For Those Who Might Be Wondering Why We Might Be In Ukraine

[ChloeTzang]

Another one - Denmark allocates $280 mln for ammunition for Ukraine, military training. "The money will go, in particular, to ammunition for Ukrainian soldiers and the creation of a Ukrainian brigade together with the countries of Northern Europe and the Baltics," the message reads.

https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/1050567.html

 

[ChloeTzang]

Ukraine Developing Patriot-Inspired Air Defense System​

Ukraine has been heavily reliant on military aid from Western nations, particularly the U.S., to keep up its supplies of air defense systems and the vital interceptor missiles. Even with waves of military aid packages, Ukraine's stocks of missiles have sometimes fallen short of what is needed to shield important sites and cities. With Trump's taking the reins, and his attitude towards Ukraine, Ukraine's access to military aid flowing from Washington is in doubt. If Ukraine develops its own air defense system, this would ease Kyiv's independence on the likes of the U.S. for the protection of its population centers and vital infrastructure.

Ukraine is developing its own air defence system with capabilities equivalent to the American Patriot system, Ukrainian Commander-in-Chief Oleksandr Syrskyi has said. The Ukrainian army chief said it was crucial for Kyiv to produce its own defenses now that Russia is using new weapons against Ukraine, like the experimental Oreshnik intermediate-range ballistic missile Moscow fired at a Ukrainian military facility in November. Umerov said in a separate statement this month that the U.K. will fund Ukraine's production of air defense systems and long-range weapons. "...I suppose that this installation may not be a replica, but in terms of its certain characteristics, a little simpler than the Patriot, because we understand that Americans have invested billions of dollars for so many years. Of course, we can copy. Yes, it may look a little funny, but it should work. If after the war there is such a capacity to provide every city, every settlement, military location with such installations, then of course, this should be emphasized,"

https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-patriot-style-air-defenses-russia-oreshnik-irbm-2017594

 

[ll74]

I follow your post quite closely. The Russians are building up their war machine. The interior politics in Russia is if any Russian citizens complains about the invasion into Ukraine its viewed as breaking the law, and we all know what happens in Russia when ya complain. I'm not looking for an argument but there needs to be a conversation, a plan as what does the West do if Russia overruns Ukraine. What happens then. Does the west put boots on the ground? Biden's feckless foreign policy has made the situation unattainable. Failure to give the Ukrainians every weapon system at the very beginning has given the Russians the ability to re-arm. Biden never took the advantage we had it. He did the same thing to Israel, fortunately Israel had the foresight to take matters in their own hand and fight their was their way.

Just maybe, creating an economic mining agreement for precious metals and other trade pacts with Ukraine may PROVIDE an equivalent to a NATO umbrella where American industry will be firmly planted on Ukraine soil.

Trump saying that Ukraine started the was was stupid, and I believe Trump knows that too. Trump's been pretty tough on Putin in the past and I don't believe he'll accept a capitulation. I also read that the Europeans gave financial and military assistance to Ukraine in the form of loans, the US just gave it without any return on investment.

"Trump says things and I believe him"

¯⁠\⁠(⁠°⁠_⁠o⁠)⁠/⁠¯

Trump parrots Putin.

Zelensky was the originator of the mineral deal.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Witkoff going delusional.....I'm not at all sure how he can say the US is close to a peace agreement without Ukrainian involvement....

 

[RobDownSouth]

"Trump says things and I believe him"

¯⁠\⁠(⁠°⁠_⁠o⁠)⁠/⁠¯

Trump parrots Putin.

Zelensky was the originator of the mineral deal.

In a perfect world, they'd carve that mantra on his tombstone when ICantHelpIt shuffles off the mortal coil.

Here Lies ICanHelp
Trump Said Things
He Believed Him​

Come to think of it, they ought to carve that onto everyone who did not get vaxxed and subsequently died of Covid-19

 

[ChloeTzang]

Zelensky was the originator of the mineral deal.

Yes, he saw it as a way to give the US a vested interest to have boots on the ground. He failed to account for Trump's lack of ethics and his transactional approach.

 

[icanhelp1]

I'm not sure of all the ins and outs of loans vs grants but I think the EU funding has largely been grants and internal funding between EU countries buying stuff from each other to send to Ukraine - the Czech ammo initiative being one example. US investment would be great, but not based on extortion the way Trump has been attempting.

I think what we see now is Ukraine going from strength to strength, not least of which is now their huge edge in drone warfare. THAT started out very ad-hoc, with small drone teams pretty much self-created and funded by Ukrainian Army units - and that was formalized. It's going beyond that now - they created "drone battalions" which work with the front line ZSU battalions and brigades, and now they are expanding these into Drone Brigades - and with hundreds of startups all innovating and working together - I read somewhere they expect to produce 4 million drones in 2025 now, and it may go beyond that. The last couple of attacks they have launched, for example, have been precded and accompanied by huge waves of drones and they are getting more and more capable. Those flamer-drones that use 3000F magnesium or something that melts thru tanks and does horrific things to Russians. Drones with machineguns for trench clearing, not to mention all the FPV drones taking out one Russian at a time. Casualty evac drones, Resupply drones. Drones laying mines....you name it, Ukraine has them and to a certain extent they are superceding artillery - and that is about all Ukraine is now reliant on the US for - artillery ammo and air defence - and Ukraine is apparantly working on a Patriot analog, Which WILL be very battle tested.

That, and the ZSU is getting more armor and equipment constantly. This is building up the strength of their combat unit - and the manpower, organizational and training issues are sorting themselves out even as the Russians continue to be thrown in with no training. Kursk for example - the ZSU is slaughterimg Russians and makimg opportunistic advances. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they do this again in Bryansk, pulling troops away from the Donbass and Kherson. And at some stage, that Bridge is gonna go boom-badda-boom and Crimea will be isolated......

I don't see any chance of Russia actually overrruning Ukraine at all here. And with the scale of this war, EU boots on the ground would be next to useless. The only armies big enough are Poland and Finland, and neither of those will go in.

I wouldn't call it extortion. A return on investment for the American people. 37 trillion in debt.

The 1994 agreement crashed and burned during the Bush, Obama days. I find it difficult to hold Trump to that standard when they didn't.

In my humble opinion it's not about weapon systems, it's about the 4 to 1 advantage the Russians have in manpower today and future deployments. N Korea as well as China figure's into this equation. Ukrainians are fighting a brilliant war but to what end. People are dying by the thousands. No country wants to put boots on the ground but are willing to fight a proxy war up to the last Ukrainian. Need Putin and Zelensky to talk but a foundation for talks need to happen. More weapons and more money is not the answer. There needs to be a give and takes. We can hope someone takes out Putin.

 

[icanhelp1]

In a perfect world, they'd carve that mantra on his tombstone when ICantHelpIt shuffles off the mortal coil.

Here Lies ICanHelp
Trump Said Things
He Believed Him​

Come to think of it, they ought to carve that onto everyone who did not get vaxxed and subsequently died of Covid-19

In a perfect world you'd pull your head out of your ass!!

 

[icanhelp1]

"Trump says things and I believe him"

¯⁠\⁠(⁠°⁠_⁠o⁠)⁠/⁠¯

Trump parrots Putin.

Zelensky was the originator of the mineral deal.

Hey dipshit, what's your solution? You don't have one!!! Biden fucked up Afghanistan, tried to fuck up Israel and has definitely fucked up Ukraine. All those fuckups stem from Biden's feckless foreign policy. I didn't defend Trump dipshit, I wrote that Trump fucked up blaming Zelensky for starting the war. What pisses me of is you just refuse to stop licking Biden's ass. The initiative for an outright win has passed, time to talk. Did Biden attempt to talk? The only talk from Biden's mouth was maybe it's only a minor incursion, and how'd that work out.

2 1/2 years ago I wrote "in for the penny in for the pound". Either get all in or get out. Biden dragged his feet at the worst possible time. Shit his pants when Putin threatened nukes. Biden didn't want to escalate the war while the Russians invaded with hundreds of thousands of troops. Putin was already escalating and Biden was napping. I remember in the beginning, mile long columns stranded mostly because of Putin's arrogance. Ukraine's best chance was then. Taking out those columns then! Europeans were also napping. How long did it take Germany to send tanks.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Germany is on the case now....

 

[ChloeTzang]

In my humble opinion it's not about weapon systems, it's about the 4 to 1 advantage the Russians have in manpower today and future deployments. N Korea as well as China figure's into this equation. Ukrainians are fighting a brilliant war but to what end. People are dying by the thousands. No country wants to put boots on the ground but are willing to fight a proxy war up to the last Ukrainian. Need Putin and Zelensky to talk but a foundation for talks need to happen. More weapons and more money is not the answer. There needs to be a give and takes. We can hope someone takes out Putin.

The 4:1 "advantage" means very little. Ukraine is now inflicting losses at 10:1 and it's improving. Also, while Ukraine has had mobilization and training issues, those are being worked on and resolved and the ZSU is gaining in #'s, and also becoming more effective with those trainng improvements and reorg into a corps structure. Not there yet, but they are on the right path, and as they get more IFV's and armor that will only improve. Note also the ZSU is now regularly flying air strikes on Russian front line units - as Russian air defences are teadily degraded, we will see more of these. Note also, the graph below. The numbers are worsening for Russia, and as mentioned above somewjere, 100k fewer men are available to mobilize overo 2025. The bell curve for Russia has hit its peak and its down all the way.

Also also - donkey based logistics....need I say more.

Also, Russian artillery is increasingly inaccurate. Poor training, and Nork ammo. Both help, and a miss is a miss is a miss. It makes a loud noise, that's all.

Add in Ukraine is taking out Russia's European oil infratsructure - with consequent drops in foreign exchange. The Russian economy is teetering on the edge of collapse...

Now lets throw in constantly improving Ukrainian drone and light crusise missile capability....those hits are getting better and more accurate. Now, think about a few things here, and these are possibilities. Ukraine has a lot of data on things like Russian pilots - including home addresses. Probably could do the same with military industruial workers. Drone bomg their houses at 1am when they're no working and home in bed - take the workers and pilots out and who will do the work or fly the planes? Do it in one massive strike - a couple of thousand drones targeting one factory or squadron - THAT would have an effect. And save on the war crime trials too.

As for people dying by the thousands? That's Russian soldiers doing that, and THAT is good. The tens of thousands would be better, and far more effective at ending the war

 

[ChloeTzang]

Also
Sweden - 1.8 billion
Denmark - 280 million
Norway - military assistance €2 billion
Norway - €1 billion in humanitarian support.

 

[ChloeTzang]

 

[ChloeTzang]

No wonder Russia needs Trump to surrender Ukraine, Russia isn’t going to last much longer. It doesn’t look good for Russia, between their crippled economy, loss of soldiers, and their ever evaporating Soviet stockpiles.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Yes, he saw it as a way to give the US a vested interest to have boots on the ground. He failed to account for Trump's lack of ethics and his transactional approach.

And you're just understand that now???????????

Fucking idiot........

 

[Rightguide]

I don't see any chance of Russia actually overrruning Ukraine at all here. And with the scale of this war, EU boots on the ground would be next to useless. The only armies big enough are Poland and Finland, and neither of those will go in.

I don't think that was ever the intention as the Russian army isn't large enough to move beyond the Dnieper River. Ukraine is simply to big.

 

[DeluxAuto]

The felon officially aligns the US himself with Putin Russia.

 

[Rightguide]

The First Draft of the Ukraine War’s History​

Washington’s policy-makers showed themselves more wicked and feckless than their Vietnam- and Iraq-era predecessors.
Featured in the February 2025 issue

Scott McConnell
Feb 19, 202512:12 PM

Provoked is a monumental work, an essential guide to understanding how the United States and Russia came to face off in an horrific bloodletting on Russia’s border a generation after the Soviet Union abandoned communism. Scott Horton seems to have read every published English-language source bearing on the deterioration of Washington’s relationship with Moscow, and has produced an acerbic, polemical, factually dense first draft of history.

His book is long (more than 1,200 pages in the Kindle edition), and would have benefited from forceful editing. He could have pinpointed more emphatically critical tipping points. Assuming there are diplomatic historians in decades to come, those with access to classified governmental records will produce more comprehensive and nuanced accounts. Still, Provoked is a book America needs now—for its scathing portrayal of a bipartisan Washington establishment that propelled the march towards a war which has wrecked Ukraine and resulted in an estimated million military casualties on both sides.

There are many threads leading to the collapse of the mutual good feelings that American and Russian leaders entertained for several years after the Soviet Union began to disband the Warsaw Pact in 1989. Horton relates how the U.S. and NATO threw military weight around in the Balkans (its military intervention against Serbia over its province of Kosovo exposed the hypocrisy of Washington’s professed respect for the sanctity of borders), supported radical Muslim Chechen rebels within Russia, and gave financial and political backing to various “color revolutions” in the former Soviet states, most with the unveiled intention of spreading regime-change “democracy” in the Russian Federation itself.

The strong continuous thread running through the entirety of Horton’s narrative is Washington’s insistence that NATO expand into the states of former Soviet empire and keep expanding, despite consistent warnings from Russian diplomats, European leaders, and the crème de la crème of American regional and foreign policy experts that such expansion would lead inevitably to conflict. NATO expansion was not the policy of “the best and the brightest”—David Halberstam’s sardonic phrase for the elites who led America into Vietnam. In this case the best and the brightest were divided, but predominantly opposed.

Much more here: https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-first-draft-of-the-ukraine-wars-history/

 

[ll74]

Hey dipshit, what's your solution? You don't have one!!!

I never have said that i did, dipshit. What I've said is that Ukraine is our ally and they are needed at the negotiating table.
Unless they are any solution is horseshit.

Biden fucked up Afghanistan, tried to fuck up Israel and has definitely fucked up Ukraine.

Irrelevant

All those fuckups stem from Biden's feckless foreign policy. I didn't defend Trump dipshit, I wrote that Trump fucked up blaming Zelensky for starting the war. What pisses me of is you just refuse to stop licking Biden's ass. The initiative for an outright win has passed, time to talk. Did Biden attempt to talk? The only talk from Biden's mouth was maybe it's only a minor incursion, and how'd that work out.

Quit complaining about Biden.

2 1/2 years ago I wrote "in for the penny in for the pound". Either get all in or get out. Biden dragged his feet at the worst possible time. Shit his pants when Putin threatened nukes. Biden didn't want to escalate the war while the Russians invaded with hundreds of thousands of troops. Putin was already escalating and Biden was napping. I remember in the beginning, mile long columns stranded mostly because of Putin's arrogance. Ukraine's best chance was then. Taking out those columns then! Europeans were also napping. How long did it take Germany to send tanks.

Your entire schtick is complaints about Biden.
Fuck off.
The Russian invasion of Ukraine is ongoing. Biden is no longer the President.
47 is capitulating to Russia.

Stop discussing Biden and comment on the actual present day.

 

[Lazaran]

The felon officially aligns the US himself with Putin Russia.

View attachment 2501496

But, nooooo, DonOld isn’t Putin’s puppet and doesn’t collude with Putin and the Russians…





We. Told. Them. So.

 

[Lazaran]

The First Draft of the Ukraine War’s History​

Washington’s policy-makers showed themselves more wicked and feckless than their Vietnam- and Iraq-era predecessors.
Featured in the February 2025 issue

Scott McConnell
Feb 19, 202512:12 PM

Provoked is a monumental work, an essential guide to understanding how the United States and Russia came to face off in an horrific bloodletting on Russia’s border a generation after the Soviet Union abandoned communism. Scott Horton seems to have read every published English-language source bearing on the deterioration of Washington’s relationship with Moscow, and has produced an acerbic, polemical, factually dense first draft of history.

His book is long (more than 1,200 pages in the Kindle edition), and would have benefited from forceful editing. He could have pinpointed more emphatically critical tipping points. Assuming there are diplomatic historians in decades to come, those with access to classified governmental records will produce more comprehensive and nuanced accounts. Still, Provoked is a book America needs now—for its scathing portrayal of a bipartisan Washington establishment that propelled the march towards a war which has wrecked Ukraine and resulted in an estimated million military casualties on both sides.

There are many threads leading to the collapse of the mutual good feelings that American and Russian leaders entertained for several years after the Soviet Union began to disband the Warsaw Pact in 1989. Horton relates how the U.S. and NATO threw military weight around in the Balkans (its military intervention against Serbia over its province of Kosovo exposed the hypocrisy of Washington’s professed respect for the sanctity of borders), supported radical Muslim Chechen rebels within Russia, and gave financial and political backing to various “color revolutions” in the former Soviet states, most with the unveiled intention of spreading regime-change “democracy” in the Russian Federation itself.

The strong continuous thread running through the entirety of Horton’s narrative is Washington’s insistence that NATO expand into the states of former Soviet empire and keep expanding, despite consistent warnings from Russian diplomats, European leaders, and the crème de la crème of American regional and foreign policy experts that such expansion would lead inevitably to conflict. NATO expansion was not the policy of “the best and the brightest”—David Halberstam’s sardonic phrase for the elites who led America into Vietnam. In this case the best and the brightest were divided, but predominantly opposed.

Much more here: https://www.theamericanconservative.com/the-first-draft-of-the-ukraine-wars-history/

Putin and Russia thank Russiaguide for their aid and comfort in propagating Putin’s and Russia’s propaganda.



Russiaguide is a traitorous POS.



JFC

Sad!!!

 

[ChloeTzang]

Norway Allocates €300 Million to Buy Weapons from Ukraine’s Defense Industry​

The Norwegian government will allocate NOK 3.5 billion (€300 million) for the purchase of military equipment for Ukraine from the Ukrainian defense industry. In addition, Norway is allocating an additional NOK 600 million (€51.5 million) for the purchase of various types of drones and financing the development of unmanned technologies for the Armed Forces of Ukraine. “By purchasing military equipment directly from Ukraine, we are helping to increase the country’s production capacity, which is an important component of our military support,” Jonas Gahr Støresaid. In total, in 2025, the Norwegian government plans to provide Ukraine with military assistance worth about €2 billion and about €1 billion in humanitarian support.

https://mil.in.ua/en/news/norway-al...-buy-weapons-from-ukraine-s-defense-industry/

 

[icanhelp1]

View attachment 2501351

Also
Sweden - 1.8 billion
Denmark - 280 million
Norway - €300 Million

I can’t verify these numbers but;

Congress appropriated $174.2 billion through the five Ukraine supplemental appropriation acts enacted FY 2022 through FY 2024, of which $163.6 billion was allocated for OAR and the Ukraine response, and $10.6 billion was allocated for other, primarily humanitarian, purposes.

I understand your concern for Ukraine but it’s not fair to minimize what the American people have already contributed to the Ukraine cause and did not get a penny back. These app bills were sanctioned by both Dems and pubs.

Trump is still committed to Ukraine sovereignty.

The backstop will be the U.S.

 

[Rightguide]

I never have said that i did, dipshit. What I've said is that Ukraine is our ally and they are needed at the negotiating table.
Unless they are any solution is horseshit.


Irrelevant


Quit complaining about Biden.


Your entire schtick is complaints about Biden.
Fuck off.
The Russian invasion of Ukraine is ongoing. Biden is no longer the President.
47 is capitulating to Russia.

Stop discussing Biden and comment on the actual present day.

Here, once again, 1174 proves himself to be selective reality enthusiast and a Loyal disciple of ignorance.

 

[icanhelp1]

Here, once again, 1174 proves himself to be selective reality enthusiast and a Loyal disciple of ignorance.

It’s the *don’t look behind the curtain* or you’ll see Bush, Obama and Biden. But it’s all Trump’s fault. If Trump cured cancer democrats would chastise him for putting oncologist out of work.