Mental Illness

I hear you. That is so hard. She has to get it firmly in her mind that her meds are her friend and she hurts herself and everyone around her when she doesn't take those meds. It's not fair to blame anyone else. *HUGS*

Collar_N_Cuffs said:

I have a bipolar friend. She consistently begs me to not let her stop taking her medication when she is in her low phases, and then stops, no matter what I do, in her manic phases. She stopped several weeks ago, and I see her cycling down, yet she blames it on everything other than the fact that she won't take her meds. Aaarrrgghhhh! I hate watching her shred herself against her disease over and over. I feel so helpless.

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Yes, she is a particularly tough case, because she believes only in homeopathic, natural, and nutrition. Therefore she always comes back to "I can heal myself, medicine is poison". This believe that all modern medicine is bad, coupled with the situation that desertslave describes for her penchant to stop medication makes it all quite predictable and painful. Thanks for the well wishes and the info

Here's the thing that's easy to say, but hard to put into practice when it comes to the mentally ill: It is not (general) your place to babysit them. Unless they have reached the point of being mentally incompetent, then they're still responsible for their own health. And even if they are mentally incompetent, if you didn't sign up to be their caretaker, then, again, it's not your problem.

That sounds harsh, I realize. You want to help. You want to do all that you can to make sure they're ok. But unless they want to get better and are willing to do the things it takes to get better, you're just banging your head against the wall.

I spent several years of my life trying to babysit more than one bipolar who didn't want to stay on their meds or wanted to do drugs and drink in addition to taking meds or any number of other, self-defeating BS. And let me tell you something: It is not worth it. Every time I tried to do it, it made ME sicker. These kinds of people are happy to shrug all the responsibility off on you and will gladly put the blame on anybody but themselves.

If somebody wants help and is willing to do what it takes to get better, then, yes, by all means, help if you can. But people who engage in self-sabotaging behavior? You just have to leave them to it, unless you happen to enjoy driving yourself crazy for someone else and accomplishing nothing in the process.

Also? As someone with the severe form of it myself, I have NEVER understood why bipolars voluntarily go off their stupid meds. I have had to a couple of times because I couldn't afford to get them filled, and it sucks. It sucks so bad. I am genuinely afraid of what will (and often does) happen if I'm not on mine. I don't get why this doesn't occur to others.

I have much experience with bipolar disorder as my mother is bipolar. Luckily we can talk candidly about it and she does take her medicines every day.

I see the same behavior in other forms of illness and addiction. I lost my cousin a few years ago to pain medication. He knew he could handle it, right up to the end. Everyone in the family tried to make a difference, but in the end it was his choice and what he was willing to do or not do.

It's called loving detachment. You can still love and care for someone but detach yourself from their responsibilities and what's in their control. Yes easier said than done, but needed for both parties.

wicked woman said:

It's called loving detachment. You can still love and care for someone but detach yourself from their responsibilities and what's in their control. Yes easier said than done, but needed for both parties.

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Yes, that. ^^^^

wicked woman said:

It's called loving detachment. You can still love and care for someone but detach yourself from their responsibilities and what's in their control. Yes easier said than done, but needed for both parties.

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So. Much. Yes. Yes. Yes!

wicked woman said:

It's called loving detachment. You can still love and care for someone but detach yourself from their responsibilities and what's in their control. Yes easier said than done, but needed for both parties.

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It's the both parties part that is hard to come by. I could probably manage it, with great difficulty, simply because I've reached the stage where I'm mentally, emotionally, and physically exhausted.

My mentally ill sibling, however...well, she hates me if I do detach and she hates me if I don't. The cycle can be pretty brutal.

Endless_Night said:

It's the both parties part that is hard to come by. I could probably manage it, with great difficulty, simply because I've reached the stage where I'm mentally, emotionally, and physically exhausted.

My mentally ill sibling, however...well, she hates me if I do detach and she hates me if I don't. The cycle can be pretty brutal.

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Just to make sure I was clear, by loving detachment I didn't mean you needed to physically detach yourself.

If she hates you either way than I would lovingly detach versus enabling. You shouldn't have to become mentally, emotionally and physically exhausted dealing with what's her responsibility. And she won't learn to deal with her responsibilities if you're doing it or covering for her. Of course I say that without knowing your personal situation.

When I say my friend blames her condition on everything but the fact that she isn't taking her medication, I didn't mean other people. She had some oral surgery and took a Tylenol 4 about two weeks ago, and is saying that the codeine is still in her system and making her crazy. That is the current reason as to why her while life is fucking up, because she took that one pill for pain.

Also, amazingly, as she begins to spiral down everyone at work has suddenly turned into an asshole. When I suggested there might be a link between her feeling bad and her perception of them turning asshole, she says... You're right! The universe is punishing me for taking that codeine. That's why everyone is ganging up on me! She didn't quite appreciate when I told her that what I meant was that her perception was skewed, and that there is very little codeine in a Tylenol 4.

I don't try to shoulder any of her responsibilities, and I do continuously try to point out as kindly as possible that her thinking might not be the most logical, and I suggest things that might help her - the number one thing being her medication. Meanwhile I sit on the sidelines and watch her suffer. That's the part I hate.

wicked woman said:

Just to make sure I was clear, by loving detachment I didn't mean you needed to physically detach yourself.

If she hates you either way than I would lovingly detach versus enabling. You shouldn't have to become mentally, emotionally and physically exhausted dealing with what's her responsibility. And she won't learn to deal with her responsibilities if you're doing it or covering for her. Of course I say that without knowing your personal situation.

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I understood what you meant, and I agree.

That's a real pain. There is no "natural". So much of the homeopathic thing is just B.S. I believe in logic and science. I believe is something affects you there are side effects "natural" or not.

My girl was always hating on her meds but I finally think she gets it that she is better and more functional and hurts people less on them now.

Due to her issues is it very hard for her to tell when meds are helping or hurting. She tends to assume hurting.

I have to point out to her the differences or she has to be shown that on X med her anxiety was 7 and on this med it's 3 on a scale of 1-10. Very frustrating.

Collar_N_Cuffs said:

Yes, she is a particularly tough case, because she believes only in homeopathic, natural, and nutrition. Therefore she always comes back to "I can heal myself, medicine is poison". This believe that all modern medicine is bad, coupled with the situation that desertslave describes for her penchant to stop medication makes it all quite predictable and painful. Thanks for the well wishes and the info

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Elle, perhaps consider it preemptive fall housecleaning?

I'm glad the bird has settled down, whatever the reason. Those kinds of feels are so unnerving! I often grin over our shared experiences. The storm thing is extra-special. I skirted a whole line of storms on the way home last night, singing at the top of my lungs to a favorite driving playlist.

I just recently learned part of the source for "spring housecleaning." I was watching a BBC series, Tudor Monastery, and it was explained that all the linens were brought out and washed, mattresses re-stuffed, fresh herbs put down and fresh rush mats, because of being shut up for so much of the winter. Few opportunities to let in fresh air, so much damp carried in from rain and snow, so it was a necessary time for a massive do-over. Makes perfect sense, but we're so removed from that in our (mostly) modern homes and medicines and cleansers, that it's not as vitally necessary anymore.

Bipolar disorder is pretty much uncureable but it is manageable. You have to become a master of who you are regardless of how the brain works. I struggle daily with BP and I'm one of the rapid cycling ones too so sometimes it gets draining bouncing from one extreme to the other. Just remember to take your meds, eat a healthy diet with healthy choice of snacks because caffeine, sugar, and alcohol are the number one enemy to people with BP. It is because it alters the mood too rapidly so our system may feel anxiety, ptsd, or depression which are the constant struggles of BP mainly. I wouldnt be surprised that a lot of people on lit are BP.
Whatever you do just be kind to people with BP because we regret hurting others constantly when we are wrapped up in it all.

Pretty sure I'd die without caffeine and be very, very grumpy without sugar, but that's just me. I'm mostly stable nowadays, though, so maybe that's the difference.

Gianbattista said:

I think all people are individuals. I genuinely think one close to me who has caused hurt cannot take on board she HAS. And for her sake I 'my glad. She needs to stay afloat, not feel guilt or try and make amends or build bridges on sand foundations.

In other case, ....I think the other is beginning to now, near the end of life, and its heart breaking. Its not helping her, far from it, and, similarly...trust from those around is too far gone to rebuild the relationships as she would like it. Relationship remains there....but not on terms she wants, and that's hard for every one.

Drawing boundaries repeatedly is exhausting, and indeed, damaging to fragile others brought up in the care of those who needed love, care and support themselves. Sometimes...being kind is too hard, saying nothing is the best I can do.

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Everyone's rollercoaster inside their head is different you cannot predict how a bipolar person will behave or react.
The person with the illness hopefully recognizes that they are ill and take the necessary actions to avoid the illness affecting others.
I still cause problems in my life, but what helps me not feel guilt after I have hurt others is the ability to truly apologize for what I have done (emotionally/verbally hurt of course, not physical hurt/violence!, that is a whole other ball game).
A sincere apology has made my life 10 times better.

BiBunny said:

Pretty sure I'd die without caffeine and be very, very grumpy without sugar, but that's just me. I'm mostly stable nowadays, though, so maybe that's the difference.

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Yay for being stable!

Caffeine just makes me hypomanic.
Sugar gives me a quick high then a crash where I get super grumpy and annoyed easily.
You are correct though, when I feel stable too, I could enjoy have both caffeine and sugary stuff without feeling weird afterwards.

mrdiscreetshh said:

Yay for being stable!

Caffeine just makes me hypomanic.
Sugar gives me a quick high then a crash where I get super grumpy and annoyed easily.
You are correct though, when I feel stable too, I could enjoy have both caffeine and sugary stuff without feeling weird afterwards.

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Makes sense to me!

Gianbattista said:

Yes, you see, you would be easy to forgive, . Not even the apology, but the recognition I think is enough. Love doesn't, from me, always need apology, just. For the person who causes an issue, through no fault of their own, not to pretend ( or for real?) they are made of Teflon and that nothing sticks to them. Sadly, in my case there has been some physical violence. not much, nothing broken or anything. Well, only hearts..

This is what I mean my individual. I do not think all BP sufferers are like this. I have friends who are BP who like you and gorgeous bibunny take responsibility for their health. And I have ...this situation, and family I almost wish I could stop loving so that it stopped hurting. I cannot class people like you and bibunny the same.

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Oh, thank you, Elle. That's so kind of you!