pain pleasure principle

Can anyone help me? I have just finished reading through a couple of other threads on here directed at subs ( & ) and it got me to thinking again about the things that I like.

I have a very low pain threshold in RL but I appear to have a much higher one in BDSM play - or so my partner/top assures me after tightening nipple clamps again and agian.

However I have never taken a spanking/flogging to any extreme, usually it is just a few smacks to 'warm me up' I love the sensations afterwards and the whole thing turns me on enourmously mentally but the actuality after the first 2 or 3 strokes is painful, not massivly painful - otherwise I would say stop but enough that it puts me off asking for it to be continued.
Now however I find myself fantasising about this more and more, when I am aroused my back and buttocks tinge and want to be smacked and caned. From reading it would appear that for many subs there is a 'breaking point' when being flogged/spanked when it goes from painful to pain&pleasure ocmbined. Is this so? because if it is maybe I need to push / be pushed a little harder to get to that point.
Or would I be asking for trouble and it would all end badly - I am very scared about hurting myself and receiving no plesure from it.

A light long flogging will get you warmed up, but there is a point where the intensity has to increase to get you in your zone. As long as you have a cautious and experience Dom/me who is careful about hitting the proper striking points, you should be okay.

Don't worry, just ask for a nice long warmup first. It takes me about 20 minutes to start floating. I'm not sure if that's the norm.

Try it.

If you dont like it,use the safe word.

I personally dont like pain to that extreme,but if you try it and like it then you have opened up a whole new area of your relationship.

My experience is limited, I've been flogged twice and have had only a half dozen spankings, but my reaction was the opposite of yours. Each whack seemed to diminish in the amount that it felt like pain, and increase it is's quotion of pleasure. In fact, with the floggings, it never seemed like pain at all, it felt more like getting a good, rough massage.
My understanding is that pain thresholds increase with sexual arousal. Maybe the nervousness you feel is causing you to not be able to get into an erotic headspace, and keeping you from starting that cycle of arousal/higher threshold?

I've done a little bit of flogging, and I think it should be pointed out that it's not something a person should just jump into without experience. It takes some practice to get the flogger to land where you want, practice that shouldn't be done on another person first. It is possible to do damage depending on the type of flogger and where you're flogging.

But I found the practice well worth it.

Hm.

If you get the musical reference, it's more of an A-B-A situation with me. First few swats or strokes after a little 'warming' are absolutely no fun, then I'm in my 'zone', I'm processing the sensory input as a pure rush, then afterwards, the remaining sting is a little unwelcome.

The only way you may be asking for trouble that I can think of would be risking overdoing it, pushing yourself too far. Or someone who's not too careful doing the "work" on you.

I also have an unusual pain threshold. Paper Cut - searing agony. Broken Pinky - minor annoyance. And when I accidentally tore my knee open (4" laceration, just under the kneecap) I just about howled the ER down while they were cleaning the tear.

It seems to be about state of mind when the sensory input hits.

except for those damn paper cuts.....

petrel...

It is so strange that you brought up this topic tonight as Himself and I were just having a conversation about this very topic this afternoon.

We were talking about how far we had progressed in the last 7 months and He was wondering how far, how much further I could go in relation to the pain which is more about sensation for me.

I am aware of the differences in the sensations, the differences between the flogger and His bare hand, or the wooden spoon or the little paint stirrer that delivers such a sharp sting.

Some of them take me into the space, some bring me out... and it is different from time to time (very confusing at times for Himself).

Today, I don't know how much is too much. If you had asked me 6 months ago, I would have told that we have already gone past what I thought was enough.

Sometimes there is a level of intensity in out play that is beyond all my expectations. It is almost overwhelming.

Are there times when it is an ouchie pain and not the good kind, yes.. but as we grow those ouchies are fewer and fewer...

Thank you all for your responses. I am lucky to have an experienced top as a partner and one who is VERY careful about hurting me or pushing things too far.
Last night we tried out things - I talked at some length about things I had fantasised about - during which we both got very arosed.
After a little while he turned things around a little so that rather than talking things through with my partner I was giving an accurate account to my Dom/Top, and woe betide me if I faltered or left things out. We then moved into scene play and I received several spankigns - harder and more slaps than I have ever experienced before and some fairly heavy duty anal/oral play.
I hit that floating zone and then my headpsace got so intense and fucked that after some play in the bathroom I ended up taking a hot shower and crying gently. Lots of cuddles and kissing to make me feel better helped and then absolutely fabulous sex.
(still squirming slightly this morning from the spanking but feeling great!)

I'd still like to get more input into this area - how have you had your limits/ boundries pushed? what did it feel like?
were you ever scared? did you have to use your safeword?
I have a really simple one for telling him that I want my partner and lover and not the top/dom which I use when things are getting too intense. I simply use his name - I would never call him by name when he is my Dom as it just doesn't feel natural so if I suddenly say 'R - can you hold me' he knows I need a littel 'time out'

touching

.

petrel: For what's it's worth, you're far from alone in this. As cellis, SpectreT and others have mentioned, everyone's threshold is different--and often the same person's threshold is different at different times.

At times, I can take a spanking so intense that it leaves actual bruises--and I want it, egg it on, the whole time. Other times, a solid pinch to my nipple leaves me feeling uncomfortable and wanting tenderness.

Don't feel like you have to simplify yourself or make it make sense all the time. Trust your Dom. Trust your instincts. Above all, trust yourself. If it's right for you, then it's right. Anyone and everyone else in the world can pass any kind of judgement they want on it, but only you can truly know what you need and when you need it, how you want it, and what it can and should do for you.

Thank you Risia & cellis - its good to be reassured that I am not alone in this and that it is perfectly normal to change the way I react to stimuli at different times.

Enjoy inflicting pain?

With such a wide range of experience, tastes, fantasies and obsessions, how can there be any 'standards' for the S/m scene? There are true sadists who get totally aroused at inflicting pain and humiliation. There are two types of recipients, the ones who want to be degraded and those who do not but accidentally get caught up in some pervert's fantasies.

There was a story on Court TV about a guy who stalked women and broke into their houses to rape them. He used a stun gun to subdue them and take them to the basement where he could actually torture them without having to gag them. He apparently enjoyed hearing them scream in pain. He became VERY aroused with the power and control and apparently repeatedly raped the women during a four or five hour torture session. He made them perform oral sex on him over and over getting himself re-aroused by inflicting more pain.

You go from that to some guy who wants feathers rubbed over him while restrained. Quite a spectrum indeed. What about these kids who orgasm while being stramgled? Where do they fit in? What about women who love nipple clamps and guys who love to watch other guys fuck their wives? The pain and humiliation take totally different forms depending on the person.

How can there be any 'standards' for the practice of S/m? Everything seems to dependon the individual case, the sadist and the masochist. I don't see how any set of rules would apply to more than two people.

The most I have done is to give my gf a good spanking followed by a hard fucking. The first time I did it she went crazy because I got turned on by inflicting pain on her ass. After about 10 hard whacks she saw my erection and screamed, "YOU ENJOYED IT...YOU BASTARD!" With that, she submitted to me totally. She literally turned into my slave performing any sex act I desired. After that, every time she did something that she knew I would dislike, SHE would say, "So....I suppose you're going to spank me again"? She was right every time. We both loved it, the domination, the submission/humiliation and the liberated sex. That doesn't even hold a candle to some of the stuff that goes on however.

CarolineOh said:

My experience.....Each whack seemed to diminish in the amount that it felt like pain, and increase it is's quotion of pleasure. In fact, with the floggings...
....that pain thresholds increase with sexual arousal. Maybe the nervousness you feel is causing you to not be able to get into an erotic headspace, and keeping you from starting that cycle of arousal/higher threshold?

Click to expand...

I know very little about the BDSM scene but I have discovered that when my gf gets aroused, she can take a lot of pain that she definitely could never do when not aroused. I pinch her nipples hard (something that would make her scream normally) and she moans in pleasure. Also, there is NO bruising!

When I want an evening of heavy lovemaking, I start by telling her what I am going to have her do. I tell her that when I'm ready, I'll have her sit at my feet ane remove my shoes and smoosh her face against them. I want her to lick them, suck my toes, lick between the toes, the bottom, the heels and to look at me for direction while she's doing it.

Then, I tell her I'll want her to remove my jeans and lick my legs. Starting with the calves, I want her to lick her way up to my knees then my thighs licking inside, around back and up to my ass. On the front, she licks my thighs up to my balls.

Honestly, by that time, her face is red, she is blushing, she is getting aroused just from the words. She hasn't even done anything yet! She goes in and gets the leather restraints...she's ready and willing...in fact....EAGER...LOL!

Another thing I've found is she can't deep throat me when she's not aroused. But when she is sexually excited, she can take it all down with very little gagging. I lube my erection with butter so it goes down easily and thrust it in to my balls are on her chin. She chokes on it if I try to make her take it all without proper foreplay.

Check out pics 7 and 9 to show you how an aroused chick swallows dick.

talk to him about what you heard. explain to him that you want to see if you can find this pain pleasure balance, and that you would like him to spank you harder or for a longer period of time or whatever it is you want at the time. being able to talk about stuff like this is important, and as others have mentioned, if you think its too much then use your safeword.

As I understand it, the techie stuff that is happening as we become horny and relish in pain (for subs) is the release of a chemical called endorphins into the blood stream. This chemical is released upon a trigger from the brain when there is pain (intentional or not) or the anticiapition of sex. It raises the threshold of pain and makes pleasure from what is normally considered painful.

For subs, as with anyone else, unintentional pain is not a desirable thing and is usually avoided. However, once aroused and the endorphins are dispersed through the body, the sub begins to take pleasure in (otherwise) mildly painful experiences. This releases more chemical which in turn raises the threshold. And the cycle loops again. If this is done well by the Dom/me the sub will eventually enter a state commonly known a "flying". (It's wonderful!!! ) It's important to remember that it does take time to disperse the chemical through out the body and take effect. This is why it is important for the Dom/me to increase the pain level gradually.

However, it is when the sub is in this "flying" state that the Dom/me's knowledge (of that sub) is of the utmost importance. In this state the sub precives vertually all pain as pleasure and can therefore sustain real harm. The sub cannot/will not use a safe word because nothing is actually painful. At least not until the scene is over, the endorphins wear off, and the damage is done. Thus, the Dom/me must have enough experience and instintivly know when to stop increasing the pain level. This is experience gained from aproaching scenes gradually so as not to have gone too far by mistake. Surely a scene that didn't go far enough is preferable because there is always another chance to do it better.

Although I've never even come close to experiencing this as a Dom, I'm told that the high from inflicting the pain can be very much the same. The arousal and sadistic infliction of pain will also have a similar affect.

A wonderful discussion on another thread was about picking only 1 of the SSC ideals as food for thought. My thoughts are to use all 3 and have a splendid time playing with partners that do the same. Just my $0.02.

For us, whether Master starts out slow or fast and hard, you hit a certain point where your endorphins rush, pleasure becoming pain. It is letting go and not being afraid. As with anything in the lifestyle this is based in trust. If you don't trust, you won't let go, ergo, you won't fly or the pain become pleasure.

To increase your tolerance of intense stimulation, there are many things you can do. "Ramping up" is a good way to go... you start gently, slowly increasing in intensity to the point where it is almost too intense. Back off a little cruise a while... kick it up a notch, two, three until you almost can't stand it again. Back it down a step... crank it up some more!

You can repeat the process until you really can't stand it, or until your Top gets worn out, or s/he feels they've taken you as far as you can safely go.

I've played a few submissives to the point of repeated orgasms, never once touching their clit or sex... Endorphin rushes can be AWESOME!

*weg*

Evil_Geoff said:

... I've played a few submissives to the point of repeated orgasms, never once touching their clit or sex... Endorphin rushes can be AWESOME!

*weg*

Click to expand...

Reminds me of when I met Shadowsdream.

Sigh...

She can do this really well.

pain/pleasure

[COLOR= Indigo]I have noticed that as time passes and I go from being a newbie to someone with a bit of experience my interest/need/tolerance level has continued to increase. It seems that if I go without for a few weeks growing into months my need/desire gets to the point where it actually feels like a craving.

When I first acknowledged to myself that I needed to be controlled and used/enjoyed by a man with a true understanding about the needs of a submissive woman with a slant in the direction of being a potential greedy masochist! This was a major hurdle for me to accept that I actually enjoyed being spanked/flogged/paddled/caned, tied up, made helpless, had my breasts bound until they turn purple and so sensitive that Him blowing on them makes me shudder, had clamps and cloths pegs put on my breasts and pussy lips....and all those things scare the shit out of me! lol But I love it and need it.

The caveat is...finding a man with the skill needed! One that has the need/desire to have a woman like me as his.

thats the core problem.

But as for this being normal....sure appears so!!

Corkie [/color]