Pregnancy and BDSM

Hey all, knowing that there are a few in here with children, I was hoping you could share some thoughts on BDSM and bondage play during pregnancy.

I've found a potential new sub who's living in the area, and we get on really well as friends. She has quite a bit of experience as a slave, though is not yet looking at starting a 24/7 relationship. We've talked about starting a more formal relationship, but there is one little catch: She's 4 months pregnant.

Does pregnancy severally curtail what you can and cannot do with regards to the more physical aspects of bondage? As the health of her and her baby are my first priority, I'm looking for some general thoughts or suggestions as I have zero experience with a pregnant partner.

Cheers!

I would at the very least have her talk with her ob/gyn about it and see what kind of activity they will clear her for. Every pregnancy is different. I did read a study recently that said that stress hormones in mom are not good for unborn babies. It was in regards to work related stress though and I don't know if BDSM would produce stress hormones.... I'm rambling, sorry.

Skye

I read this thread.. and read it again, pondering what I would do...

Pretty much only came up with one acceptable response to this.. Personally, if it were myself, (and I am glad to hear that you are placing your sub and her unborn child first in this matter) I would simply discuss together what types of bondage and play you are wishing to do, then make a list... I know it is an touchy subject, perhaps, but speak to a professional, a person in the medical field and ask questions. Letting them know that you wish only to keep all parties involved safe.

I know that I did discuss some of these issues with my own doctor. His advice was simple. No severe jarring, IE Bending over and really lashing at her.. No sharp jabs to the abdomen.. and no electro play.. common sense...

Still, depending on her health concerns, it is best for her to seek out the advice of a professional. Good luck with this, and I hope it helped.

~RS

Thanks for the advice. I think it's only obvious that electro-play and any sort of hard work to the abdomenal area would be out of the question. Personally I think a little light work on the back, buttocks, and breasts should be fine, but talking to a professional is always a good idea. Of course, she knows her body much more than anyone else as well, so her input will be taken seriously as well.

Do a search. I know I posted some links on a similar thread a looooooong time ago. There's not a whole lot of info out there, but at least it's something to go on.

Master and I have been able to do loose bondage (In fact, are attending a Midori workshop next month, with ok from doc), some very light flogging and spankings.

Master and I have been able to do loose bondage (In fact, are attending a Midori workshop next month, with ok from doc), some very light flogging and spankings.

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That's what i figured as well, though it's not a huge loss anyways. I would imagine the closer we get to the due date, the milder we have to play as well.

The human body is a remarkably strong, adaptable, capable machine. The myth (and it is a myth) that the female body becomes some sort of fragile thing that's going to break easily when she becomes pregnant is a Western cultural idea that is left over from the Dark Ages when sanitation was non-existant, most people ate terrible diets, and the mortality rate during childbirth was the highest it's ever been because of the poor health and filthy living conditions of people at that time.

Other cultures never forgot that women were expected to (and capable of) working in the fields, foraging, etc right up to the moment they went into labor.

There _are_ some safety concerns to keep in mind when playing with a pregnant woman though.

#1 - Don't beat her belly. That one is a no-brainer
#2 - Shoulders/upper back is fine as long as her belly isn't pressed up against something hard and unyielding.
#3 - Spanking is fine, though you probably don't want to leave marks if she's going in for regular pre-natal care. The ass and thighs are fine targets even with pregnant women. Again, keep in mind the tummy. The bigger it gets the less comfy she may be bent over, so you might have to spank her while she's standing. If your usual sstyle of spanking is likely to knock her off her feet as you apply home-run power to her ass, you might want to tone it down just a wee bit.
#4 - Bondage on the limbs - carry on as usually, within the limits of momma's comfort zone and flexibility. You are NOT going to harm baby by rope tying or cuffing mom's ankles, wrists, arms or legs.
#5 - Bondage on the breasts - You probably don't want to go toooo tight, particularly later in the pregnancy, she might start lactating! Of course, that _could_ be a turn on, so carry on.
#6 - Bondage on the abdomen - light here. Don't need to put undue pressure on the precious package. Karada's on preggers women are sexy! Can make her feel desireable when her hormones and fun house mirror are making her think she is fat and ugly.
#7 - Put her on her back, elevate her feet and cane away... bastinado, particularly if done lightly, may become a favorite way to play for her.
#8 - Electrical play above the hips is a bad idea. Don't.
#9 - Blood play (piercings, cutting, needles... ) Just as a safety thing so you don't introduce any pathogens directly into the blood stream, I would say "bad idea". But if you play with sterile instruments and clean your play area using normal blood-play precautions (though you might want to find an germicidal alternative to rubbing alcohol) I don't see any logical reason you can't, but I would rather err on the side of caution here. Again, explaining this to the doc might be a problem, so the smart idea is to say No to blood play until after baby is born.

Be guided by what _she_ is comfortable with, start slow and easy, and ramp up gradually. She will _know_, trust me on this, if things start to get more than she can handle. You have to work, really, really WORK to hurt the baby. The whole female reproductive system is designed to protect that baby and allow the mother to hunt, forage, feed, fend for itself until the baby arrives. If we weren't built that way from the start, we NEVER would have made it this far.

YIK,
- Geoff

O'Mac said:

That's what i figured as well, though it's not a huge loss anyways. I would imagine the closer we get to the due date, the milder we have to play as well.

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Yes, and beware the squirting of the breast milk lol

Evil_Geoff said:

#3 - Spanking is fine, though you probably don't want to leave marks if she's going in for regular pre-natal care. The ass and thighs are fine targets even with pregnant women. Again, keep in mind the tummy. The bigger it gets the less comfy she may be bent over, so you might have to spank her while she's standing. If your usual sstyle of spanking is likely to knock her off her feet as you apply home-run power to her ass, you might want to tone it down just a wee bit.

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I find putting a body pillow, kind of folded in half under my breasts, helps to elevate my body enough that kneeling on the bed is comfortable, as it leaves a bit of a hole for my belly to not be squished.

As Geoff says, follow her lead. She'll be sure to come up with some creative ideas for play and comfort.

Hmmm...foot caning..... *looks around for her Master*

Little Hijack /

LunarKitten I love your av

Evil_Geoff said:

The human body is a remarkably strong, adaptable, capable machine. The myth (and it is a myth) that the female body becomes some sort of fragile thing that's going to break easily when she becomes pregnant is a Western cultural idea that is left over from the Dark Ages when sanitation was non-existant, most people ate terrible diets, and the mortality rate during childbirth was the highest it's ever been because of the poor health and filthy living conditions of people at that time.


- Geoff

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True in part EG, but also not true. If you are someone unaccustomed to exercise before pregnancy, most reputable doctors and health professionals will caution you on beginning anything substantial after becoming pregnant because the body is not accustomed to using particular muscles in that way, being flexible etc., and to then start after pregnancy has begun and the body is already trying to adjust can cause problems of varying degrees based on what you might subject it to and how the body reacts to that. I imagine if you are not used to being in certain positions which might be used in bondage, to start once pregnant might incur risk to mother and possibly baby dependent on particular health and characteristics.

From my own experience of pregnancy, despite being fit and leading a fairly active life up to that point which also included regular 10+ hours on the back of motorcycles in various weather and road/off road conditions, dancing, exercise etc., once I became pregnant, there were difficulties with muscles which did not appreciate being treated quite the way they had been to that point, and joint pain which had not been there before which I was told was caused by changes within the body causing pressure and tightness. It is true babies are born everyday, but it is also true as I heard on a documentary last week that humans are the only species which have such lengthy, painful, and high ratio of birth difficulties and complications.

Catalina

Hmmm, all very sound advice. Thanks again!

I didn't scene when I was pregnant. Damn!!!

I did find I could fuck in all sorts of positions, but it wasn't comfortable in many of them, right up until I had the little angels. *snickers*

I was powerfully motivated to keep right on screwing though. I've gotta love that insecurity thing I do so well! *beams*

Fury

ImSkye said:

I would at the very least have her talk with her ob/gyn about it and see what kind of activity they will clear her for. Skye

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I'd strongly suggest that the OB/MD/Midwife be informed as to any BDSM activities. A caregiver who notices, say bruises and rope burns on a pregnant patient is trained to see those as warning flags of abuse. If the caregiver isn't OK with consensual violence, she might want to consider another caregiver. She needs honest open information for her own health, and for the baby's.

ImSkye said:

I did read a study recently that said that stress hormones in mom are not good for unborn babies. It was in regards to work related stress though and I don't know if BDSM would produce stress hormones.... I'm rambling, sorry. Skye

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I seem to remember hearing that too. But one thing to keep in mind is that we have what amounts to two separate systems for dealing with stress. One (sympathetic nervous system, in case you're wondering) produces adrenaline, the "fight or flight" hormone, which I've heard can affect a fetus negatively. (Just FYI, it also can inhibit the birth process, and make it more painful.)

The other system is the parasympathetic, which produces endorphins. These hormones produce feelings of well-being and contentment, the "runner's high", decrease sensation of pain, and ease childbirth. These hormones seem to be responsible too for "subspace", the state of consciousness that a Sub experiences with a good dom(me), in which everything is wonderful and groovy, and pain tolerance is enhanced. If this is the state in which your sub finds herself, and into which you can learn to put her with a minimum of adrenaline, then I wouldn't worry about "stress hormones".

It also oughta be great practice for birth; if she can react to the stress and pain of birth by switching on the parasympathetic system, and if you have learned how to help her do that most effectively, then your practice could be argued to be beneficial.

(Great aftercare can also make a difference; if she's brought back down from the stress, and if she takes steps to minimize stress elsewhere in her life, the baby might be better off, even with a bit of adrenaline every so often, than the mom working a continuously stressful job.)

I think I'd also note that if she seems tired in general, then you might want to go easy; her body is very busy, and I'd respect that; you could use that time to explore other aspects of your BDSM practice than "how hard can I hit you?" The Power and Trust and Service aspects of our way of doing things can be quite powerful even with a minimum of physical or emotional stress.

I'd also be wary of anything that restricts her breathing or blood flow (can restrict oxygen to fetus) or anything that restricts her movement for very long, esp. if she's on her back or on her right side (this can also restrict blood flow to the fetus). You might also go easy on her nipples and areolae. If they get damaged, it could lead to plugged milk ducts, which ain't no fun. I'd keep this as a limitation until she's done nursing, if she does that.

Please note I am not a medical professional. I am a mom, into BDSM, and studying towards certification as a Childbirth Educator. So there ya are; back to "talk to her caregiver." It'll be good practice for when she has to discuss handling the actual birth.

You might also check out this link, giving advice on a similar question: http://bondage.com/id/13/which/232/show_column.html

Geoff, I'm saving your entire post. I'm doing a lot of research in this area, as I hope to serve my local BDSM community as a childbirth educator. There's no official info out there--certainly no medical research!--so we need to talk talk talk amongst ourselves. I would like to make one comment:

Evil_Geoff said:

#7 - Put her on her back, elevate her feet and cane away... bastinado, particularly if done lightly, may become a favorite way to play for her.
- Geoff

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I'd limit any time spent doing this, especially as time goes on and the uterus gets heavier. It can press on the artery leading to the placenta, and potentially cause fetal distress. That's one reason why some hospitals are moving away from requiring women to take this position in birth.

Unless the Dom wants to do a whole medical scene, and knows how to use a fetoscope to keep tabs on mr/ms baby, (Oh, which could be fun...) then I'd limit this sort of position to a few minutes.

But Yes Yes Yes on trusting her perceptions of her body, and how tough we can be.

Do you know of any resources with more info on tying a pregnant woman in a safe way?

catalina_francisco said:

I imagine if you are not used to being in certain positions which might be used in bondage, to start once pregnant might incur risk to mother and possibly baby dependent on particular health and characteristics.
Catalina

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I think as long as they start slow, and continue slowly into any new territory, bondage and associated stuff should be safe enough. I'd think unfamiliar positions would be more "uncomfortable" than unsafe in and of themselves, with caveats described elsewhere. One thing to keep in mind; pregnant women's ligaments are much more pliable. A bit more range of movement is possible, and as long as it's not overdone, and not expected *after* birth, there shouldn't be a problem.

There are also some kinda odd positions that women are encouraged to practice as the birth approaches: if these are worked into a scene, and the mom not pushed too hard, this could be quite helpful. If she's well-practiced at, say, maintaining a deep squat for longish periods due to (sensible) practice, she'll be very well off come the birth.

catalina_francisco said:

It is true babies are born everyday, but it is also true as I heard on a documentary last week that humans are the only species which have such lengthy, painful, and high ratio of birth difficulties and complications.
Catalina

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To play devil's advocate, a case *could* be made that gentle, respectful BDSM practices could make childbirth easier and safer. Speaking from a "mom as sub" angle, at least. She'd be much less afraid of pain, and would know how to relax into it and handle it; struggling against pain can make childbirth much more difficult physically. Her Dom would know better how to get her into a headspace where this is even more likely. She might be better able to maintain birth positions which open up the pelvis to a greater degree than the standard lying-back-on-the-bed one. She'll also likely be better than the average person to be able to speak up for herself and her needs, and better able to assess what's uncomfortable but bearable, and what indicates a true problem.

It's true our births as a species are more difficult. But it's also true that standard medical practices can make it even more difficult than it has to be. Any pregnant woman/couple would do well to educate themselves as well as they can on normal birth, and then they can help ensure that they have the best outcome possible for them.

In addition to the wonderful advice given, I'd like to add that gagging should probably be avoided. Pregnant women are prone to passing out as it is, and they definitely need a clear air passage because they're breathing for two (even more so as the baby gets bigger and crowds her lungs!).
Also, there's the nausea, an expecting woman can have an attack of vomiting and nausea any time - so best never to put her in a position (gagged or otherwise) where she could suffocate or choke.

I think you'll be fine, it will just take more watchfulness on your part to make sure you are reading her correctly.