Pure
Fiel a Verdad
- Joined
- Dec 20, 2001
- Posts
- 15,135
I'm looking to pick others' brains about what i'll call, a female archetype; loosely, any mythic or compelling figure from the arts or literature, including even pop culture. but a particular one: she is to embody power, but NOT be a mom [i.e. not primarily a 'mom' to her partner]. Abby Holland and Swamp Thing could be an example. [[Belle, in Beauty and the Beast is another example.]]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:SwampThing22.jpg
Further, this figure, who is sexual, is not simply a 'love goddess,' an aphrodite, at least as we understand her now. this figure having a hold over males, often subjects one in particular. she, in many stories, loves this subject, in her own way, which may include torment. the 'subject' is sometimes less than human; generally defective in many ways, but one. he is devoted and loving.
I don't find any major figures of Greek Myth, to fit very well, e.g. not Athena, Demeter, Hera. These just mentioned tend to be virgins or wives, reflecting Greek patriarchy, i suppose.
[[some of the femmes fatales fit, possibly Mme de Merteuil [Glenn Close], in Dangerous Liaisons, or Lola, in the 'Blue Angel,' but not those simply chasing the big bucks and/or actively trying to kill the lover or husband.]][revised at *]
the standard fdom or 'domme' of most porn stories fits poorly as well, being a male fantasy figment. her cruelty tends to be a tack on [[to the services she provides]]; she's often simply jenna jameson with a whip.
besides giving a name, if you'd characterize the person a bit, and give any reflections, that would be helpful.
note: if you have written anything with such a figure, or seen her here are lit, let us know. let's discuss.!
===
ADDITION
11-08 10 am
1. As Stella pointed out--thanks!-- the above can, with small modifications, equally apply to a woman of power who is lesbian.
2. I did not mean to exclude all moms, i.e. women with children; i simply wanted it to be the case that she was NOT just a 'mom figure' -or not primarily that--to her subject/partner.
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*
Modification:
In the course of discussion is has become clear that femme fatale is a rather different figure, though she has strength in commmon with the archetype sought (femme de pouvoir). The archetype sought is NOT hostile to her partner, but has a beneficial effect in various ways, and is often protective. The femme fatale brings misery and destruction [after the infatuation of her prey]; the archetype sought brings some kind of fulfillment and thriving. Another issue is the *degree* of control or direction, from the relatively laissez faire but guiding ("Marge" in Fargo) to total direction. Again, the difference with the femme fatale is that the ff's control over the situation, is at best heedless self- seeking at the expense of the other, and, at worse, destructive or lethal.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:SwampThing22.jpg
Further, this figure, who is sexual, is not simply a 'love goddess,' an aphrodite, at least as we understand her now. this figure having a hold over males, often subjects one in particular. she, in many stories, loves this subject, in her own way, which may include torment. the 'subject' is sometimes less than human; generally defective in many ways, but one. he is devoted and loving.
I don't find any major figures of Greek Myth, to fit very well, e.g. not Athena, Demeter, Hera. These just mentioned tend to be virgins or wives, reflecting Greek patriarchy, i suppose.
[[some of the femmes fatales fit, possibly Mme de Merteuil [Glenn Close], in Dangerous Liaisons, or Lola, in the 'Blue Angel,' but not those simply chasing the big bucks and/or actively trying to kill the lover or husband.]][revised at *]
the standard fdom or 'domme' of most porn stories fits poorly as well, being a male fantasy figment. her cruelty tends to be a tack on [[to the services she provides]]; she's often simply jenna jameson with a whip.
besides giving a name, if you'd characterize the person a bit, and give any reflections, that would be helpful.
note: if you have written anything with such a figure, or seen her here are lit, let us know. let's discuss.!
===
ADDITION
11-08 10 am
1. As Stella pointed out--thanks!-- the above can, with small modifications, equally apply to a woman of power who is lesbian.
2. I did not mean to exclude all moms, i.e. women with children; i simply wanted it to be the case that she was NOT just a 'mom figure' -or not primarily that--to her subject/partner.
----
*
Modification:
In the course of discussion is has become clear that femme fatale is a rather different figure, though she has strength in commmon with the archetype sought (femme de pouvoir). The archetype sought is NOT hostile to her partner, but has a beneficial effect in various ways, and is often protective. The femme fatale brings misery and destruction [after the infatuation of her prey]; the archetype sought brings some kind of fulfillment and thriving. Another issue is the *degree* of control or direction, from the relatively laissez faire but guiding ("Marge" in Fargo) to total direction. Again, the difference with the femme fatale is that the ff's control over the situation, is at best heedless self- seeking at the expense of the other, and, at worse, destructive or lethal.
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