How do you avoid "barely legal" at Smashwords?

How do you avoid the suggested extra scrutiny of "barely legal" erotica at Smashwords? I mean 18 is 18, right? I can see the potential yellow flag circumstance in an 18 year-old high school student yet the same age in college getting a free pass perhaps, but what if it's a 21 year-old but someone at Smashwords thinks the character is behaving like a 17 year-old? Is this just them covering their legal backside?

From section 9f of their TOS:

"Barely legal" erotica is strongly discouraged, and is subject to additional review and may be removed without notice at the sole determination of Smashwords, especially if characters are in situations - or have mannerisms - that suggest that the characters are actually underage.

Jessicathe69 said:

From section 9f of their TOS:

"Barely legal" erotica is strongly discouraged, and is subject to additional review and may be removed without notice at the sole determination of Smashwords, especially if characters are in situations - or have mannerisms - that suggest that the characters are actually underage.

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By those rules you should write your characters as mature adults with no under 18 mannerisms. If you're a write, I'm sure you can do that.

If you want to write a young adult novel then cut out the sex or make sure that the sex isn't graphic, too detailed, and is not the point of the story.

Smashwords doesn't go out of its way to actually monitor content. It's probably not something you need to worry too much about.

Jessicathe69 said:

"Barely legal" erotica is strongly discouraged, and is subject to additional review and may be removed without notice at the sole determination of Smashwords, especially if characters are in situations - or have mannerisms - that suggest that the characters are actually underage.

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I don't write for smashwords (yet), but this I personally do this for age limit stuff. My characters are at their youngest college freshmen, who are no longer living anywhere near home, and I usually hint at some back story of maturity. Even if I'm writing younger adults, I try to make them at least in their early 20s, and have them interact with people a little older than them.

No high school senior and their naughty teachers. No flashbacks to teenage sex. No in depth references to childhood, parents, families or anything else that would be associated with a minor. In only one of my stories has a minor even shown up.

Basically, even if my characters are younger and sexually inexperienced, I make it clear that they're still independent people who are moving towards adulthood.

KeithD said:

Smashwords doesn't go out of its way to actually monitor content. It's probably not something you need to worry too much about.

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Thanks, that sounds perfectly logical. After all their TOS was most likely was written by a team of lawyers anyway. Reading through their FAQ's gave me the impression that they do not actually read submitted content (and won't if asked to) but are concerned by formatting and that, while you can write about explicit sexual situations, no pornographic images can be included with the text. Probably yet another TOS that people rarely read anyway.

Maeven_quinn said:

I don't write for smashwords (yet), but this I personally do this for age limit stuff. My characters are at their youngest college freshmen, who are no longer living anywhere near home, and I usually hint at some back story of maturity. Even if I'm writing younger adults, I try to make them at least in their early 20s, and have them interact with people a little older than them.

No high school senior and their naughty teachers. No flashbacks to teenage sex. No in depth references to childhood, parents, families or anything else that would be associated with a minor. In only one of my stories has a minor even shown up.

Basically, even if my characters are younger and sexually inexperienced, I make it clear that they're still independent people who are moving towards adulthood.

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Thanks. One of my main stories involves a college freshman (18, which I may change to 19 now) and one of her professors and the story displays a young woman who is away from home and mature beyond her years.

Jessicathe69 said:

Thanks. One of my main stories involves a college freshman (18, which I may change to 19 now) and one of her professors and the story displays a young woman who is away from home and mature beyond her years.

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I can’t imagine smashwords refusing that. From what I hear, they publish dubcon, right? And here It sounds like you have a young woman who consents. That’s all that should matter.

Write about actual adults.

Maeven_quinn said:

I can’t imagine smashwords refusing that. From what I hear, they publish dubcon, right? And here It sounds like you have a young woman who consents. That’s all that should matter.

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Thanks. Yes, consents and embraces. In fact I want to write about strong young women (of legal age (adults) of course) who embrace their sexuality and the men - and women - who support and challenge them.

Maeven_quinn said:

I can’t imagine smashwords refusing that. From what I hear, they publish dubcon, right? And here It sounds like you have a young woman who consents. That’s all that should matter.

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Believe it or not they actually publish bestiality. And not just werewolves.

Zeb_Carter said:

Believe it or not they actually publish bestiality. And not just werewolves.

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Werebats?

I have to add a question to the already ongoing topic: just why - and it seems to be a thing about English speaking cultures - there is a hard line in place when it comes to writing fiction involving under eighteen years old characters?

How would a story between a 16yo and a 19yo be met? Or even worst: how about a romance between a 16 year old and a late twenties individual?

We had a film made around such a story in my country and the book was a huge hit.

When I started writing, I asked around to people involved in the medium in my country what were the hard lines set in place and the only one I got back was paedophilia. Besides that, pretty much anything goes.

There is no such limitation in mainstream publishing. It's in erotica and it is discussed here ad nauseum (ad nauseum!) in wheel spinning fashion. It's a self-imposed limitation by some erotica publishers, distributors, and Web sites, based, presumably on personal taste (which is their right) and/or wish to keep certain classes of users and vigilantes at bay. Did I mention that it's discussed ad nauseum here, where nobody can do a thing about it?

Maeven_quinn said:

Werebats?

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Werepugs!

Zeb_Carter said:

Believe it or not they actually publish bestiality. And not just werewolves.

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Werewolves aren't bestiality. Bestiality is sex with REAL animals not mythological ones.

Qyron said:

.. How would a story between a 16yo and a 19yo be met? Or even worst: how about a romance between a 16 year old and a late twenties individual?

We had a film made around such a story in my country and the book was a huge hit.

When I started writing, I asked around to people involved in the medium in my country what were the hard lines set in place and the only one I got back was paedophilia. Besides that, pretty much anything goes.

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16-19 is YA (young adult / teenage) fare in North America. If you write mainstream YA, sex can occur or be mentioned without a great deal of explicit detail but the main theme must be other than erotic. I grew up reading Judy Blume novels among others and she got fairly explicit and pushed the borders. YA is an entire genre and in huge demand, but there's a line between mainstream publishing and the stories you get on Literotica so it depends where you want to go.

Mainstream is easy, just pick up any YA novel written for teenage girls and you can figure out the rules fast enough, and the sex can get fairly explicit but not in the sort of detail you get here. Erotic content in explicit detail as found on Literotica is another story and there's threads here on that ad nauseum, as KeithD pointed out. It's something that every new writer to Literotica whose interests lie in writing that age bracket push up against.

16yo and late twenties? The simple rule is, no under 18 on Literotica. Not even if they're teenage mutant ninja turtles. It's a site rule, and nothing to do with what's acceptable in the broader publishing market. Storiesonline will take stories with 14yo up characters, asstr is anything goes, and there's a few more out there but Literotica has by far and away the biggest readership.

Wattpad is okay, you can post stories as written here on LIT but they have their own set of rules and they don't vet the content, but they have user reporting. So you have a platform there to try.

Qyron said:

How would a story between a 16yo and a 19yo be met? Or even worst: how about a romance between a 16 year old and a late twenties individual?

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Can't speak for everyone, but romance between a late 20s person and teenage makes my skin crawl. It's usually indicative of a extremely lopsided, and not truly consensual in the "informed consent" sense of the term on part of the minor. On part of the adult, one wonders about their own maturity level.

I also had an early 20s stalker when I was sixteen, so these scenarios bring up bad memories, putting it lightly.

KeithD said:

There is no such limitation in mainstream publishing. It's in erotica and it is discussed here ad nauseum (ad nauseum!) in wheel spinning fashion. It's a self-imposed limitation by some erotica publishers, distributors, and Web sites, based, presumably on personal taste (which is their right) and/or wish to keep certain classes of users and vigilantes at bay. Did I mention that it's discussed ad nauseum here, where nobody can do a thing about it?

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When I had my first adult library card (starting in 1969 I think at the age of fourteen) I could go in and borrow a copy of Lolita or Rabbit Redux. (Actually I didn't read the former until years later and I read a paperback version of the Updike book my mother left around.)

Of course one actually had to go to the branch to get it, and besides most of the books had text only. (I guess there are a few pedophiles somewhere who read Lolita but it's not "arousing" per se.)

The Internet makes people a bit jumpy because we've finally reached the point of almost no limits at all. Anyone can access anything at any time. So I can understand way there is a rear-guard action by sites to hold some line.