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Old 11-29-2017, 07:38 PM   #26
FutureFiction
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Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
Sorry, I find it hard to take seriously someone pontificating on the perfectly written story and on how ratings should be given who shows no evidence of writing stories. In writing terms we call this show, not tell, and take it as a goal.

My view of a perfect story critiquer is one who can back up their views with perfect story writing themselves.
I can understand why a professional writer might value the opinions of other writers more than the average reader. But I donít think a person should have to be a writer, director, or cinematographer to be a respected film critic. You either respect a personís opinion or you donít. And you either like something or you donít. Itís as simple as that.

And I wonít be posting stories here any time soon. If I create any literary work in the near future, it will be in the form of visual novels / interactive movies.
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Old 11-29-2017, 07:52 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by electricblue66 View Post
As a writer, your list of prescriptive requirements (they're not desirements because you want to change so many things in the source material) is, frankly, so bizarre that I wonder how you get enjoyment out of material here at all.

Your stance, ultimately, denies writers their own creativity and makes you the reader the most important part of the relationship - whereas it's actually the other way around.

Writers generally write what they want to write because they're either exploring their inner world (I'm an example of that) or they're catering to a broad audience. Readers get on board those trains, and it's the writer's creativity they follow. Especially if they don't / can't write themselves.
I think customer, viewer, or reader satisfaction is the most important part of the relationship.

Iím grateful for the work of the few writers that I like, but I have a completely different way of thinking about things. Your words ďreaders get on board those trainsĒ made think about something that I call the fictional wall. The video is a depiction of the psychological pain that I usually feel when Iím reading a novel that Iím not enjoying or watching the average movie or television show. The linear journeys and the collisions are representations of a series of predictable and undesirable and storylines. I want to reduce the collisions by making semi-linear / modifiable storylines more prevalent. Itís just another way of thinking about the creation of novels and screenplays.
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Old 11-29-2017, 10:03 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by FutureFiction View Post
I can understand why a professional writer might value the opinions of other writers more than the average reader. But I donít think a person should have to be a writer, director, or cinematographer to be a respected film critic. You either respect a personís opinion or you donít. And you either like something or you donít. Itís as simple as that.

And I wonít be posting stories here any time soon. If I create any literary work in the near future, it will be in the form of visual novels / interactive movies.
I think a nonwriting critic needs to have more going for them than just self-appointed opinions about writing and simply "liking" or not "liking" a story doesn't have much to do with meaningful writing critique, but it's fine with me if you think otherwise.
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Old 11-30-2017, 01:00 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by FutureFiction View Post
My idea of the perfect Literotica story is HectorBidon's "Waiting for the locksmith" (https://www.literotica.com/s/waiting-for-the-locksmith). It's a simple story, in a sort of understated Faulkneresque style, that, man, just hits every one of my buttons dead on.
Why thanks. What a nice thing to say. I'm glad you liked it.

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If everybody wrote like Hector, it would definitely be an improvement over the current way of doing things.
I don't know if I'd go that far. There are a lot of good authors on this site. But I appreciate you including me in the list.

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As a heterosexual female with "gentle, but arousingly full and feminine" breasts and an interest in immersive stories, the first thing that I search for before I decide to read a story is Hector's byline.
Come on. Really? I'm blushing.

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I sleep in the nude, dreaming that I'm wrapped in Hector's arms.
Still blushing. But sweet of you to say. In fact, I think this was the sweetest post I've ever read on the AH.

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Old 11-30-2017, 01:27 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by FutureFiction View Post
I think customer, viewer, or reader satisfaction is the most important part of the relationship.
We'll agree to differ, then.

I write for myself, with little regard for my reader's interests or desires - I certainly wouldn't change anything I wrote to cater for a perceived audience desire.

But I do know that those who follow me do so because they want to read stories written with my particular style; and a part of their interest is to read whatever it is I come up with next (in other words, they are quite content for my hand to hold the pen, and for their fingers to turn the page).

So in my case, it IS a one way feed. Of course it's nice to get a favourable audience response, but never at the expense of my own creativity.
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Old 11-30-2017, 10:02 AM   #31
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Funny, I thought the idea of fiction in the first place was to delve into the imagination of the writer and perhaps . . . steel yourself . . . learn to see something from another perspective. If all we wanted was to have every story tailor made to fit our fetishes, proclivities, and preferences, no one would ever learn a new technique and there certainly wouldn't be any surprise or twist endings. On Literotica especially, I see each tale as almost a voyeuristic foray into another person's head. Tout AI all you want; nothing will ever surpass the human mind for sheer creativity. And AI will never have any concept of the feel of skin against skin, the nuances of orgasms, voices, or hearts.
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Old 11-30-2017, 12:31 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by FutureFiction View Post
And I wonít be posting stories here any time soon. If I create any literary work in the near future, it will be in the form of visual novels / interactive movies.
Thanks,

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Old 11-30-2017, 02:34 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by electricblue66 View Post
We'll agree to differ, then.

I write for myself, with little regard for my reader's interests or desires - I certainly wouldn't change anything I wrote to cater for a perceived audience desire.

But I do know that those who follow me do so because they want to read stories written with my particular style; and a part of their interest is to read whatever it is I come up with next (in other words, they are quite content for my hand to hold the pen, and for their fingers to turn the page).

So in my case, it IS a one way feed. Of course it's nice to get a favourable audience response, but never at the expense of my own creativity.
Most writers write for themselves and thereís nothing wrong with that. I just want another layer of algorithms to be added to the experience of reading content on electronic devices. The plots and dialog in an interactive novel / movie would still be derived from the minds of writers. But the viewer or reader could have the option of altering some of the details in a story, or they could choose a specific path or protagonist that they would like to follow.
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Old 11-30-2017, 02:44 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by igottapussy View Post
Funny, I thought the idea of fiction in the first place was to delve into the imagination of the writer and perhaps . . . steel yourself . . . learn to see something from another perspective.
I enjoy the process of delving into the minds of writers, and learning new things and seeing things from different perspectives.

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If all we wanted was to have every story tailor made to fit our fetishes, proclivities, and preferences, no one would ever learn a new technique and there certainly wouldn't be any surprise or twist endings. On Literotica especially, I see each tale as almost a voyeuristic foray into another person's head.
I think erotic fiction is different than other genres (especially if the story is very pornographic). I donít know about you, but when Iím sexually aroused, I would prefer to see and hear things that are aligned with my sexual preferences. Non-erotic stories are different.

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Tout AI all you want; nothing will ever surpass the human mind for sheer creativity. And AI will never have any concept of the feel of skin against skin, the nuances of orgasms, voices, or hearts.
Thatís debatable. Ask a random group of scientists and engineers about the future of AI, and you wonít get a consensus beyond a general statement like, thereís a high probability that it will change the way we live and think about the human condition before the end of this century. But you wonít get any detailed answers describing the architecture of AGI / ASI or when it will be created. Anything beyond artificial narrow intelligence is still an ambiguous theoretical possibility.

And then thereís also the possibility of merging biology with technology. What are the theoretical limits of nanotechnology, cybernetics, and synthetic biology?
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Old 11-30-2017, 03:06 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by FutureFiction View Post
Most writers write for themselves and thereís nothing wrong with that. I just want another layer of algorithms to be added to the experience of reading content on electronic devices. The plots and dialog in an interactive novel / movie would still be derived from the minds of writers. But the viewer or reader could have the option of altering some of the details in a story, or they could choose a specific path or protagonist that they would like to follow.
They already do. Some of my stories posted on Literotica have been stolen and posted elsewhere with alterations.
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electricblue66:
It's like [oggbashan] is writing for the third puffin over there by the sixth rock, when everyone else is an emperor penguin in the Antarctic, where there's tens of thousands of the bastards.

ďThe inimitable stories of Tong-King never have any real ending, and this one, being in his most elevated style, has even less end than most of them. But the whole narrative is permeated with the odour of joss-sticks and honourable high-mindedness, and the two characters are both of noble birth.Ē
― Ernest Bramah, Wallet of Kai Lung
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Old 11-30-2017, 07:01 PM   #36
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Heh, I have a story that a reader called "perfect"... ("For Her Too"). Does that count?

The mental editing you describe I've done myself... in the Incest category, for example, some stories become really sweet gradual erotica when you alter them to make the characters unrelated.

You seem to be describing Interactive fiction / enhanced novels with a touch of up-front customization for personal preferences. Interactive fiction (of the non-game variety) is growing in popularly... from weirdness like "Tap" from Wattpad to Inkle to, er, there's another big interactive story site I can't remember right now. Some AI could make the niche a lot better, though AI is unlikely to ever replace authors completely. They lack imagination.

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Old 11-30-2017, 09:57 PM   #37
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You seem to be describing Interactive fiction / enhanced novels with a touch of up-front customization for personal preferences. Interactive fiction (of the non-game variety) is growing in popularly... from weirdness like "Tap" from Wattpad to Inkle to, er, there's another big interactive story site I can't remember right now. Some AI could make the niche a lot better, though AI is unlikely to ever replace authors completely. They lack imagination.
Your last sentence for me is the key point. All of the discussion re AI and interactivity seems to miss the point that somewhere along the line you have to generate all of the inputs to allow the multiple paths and personalisation the OP wants to see.

Pony up with money and I can see someone hacking all this content out (like colouring by numbers) but it all sounds pretty soulless and unerotic to me. Like most video porn.

It ain't going to happen in my life time - I've been reading this kind of speculation for decades, and just look at all the written content, written the traditional way, by scribblers.
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Old 12-01-2017, 03:21 AM   #38
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I started this thread to have a discussion about idealism and the future of storytelling.

Perfection (within the realm of art and fiction) is mostly perception. Itís something thatís in the mind of the reader. My idea of the perfect Literotica story is something that doesnít exist in this world. Itís something that could be described as a theoretical possibility in the future, or it could be something from another reality where interactive fiction is more prevalent, and Chyoo 5.0 (not 3.0) is up and running in 2017 with more active readers and writers than the main site.

Some writers strive for perfection by trying to be original and unpredictable, or by thinking about things like their fan base, logical consistency, or scientific and historical accuracy. Writers can strive for perfection, but I think itís impossible for a story to be perfect (especially erotic stories) if itís not at least partially interactive or modifiable.

So whatís your idea of the perfect erotic story? And what do you think is the future of storytelling?
*Reads your shit*
I don't wanna say that you might have a little OCD there, but you've definitely got a little OCD there, buddy.

I also make imaginary edits to movies I watch, but only the ones that I don't like. In my opinion, I think that "perfection" is purely perspective. I think the saying goes "Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder." It works well here with the concept of what you might call perfect. What you might like might not be what someone else is looking for in their stories.

If you wanted an answer for your question regarding what would be the perfect erotic story then I'd say mine would be one that perfectly caters to my personal tastes. Thing is, we're not looking to find the perfect erotic story, we're looking for a good, entertaining erotic story that meets our tastes and what we want from an erotic story.

Everyone is different. Some want rough, nasty shit that they can get their hands dirty with right away from the start. Some want more gentle, sensual shit. Some might want more adventurous, more taboo, and more out there kind of raunchy stuff. Some might even want a fuller story behind their erotica rather than simple textual porn.

Perfect porn doesn't exist neither does a perfect story. If you want to make something that caters perfectly to you then write that shit yourself. That's what I'm doing right now.

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Old 12-01-2017, 03:28 AM   #39
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Why thanks. What a nice thing to say. I'm glad you liked it.



I don't know if I'd go that far. There are a lot of good authors on this site. But I appreciate you including me in the list.



Come on. Really? I'm blushing.



Still blushing. But sweet of you to say. In fact, I think this was the sweetest post I've ever read on the AH.


That's funny.
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Old 12-01-2017, 07:04 AM   #40
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The other side of the picture - The Bad Sex Awards

The short list for this year's bad sex awards has been announced:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ders-in-quotes

One quote:

He puts his hands on Biancaís shoulders and slips off her low-cut top. Suddenly inspired, he whispers into her ear, as if to himself: ĎI desire the landscape that is enveloped in this woman, a landscape I do not know but that I can feel, and until I have unfolded that landscape, I will not be happy Öí

Bianca shivers with pleasure. Simon whispers to her with an authority that he has never felt before: ĎLetís construct an assemblage.í
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electricblue66:
It's like [oggbashan] is writing for the third puffin over there by the sixth rock, when everyone else is an emperor penguin in the Antarctic, where there's tens of thousands of the bastards.

ďThe inimitable stories of Tong-King never have any real ending, and this one, being in his most elevated style, has even less end than most of them. But the whole narrative is permeated with the odour of joss-sticks and honourable high-mindedness, and the two characters are both of noble birth.Ē
― Ernest Bramah, Wallet of Kai Lung
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Old 12-01-2017, 04:52 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by oggbashan View Post
The short list for this year's bad sex awards has been announced:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ders-in-quotes

One quote:

He puts his hands on Biancaís shoulders and slips off her low-cut top. Suddenly inspired, he whispers into her ear, as if to himself: ĎI desire the landscape that is enveloped in this woman, a landscape I do not know but that I can feel, and until I have unfolded that landscape, I will not be happy Öí

Bianca shivers with pleasure. Simon whispers to her with an authority that he has never felt before: ĎLetís construct an assemblage.í
Wow! I'm so aroused right now...amazingly erotic!
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== Results from bdsmtest.org == 99% Switch / 91% Voyeur / 87% Degradee / 85% Experimentalist / 77% Non-monogamist 77% Submissive / 76% Rope bunny / 74% Degrader / 70% Rigger / 66% Dominant / 60% Master/Mistress / 52% Exhibitionist / 36% Slave / 34% Owner / 25% Vanilla / 23% Masochist / 13% Sadist
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Old 12-03-2017, 12:11 AM   #42
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So, "perfect" is a myth. There is no "perfect" that will work for everyone. "Perfect" is relative to each person, and still very unrealistic. The perfect example is: What works for me, doesn't work for you or the next person.
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Old 12-03-2017, 09:18 AM   #43
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I think the only perfection is in the eye of the beholder's imagination and only for that one, first time. After that it wouldn't have the same effect. You shouldn't be searching for the perfect interactive story but expanding your imagination.
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