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Old 10-27-2003, 06:29 PM   #1
Chimney Sweep
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Question Help! Need womens' perseptive on non-consent.

Howdy!

I'm new here (3 stories, and thanks to those who read them!) and I'd like to submit more, but I have a bit of a writer's block (or lack of imagination, or desire to get it right - whatever) on a non-consent story.

I intend this to be another iteration of The Game:
http://www.literotica.com:81/stories....php?id=110893

Only this one with a rape fantasy. Not having done this myself, I'm unsure how to procede. I'm hoping for some guidance, perhaps just some pointers to other stories written by women about non-consent to get me moving inthe right direction.

Here is the basic setup: Girl has a fantasy of non-cnsent/rape, and she has a friend who sets up a date for her with a guy who will fulfill that fantasy. It's a role playing thing and there is a release word.

I guess what gives me pause is that I don't want to write something evil and hateful, but hot and provocative - something a woman might enjoy reading. I can give in to my own inner beast and go all out nasty, but I'm worried it will go astray.

Is that even a reasonable request or do I just need to shut up and write and see what happens?

Thx!
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Old 10-27-2003, 06:34 PM   #2
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welcome

Welcome, not that I can advise too much being a bloke, but you're wise to ask if you aren't sure. Too violent and you'll get either rejected, or slated, or both, to mild and you'll just get slated

Come on girls, we need an answer????????
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Old 10-27-2003, 06:36 PM   #3
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I'm a guy who's probably read hundreds of nc stories and I don't know that it is possible to write one that is hot and prevocative for both men and women. I say shut up and write, just write it to your own criteria. Anyone who doesn't like it can find something else to read.
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Old 10-27-2003, 07:12 PM   #4
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Ok... rape fantisy.

I have see this done several ways.

1. Woman enlists her man to role play a rape during real sex play. Boring but probably the most common in real life.

2. Man knows woman has a rape fantisy and sets up the "rape" in the dark so she can't see. Proceeds with the "rape" and in the end woman is allowed to discover the truth. This is really my favorite. It sets the scene for real emotion, fear, etc.

3. Same as either 1 or 2 above except man enlists one or more of his friends (often one is black) to carry out the rape. This I have realism problems with generally.

That just about covers it. If you can come up with a different idea more power to you. I would love to read it.

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Old 10-27-2003, 07:15 PM   #5
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Re: Help! Need womens' perseptive on non-consent.

Quote:
Originally posted by Chimney Sweep

I guess what gives me pause is that I don't want to write something evil and hateful, but hot and provocative - something a woman might enjoy reading. I can give in to my own inner beast and go all out nasty, but I'm worried it will go astray.
I do a lot on 'reluctant' sex, where the woman resists at first but soon becomes a willing participant. There's usually some force, but not violence.

It depends on how nc you want it to be. I think that the key to keep it from getting nasty is the man's motivation. You need a man who is motivated by passion and desire, and not by anger and rage. And of course, the woman has to know that this kind of thing is going to turn her on, because the man's going to take his cues from her.

What seems to make these scenes work for me is the woman's understanding that the man's actions are evidence of his desire for her and not an attemnpt to hurt her.

---dr.M.
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Old 10-27-2003, 07:31 PM   #6
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What Dr. M said.

In rape fantisy I always think of the movie "Alien". I remember sitting in a theater sweating and jumping in my seat as he tension builds endlessly. But I also remember walking out of the theater with a smile knowing that it was just a movie and the tension was gone with the final credits.

That's the way I see a good rape fantisy: Lots of building tension with a relief in the end. And As Dr M said the rape doesn't need to be violent or motivated by hatred or anger. This is "fantisy" also known as "SEX PLAY".
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Old 10-27-2003, 07:40 PM   #7
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Re: welcome

Quote:
Originally posted by pop_54
Come on girls, we need an answer????????
Dear Pop,
Just an answer or The Answer?
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Old 10-27-2003, 07:54 PM   #8
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Hey,

Rape fantasy centers on control. The key premise isn't even the sex, it's control if you are fantasizing from the perspective of the rapist or lack of control if you are fantasizing from the perspective of the victim. For most women who have a rape fantasy it's just that, a fantasy. In the fantasy they may have all sorts of unpleasant things done to them, but it's thier fantasy and they have ultimate control, similar to the control you as a writer have.

Jenny has covered the more plausible means of moving from a fantasy to a reality. A lot is dependent on you as author.

If you get a little wild or go a little overboard when you write you can cover that by setting up your female character to suit your needs. Perhaps she is a bit of a mashochist and a little rough play won't bother her. It's really up to you in how you wish to contrive it.

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Old 10-27-2003, 09:43 PM   #9
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There have been several threads on this...none of which I can locate at the moment. But yeah, to my mind, the key is the whole attitude embodied in a story rather than specific acts.

IMO, a woman who likes to read nonconsent (points to self) is looking for permission to be wild and wanton and completely sexual, totally carried away by passion. That's hard for your average middle-class American woman to manage--she doesn't really trust her own impulses, and she is still working with a legacy of "ladylike" behavior drilled into her from childhood. She doesn't have to have been born in the first half of the 20th century to have grown up in an atmosphere that subtly discouraged women's open sexual expression; in many parts of the country, the sexual revolution never really arrived, or it only arrived for men.

So in fantasy she's swept off her feet by a muscular, macho male who MAKES her do all these overwhelmingly naughty things. He might be someone she knows, but often he's a sexy stranger. She struggles, but is overcome by superior strength and determination. She feels completely desirable, because he will do anything to be with her, including 'rape'. It's all HIS fault--she didn't initiate sex or ask for certain things to be done to her, but it happens anyway. So guilt goes out the window and she can relax and enjoy herself.

Masochism, to my mind, is beside the point. The woman's desires are always central, while remaining unverbalized and possibly unconscious. The man is acting out exactly what she wants him to do--he functions as a mind-reader and releaser for her, not truly as an independent being. Genuine rape has NOTHING to do with it. It's not about being truly hurt or humiliated, at least not as a central element. But then I don't swing that way--every woman's fantasies are different, probably far more variable than men's in general. There are all shades of n/c, and I enjoy different types at different times.

MM
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Old 10-27-2003, 09:58 PM   #10
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Hi chimney..

I'm fairly new here myself but I've written a non-consent story:

http://www.literotica.com/stories/sh....php?id=111017

Like the good Dr. says of his work, I also allowed my heroine to turn from forced to partake in sex to actually enjoying and and encouraging it.

A fantasy is a fantasy. We're all different. Why not write what you feel and let someone read it to see if it's too harsh?

Good luck with it.
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Old 10-27-2003, 10:02 PM   #11
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Write it from her pont of view, weather it is third or first person, get inside of her head. Let her have some internal conflict- is it getting too real? is she wrong for enjoying it? will she be able to face herself tomorrow? Does she feel genuine fear? ect. Try to *be* her as you right. If you absolutlty can't imagine yourself as the woman, I wouldn't attempt the story the way you are trying to write it.
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Old 10-27-2003, 10:04 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Madame Manga

She feels completely desirable, because he will do anything to be with her, including 'rape'. It's all HIS fault--she didn't initiate sex or ask for certain things to be done to her, but it happens anyway. So guilt goes out the window and she can relax and enjoy herself.

Madame M, that's exactly how I understand it. Exactly. I kept only those three lines above because I think you hit the essence of this fantasy squarely on the head there. The man's 'violence' is an expression of his desire, and I think the woman (in fantasies) understands that. I think that's what's behind all the abduction and forced-sex fantasies: he wants her so badly he'll stop at nothing. And of course, he then forces her to do all the things she secretly wants to do.

I'll go out on a limb and say something else: I think a lot of the violence in D/s--the whippings and spankings--also works off that same dynamic. The woman recognizes that she's in some way responsible for the man's raging desire, and the whipping or spanking is a measure of his lust for her. He's willing to break the taboo over hitting her because of his passion.

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Old 10-27-2003, 10:10 PM   #13
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I posted one nonconsent story, it got easily twice as many looks as my BDSM stuff but much lower votes. It was more of a "consent by seduction" thing about a kidnap victim than a rape fantasy.

The feedback I got from women was overwhelmingly positive, the feedback from men was that "it wasn't nasty enough." Nonconsent is a popular category and you'll get lots of reads; I don't especially enjoy most of the stories in the category but it can be a good story when well written. The inherent drama and conflict is built in by the category.

I think your own advice is best -- just write it and see what happens.
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Old 10-27-2003, 10:20 PM   #14
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The truth about Non-consent...

Real non-consent is spelled RAPE in large type in every newspaper in the country.

Fantasy non-consent actually centers on the woman's desire to be taken in such a way that she can actually be uninhibited about it. Underline CENTERS ON THE WOMAN'S DESIRE here. True, it may be an unconsious, more or less dormant desire on her part, but it is her desire nonetheless that we are talking about here.

For conformation read any romance novel written in the 1950's, and 60's for a better understanding of the mental imaging. In general all women wish that their lovers could read their mind's desires, almost as much as they wish that they could read their other half's mind all the time. LOL Now if you take all of this into count when you write your story it'll be a hit.

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Old 10-27-2003, 11:08 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Seattle Zack

The feedback I got from women was overwhelmingly positive, the feedback from men was that "it wasn't nasty enough."
That's about what I'd expect. Warning: generalizations ahead.

A male-centered nonconsent story (of which I have read more than I wanted) is almost always about a man taking out his frustration on a woman who has rejected him, or on a proxy for her. He is angry, because he's been deprived or put down or otherwise made to feel less powerful than he thinks he ought to be. It is not about the woman or her desires or genuinely about his desire for her--it's about how he goes about getting what HE wants, and especially, getting even.

As a result, hurting and humiliation are an integral part of such a story, though they may not be particularly overt. If the story isn't nasty in some sense, it lacks its point. If a woman who enjoys n/c reads a story like this, she is usually left with a sour taste in the mouth--this wasn't at all what she was after. The woman is turned into a receptacle for the man's actions and aggressions instead of being the focus of the story. She is ultimately irrelevant, and even the most masochistically oriented woman usually wants to be the center of attention.

That is not to say that every man enjoys a revenge scenario, or that a man can't write a woman-centered n/c story and get a kick out of it. Plenty of men understand feminine psychology and are able to make wise use of it to give women a thrill.

MM
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Old 10-28-2003, 06:23 AM   #16
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Re: The truth about Non-consent...

Quote:
Real non-consent is spelled RAPE in large type in every newspaper in the country.
Yup. This is why I've so far discarded every attempt I've ever had at writing an NC themed story. I have never really come to terms with the happy victim scenario.

However, now I think I have one that will work, because it has the paticipants reacting in a more realistic way. I have a non-consent situation that I've been working that might be a bit over the top for many readers in terms of bordering on downright rape.

I have a man and a woman meeting and chatting over the Internet (possibly here on the Lit borads?). They hit it off, and discover that they share a few mutual fantasies. The most powerful of those would be a rape situation. Finally, they agree to meet and act it out as a full scale role play, from meeting "as strangers" in a bar, and ending in a faux rape. Then they'd leave and go back to their respective lives.

This happens, and we follow this part through the eyes of the man. He meets the woman in the bar, and gives a really convincing flirty-gentleman-turning-agressor performance. And he finds her victim preformance to be just as good. As agreed, he leaves her without a word, goes home and logs on to discuss the experience with her.

...and is met with those words: "Where the hell were you? I waited for hours!"
Wrong bar, wrong woman.

This story is merely the intro to the real story though, a lengthy, tenative and nervous romance between the man and that other woman, two from chock and guilt pretty messed up individuals.

I would have to dig deep into both of their minds to make this story fly and I have no idea if this will be anything very erotic, and if it really have a place on Lit, due to the nature of the initial rape situation. We'll see...
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Old 10-28-2003, 09:14 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Madame Manga


IMO, a woman who likes to read nonconsent (points to self) is looking for permission to be wild and wanton and completely sexual, totally carried away by passion. That's hard for your average middle-class American woman to manage--she doesn't really trust her own impulses, and she is still working with a legacy of "ladylike" behavior drilled into her from childhood. She doesn't have to have been born in the first half of the 20th century to have grown up in an atmosphere that subtly discouraged women's open sexual expression; in many parts of the country, the sexual revolution never really arrived, or it only arrived for men.

I feel so sorry for average middle-clas American women.



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Old 10-28-2003, 03:28 PM   #18
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Re: Re: The truth about Non-consent...

Quote:
Originally posted by Icingsugar

a man and a woman... over the Internet... share a few mutual fantasies... agree to meet and act it out.. meeting "as strangers".. ending in a faux rape. Then...go back to their respective lives... He meets the woman in the bar... goes home and logs on ....and is met with those words: "Where the hell were you? I waited for hours!"...a lengthy, tenative and nervous romance between the man and that other woman, two from chock and guilt pretty messed up individuals.
I think this would be an awsome story. Love the twist.

I'm really hope you'll write it- I'm almost begging. And yes, I think it would be erotic.

Anther possiblitly is that something holds him up, and the woman really gets 'date raped', but thinks it's part of the roll-play. When she finds out the truth, she doesnt' know how to feel about it.

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Old 10-28-2003, 05:02 PM   #19
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Thanks for all the input! I think I have an angle on how to handle it now. In fact, I've started another one with more accessable motivation that should serve as a stepping stone. SO many stories half done.......it's hard to transition from the setup and charcter generation to the bump and grind without losing continuity and tone. Practice, practice, practice....

ps - my high school English teacher would be aghast at my use of her tutelage.
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Old 10-28-2003, 07:07 PM   #20
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A bit late here, but feeling the need to comment and damn myself to eternal hellfire or public censure. It's always so reassuring to find that I'm a worse pervert than even I thought.

I read a lot of non-consent stories. They're my preferred reading matter. I'm branching out into more of the BDsM stories because many of them have similar elements as pointed out by Dr. M. I have a dislike for a certain widely used theme, however, that can be found in both stories: the woman who instantly becomes a cum-guzzling slut upon being raped.

My problem is not what most would immediately assume. I'm don't get up in arms about the realities of rape not being a turn on because these are fantasies. Nobody is saying that rape is good or that women ought to like it or that anyone should promote it or deserves it. That's for the knee-jerk pc crowd of whom I will never be a member.

I hate that a perfectly good rape fantasy is often ruined by taking the element of non-consent out of it. I read non-consent stories on purpose. I'm a woman and I like orgasms, but I read NC stories from more of a voyeuristic stance than from a personal one. I'm not the woman in the story. I'm watching what happens to her. I don't personally like pain and humiliation, but that doesn't mean that I find reading about it offensive or a turn off. I don't find it offensive or a turn-off if the woman in a non-consent story doesn't climax or even become aroused.

I'm sure there are all kinds of Freudian pronouncements that could be made, but I'm not all that interested. Or, rather, I should say I'm not concerned. The theories might indeed be interesting, but insofar as whether I'm worried that I might be "ill", nah, nothin' doing.

So all this just goes to say that there's at least one reader and (from my conversations with others) probably quite a few who don't mind if the story gets rough and stays rough. Some people read non-consent but want the story to back off and change to a happy ending. Others of us don't mind sticking it through with a consistent non-consent theme.

There's a female author who's name I can't recall at the moment who writes pretty tough NC stories that resolve in a way that I much prefer to the "change of heart" type. Why not have it be truly non-consensual and then let the woman kick a little ass afterward if you feel the need for redemption?


-B
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Old 10-28-2003, 07:10 PM   #21
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hiya

if she aint objecting it aint rape, full stop.

if she is it's illegal. full stop.

we often have our little game and pretend we're being 'forced', but you can't call it rape, cos we want it. rape fantasy can only be in the head of the bloke doing it, not the bird wanting it.
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Old 10-28-2003, 07:26 PM   #22
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Re: Help! Need womens' perseptive on non-consent.

Quote:
Originally posted by Chimney Sweep
Howdy!

I'm new here (3 stories, and thanks to those who read them!) and I'd like to submit more, but I have a bit of a writer's block (or lack of imagination, or desire to get it right - whatever) on a non-consent story.

I intend this to be another iteration of The Game:
http://www.literotica.com:81/stories....php?id=110893

Only this one with a rape fantasy. Not having done this myself, I'm unsure how to procede. I'm hoping for some guidance, perhaps just some pointers to other stories written by women about non-consent to get me moving inthe right direction.

Here is the basic setup: Girl has a fantasy of non-cnsent/rape, and she has a friend who sets up a date for her with a guy who will fulfill that fantasy. It's a role playing thing and there is a release word.

I guess what gives me pause is that I don't want to write something evil and hateful, but hot and provocative - something a woman might enjoy reading. I can give in to my own inner beast and go all out nasty, but I'm worried it will go astray.

Is that even a reasonable request or do I just need to shut up and write and see what happens?

Thx!

i say write to your own tastes. believe it or not, not every woman enjoys reading the "giving her what she really wants" type of nonconsent story. i tend to go more for the brutal selfish stuff myself...i click right off the stories that involve the woman enjoying the experience or developing some sort of emotional bond with her "attacker". when i want to read nonconsent erotica, i want to read about nonconsentual acts. but what i like is neither here nor there...read what you like, and there will be others who will like it as well, male and female, regardless of what type of nonconsent you make it.
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Old 10-29-2003, 09:45 AM   #23
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Re: Re: Help! Need womens' perseptive on non-consent.

Quote:
Originally posted by ownedsubgal
i say write to your own tastes. believe it or not, not every woman enjoys reading the "giving her what she really wants" type of nonconsent story. i tend to go more for the brutal selfish stuff myself...i click right off the stories that involve the woman enjoying the experience or developing some sort of emotional bond with her "attacker". when i want to read nonconsent erotica, i want to read about nonconsentual acts. but what i like is neither here nor there...read what you like, and there will be others who will like it as well, male and female, regardless of what type of nonconsent you make it.
hi there! I am a female, and I have written a couple of nonconsent stories, well more, but only posted a couple. They have been received well, got lots of good feedback. The link is in my sig line. On my page, She:the taking... is a true story, I have another one that i am just not ready to tell yet.
Hope that can help you some PM me if you want to ask something I didnt put in the story, ok?

bye 4 now and good luck withyour endeavors!! maria
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