Yet Another Category Question

[madelinemasoch]

In my relative silence, I've been catching ideas. I have one idea budding in my mind like a pair of HRT breasts that I would like to share and field out with you. It involves a group of "boys" getting together, some of them full time dressers as women, some of them in need of feminization and community with like-minded others, and some of them even taking estrogen and testosterone blockers. They're all feminine. There's some sexual things that go on between them, especially the exposure of all of their genitalia, all at once. This exposure and the dialogue concerning it is more the central sexual piece of the story than the oral (and maybe even anal?) sex and masturbation that goes on between them. All of them are white, and that plays a role in the eroticism of the story as well, as they all share BNWO (Black New World Order) ideology. They're essentially deriving erotic enjoyment from their own self-perceived weakness, humiliation, feminization, exposure, and togetherness as "whitebois."

While I won't be publishing again for quite some time, if at all, I'm wondering which category this will/would fit into. Before anyone suggests, I want to avoid the Fetish category for all future endeavors. I had a bad experience where I put a chapter of a previous story into Fetish and it barely got any attention compared to my previous BDSM work. I'm convinced the category gets no play, so to speak. I'm also reticent to label these goings-on as a fetish, as it's more than that to me and to the characters involved, and that category feels like slapping the label of "this is a fetish" onto the contents of any given work. I don't want to do that; it feels like a disservice. I also have theoretical disagreements with the labeling of things as "fetishes" in general. I prefer the term "erotic form" as it describes an arrangement between people, actions, roles, and ideas, which I find truly produces the eroticism in any given scene, as opposed to a "fetishized" object like a whip or a coat of fur. Erotic form also implies an entire style and tone, while the term fetish does not. In my work, at least, I find this conceptual framework applies much better, especially when I include things that are explicitly not my fetish in my work. For example, including foot worship in a scene doesn't indicate that I have a foot fetish; the eroticism is derived not from the feet as object but from the relation the action reinforces between the characters: worshiper and worshiped, submissive and dominant.

I feel like avoiding the Gay Male category for this, as well, as it's more of a story that explores genderbending than one that explores homosexuality. Femininity does not equal gayness, contrary to the beliefs of your average high school bully. Also, these whitebois to varying degrees do still prefer women to men in terms of their relationships and attraction, and as I've already stated, the sex acts are less the centerpiece here than the mutual exposure and humiliation as well as the shared togetherness and community within that scope. I think GM would do both the story and the normal readers of that category a disservice.

The Trans category kinda seems like the obvious choice, but I haven't decided on pronouns usage yet, and the use of the term "whitebois" might be considered offensive in that category(?) I'm not entirely sure about it. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[Bramblethorn]

All of them are white, and that plays a role in the eroticism of the story as well, as they all share BNWO (Black New World Order) ideology. They're essentially deriving erotic enjoyment from their own self-perceived weakness, humiliation, feminization, exposure, and togetherness as "whitebois."
...

The Trans category kinda seems like the obvious choice, but I haven't decided on pronouns usage yet, and the use of the term "whitebois" might be considered offensive in that category(?) I'm not entirely sure about it. Any advice would be appreciated.

The BNWO element is going to be offensive to some people no matter what terminology you use around it and no matter what category. It would surprise me if "whitebois" were to offend a reader who was otherwise cool with that theme.

Trans/CD is a tricky category because it's the home for several very different types of stories. Realistic trans male/trans female/nonbinary stories, fetishy chaser stuff that a lot of trans people find icky, cross-dressers, and things that are some complicated blurring of those, all of them go there even though they might not have much in common. It seems like the most obvious category for this kind of story but letting readers know up front what sort of story you're telling might help reduce frictions.

 

[madelinemasoch]

The BNWO element is going to be offensive to some people no matter what terminology you use around it and no matter what category. It would surprise me if "whitebois" were to offend a reader who was otherwise cool with that theme.

Trans/CD is a tricky category because it's the home for several very different types of stories. Realistic trans male/trans female/nonbinary stories, fetishy chaser stuff that a lot of trans people find icky, cross-dressers, and things that are some complicated blurring of those, all of them go there even though they might not have much in common. It seems like the most obvious category for this kind of story but letting readers know up front what sort of story you're telling might help reduce frictions.

I think that's true. The title is going to be "Whiteboi Clitty Party" or something like that, so it should be very apparent what readers will be getting into.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

It's a story that will attract a very small subset of readers, no matter how good it is or where you put it. I would guess those readers are most likely to use tags, but otherwise to find it in Fetish. If you get the tags right, people will keep finding it over time.

I'd go to Lit's tag search and test what tags come up with the most similar stories, then use ten of those.

 

[nice90sguy]

I recently played a femdom-game called "The SUP" which features BNWO, cuckolding and sissification. I had to lookup "BNWO" when I played it. There are a couple of other femdom games featuring this trio of sub fetishes. I guess they're connected. If that guess is right, can someone explain why? Is it just a "black men have big dicks" thing?

The race angle doesn't work for me, nor, I guess will it work for most Brits. I'm light-skinned, and happen to live in a majority black (Catholic/Anglican) neighbourhood. It's class and culture, not race, that is the group-marker in the UK. And black people, particularly working-class black people, are very integrated into British culture, so race isn't much of thing here. A BNWO is as ludicrous to me as a GNWO ("Ginger New World Order").

 

[madelinemasoch]

I recently played a femdom-game called "The SUP" which features BNWO, cuckolding and sissification. I had to lookup "BNWO" when I played it. There are a couple of other femdom games featuring this trio of sub fetishes. I guess they're connected. If that guess is right, can someone explain why? Is it just a "black men have big dicks" thing?

The race angle doesn't work for me, nor, I guess will it work for most Brits. I'm light-skinned, and happen to live in a majority black (Catholic/Anglican) neighbourhood. It's class and culture, not race, that is the group-marker in the UK. And black people, particularly working-class black people, are very integrated into British culture, so race isn't much of thing here. A BNWO is as ludicrous to me as a GNWO ("Ginger New World Order").

When I looked up SUP all I found were Supreme Gameboys.

I'm online friends with a woman who is committed to BNWO and lives in the UK, so you might be surprised. There are a lot of factors like contrast and bringing people together that go into the interracial dynamic, but in specific to white girls and black men, my theory is that it's a libidinal imprint based on real oppression throughout history. That is to say that the reason why it's erotic is because it reverses the traditional hierarchy of white supremacy. Without that history I don't think BNWO would be a thing. Within it, the virility and masculinity of black men is emphasized and put into contrast with the effeminacy and sexual inadequacy of white men, which is also emphasized. I don't know if that explains anything, but I kinda think you either believe in that reality when you see it or you don't.

 

[nice90sguy]

When I looked up SUP all I found were Supreme Gameboys.

https://f95zone.to/threads/the-sup-v0-5-megymonster.171918/

 

[lovecraft68]

In my relative silence, I've been catching ideas. I have one idea budding in my mind like a pair of HRT breasts that I would like to share and field out with you. It involves a group of "boys" getting together, some of them full time dressers as women, some of them in need of feminization and community with like-minded others, and some of them even taking estrogen and testosterone blockers. They're all feminine. There's some sexual things that go on between them, especially the exposure of all of their genitalia, all at once. This exposure and the dialogue concerning it is more the central sexual piece of the story than the oral (and maybe even anal?) sex and masturbation that goes on between them. All of them are white, and that plays a role in the eroticism of the story as well, as they all share BNWO (Black New World Order) ideology. They're essentially deriving erotic enjoyment from their own self-perceived weakness, humiliation, feminization, exposure, and togetherness as "whitebois."

While I won't be publishing again for quite some time, if at all, I'm wondering which category this will/would fit into. Before anyone suggests, I want to avoid the Fetish category for all future endeavors. I had a bad experience where I put a chapter of a previous story into Fetish and it barely got any attention compared to my previous BDSM work. I'm convinced the category gets no play, so to speak. I'm also reticent to label these goings-on as a fetish, as it's more than that to me and to the characters involved, and that category feels like slapping the label of "this is a fetish" onto the contents of any given work. I don't want to do that; it feels like a disservice. I also have theoretical disagreements with the labeling of things as "fetishes" in general. I prefer the term "erotic form" as it describes an arrangement between people, actions, roles, and ideas, which I find truly produces the eroticism in any given scene, as opposed to a "fetishized" object like a whip or a coat of fur. Erotic form also implies an entire style and tone, while the term fetish does not. In my work, at least, I find this conceptual framework applies much better, especially when I include things that are explicitly not my fetish in my work. For example, including foot worship in a scene doesn't indicate that I have a foot fetish; the eroticism is derived not from the feet as object but from the relation the action reinforces between the characters: worshiper and worshiped, submissive and dominant.

I feel like avoiding the Gay Male category for this, as well, as it's more of a story that explores genderbending than one that explores homosexuality. Femininity does not equal gayness, contrary to the beliefs of your average high school bully. Also, these whitebois to varying degrees do still prefer women to men in terms of their relationships and attraction, and as I've already stated, the sex acts are less the centerpiece here than the mutual exposure and humiliation as well as the shared togetherness and community within that scope. I think GM would do both the story and the normal readers of that category a disservice.

The Trans category kinda seems like the obvious choice, but I haven't decided on pronouns usage yet, and the use of the term "whitebois" might be considered offensive in that category(?) I'm not entirely sure about it. Any advice would be appreciated.

Although you want to avoid it, Fetish is the proper place because you have several moving parts here so to speak, and seems the main focus is being sissified and feminized. As for a term being offensive, again that category is far more accepting than most. But the term "whitebois" is far less offensive than the BNWO which is nothing short of pure racism, and racism is not a kink. If you enjoy in fantasy or reality submitting to a black man or woman, that's fine, but the BNWO is no different than white supremacy, and we all know that's evil because modern one sided political ideology tells us that 100 times a day, and only in their ignorant world is the reverse somehow okay.

Like I say about LW-that hatred and violence against women is not a kink- Racism is not a kink and should not be sexualized. That's my opinion of course, but you're asking, so you get the answer.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

The race angle doesn't work for me, nor, I guess will it work for most Brits. I'm light-skinned, and happen to live in a majority black (Catholic/Anglican) neighbourhood. It's class and culture, not race, that is the group-marker in the UK. And black people, particularly working-class black people, are very integrated into British culture, so race isn't much of thing here.

Religion, class and age are; race alone really isn't, but there's obvious overlaps - e.g. Muslims and certain evangelical Christian types are almost never white. In south London the majority ethnic group would be 2nd to 4th generation mixes of black and white, it's that boringly normal. My neighbour said she and her kids and grandchildren ticked six different ethnicity boxes on the census, in one household.

I wrote a story with two characters of mine (white English, white Irish, to use census terms) getting together with two younger guys (mixed black Caribbean/white, black African), but eventually even 'gay interracial' wasn't a relevant tag because the story was way more about age gaps - the race difference was just not a thing.

A BNWO is as ludicrous to me as a GNWO ("Ginger New World Order").

Now that's just perverted and sick!