the business of actually building a better Russia and a better Ukraine.”

President Donald Trump has warned he’s ready to abandon peace efforts if a deal isn’t reached soon. His envoy, Steven Witkoff, is scheduled to visit Russia later this week after meeting with President Vladimir Putin three times since Trump’s inauguration.

I can't see Trump abandoning his efforts to force Ukrainian capitulation. He's either bought, or credulous enough to swallow Putin's lies without choking, and Witkoff along with him. I'm disappointed by Kellogg and Rubio tho - Kellogg especially, because Rubio's a politician after all, and Trump has bought him. What this does seem to mean though, is that having presented Ukraine with an ultimatum the Trump Administration knows Zelensky cannot accept, Trump will now move to cut all assistrance to Ukraine, walk away, and lift sanctions from Russia, whilst also encouraging Putin to make a move on the Baltic States.

Peace in our time, indeed, says Neville Trump.

https://euromaidanpress.com/2025/04/23/vance-ukraine-and-russia-must-make-land-swaps-to-end-war/

 

[ChloeTzang]

Zelensky Dodged an American Ambush in London

President Volodymyr Zelensky knows an ambush when he sees one. Having previously been ambushed in the Oval Office and eviscerated by Donald Trump and JD Vance, he has avoided an enfilade from a crack team of American diplomats in the London kill zone by not turning up at all. Tipped off that his intended target was not going to wander into his sights, the US team leader, secretary of state Marco Rubio, called off the operation altogether and stayed in Washington along with Steve Witkoff, Trump’s envoy to Vladimir Putin. Keith Kellogg, Trump’s envoy to Ukraine, who was already in London, has been left to obderve while foreign secretary David Lammy meets with the Ukrainian foreign minister for much-downgraded “talks”. At least the British hosts were not saddled with what could have been a historic mess in which Zelensky was presented with a US-Russian ultimatum and then painted as a rejectionist warmonger when he said “Nemaye” (no).

Rubio has signalled that the US is prepared to walk away from brokering peace talks if there is no breakthrough in negotiations about a “ceasefire”. Ukraine would have been told to freeze Russian control of the east of the country. Zelensky would have been further asked (or told) to recognise the Kremlin’s de facto rule over Crimea, to agree that Ukraine can never join Nato, and generally to roll meekly under Putin’s tank tracks. Zelensky cannot negotiate away Ukrainian territory, even if he were to fold to US pressure. Ukraine’s constitution forbids it. Membership of Nato is an objective enshrined in the same document. His response to the latest US idea was straightforward. “There is nothing to talk about – it is our land, the land of the Ukrainian people.”

Lammy, who had described the London talks as coming at a “critical point”, did his best to spin the latest breakdown by saying: “The UK is working with the US, Ukraine and Europe to put an end to Putin’s illegal invasion.” But he knows deep down that Trump and his men do not believe that Russia has illegally invaded Ukraine. They have all variously pinned the blame for the 2014 and 2022 assaults on Ukraine’s Nato ambitions and Europe’s creeping “conquest” of former Soviet-bloc colonies in Eastern Europe.
Trump sees Ukraine much like Putin does (though without the sentimental attachment to a Russian imperial fantasy) – as a vast resource of minerals to feed American industrial profit like a Thanksgiving turkey. Putin wants Ukraine’s stuff, too, and its people can go hang – literally. France and Germany were also planning to send their foreign ministers and security advisers for Wednesday’s summit. They’re not going now, because Ukraine isn’t walking into the ambush and won’t need rescuing.

Who'd have thought the USA would turn out to be just as much a threat to Ukraine as Russia. Ukraine now has to fight Russia while also keeping an eye out for a knife in the back from the Trump Administration, who are fast turning themselves into an enemy of Europe and of Western Civilization.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-zelensky-trump-ceasefire-putin-b2737840.html