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Old 09-06-2018, 02:55 AM   #1
FEELINGLUCKYPUNK
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WHEN DO YOU KNOW A BOOK IS BULL SHIt?

When the author includes facts you know are bogus.
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Old 09-06-2018, 03:13 AM   #2
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When it's boring and no point in reading it,waste of time
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Old 09-06-2018, 03:19 AM   #3
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When the author starts insulting the readers intelligence with unbelievable BS. Fiction is one thing, but it has to be believable.
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Old 09-06-2018, 03:57 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by FEELINGLUCKYPUNK View Post
When the author includes facts you know are bogus.
That's okay as long as it's plausibly bogus. Alternative history is full of that with all those what ifs. Look at Steve Stirling's "The Guns of the South." AK47s in the Civil War. Totally bogus but one accepts the implausiblity because that's the story.
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Old 09-06-2018, 04:06 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChloeTzang View Post
That's okay as long as it's plausibly bogus. Alternative history is full of that with all those what ifs. Look at Steve Stirling's "The Guns of the South." AK47s in the Civil War. Totally bogus but one accepts the implausiblity because that's the story.
Can't remember the authors name, but was very similar. Time Traveling to the civil war a Black agent sent to stop sten guns being used by the south. Again plausible reality.
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Old 09-06-2018, 04:37 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by MidnightRyder1a View Post
Can't remember the authors name, but was very similar. Time Traveling to the civil war a Black agent sent to stop sten guns being used by the south. Again plausible reality.
Yes, they're fun. Bogus facts can be plausible if they're used appropriately and alternative history and science fiction as genres are full of bogus facts - they're an accepted part of the genre where you suspend disbelief.

Now in other genres it's a different story.
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Old 09-06-2018, 04:40 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChloeTzang View Post
Yes, they're fun. Bogus facts can be plausible if they're used appropriately and alternative history and science fiction as genres are full of bogus facts - they're an accepted part of the genre where you suspend disbelief.

Now in other genres it's a different story.
One book that drove me mad with trying to use current tech and suspense was Dan Brown -- Digital Fortress Didn't enjoy the book, but it was one of those that I ended up reading all the way threw just to see how bad it was lol then after that have never read any of his books.
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Old 09-06-2018, 04:45 AM   #8
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One book that drove me mad with trying to use current tech and suspense was Dan Brown -- Digital Fortress Didn't enjoy the book, but it was one of those that I ended up reading all the way threw just to see how bad it was lol then after that have never read any of his books.
Yes, I tried a couple of his and passed.
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Old 09-06-2018, 06:14 AM   #9
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There's two things that make me return the book to the shelf, or on Literotica or other online fiction sites press the back button straight away:

1. Second Person Point of View
2. Present Tense rather than Past Tense - I just cannot stand a present tense narrative rather than a past tense narrative - i.e. 'Jane is away sick from work with the flu' rather than 'Jane was away sick from work with the flu'. I find present tense annoying and pretentious, the only exception being an epilogue describing what characters are up to now.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:15 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by RetroFan View Post
There's two things that make me return the book to the shelf, or on Literotica or other online fiction sites press the back button straight away:

1. Second Person Point of View
2. Present Tense rather than Past Tense - I just cannot stand a present tense narrative rather than a past tense narrative - i.e. 'Jane is away sick from work with the flu' rather than 'Jane was away sick from work with the flu'. I find present tense annoying and pretentious, the only exception being an epilogue describing what characters are up to now.
Oh no! I've done both. "Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow" was all second person. And I quite enjoy first person present tense. I think it gives some real immediacy to that first person experience. Personal preferences I guess.
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All of Chloe Tzang's stories can be found here
Chloe supports our Veterans by drinking Black Rifle Coffee
Aaaaand... Chloe's first actual published short story ("Blood Sacrifice") now available on Amazon as part of the Sex and Sorcery 4 anthology
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:26 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by ChloeTzang View Post
Oh no! I've done both. "Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow" was all second person. And I quite enjoy first person present tense. I think it gives some real immediacy to that first person experience. Personal preferences I guess.
Your story is first person POV, since it's told from the point of view of "I." Although it refers to a "you" it's not told from that person's POV.

Second person would be this:

"You went to the store and you wondered what you wanted to buy. You bought a bottle of wine because friends were coming to your house later and you knew they were big drinkers."

I agree about present tense. As long as the tense is consistent it can work well.
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Old 09-06-2018, 07:39 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetroFan View Post
There's two things that make me return the book to the shelf, or on Literotica or other online fiction sites press the back button straight away:

1. Second Person Point of View
2. Present Tense rather than Past Tense - I just cannot stand a present tense narrative rather than a past tense narrative - i.e. 'Jane is away sick from work with the flu' rather than 'Jane was away sick from work with the flu'. I find present tense annoying and pretentious, the only exception being an epilogue describing what characters are up to now.
Agree 1.
2 means you miss a truckload of perfectly good story-telling, both here on Lit and in the outside world. It's a prejudice as absurd, really, as saying I won't read stories with pink in them as a colour.
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Old 09-06-2018, 08:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonDoom View Post
Your story is first person POV, since it's told from the point of view of "I." Although it refers to a "you" it's not told from that person's POV.

Second person would be this:

"You went to the store and you wondered what you wanted to buy. You bought a bottle of wine because friends were coming to your house later and you knew they were big drinkers."

I agree about present tense. As long as the tense is consistent it can work well.
Blushes. I didn't realize that. I have to study more on the theory. All this writing stuff. Eek. I just write. The rules all go right by me half the time and now I'm embarrassed. Sort of 😳
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All of Chloe Tzang's stories can be found here
Chloe supports our Veterans by drinking Black Rifle Coffee
Aaaaand... Chloe's first actual published short story ("Blood Sacrifice") now available on Amazon as part of the Sex and Sorcery 4 anthology
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Old 09-06-2018, 09:25 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by ChloeTzang View Post
Blushes. I didn't realize that. I have to study more on the theory. All this writing stuff. Eek. I just write. The rules all go right by me half the time and now I'm embarrassed. Sort of 😳
Nothing to blush about. I've seen lots of people refer to I-You stories as 2 person POV.

Real 2d person POV is rare. I think I've seen one story on Literotica in that POV, and the only published story I can recall reading in that POV is Bright Lights Big City.
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Old 09-06-2018, 10:25 AM   #15
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I picked up a book in the hospital when my wife was having surgery. I forget the title and who wrote it but it was an alternate history of the US. We lost the revolutionary war and the great-great-great grandson of George Washington was in charge of a project to build a tunnel from New Amsterdam to London to transport people and food to and from.

Everything was plausible, but so crazy. It was an interesting read while I waited for my wife to get out of surgery, but I never finished it, I just dropped it back on the table I found it and never went back
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Old 09-06-2018, 10:30 AM   #16
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Lit stories that make me click back instantly...

1. the women are described in agonizing detail or has 42DDDD tits on a 5' frame.
2. the men are also described in agonizing detail or has a foot long dick.

Click back fast as I can.
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Old 09-06-2018, 11:10 AM   #17
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I picked up a book in the hospital when my wife was having surgery. I forget the title and who wrote it but it was an alternate history of the US. We lost the revolutionary war and the great-great-great grandson of George Washington was in charge of a project to build a tunnel from New Amsterdam to London to transport people and food to and from.

Everything was plausible, but so crazy. It was an interesting read while I waited for my wife to get out of surgery, but I never finished it, I just dropped it back on the table I found it and never went back
Harry Harrison. A Trans-Atlantic Tunnel, Hurrah

I have it somewhere along with his Stainless Steel Rat books.
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All of Chloe Tzang's stories can be found here
Chloe supports our Veterans by drinking Black Rifle Coffee
Aaaaand... Chloe's first actual published short story ("Blood Sacrifice") now available on Amazon as part of the Sex and Sorcery 4 anthology
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Old 09-06-2018, 12:11 PM   #18
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Harry Harrison. A Trans-Atlantic Tunnel, Hurrah

I have it somewhere along with his Stainless Steel Rat books.
Yes, yes, that was it. I actually liked the other stuff he wrote, even the Rat books, I just couldn't believe we lost the Revolutionary War in my mind.
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Old 09-06-2018, 12:50 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by FEELINGLUCKYPUNK View Post
When the author includes facts you know are bogus.
That would be nonfiction. In fiction, it depends on the approach being taken.
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Old 09-06-2018, 01:55 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by MidnightRyder1a View Post
When the author starts insulting the readers intelligence with unbelievable BS. Fiction is one thing, but it has to be believable.
Internal consistency is the key here.
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Old 09-06-2018, 02:42 PM   #21
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And if it's science fiction then I can make any shit up that want too. Does it have to have a basis in fact? No, why should it. I can million ton space ships float a foot above the ground forever if I want too.

As a matter of fact I do that in my Warrior One series of short stories.
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Old 09-06-2018, 02:47 PM   #22
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And if it's science fiction then I can make any shit up that want too. Does it have to have a basis in fact? No, why should it. I can million ton space ships float a foot above the ground forever if I want too.

As a matter of fact I do that in my Warrior One series of short stories.
And as long as it's consistent, it works. I always liked that Robert Heinlein line "the door dilated". It conveys so much in so few words. And it's totally bogus. Doors don't dilate. Yet.
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All of Chloe Tzang's stories can be found here
Chloe supports our Veterans by drinking Black Rifle Coffee
Aaaaand... Chloe's first actual published short story ("Blood Sacrifice") now available on Amazon as part of the Sex and Sorcery 4 anthology
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Old 09-06-2018, 04:59 PM   #23
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And as long as it's consistent, it works. I always liked that Robert Heinlein line "the door dilated". It conveys so much in so few words. And it's totally bogus. Doors don't dilate. Yet.
“The door dilated” is the most famous phrase in science fiction amongst sf authors (or at least it used to be) because of how economically it pushed the reader into the world of the future.

The runner-up of this prize belongs to PK Dick, for, “The car gained velocity and altitude.”
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Old 09-07-2018, 12:53 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Zeb_Carter View Post
I picked up a book in the hospital when my wife was having surgery. I forget the title and who wrote it but it was an alternate history of the US. We lost the revolutionary war and the great-great-great grandson of George Washington was in charge of a project to build a tunnel from New Amsterdam to London to transport people and food to and from.

Everything was plausible, but so crazy. It was an interesting read while I waited for my wife to get out of surgery, but I never finished it, I just dropped it back on the table I found it and never went back
Mencken argued we lost the Revolution. In college I argued the South won the Civil War, got an A for my performance.
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Old 09-07-2018, 01:01 AM   #25
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Here's one anchored in facts: Abe Lincoln was assassinated by a conspiracy of Radical Republicans and US Army elites.
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