Old 09-13-2017, 02:15 PM   #1
HisArpy
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Thumbs down This fucking sucks

I have a book that my publisher submitted to one of the PROFESSIONAL review businesses months ago. She followed the guidelines and got the confirmation of submission.

No review.

Waiting . . .

No review.

More waiting . . .

My publisher sends an email: "Hey, whats up with the delay? We're going on 9 months since submission."

Email back - "checking"

"Submission declined for review".

WTF? They take PORN and review it and my book isn't porn. I could post it here and be WELL WITHIN the forum guidelines. (I can't do that however.) They don't have any restrictions on content and my publisher has submitted other similar erotica works with them and gotten reviews. AND, we submitted well before release.

Fucking bastards.

No I won't say which review magazine. What I will say is that this was their JOB and they FUCKED IT UP and I'm paying for it with low sales. I can't submit to another review house because; 1. I'm already on the shelf, and 2. All review submissions MUST BE done at the same time to all the review companies. So, you get 1 shot to everyone (don't forget about the FEES!) or you get hosed.

I swear I've never seen an industry so screwed up as the publishing industry. The people in MY other line of work aren't even this bad; and lawyers are the biggest assholes I've ever met. Bar none.

Anyway, rant over. Feel free to post your own stress release if you need to.
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Old 09-13-2017, 03:46 PM   #2
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You make me want to stay an amateur.
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Old 09-13-2017, 05:15 PM   #3
sr71plt
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Just putting something out for review doesn't get it reviewed. Very little of what is requested for review is reviewed. Now that there's many times more on offer than was being published thirty years ago, even a smaller percentage of what is sent out for review is being reviewed. Most of what is reviewed is what is being produced by big, mainstream publishers (and then only for books given big marketing budgets) or academic publishers (who require peer review).
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Old 09-13-2017, 05:30 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sr71plt View Post
Just putting something out for review doesn't get it reviewed. Very little of what is requested for review is reviewed. Now that there's many times more on offer than was being published thirty years ago, even a smaller percentage of what is sent out for review is being reviewed. Most of what is reviewed is what is being produced by big, mainstream publishers (and then only for books given big marketing budgets) or academic publishers (who require peer review).
This may be true, but when a company is in business to collaborate with LIBRARIES to review new releases and recommend whether libraries should order a copy or two, they'd BETTER BE reviewing EVERYTHING. Otherwise libraries are getting short changed by the businesses they hire and subscribe with to do just that sort of thing.

As to the industry as a whole, try this one; slush is frowned on. Yet there have been many national bestsellers which were denied submission because they were unsolicited manuscripts. My point to that being, the INDUSTRY is in the business of reading manuscripts to find the winners for publication. If they don't accept new reading materials, how exactly do they find that Mozart level author in the slush pile? That's their JOB and they don't just NOT do it, they make it the author's fault that they REFUSE to do it.

This has nothing to do with marketing at all. It has everything to do with the fact that the industry sucks because the people in it suck. And then they blame the authors for it.

Yes I'm pissed. I have a good reason to be pissed. Does it change anything? No. But I'm still pissed.
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Old 09-13-2017, 06:05 PM   #5
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I'm sorry. Reality doesn't operate on your wishes. Nobody obligates anyone else to provide a book review on demand--unless you paid for one and they didn't deliver but cashed your check.
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Old 09-13-2017, 06:51 PM   #6
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I'm sorry. Reality doesn't operate on your wishes. Nobody obligates anyone else to provide a book review on demand--unless you paid for one and they didn't deliver but cashed your check.
This is what I call "Welcome to Beta-world" thinking.

Beta-World is a place where people create things and put them up for use by the public. Either for free or for sale.

Most often the product is junk. However, Beta-World merely says that perhaps the user should have chosen a better product, assuming; a. A better product exists; and b. That it's the consumers fault that the product sucks because they chose it instead of a different one.

Moral: When you are in business, you are IN BUSINESS. If you can't or won't satisfy your customers and suppliers, you're failing.
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Old 09-13-2017, 07:12 PM   #7
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Moral: When you are in business, you are IN BUSINESS. If you can't or won't satisfy your customers and suppliers, you're failing.
Huh? No. You're failing if you don't make money. And even then you are not failing if you can sell the business before it implodes.

Customers? Satisfaction? Irrelevant. Amazon Prime is the model of the future - pay for the privilege of getting things soon after you pay for them, which used to be an assumed circumstance back when you went to the store to buy something. Getting money for nothing is the golden rule today.

Anyway, what pilot said. If you're not paying for service, don't expect service.
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Old 09-14-2017, 12:13 AM   #8
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I get your argument HisArpy, but it's like this...

When you are trying to bake bread, you are restricted by the amount of ovens. So too here. They can't review it all.

But still, if they imply they will review it and change their mind, they got a duty to notify.
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Old 09-14-2017, 12:24 AM   #9
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Moral: When you are in business, you are IN BUSINESS. If you can't or won't satisfy your customers and suppliers, you're failing.
I think your problem (other than that sense of entitlement) is that you think you are the customer of a book review service. You're not. The customer is the reader of their reviews. And book review services, like mainstream publishers, have no problem with low supply--just the opposite.
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Old 09-14-2017, 10:18 AM   #10
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I think your problem (other than that sense of entitlement) is that you think you are the customer of a book review service. You're not. The customer is the reader of their reviews. And book review services, like mainstream publishers, have no problem with low supply--just the opposite.

Once again you miss the point and substitute Beta-World.

I submitted a manuscript for review. They failed to do their part after ACCEPTING the submission. When queried on why, rather than say "oops", they just dumped my book and inferred that I was to blame for it without specifying a reason or cause.

They could have said months ago that they don't review that type of manuscript and pointed to their guidelines (which don't limit what they will accept). They could have sent a notice apologizing for the delay. They could have actually done their job even with the delay.

But they didn't.

As to entitlement, bullshit. I worked just as hard as you did for you works and everyone else here who submits work for us to read. i produced a book that a publisher thought worthy of marketing. I got through th gauntlet by perseverance and luck just like everyone else who succeeds. To be metaphorically murdered by a lazy Son of a Bitch who can't or won't do their job isn't a sense of entitlement, it's rage.

And if you can't see that, you need to go work on your character development skills.
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Old 09-14-2017, 10:53 AM   #11
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Interesting thread...

If you can filter the sarcasm and the snark, there are key issues in some of the discussion that are important to note.

I don't have anything to contribute yet but I am keeping an eye on this thread.
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Old 09-14-2017, 01:04 PM   #12
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Once again you miss the point and substitute Beta-World.
No, Arpy, I'm talking real world. You're stuck in false entitlement.
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Old 09-14-2017, 01:34 PM   #13
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They could have said months ago that they don't review that type of manuscript and pointed to their guidelines (which don't limit what they will accept). They could have sent a notice apologizing for the delay. They could have actually done their job even with the delay.

But they didn't.
Now show me in the contract where it says they must do those things.

What? No written, signed contract? Gee. You read some words on the web somewhere and you seem to think they're in some sense binding. That's not even quaint; it's simply absurd.

Being ignored sucks, but that's what will happen when you produce a over-produced commodity. We tell this to new people here frequently - no one is obligated to read, comment on, or rate your story. Well, it's not just here. No one is obligated to pay attention to you anywhere, unless they signed something promising to.

You can accuse them of bring rude. That's literally all you have to work with.
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Old 09-14-2017, 02:13 PM   #14
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Now show me in the contract where it says they must do those things.

What? No written, signed contract? Gee. You read some words on the web somewhere and you seem to think they're in some sense binding. That's not even quaint; it's simply absurd.

Being ignored sucks, but that's what will happen when you produce a over-produced commodity. We tell this to new people here frequently - no one is obligated to read, comment on, or rate your story. Well, it's not just here. No one is obligated to pay attention to you anywhere, unless they signed something promising to.

You can accuse them of bring rude. That's literally all you have to work with.
Trust me on this, you have no idea what you're talking about. For reference, see my profile and link to my bio. I actually DO know what I'm talking about.

A basic contract is created when there is an offer and acceptance and something of value is exchanged - be that goods, services or remuneration. I submitted my manuscript and they accepted it for review. I didn't just offer it, they ACCEPTED IT. A contract came into existence and that moment in time which they then breached when they failed to perform.

The contract isn't actionable, but that doesn't mean it's not there.
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Old 09-14-2017, 03:06 PM   #15
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Obviously you just are going to refuse to acknowledge that this is how the system works--for everyone, not just you--Arpy. So it's fine to leave it that way. You're without a review and refuse to acknowledge that you aren't owed one. But you are still without a review. Join the club.
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Old 09-14-2017, 04:29 PM   #16
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You keep saying accepting. You sent them the manuscript and they didn't send it back. Is that what makes you think they accepted it? Did they send you a letter of acceptance?

90% of stuff publishers received back in the paper and pen days, ended up in the circular file. Today it is even easier to get rid of. It is called the delete button. Just because you sent it, does not mean they accepted it.

Did you pay for this service? If not, then you don't have a leg to stand on with your anger.
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Old 09-14-2017, 05:54 PM   #17
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The contract isn't actionable, but that doesn't mean it's not there.
Contracts that aren't actionable. What will they think of next? Let us know how far you get with your non-actionable, implicit, no-ink-used contract.

No, don't. You're going on ignore because despite being a lawyer, you don't seem to understand that "I want it" doesn't mean "you get it." And ranting about it here gets you nowhere. Good luck with whatever you try next.
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Old 09-14-2017, 08:00 PM   #18
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Perhaps they did you a favor.

Are you looking for honest feedback?

I read the prologue and first three preview chapters on Amazon: It's pretty bad, horrible really.

- All tell no show

- unrealistic premise, unrealistic characters, unrealistic dialogue.

- bad prose, bad dialogue, bad fucking everything.

- a dude trying to write female characters is hard, a dude writing Lesbian characters is nigh impossible.

Why would anyone buy this? I wonder. You couldn't pay me to read this.

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Old 09-15-2017, 01:28 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Dream_Operator View Post
- All show no tell

- unrealistic premise, unrealistic characters, unrealistic dialogue.

- bad prose, bad dialogue, bad fucking everything.

- a dude trying to write female characters is hard, a dude writing Lesbian characters is nigh impossible.

Why would anyone buy this? I wonder. You couldn't pay me to read this.
I'm guessing you meant "...all tell, no show".


Well, the OP got a fairly brutal piece of unsolicited feedback right there - and he can't do a thing about it coz there ain't no contract!

Almost tempts me to go see for myself, but if I pay attention to reviews, why bother!!

Note to OP: be careful what you ask for. Because you might just get it.

This thread's been a good chuckle track, thanks all!
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Old 09-15-2017, 02:27 AM   #20
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- a dude trying to write female characters is hard, a dude writing Lesbian characters is nigh impossible.
*peeks at blurb*

OP is marketing a lesbian romance, under a LGBT imprint, with a blurb that describes one of the main characters as "perfect except for her Lesbian side"?

I think lack of reviews might not be the only thing hurting sales here.
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Old 09-15-2017, 09:20 AM   #21
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Thank you to everyone for the feedback. Your uncaring brutality does wonders for my ego.
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Old 09-15-2017, 09:42 AM   #22
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Thank you to everyone for the feedback. Your uncaring brutality does wonders for my ego.
All part of the service provided by your peers. I recommend coffee and a sense of humor coz this is not Sensitivity Central.

Now whose going to step up next for their round of abuse and criticism? I feel I've done my bit lately. Lol.
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Old 09-15-2017, 10:08 AM   #23
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All part of the service provided by your peers. I recommend coffee and a sense of humor coz this is not Sensitivity Central.

Now whose going to step up next for their round of abuse and criticism? I feel I've done my bit lately. Lol.
Yup, somewhere in that 100k words per weekend, there's pearls

There's a Bowie song all about you, Chloe:

"China Girl" is a song written by David Bowie and Iggy Pop during their years in Berlin, first appearing on Pop's debut solo album, The Idiot (1977). The song became more widely known when it was re-recorded by Bowie, who released it as the second single from his most commercially successful album, Let's Dance (1983). The UK single release of Bowie's version reached No. 2 for one week on 14 June 1983, behind "Every Breath You Take" by the Police (Wikipedia)
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Old 09-15-2017, 10:58 AM   #24
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I guess I don't get it. I don't mind that I don't. To me publishing isn't as good as people pretend it to be. I wouldn't want to publish porn. For me it is just a diversion. I'm not that good at it any way. I wouldn't spend years worrying about a word I'd used in it like I do with my other stuff.

My main writing is totally nonsexual.it is about and for children. It is a lot more difficult to write.. it needs humour which I see so little of in erotica. It is what I'm proud of. I can show it to any one. I have illustrated some of it. I'm not saying it is a world beater. I'm just saying how I feel about it. My babies.
Onevday I just might get it all presented to sell at markets- no agents, no publishers, nothing like that. I won't give it all away but it has to be better than having forgotten representations at massive publishing houses.

Of course there are writers who hit the big time in the established way, but there are a lot more who don't.. often the rejection of a publishing house ot agent is a good thing. It saves the writer from enduring humiliation. I believe the last person to see one's self is one's self. For some one who writes, who is engaged in fantasy for so long it is especially important. I once had a publisher look at my "/stuff" and was saved. That was a long time ago. I've worked at it since and think l'm better now. That is an opinion though and would need substantiation.
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