That didn't take long: Leading Democrat proposes reinstating draft...

moana15 said:
That was his point. And like others have said, it isn't a new point, so don't worry, you're probably safe.

Charlie's argument has always been that war is less likely to be waged if there is a chance that sons and daughters in your constituency might be in it. If the burden of defending the country is fairly distributed, you won't have a scary nut job with power (Bush) sending people into battle for needless, stupid reasons. Even a nut would hopefully consider it more carefully before you know saying shit like "bring it on."

However, as the head nut proves, a draft is no guarantee that the burden gets shared across the country. There are those that can still get out of it easy enough same way they get out of paying their fair share of taxes.
"Burden" or not, no individual owes one minute of their life to another person without actively doing something to incur that debt. As I said earlier, service to one's country is a gift, whether the giver realizes it or not.

Beyond that, most people who have ever been in the military, or are still in it, are of the opinion that they do not want to serve with someone who was coerced into service - or even serve with someone whose heart isn't in it. Indeed, so do a lot of people who haven't been in the military - and rightly so.

As I said, if we need more people in the military, then we should make such service less of a hardship by giving those who serve enough pay and benefits commensurate with their effort and risk.

Saying that forcing people into the military against their will is "social justice" or "fair" is just beyond all logic. Saying it will make us less likely to engage in war is naive and wrong.

The fact that there are at least two posters in this thread who believe this bovine fecal matter just shows that I was right to start the thread in the first place.
 
I bet that a democrat proposed a draft is just eating LT up like acid. :D
 
moana15 said:
That was his point. And like others have said, it isn't a new point, so don't worry, you're probably safe.

Charlie's argument has always been that war is less likely to be waged if there is a chance that sons and daughters in your constituency might be in it. If the burden of defending the country is fairly distributed, you won't have a scary nut job with power (Bush) sending people into battle for needless, stupid reasons. Even a nut would hopefully consider it more carefully before you know saying shit like "bring it on."

However, as the head nut proves, a draft is no guarantee that the burden gets shared across the country. There are those that can still get out of it easy enough same way they get out of paying their fair share of taxes.

Provide historical examples of this.

Ishmael
 
wow, i used to think i knew everything about politics and policy. Then I started working on Capitol Hill.
Some of you, I'm sorry to say, have no idea what political reality is. I suggest an internship. I'm sure there are some republicans looking for help.
 
Moreover, I think the statement that "republicans are brave with other people's children" is just flat wrong and insulting to the point of being egregiously offensive.

I may disagree with their politics, but I know quite a number of people who consider themselves republicans and Bush supporters who have loved ones in Iraq or Afghanistan, and even some who have loved ones there.

My family is rather conservative (I am the black sheep for the most part), and we have several family members who are either overseas serving (voluntarily), and one who may be going soon. One who is in military intelligence (but is a civilian) has volunteered to go and has been several times and has been in active combat zones.

Don't be so free to throw around such insulting assertions without the facts to back it up.
 
bare_pussy said:
wow, i used to think i knew everything about politics and policy. Then I started working on Capitol Hill.
Some of you, I'm sorry to say, have no idea what political reality is. I suggest an internship. I'm sure there are some republicans looking for help.
There are only two forms of life lower than a used car salesman - one is a child molester, the other is a politician.

We need more people skilled in leadership, not more people skilled in politics. :rolleyes: Unfortunately, we get the "leadership" we vote for.
 
bare_pussy said:
wow, i used to think i knew everything about politics and policy. Then I started working on Capitol Hill.
Some of you, I'm sorry to say, have no idea what political reality is. I suggest an internship. I'm sure there are some republicans looking for help.
An internship wit bare_pussy would be a fantasy cum true
 
moana15 said:
There are those that can still get out of it easy enough same way they get out of paying their fair share of taxes.
I always chuckle when I hear this one.
 
bare_pussy said:
wow, i used to think i knew everything about politics and policy. Then I started working on Capitol Hill.
Some of you, I'm sorry to say, have no idea what political reality is. I suggest an internship. I'm sure there are some republicans looking for help.

*chuckle* Lived there and worked there for years. It's not a matter of whether you're dealing with a whore, merely the price. The whores at 14th and G wanted a LOT more money than those at S.

Not so different in the capitol building. Whores are whores. No matter if you call yourself a 'public servant' a 'working girl' or an 'advocate group.' At least the whores are honest and only take revenue from the willing.

Ishmael
 
If you had all the answers, chances are you'd be working on the Hill bringing about the changes.
instead, you'd rather be another complainer thinking there's no one working for the greater good of america. Sorry - I'm a realist and i still believe there are people in Congress who care about average Americans and think the administration is guilty of treason, think that average americans are being shit on and want to help us.
Again, if you have all the cures for society's ills...then you should run for office and fix things. But you cant because you simply have opinions, not real world solutions. I have a coworker like you only she's left wing. All opinion and no real world solutions. useless on both sides of the aisle.
 
bare_pussy said:
If you had all the answers, chances are you'd be working on the Hill bringing about the changes.
instead, you'd rather be another complainer thinking there's no one working for the greater good of america. Sorry - I'm a realist and i still believe there are people in Congress who care about average Americans and think the administration is guilty of treason, think that average americans are being shit on and want to help us.
Again, if you have all the cures for society's ills...then you should run for office and fix things. But you cant because you simply have opinions, not real world solutions. I have a coworker like you only she's left wing. All opinion and no real world solutions. useless on both sides of the aisle.

Why? There is no hope with the whores. It's no longer about the good of the country, it's about who has the 'power.' Those without a mandate, claim one, for no other reason, I suppose, than to justify that which they have already decided to do.

Fortunately, the likes of Rangel and Pelosi have already been repudiated by thier own party. So there is hope yet.

And lest you think I'm just anti-Democrat, I hold NO love for Republicanism either. I'm quite active in a thrid way.

And lest you think I'm not aware of how the bureaucracy works, I was on the staff at Los Alamos before it became a security seive in the name of 'multi-culturalism.' Capiche'? Those of us that put the nation above the concept of 'getting along.'

Those of us that understand that all cultures are NOT created equal. That the 'noble' savage wasn't 'noble', just savage.

Those of us that understand that the moment you promote an inferior culture to your level you have lost. It would be as if Lincoln had said, "Well, the Confederacy is right. Live and let live."

Ishmael
 
bare_pussy said:
If you had all the answers, chances are you'd be working on the Hill bringing about the changes.
instead, you'd rather be another complainer thinking there's no one working for the greater good of america. Sorry - I'm a realist and i still believe there are people in Congress who care about average Americans and think the administration is guilty of treason, think that average americans are being shit on and want to help us.
Again, if you have all the cures for society's ills...then you should run for office and fix things. But you cant because you simply have opinions, not real world solutions. I have a coworker like you only she's left wing. All opinion and no real world solutions. useless on both sides of the aisle.
There are other ways (in some ways better) to work towards a better world than a life in politics.

For one, you can do as I did and serve your country in the military saving people's lives and making their lives safer. I did this for four years, but won't again for a number of reasons (the two main ones being that the service I was in went from being about saving lives to enforcing drug laws, the other because I was not physically fit to serve anymore).

Another way is to educate and convince people that government, while a necessary evil, should be limited, and that in almost all situations they are better off improving the world themselves than relying on others in power to improve it for them when in truth those in power only want more power, not to improve the lives of others.

The battle for power is not centered in Washington DC fighting over politics where deals are made in back rooms with a wink and a nod, where ideals are compromised for more power and the sake of pragmatism by people who consider themselves "realists", it is for the hearts and minds of the people at large. Politicians can't do shit without being voted into office. Agitators on the other hand only have to convince their fellow man that politicians are what every person knows deep in their heart to be true - i.e., as Ish puts it - a whore.
 
Ishmael said:
Fucking forget it LC. How many times have we been down that path? No one knows how to conjugate a sentence anymore.

In Ish's day, whole sentences (not just verbs) were conjugated.
 
Oliver Clozoff said:
In Ish's day, whole sentences (not just verbs) were conjugated.

There ya go Ollie. We dealt in complete thoughts back in those olden days. And knew how to conjugate sentences. Learned it in the 4th grade even.

Ishmael
 
Forget the draft - mandatory 2 year military service for everyone.

That'll make them think twice before they go traipsing after phantom weapons and freedom butter.
 
Mr. Show said:
Forget the draft - mandatory 2 year military service for everyone.

That'll make them think twice before they go traipsing after phantom weapons and freedom butter.

Damn sure will. Nothing like a military coup to cure the nations ills. Ar you fucking stupid?

Ishmael
 
Ishmael said:
There ya go Ollie. We dealt in complete thoughts back in those olden days. And knew how to conjugate sentences. Learned it in the 4th grade even.

I do enjoy a touch of schadenfreude when you deign to criticize youngun' fer their schoolin' then use a word incorrectly.

you da man, Ishy.
 
Two or three years ago, when 90% of idiots supported the war in Iraq, wouldn't it have made sense to reinstate the draft? We need about twice as many soldiers in Iraq as we have there. And almost every retired General is saying we need more. I personally would be opposed to the draft, as my sons would both be of draft age during this idiotic war, but, why not have all of America sacrifice for this? If there had been a shared sacrifice early in the war, such as a war tax and the draft, we wouldn't be pinned down there today.
 
bare_pussy said:
If you had all the answers, chances are you'd be working on the Hill bringing about the changes.
instead, you'd rather be another complainer thinking there's no one working for the greater good of america. Sorry - I'm a realist and i still believe there are people in Congress who care about average Americans and think the administration is guilty of treason, think that average americans are being shit on and want to help us.
Again, if you have all the cures for society's ills...then you should run for office and fix things. But you cant because you simply have opinions, not real world solutions. I have a coworker like you only she's left wing. All opinion and no real world solutions. useless on both sides of the aisle.

I love it when 25 year olds have all the answers in the world.

Really, I do. :D
 
Oliver Clozoff said:
I do enjoy a touch of schadenfreude when you deign to criticize youngun' fer their schoolin' then use a word incorrectly.

you da man, Ishy.

It's a gift Ollie. Or a test. <shrug> Amazing that you were the only one to catch that. Which goes further towards my point than yours sweety.

Ishmael
 
This is much ado abou nothing. Whether this is a genuine proposal or a cynical publicity ploy to score political points, either way it's not viable. It's not gonna get votes from either party.
 
The Heretic said:
<snip> I did this for four years, ...</snip>

Thank you for your dedication and service to our country. I can't tell you how much this means me, and so many others.

When I was military age, I tried to get in the Air Force Academy, but was not physically acceptable. And this was during a time when military service was much out of favor (the late '70s). I regret to this day not having served my country in that way.
 
zipman said:
I love it when 25 year olds have all the answers in the world.

Really, I do. :D
Was this not the case for most of us when we were young and naive?
 
Back
Top