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Old 02-23-2013, 02:31 PM   #1
Sweet_T
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D/s with children in the house

Now that my kids are older (teenagers) I wonder how my D/s relationship with my husband will affect their perspective of relationships. I know D/s is not for everyone and do not instill any of our personal preferences/perceptions about the details/rituals of ours into my sons.

However:

They see me give Him first choice of everything.
They hear Him command me with a simple statement ("door" or "drink" or "shoes") and have for years watched me comply.
They hear Him address me as "girl" or "woman" and see me respond positively.
They see me kneeling at His feet with my head resting on His lap all the time.
They have seen him lead me around with his hand on the back of my neck.

And this is us putting effort into subtlety. I have two main concerns: that someday maybe one of my sons will come across a more dominant "independent" type woman, attempt to pull this stuff off and get punched in the face. OR that they will decide that our relationship is "bad" because he does not treat me as an equal. (One of them already alludes to this.)

Does anyone else have older kids? Just wondering how other people do it. I can't imagine us compromising any more than we already do- it would require an incredible amount of effort...
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:02 PM   #2
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Most of the world conducts their private life in view of the kids. For better or worse.

it might be time for you to have a talk with them. "Me and your dad do things this way *because it pleases us.* and we do not think that everyone else should do it this way. You guys should make up your own minds, and remember-- we have made a choice. We understand each other's minds here."

And then be prepared for some backlash, and smirking because as far as they are concerned, you are having your sex life in front of them.

And yes you sure as hell can "compromise more." If you really wanted to.
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:10 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stella_Omega View Post
Most of the world conducts their private life in view of the kids. For better or worse.

it might be time for you to have a talk with them. "Me and your dad do things this way *because it pleases us.* and we do not think that everyone else should do it this way. You guys should make up your own minds, and remember-- we have made a choice. We understand each other's minds here."

And then be prepared for some backlash, and smirking because as far as they are concerned, you are having your sex life in front of them.

And yes you sure as hell can "compromise more." If you really wanted to.
How is this our sex life in front of them? None of what I listed is sexual. Submission is honor and reverence that projects into all aspects of a D/s relationship, from my experience and sex just happens to be part of "all aspects."
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:25 PM   #4
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your kinks in front of them = your sex life in front of them, especially with vanillas.

having grown up with this, it is less likely to seem strange to your children, but their friends & friends parents may react very differently. Whether they see hints of this while causally visiting your house, or by hearing stories from your kids; their alarm bells my lead to a variety of headaches for you.

If your son tried to lead a stong/ independent woman around by grabbing the back of her neck, getting punched in the face would be the least of his concerns. Without consent; this is assault.
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Old 02-23-2013, 03:42 PM   #5
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Wow, I think we are so set and natural in our roles that I don't even see what I listed as kink by society's definition. I see it as everyday life. 50 years ago, this would have been typical.
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Old 02-23-2013, 04:57 PM   #6
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people now go to jail for things that were 'typical' 50 years ago.

women's rights have come a long way, thank god.
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:01 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
Wow, I think we are so set and natural in our roles that I don't even see what I listed as kink by society's definition. I see it as everyday life. 50 years ago, this would have been typical.
Typical 50 years ago? Uh no.

The things you describe were not typical 50 years ago.

Not judging what you do, that is your business. But that is a false statement.
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:06 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
Wow, I think we are so set and natural in our roles that I don't even see what I listed as kink by society's definition. I see it as everyday life. 50 years ago, this would have been typical.
I would argue it's more an idealized construct of "what was typical 50 years ago".


And yes, from your description, you are teaching your sons that patriarchy is king and women are subservient simply because of their gender. Teen years is a little late to be thinking of the impact [alternative lifestyle] household dynamics have on children, but it is possible to point out other relationships that are just as respectful/healthy/successful, even though they are different. Because yes, if your sons expect women (as a gender) to model your behavior... They may find dating a bit more frustrating than most.
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:24 PM   #9
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My son had a highly jealous and emotionally demanding girlfriend. He had no idea how to handle this, and no matter how I tried to explain to him that her behaviour was somewhat normal, he seemed not to believe me UNTIL I explained to him that I am simply... different. I cited that I do not ever yell or lose my temper, nor do I attempt guilt trips. He realized that even his teachers did these things and decided I was right- that maybe he did have a unique mother...

This has not JUST come up in my mind- but honestly, how much should ANYONE conform to societal norms just for appearances? Should I throw a few emotional tantrums and become a bit of a drama queen and write "honey do" lists just to balance stuff out? Should I act like the wife on "Everybody Loves Raymond" and constantly belittle, humiliate and put my husband down?
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:33 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
My son had a highly jealous and emotionally demanding girlfriend. He had no idea how to handle this, and no matter how I tried to explain to him that her behaviour was somewhat normal, he seemed not to believe me UNTIL I explained to him that I am simply... different. I cited that I do not ever yell or lose my temper, nor do I attempt guilt trips. He realized that even his teachers did these things and decided I was right- that maybe he did have a unique mother...

This has not JUST come up in my mind- but honestly, how much should ANYONE conform to societal norms just for appearances? Should I throw a few emotional tantrums and become a bit of a drama queen and write "honey do" lists just to balance stuff out? Should I act like the wife on "Everybody Loves Raymond" and constantly belittle, humiliate and put my husband down?
You might not want to give them the idea that the only alternative to your relationship model is highly jealous, emotionally demanding, guilt trips, drama queen tantrums and humiliating and putting husband down.
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:37 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
My son had a highly jealous and emotionally demanding girlfriend. He had no idea how to handle this, and no matter how I tried to explain to him that her behaviour was somewhat normal, he seemed not to believe me UNTIL I explained to him that I am simply... different. I cited that I do not ever yell or lose my temper, nor do I attempt guilt trips. He realized that even his teachers did these things and decided I was right- that maybe he did have a unique mother...

This has not JUST come up in my mind- but honestly, how much should ANYONE conform to societal norms just for appearances? Should I throw a few emotional tantrums and become a bit of a drama queen and write "honey do" lists just to balance stuff out? Should I act like the wife on "Everybody Loves Raymond" and constantly belittle, humiliate and put my husband down?
Wow, prejudice much?

So it has to be your way, what you consider the "right" way and the rest of "us" are females that throw temper tantrums, act like drama queens, and constantly belittle, humiliate and put our husbands's down?

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The master of the garden is the one who waters it, trims the branches, plants the seeds, and pulls the weeds. If you merely stroll through the garden, you are but an acolyte.

Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage."

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Old 02-23-2013, 05:45 PM   #12
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I am merely suggesting methods to "balance things out" that demonstrate the very opposite extreme from what occurs in my home. I am sorry you identify with these examples..
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Old 02-23-2013, 06:20 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
I am merely suggesting methods to "balance things out" that demonstrate the very opposite extreme from what occurs in my home. I am sorry you identify with these examples..
I don't identify with these examples, Mrs Passive-Aggressive.


I feel sorry for your children, you are a real mess.
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I am your servant. I shall not be free. You will protect me; you will keep me safe; you will guard me. You will keep me sound; you will protect me from every demon. -- Ancient Egyptian woman's slave contract

The master of the garden is the one who waters it, trims the branches, plants the seeds, and pulls the weeds. If you merely stroll through the garden, you are but an acolyte.

Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength, while loving someone deeply gives you courage."

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When you seek the light, darkness follows.

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Old 02-23-2013, 06:23 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post

Does anyone else have older kids? Just wondering how other people do it. I can't imagine us compromising any more than we already do- it would require an incredible amount of effort...
This is simple in my mind. It is the responsibility of every parent to prepare their offspring how to best survive and succeed in present and future society. It is your right to determine how you will present these life lessons, within the confines of the law.

By even asking "IF", you already feel a sense that your personal choices are in conflict with those responsibilities, and you don't need a bunch of strangers passing judgement on you. It's time to talk to your kids and set the record straight - either mommy and daddy made a booboo and forgot to put the porn back in the bottom drawer, or mommy and daddy like this "__________", but we aren't trying to lead by example in this instance.
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Old 02-23-2013, 06:30 PM   #15
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G.A. Aiken has a dragon-themed series of fantasy romance novels where some of the main characters are some dragon siblings, and their parents have a D/s relationship that's public knowledge, and their children and others comment on this in various ways over the course of the series.
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:20 PM   #16
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Quote:
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I am merely suggesting methods to "balance things out" that demonstrate the very opposite extreme from what occurs in my home. I am sorry you identify with these examples..
Oh, for shame. That's not actually the way to discuss nuanced issues that might be really important to you. The object is to achieve an actual balance, in your actual life, not to insult the people you've asked for help.
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:44 PM   #17
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:56 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
Now that my kids are older (teenagers) I wonder how my D/s relationship with my husband will affect their perspective of relationships. I know D/s is not for everyone and do not instill any of our personal preferences/perceptions about the details/rituals of ours into my sons.

However:

They see me give Him first choice of everything.
They hear Him command me with a simple statement ("door" or "drink" or "shoes") and have for years watched me comply.
They hear Him address me as "girl" or "woman" and see me respond positively.
They see me kneeling at His feet with my head resting on His lap all the time.
They have seen him lead me around with his hand on the back of my neck.

And this is us putting effort into subtlety. I have two main concerns: that someday maybe one of my sons will come across a more dominant "independent" type woman, attempt to pull this stuff off and get punched in the face. OR that they will decide that our relationship is "bad" because he does not treat me as an equal. (One of them already alludes to this.)

Does anyone else have older kids? Just wondering how other people do it. I can't imagine us compromising any more than we already do- it would require an incredible amount of effort...
You've been together for how many years? I'm curious what's brought this up for you now.
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Old 02-23-2013, 08:59 PM   #19
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Simple example, not bdsm-related, trying not to get pulled into the drama here:

When I was a kid, I grew up with an alcoholic father who would come home at 2am drunk out of his mind. I grew up with a mother who separated from him multiple times, but kept going back because SHE had been taught that parents STAY TOGETHER for the children.

Does this mean I'm going to tell my children to never ever touch a drop of alcohol? Does this mean I'm going to tell my children NOT to try to work things out with their partners, if it's possible? No. That would be stupid.

What I am going to do, and what ANYONE who's been through one extreme of some issue should do, is EDUCATE. You explain to your children that yes, mom and dad have a relationship that makes them both very happy, even though it might not be the "norm". And you explain that the "norm" consists of things like communication, honesty, mutual feelings, broad things like that that cover pretty much any "type" of relationship. NO, a relationship with an overly-jealous, possibly manipulative girl is not healthy. Neither is a relationship where one partner belittles and puts down the other. You don't teach extremes, you teach generalities, what, in GENERAL, a normal relationship should feel like.
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....

Quotes from my current in-progress novel:

“I understand. We can take things slow… And okay, that may be the wrong phrase since we’ve already slept together, but the more relationship-type things, I’m not going to push you, alright?”

"Remy gently grabbed her arm and pulled her close, lips meeting softly. I bit my own lip and watched as their kiss slowly deepened, watched as Remy's hand slowly rested against the back of Allison's neck to pull her closer. This was the part where I was supposed to get jealous, right? Speak up, ask what the hell was going on? But I couldn't. I couldn't ruin the moment because no matter what I *should* have been feeling, I wasn't."

"Surely if I was going to be concerned about any of her destructive habits I *should* be attempting to talk to her about the drugs… But that felt like a much more difficult thing to approach then her promiscuity."
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Old 02-23-2013, 09:39 PM   #20
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I've been concerned with the impact my behavior was having on my kids. It's caused me to modify my behavior around them, and especially to "own" my own authority with them, which is (I think) the most critical aspect of our relationship that was compromised by my slavery to my husband. For a while, I acted like I didn't have any authority at all, which is the wrong message for kids.

We took the ropes off our bed after our young children started tying each other up in them. And we stopped impact play at a certain stage because the noise always woke up my daughter. (I can't wait for my kids to leave home. . . .) My kids regularly find sex toys in our bedroom, and have had all kinds of reactions ranging from "gross" to "curious." Though I used to worry about it when they were younger, I don't worry so much now. Kids have been exposed to their parents' sexuality for a long time. It's more important that they have a healthy respect for sex, in my opinion, than that they are shielded as teenagers from any glimpse of their parents' relationship. (I hope it is clear that I am not saying that kids should be exposed to their parents' overt sexual acts. In a house with teenagers, privacy is important for everyone.)

Less important than the fact that my older kids might judge my relationship with their father (which they do) is the fact that they trust me to care for them, love them, and set aside my own desires to meet their needs when they ask for help.

It's how "caught up" I can be in my own sexual relationship(s) that is the bigger problem in our lives. If I'm too preoccupied and distracted by my own sexual thoughts and feelings, then it's always best for me to focus on other things for a while to maintain emotional balance within the family.
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Old 02-23-2013, 10:37 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Stella_Omega View Post
Oh, for shame. That's not actually the way to discuss nuanced issues that might be really important to you. The object is to achieve an actual balance, in your actual life, not to insult the people you've asked for help.
For shame??? I cannot seriously consider what you call "help" from a person who decides I am a "mess" based on 3 or 4 posts on a thread in a forum to which I am brand new. I think this is one of those classic deflection situations.

As for the idea that raising question of "if" indicating conflict with my responsibility to my sons, I believe that only the narrow minded cease to assess their own personal life situations and seek improvement and feedback. This topic is not your typical PTA mom type conversation so while it has been a significant topic through our relationship, it is rare that I discuss it in an open forum.

Those who imply that D/s is all about porn and sex need to learn a little more about D/s. It is not one in the same with BDSM even though they CAN intertwine. While I am new to this forum, I am not new to the lifestyle. I have been with my Dom for 8 years- prior to this I was single for a while and before that I was in a very awkward ill fitting relationship with the father of my children. (Ex-husband) prior to that I was a young adult who knew that she thrived on serving and inspiring others...

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Old 02-23-2013, 11:22 PM   #22
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To take this slightly out of the D/s perspective...

When my children were young (before I divorced their father), the "status quo" was a full time stay at home mom, who did *everything* related to the home. their father didn't ever do more in the kitchen than make a PB&J sandwich; being primary caregiver to the children (even temporarily, for a few hours) was unheard of.

It was my choice to live that way. It was important to me (and him) that I run the household; it was my "job".

However...

When I noticed my children (boys and girls) assuming "that's what women do", I made a conscious effort to routinely discuss alternatives [to how our household did things]. I didn't belittle or downgrade women who worked outside the home; I talked about choice. I made X choice (pros/cons); others may choose Y (pros/cons). Their father & stepmother tend to put more responsibility of the 16 year old daughter's shoulders (re: younger siblings) than her 18 year old brother. I remind him he is equally nurturing, loving, responsible and capable (even if he does things differently than his sister).

Life is ultimately about balance.

If my son was getting involved with histrionic, demanding teenage girls I'd be asking A) what attracted him to her in the first place, B) why that kind of behavior is tolerated/encouraged by him, and C) what is he getting out of it?
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Old 02-23-2013, 11:52 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Sweet_T View Post
Now that my kids are older (teenagers) I wonder how my D/s relationship with my husband will affect their perspective of relationships. I know D/s is not for everyone and do not instill any of our personal preferences/perceptions about the details/rituals of ours into my sons.

However:

They see me give Him first choice of everything.
They hear Him command me with a simple statement ("door" or "drink" or "shoes") and have for years watched me comply.
They hear Him address me as "girl" or "woman" and see me respond positively.
They see me kneeling at His feet with my head resting on His lap all the time.
They have seen him lead me around with his hand on the back of my neck.

And this is us putting effort into subtlety. I have two main concerns: that someday maybe one of my sons will come across a more dominant "independent" type woman, attempt to pull this stuff off and get punched in the face. OR that they will decide that our relationship is "bad" because he does not treat me as an equal. (One of them already alludes to this.)

Does anyone else have older kids? Just wondering how other people do it. I can't imagine us compromising any more than we already do- it would require an incredible amount of effort...
To address the original post: I do not have kids, but I have often thought about this issue. I think that, because they are already teenagers and have been exposed to your D/s dynamic all this time, it's probably a little late to "compromise" even more. As previous posters have advised, however, it's NOT too late to talk to them about it.

If you genuinely want to educate them about the alternatives, then I think it's important to show them POSITIVE examples of non-D/s relationships. It sounded from some of your reply-posts that you have painted a picture of "there are jealous, high-maintenance women in the world, and then there's me." That's not going to help your sons understand that your way isn't the "right" way. If you have relatives or close family friends in healthy relationships with a different power dynamic, those examples would be much more helpful to round out your sons' perspectives.

To address this issue: "How is this our sex life in front of them? None of what I listed is sexual. Submission is honor and reverence that projects into all aspects of a D/s relationship, from my experience and sex just happens to be part of "all aspects." " Is obeying commands and kneeling at your husband's feet the same as blowing him in front of your kids? No. But, do you obey commands and kneel at the feet of everyone else in your life? I'm guessing not. Your submission to your husband is tied to the fact that he's your partner, even if it isn't blatant foreplay. (Though, if your experience is anything like mine, this day-to-day submission DOES keep things primed and ready to go in the sexual arena.) So, if your sons gain a full understanding of what a D/s dynamic is, it would be natural for them to associate your acts of submission with your sex life. And, since you're their parents, they'll probably be put off by the thought.

Good for you, for realizing that you may be making life harder for your kids and asking for help to change it. They're lucky to have a mom who looks out for them.
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Old 02-24-2013, 03:29 AM   #24
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Wow, so I am confused. Apparently, a lot of folks here think that a power dynamic is inherently sexual foreplay? I personally believe that to be a gross oversimplification, if not out right incorrect for a lot of people who adhere to this lifestyle. It is possible to have a kinky sex life without a D/s lifestyle dynamic, and it is possible to have the D/s lifestyle dynamic without the kinky sex life. It is perfectly logical for the OP's husband to ask for his shoes and have his wife comply, all without it being a sexual scenario. Holy crap, Batman! Isn't this BDSM 101?

Now, I am young whipper-snapper with no children of my own, and hopefully not for years to come. But I do know--having been a child myself--that an individual's parents aren't usually their only social influence. You learn that different varieties of relationships exist by being exposed to those relationship types via friends, coworkers, teachers, etc. Unless the OP's children have been monstrously sheltered, I doubt that they will automatically assume a machismo personality and desire a D/s dynamic solely because they've grown up with the exposure. Kids are not stupid. They pick up information from a wide variety of resources, and are probably aware of the fact that--OMG!?!--different people have different relationship types according to their different personalities.

That being said, if your children are teenagers, you probably want to start discussing relationships with them now. Not because you are in a committed D/s relationship, but because you are a parent and this sh*t is important. You'll want to explain that different relationships involve different power dynamics, and knowing where you want the balance of power to lie is an essential consideration. Bot unequal, equal, and semi-equal power relationships are okay, as long as both partners desire the same type of arrangement and work well together. Throw in there that you like to be submissive to your husband--because that makes YOU happy--and all is well.

I don't see how this has to be a traumatic, life altering experience.
I think this is all about what kind of behaviour you want to model for your children. Kids tend to do as you do and not as you say. If you don't want that from them you are going to have to talk to them a lot about your reasoning behind that.
Husband commanding wife with one word sentences is a good example. Most of us are trying to get our kids to remember "Please?" and "Thank you!" at all times and watching their father doing something else is going to need som explaining. Otherwise they are going tom make their own conclusions, like that's how my parents think a man should treat a woman or that's how a wife should be treated, my mother isn't wort the respect other grown ups get or something else. Point is, you need to explain the value system behind your behaviuor if it is far from what you tell them to do or far from how other people do things.
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:08 AM   #25
Tabea
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I think your behaviour around your children is problematic.

Children often unconsciously model their parent’s relationship. That would lead to huge problems when a woman doesn’t want to submit. They have already seen your partner use mild force to make you submit (leading you around).

I’ll echo what many others have said, please talk to your boys about relationships. You could tell them that in your relationship your partner makes most of the decisions because you both decided that you prefer that, but he still loves and respects you. There are other relationships where the woman makes more of the decisions and relationships where both make decisions together and it is all okay if it is what makes the people involved happy.
It is important for them to know that your partner does love and respect you even if it doesn’t always look like that to them.

I am afraid you will end up having problems with your sons not respecting you. Giving one word commands is not a normal respectful ways for humans to interact; it is how you command dogs. Why should your sons respect and obey you when they see you treated like a dog in that regard by your partner? Can’t your partner use whole sentences and please or even occasionally fetch his own shoes? How hard is that?
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