BDSM: A Different Perspective

I realized something tonight talking to My slave. We are 24/7. But not in the sense that we are Master/slave 24/7.

Truth be told she doesn't like the idea of 24/7 because she didn't want to lose our other aspects of our relationship like Daddy/little girl or even just boyfriend/girlfriend, which I understand because I don't want to lose them either.

But I realized something. We are 24/7 already. I asked her a few questions to help her see this as well because she was of the notion that 24/7 meant Master/slave and nothing else.

Finally I asked her this: "So, would I be correct in saying that you feel submissive toward Me 24/7, want to please Me 24/7, want to make Me happy 24/7, and have your actions and thoughts guided by those things 24/7?" she of course answered yes and realized herself that we truly are 24/7. That even when we are just bf/gf, Daddy/lg, M/s, or whatever there are two constants, My Dominance over her and her submission to Me and that she doesn't have to call Me Master or Me call her slave to be 24/7. (And of course I don't mean to belittle, diminish, or offend anyone who has a 24/7 M/s relationship like that.)

I bring this up because I feel like the biggest misconception about BDSM, especially by those new to it, is that BDSM is a one size fits all. That because one couple or person (PYL or pyl) does BDSM a certain way then that is exactly what BDSM means. I feel this is incorrect. BDSM is whatever you want to make of it. That's why it is so open and accepting of so many different, and sometimes out there, things and people.

So, don't worry if you don't "fit" into exactly what this person or this couple does or writes about on the board. Just be yourself and do what will make you happy. The rest will just fall into place.

And I just used the example of 24/7 because that is what Me and My little girl were talking about.

The misconceptions about BDSM can really be applied to all aspects of BDSM whether it's relationships, being a PYL or a pyl, what you're into, what you're not into, how you feel, or whatever.

THis is something that plays in my mind alot as well, perhaps moreso over the past few weeks.

When I was starting out, playing but refusing to acknowledge my submissiveness, I remember sitting down and thinking about what it ment to be a submissive, and even further, what it ment to be a slave. I had an ideal in my head of a kept women, every moment serious, not allowd to speak unless spoken to, never talking back, every moment lived as if he were a king and the slightest sign of disrespect would mean savier punishment.

As I learned more, grew more, developed the relationship with Jounar, and observed my closest friends, my views changed. But even up until my recent visit with Jounar, I had a misguieded notion that, to some extent, there was no room for light hearted playfulness in a BDSM relationship. That is, until he said something to me that really got me to thinking.

It was early in the trip, 2nd or 3rd night maybe, he asked me what I had expected the trip to be like, and if what had past so far matched that expectation. I told him that I worked very hard not to develope an expectation, that it would be like examining a package under the christmas tree and getting into your head what it is. When you open the package, no mater how much you love what was really in there, you would be disapointed if it wasn't exactly what you had thought it would be. But I did have some idea that it wouldn't be all paddles, collars, whips and chains like some fantasies might lead you to believe.

He replied with this, "Exactly. That stuff is fantasy, not realistic. I love having a sub. . . or in this case a slave, but it's the person I love. It's the person that I want to know, and the person that keeps me."

I've always been one to say that the relationship is more important than the D/s, but this really put it into light for me. Curling at his chest while we watch a movie didn't make me any less his slave. Nor did teasing him about walking too fast for me to keep up. Nor was he any less my Owner when I teasingly threatend him with birthday spankings. *giggles*

For a long time I worried about pushing our relationship further, as far as D/s or M/s goes, because I didn't want to loose that playfulness that we share. Now, more than ever, I realize that that playfulness is as much apart of who we are as the D/s is, perhaps even moreso.

Dude, I'm 24/7 M/s with my girls, and I can't imagine being serious all the time. We joke and laugh and have a good time. Sure, there are times when things are deadly serious, but there's a whole lot of silly fun. To be frank, the long-term M/s couples that I know are usually light-hearted and playful quite a bit. I've seen more constantly serious D/s relationships than I have M/s ones *shrug*

The key to 24/7, as mentioned in the first post, is that the pyl feels submissive 24/7, and the PYL feels dominant similarly. If the relationship has those elements in play 24/7, it's 24/7. That's pretty much it. There's no seriousness requirement, or need to say "Master" all the time. It's basically all about how each person feels towards the other in the relationship.

Geeze, I would be so frikken bored with constant seriousness. Ugh.

Homburg said:

Dude, I'm 24/7 M/s with my girls, and I can't imagine being serious all the time. We joke and laugh and have a good time. Sure, there are times when things are deadly serious, but there's a whole lot of silly fun. To be frank, the long-term M/s couples that I know are usually light-hearted and playful quite a bit. I've seen more constantly serious D/s relationships than I have M/s ones *shrug*

The key to 24/7, as mentioned in the first post, is that the pyl feels submissive 24/7, and the PYL feels dominant similarly. If the relationship has those elements in play 24/7, it's 24/7. That's pretty much it. There's no seriousness requirement, or need to say "Master" all the time. It's basically all about how each person feels towards the other in the relationship.

Geeze, I would be so frikken bored with constant seriousness. Ugh.

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Which brings up the obvious question...Where does this idea that M/s has to be serious "yes master, no master" all of the time come from?

It's not that uncommon a missconception. Infact it ranks right up there with a slave being nude save a collar 24/7.

the captians wench said:

Which brings up the obvious question...Where does this idea that M/s has to be serious "yes master, no master" all of the time come from?

It's not that uncommon a missconception. Infact it ranks right up there with a slave being nude save a collar 24/7.

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that is obviously a falsehood. i am nude save my collar AND cuffs. cant forget those *rolls eyes*

the captians wench said:

Which brings up the obvious question...Where does this idea that M/s has to be serious "yes master, no master" all of the time come from?

It's not that uncommon a missconception. Infact it ranks right up there with a slave being nude save a collar 24/7.

Click to expand...

(just using your quote as a jump off point Wenchie, not saying this is you)
Once again, it comes down to the choices of those involved. We have a lot of fun times in our M/s and 'Yes, Master' only when appropriate...the underlying factor (which is the serious one) is the power differential and that his needs are expected to be met before mine, always. That extends to times when I am ill, or injured, where he will usually expect me to still serve him, sometimes extending a little patience if I am slower in movement, sometimes demanding I push through the pain to make sure he doesn't have to wait. For others it is more a matter of if the slave is ill or injured, their needs come first and they are expected to rest and even sometimes have the PYL wait on them exclusively...wouldn't work for us, but different strokes for different folks.

Similarly the same goes for nudity. While some may mock because it doesn't feature in their concept of reality, for others it is very much a reality. I don't see why it would be seen as such a joke given a lot of people not in this lifestyle adopt a naturalist mode of living and those who may mock the naked slave concept often wouldn't think of doing the same when discussing naturalists...why the difference, especially from people who want to or claim to live this lifestyle? Truth be told, it is made clear that if we lived alone, just the 2 of us, I would be expected to be nude at all times....as we don't, it is a rule reserved for when we are away from home and alone without exemption. That doesn't mean a M/s has to incorporate this rule, but nor should it be a point of mockery for those who do.

Catalina

Dude, I never wear clothes when I'm at home, unless someone who might get freaked out is coming over. My friends know to call or text before they come over, or at least knock before barging in if they don't feel like seeing my bare fat ass. I like being nekkid. Ain't nothin' wrong with that.

I actually do have something useful to say, but I'm tired. I'll be back after I sleep to add something with a little more substance than "I like being nekkid."

Daddy2mylilgirl said:

So, don't worry if you don't "fit" into exactly what this person or this couple does or writes about on the board. Just be yourself and do what will make you happy. The rest will just fall into place.

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This is very true for many. We basically live our lives for us, socialise with others in the lifestyle very little (almost non-existent infact), and walk to the beat of our own drum because at the end of the day we are the people in the relationship, not any Tom, Dick or Harriet who think they know exactly how it should be done and like to direct others similarly according to their personal guidebook. There are key elements which I think exist (such as for D/s there has to be some element of dominance and submission involved), but from there, each relationship has its own individual flavour which suits those involved. Doesn't make it right or wrong, just realistic.

Catalina

Please don't throw things at me, but I thought 24/7 meant you lived together and lived D/s 24/7.

intothewoods said:

Please don't throw things at me, but I thought 24/7 meant you lived together and lived D/s 24/7.

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i am very much in a 24/7 TPE M/s (and im sure there are other acronyms to throw at it if you really wanted to)... and im currently in a long distance relationship *shrug*

This is a great thread, thank you for starting it.

I couldn't agree more with the statement that this is not a one size fits all lifestyle. There are so many variations and options and that is just the way it should be. There are even many variations on the definitions people have for the "labels".

I live a 24/7 TPE M/s relationship. I am always his slave and he is always my Master, even when I am teasing him for dripping ice cream on his shirt or he is taking care of me because I am ill. Even though we are always Master and slave we are also always in love with each other and having fun with each other.

There are times I know that Master wants to beat me, but he doesn't, because he has assessed my health or emotions and know it isn't a good time. There are also times when he wants to beat me and knows I don't really want it right then but that is tough and he does it anyway, because he is my Master and he can.

There are so many people who think that because they don't do things a certain way they are not Master or Dom or sub or slave but that is only because they are applying other people's viewpoints.

This is a wonderful life and one that we can pick and choose the parts we want and need - there is no requirement to do "it all".

There are also those who think that just because they don't do something that if others say they do then they are obviously making it up. That isn't correct either.

Thank you for starting the thread, I am sure that many of us will get a lot from it. I could write so much more but will wait to read more posts.

Trueth be told, I'm naked when ever I'm not in public, but when I was there, I wasn't naked inside the hotel room all the time. *shrug*

My point was that there are certian ideals that people get in their head as newbies as the way things have to be. In order to be M/s you have to have your slave naked all of the time, in order to be 24/7 she has to be leashed to the bed when ever you are not around.

If people like that sort of thing great, but I remember, as a newbie, getting this sence of "you're not doing it right",(I even remember the first dispute I had with Jounar being over that feeling) so where did this rule book come from as so many seem to get the same ideas of what M/s "really" is.

Hey, it's all fine with me. I had just always heard people say, we're 24-7 in the context of being married and/or living together, and we're D/s all the time.

And I honestly rarely use the term or hear it used amongst people I know irl. Same with "lifestyler." Usually how I hear the 24-7 thing used is either by people who do live together, who will tell me, we are not 24-7, meaning there isn't a permanent power exchange going on in their relationship, or more often, by people who are M/s who do not live together, who will say, we are M/s, but we aren't 24/7 - i.e., we don't live together. We are not together 24-7.

Most people I know who have D/s as part of their relationship do not turn it off and on consciously. It's more natural and organic.

24/7 is a state of mind, not a state of being.

catalina_francisco said:

(just using your quote as a jump off point Wenchie, not saying this is you)
Once again, it comes down to the choices of those involved. We have a lot of fun times in our M/s and 'Yes, Master' only when appropriate...the underlying factor (which is the serious one) is the power differential and that his needs are expected to be met before mine, always. That extends to times when I am ill, or injured, where he will usually expect me to still serve him, sometimes extending a little patience if I am slower in movement, sometimes demanding I push through the pain to make sure he doesn't have to wait. For others it is more a matter of if the slave is ill or injured, their needs come first and they are expected to rest and even sometimes have the PYL wait on them exclusively...wouldn't work for us, but different strokes for different folks.

Similarly the same goes for nudity. While some may mock because it doesn't feature in their concept of reality, for others it is very much a reality. I don't see why it would be seen as such a joke given a lot of people not in this lifestyle adopt a naturalist mode of living and those who may mock the naked slave concept often wouldn't think of doing the same when discussing naturalists...why the difference, especially from people who want to or claim to live this lifestyle? Truth be told, it is made clear that if we lived alone, just the 2 of us, I would be expected to be nude at all times....as we don't, it is a rule reserved for when we are away from home and alone without exemption. That doesn't mean a M/s has to incorporate this rule, but nor should it be a point of mockery for those who do.

Catalina

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I think the nudity issue is a common joke because it is one of the first stereotypes that non-M/s people think of when they think M/s or 24/7. The slave is on his/her knees, collared, and naked constantly, doing nothing else than sitting there waiting for instruction, beating, etc. It's a common misconception because it is also a common fantasy, and is present in an awful lot of bullshit, but still read, fanfic.

viv is naked in the bedroom at night. She's also collared. It's how she sleeps. The rest of the time there are kids around, so she's not. MIS is frequently naked and collared when she is in her room alone, but neither are kneeling there waiting on me because they both have things to do. Things I want them to do. Nudity, in our case, is a pleasure and a priviledge dictated by circumstance, not M/s.

As to illness or injury, it really depends. If the slave is incapacitated, I'm going to take care of her. She is my property and my responsibility. If she's simply feeling bad, it will depend. I tend to be far more lenient and patient, but I am still going to expect that core duties and services are performed.

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serijules said:

24/7 is a state of mind, not a state of being.

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Spot on. Damn.

It think for me, 24/7 comes down to 100% loyalty from the other person. I don't see why laughter and silliness should not come with that; if it didn't, why would you want to be with them in a 24/7 relationship?

Homburg said:

I think the nudity issue is a common joke because it is one of the first stereotypes that non-M/s people think of when they think M/s or 24/7. The slave is on his/her knees, collared, and naked constantly, doing nothing else than sitting there waiting for instruction, beating, etc. It's a common misconception because it is also a common fantasy, and is present in an awful lot of bullshit, but still read, fanfic.

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I don't bother anymore worrying about what misconceptions people outside the lifestyle may have, I am far more disturbed when those living it anywhere between casually to 24/7 ridicule things they don't do so consider BS or a joke. While those in your and our household do not kneel naked constantly (yikes, my knees, especially now, would never handle it), some do so a lot more than us....doesn't mean they are living in a fantasy, just they do things differently just as we all differ in some way.

Homburg said:

viv is naked in the bedroom at night. She's also collared. It's how she sleeps. The rest of the time there are kids around, so she's not. MIS is frequently naked and collared when she is in her room alone, but neither are kneeling there waiting on me because they both have things to do. Things I want them to do. Nudity, in our case, is a pleasure and a priviledge dictated by circumstance, not M/s.

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Yep, it is something we savour when we can which is very rarely...and quite often he is naked as well as he likes it that way. Sleeping naked has been something I have done most of my adult life, so I don't think of it as predominantly submissive except in that it is a rule of his I must keep to if I ever changed completely and decided I wanted it different...similarly, whenever I have lived alone or without children around, I have spent a good time naked. Often it was more about trying to keep cool, but also something I enjoyed. For those who have never done these things, it is often thought to be a BDSM etc., type thing and/or a novelty, hence I guess why some find it strange or comedy fodder.

Homburg said:

As to illness or injury, it really depends. If the slave is incapacitated, I'm going to take care of her. She is my property and my responsibility. If she's simply feeling bad, it will depend. I tend to be far more lenient and patient, but I am still going to expect that core duties and services are performed.

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Yes, as difficult as it is at times, and even though I sometimes in the moment wish life was easier, it helps to retain our dynamic and keep me in correct mindset to not be pampered and waited on. He chooses his moments when he decides to give me a little leeway, but they are not predictable and can thus mean I get given some allowance when I am not that bad, and ordered to keep going when I am far from alright...it varies. He accepts responsibility for if he pushes me too far when not adviseable, though it may not mean he lets up. It works for us most of the time, but is not for everyone, nor how we could have lived in the early days. The one thing I have found to be true is the journey takes many twists and turns, many of them borne from growth in our relationship and an ability to push harder for what we really want as our reality without fear of the consequences between us...it's a nice feeling.

Catalina

serijules said:

24/7 is a state of mind, not a state of being.

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I totaly 100% agree, thank you.

On the nudity. I know a lot of naturalists, and people who just like to hang out naked. It's not my cup of tea, but I also don't get dressed in the bathroom or anything! Then again, I don't see the big deal about bfing a baby in public either. They're just breasts. Nudity is not always sexual.

It does make me a little batty when people say, this is what X means to me. X can mean something completely different to you, but this is what X means to me. Well, great, but if we all decide to create our own definitions for words, we will eventually have a hard time communicating with each other.

Whether 24/7 requires state of mind or actual presence, we are talking about power exchange. Not the desire to make someone happy. Most people I know in successful relationships would say they want to make their partner happy.

intothewoods said:

Whether 24/7 requires state of mind or actual presence, we are talking about power exchange. Not the desire to make someone happy. Most people I know in successful relationships would say they want to make their partner happy.

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Ah, but in most of those relationships, you don't find one partner able to tell the other to strip and get into a slave pose immediately and without question.

Most of the 24/7 relationships I've been familiar with were more like 6/7, with an additional 18 hours a day on call.

catalina_francisco said:

I don't bother anymore worrying about what misconceptions people outside the lifestyle may have, I am far more disturbed when those living it anywhere between casually to 24/7 ridicule things they don't do so consider BS or a joke. While those in your and our household do not kneel naked constantly (yikes, my knees, especially now, would never handle it), some do so a lot more than us....doesn't mean they are living in a fantasy, just they do things differently just as we all differ in some way.

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Absolutely agree.

Yep, it is something we savour when we can which is very rarely...and quite often he is naked as well as he likes it that way. Sleeping naked has been something I have done most of my adult life, so I don't think of it as predominantly submissive except in that it is a rule of his I must keep to if I ever changed completely and decided I wanted it different...similarly, whenever I have lived alone or without children around, I have spent a good time naked. Often it was more about trying to keep cool, but also something I enjoyed. For those who have never done these things, it is often thought to be a BDSM etc., type thing and/or a novelty, hence I guess why some find it strange or comedy fodder.

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I sleep naked too, and am generally wearing little more than a pair of exercise shorts around the house. Nudity is just nudity.

Yes, as difficult as it is at times, and even though I sometimes in the moment wish life was easier, it helps to retain our dynamic and keep me in correct mindset to not be pampered and waited on. He chooses his moments when he decides to give me a little leeway, but they are not predictable and can thus mean I get given some allowance when I am not that bad, and ordered to keep going when I am far from alright...it varies. He accepts responsibility for if he pushes me too far when not adviseable, though it may not mean he lets up. It works for us most of the time, but is not for everyone, nor how we could have lived in the early days. The one thing I have found to be true is the journey takes many twists and turns, many of them borne from growth in our relationship and an ability to push harder for what we really want as our reality without fear of the consequences between us...it's a nice feeling.

Catalina

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Absolutely. Taking responsibility is dead necessary. I push too hard sometimes too, and being forced to pick up my own wreckage is part of the price I pay for doing so.

I might be a little presumptuous in trying to discuss something I know less about than all of you, but I wonder how it can possibly be shocking that not all 24/7 M/s relationships are exactly the same in terms, circumstance and situation...

If you consider that this is another type of relationship - granted, an intense and special relationship most people will never experience - the normal rules apply to its label. My "best friend" might be someone I talk with every few weeks when we get together, yours might someone you see all day every day, either way, it's someone close. My "boss" might not be very friendly, we might have a very distant relationship, while yours might be warm and friendly with you; either way that person is cutting your cheques. My "lover" might resemble a good friend with nakedness perks, yours might be your 100%-positive soulmate, but either way it's someone to love and cherish.

... Yet we all use these words to refer to all these situations. And no one is shocked or surprised or feels I'm not playing by the rules if my definition for the relationship's label is different. We all still understand each other in this setting - why do the rules have to change in this specific case?

Penny Lane you are exactly right. But for some reason, maybe because of the initials BDSM, a lot of folk do think it is a "one size fits all" when that could not be further from the truth!

Zoots_owner said:

Ah, but in most of those relationships, you don't find one partner able to tell the other to strip and get into a slave pose immediately and without question.

Most of the 24/7 relationships I've been familiar with were more like 6/7, with an additional 18 hours a day on call.

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Yes, that's why I said the difference is power exchange, not just generally trying to please someone.