COVID-19 RESOURCES
LIT CAMS (200 Free Tokens)ADULT TOYSVOD MOVIES

Google refuses to shut down gay conversion app Living Hope Ministries

sultrysandy

sultrysandy

Moof - Geekette
Joined
Jul 15, 2016
Posts
207,261
.
Google is refusing to shut down a gay conversion therapy app that has already been banned by Apple, Amazon, and Microsoft


  • Google is resisting calls to remove what appears to be a gay conversion therapy app from the Play Store.

  • Apple, Amazon, and Microsoft have all banned the app, created by US Christian group Living Hope Ministries.

  • A petition on change.org calling for the app's removal has received more 140,000 signatures and LGBTQ+ activists are trying to meet with Google CEO Sundar Pichai.


Google is resisting pressure to remove what appears to be a gay conversion therapy app from the Play Store after Apple, Amazon, and Microsoft all banned the service.

The app in question is the creation of US Christian group, Living Hope Ministries. It is eponymously named in the app store and has been downloaded more than 1,000 times.

Critics say it wants people to "pray away the gay," encouraging young people identifying as LGBTQ+ to become heterosexual through a mixture of therapy and prayer.

A petition on change.org calling for the app's removal has received more 140,000 signatures, and a spokesperson for the Human Rights Campaign reportedly described the app as "life-threatening" to LGBTQ+ young people.

Axios said "several major LGBTQ+ rights groups" have written to Google CEO Sundar Pichai to secure a meeting about the app, but have been unsuccessful. It follows Apple, Amazon, and Microsoft all banning the app.

In a statement on its website, Living Hope Ministries describes itself as proclaiming "a Christ-centered, Biblical world-view of sexual expression rooted in one man and one woman in a committed, monogamous, heterosexual marriage for life." It adds that "anything less than this ideal, falls short of God's best for humanity."
.
 
Thanks for this, I hadn't heard. I've tried to sign just now, but it hung so I'll try later for sure x

Working again, signed :)

Google are frigging scary
 
Last edited:
It's probably because google only cares about what's illegal, not just morally wrong. Not to defend them, I'm not their biggest fan, especially when it pertains to android phones and some of their networks like Google Drive.
 
Jax, I am going to suspend judgement on the execs at Google right now. This, despite there ihas s no issue that gets me more enraged on this earth right now than this practice. From a legal perspective, California (where Google incorporates) banned gay conversion 'centers', so from there it seems that if there is no monetary exchange taking place (profit or non-profit?) it would be a matter of 1st Amendment right to express (not to engage oneself and practice) your religious principles. (yes, no matter how awful they are) There are many other issues possibly at stake too: 1) what happens when you cross state lines (the google app is downloaded, I assume from CA) Is the 'gay conversion therapy', which may be popular in South Carolina, if banned, a restriction of religious liberty? This issue I believe will be brought to an Appellate Court (it likely was in CA already) and likely the highest Appellate in the nation, the Supremes. 2) I have not seen the App (for I fear I could not contain my rage) but is it Directly a 'how to' or is it PART of this religious group's philosophy. This would make a difference in ANY Appellate Court (including those whose jurisdiction is California)

BTW I have already signed the petition in another venue online.
 
tryingagurl said:
From a legal perspective, California (where Google incorporates) banned gay conversion 'centers', so from there it seems that if there is no monetary exchange taking place (profit or non-profit?) it would be a matter of 1st Amendment right to express (not to engage oneself and practice) your religious principles.
Click to expand...

The First Amendment prevents government (specifically, Congress) from infringing on speech. It doesn't put any restrictions on private enterprises, such as Google, which can and do censor what appears on their platforms.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances
 
Perhaps I'm missing something? If it's an 'app', wouldn't that imply that the people using it are doing so of their own free will? As odd as it may seem to most of us, I'm sure there are still those who 'want to be cured' of the curse of their sexuality. Shouldn't it be they who decide the app's future?

I'm all in favor of using my wallet and my voice on a petition. But at this point it doesn't seem that this app is a big deal (nor can I imagine it being very effective. But, if it is, and the ones who bought it are happy with it...:confused: )

(Are there those who use this app in a forced conversion attempt?)
 
yukonnights said:
Perhaps I'm missing something? If it's an 'app', wouldn't that imply that the people using it are doing so of their own free will? As odd as it may seem to most of us, I'm sure there are still those who 'want to be cured' of the curse of their sexuality. Shouldn't it be they who decide the app's future?
Click to expand...

The American Psychological Association reviewed research on "sexual orientation change efforts" (SOCE, aka conversion therapy, back in 2009: Appropriate Therapeutic Responses to Sexual Orientation[/quote].

In summary:
- conversion therapy doesn't work
- it can have harmful consequences including depression and suicidality
- it gets in the way of interventions that do improve mental health of LGBTI people, e.g. encouraging self-acceptance

So it's quack medicine, more likely to harm than benefit people. That seems like plenty of reason to ban it. Indeed, Google [url="https://www.techradar.com/au/news/google-bans-dodgy-diet-pills-and-snake-oil-salesmen-from-the-play-store"]already bans other shonky medical apps.
 
tryingagurl said:
Jax, I am going to suspend judgement on the execs at Google right now. This, despite there ihas s no issue that gets me more enraged on this earth right now than this practice. From a legal perspective, California (where Google incorporates) banned gay conversion 'centers', so from there it seems that if there is no monetary exchange taking place (profit or non-profit?) it would be a matter of 1st Amendment right to express (not to engage oneself and practice) your religious principles. (yes, no matter how awful they are) There are many other issues possibly at stake too: 1) what happens when you cross state lines (the google app is downloaded, I assume from CA) Is the 'gay conversion therapy', which may be popular in South Carolina, if banned, a restriction of religious liberty? This issue I believe will be brought to an Appellate Court (it likely was in CA already) and likely the highest Appellate in the nation, the Supremes. 2) I have not seen the App (for I fear I could not contain my rage) but is it Directly a 'how to' or is it PART of this religious group's philosophy. This would make a difference in ANY Appellate Court (including those whose jurisdiction is California)

BTW I have already signed the petition in another venue online.
Click to expand...
While I agree gay conversion tactics are ridiculous, it is not as enraging as people being stoned, or tossed off buildings for being suspected to be lgbt.
 
Gamina said:
While I agree gay conversion tactics are ridiculous, it is not as enraging as people being stoned, or tossed off buildings for being suspected to be lgbt.
Click to expand...

Most of us here have a better chance of influencing Google than the folk you're talking about. Just because there's something even worse happening elsewhere in the world doesn't mean we shouldn't try to fix what can be fixed.
 
Not saying you shouldn't. Just that there are better things to be most enraged about




Bramblethorn said:
Most of us here have a better chance of influencing Google than the folk you're talking about. Just because there's something even worse happening elsewhere in the world doesn't mean we shouldn't try to fix what can be fixed.
Click to expand...
 
Gamina said:
Not saying you shouldn't. Just that there are better things to be most enraged about
Click to expand...

Impotent rage against things we can't change isn't "better" than rage directed at evils within one's sphere of influence. It's just a recipe for paralysis, and telling people that they ought to be outraged about something else instead is very rarely effective.
 
Bramblethorn said:
The American Psychological Association reviewed research on "sexual orientation change efforts" (SOCE, aka conversion therapy, back in 2009: Appropriate Therapeutic Responses to Sexual Orientation.

In summary:
- conversion therapy doesn't work
- it can have harmful consequences including depression and suicidality
- it gets in the way of interventions that do improve mental health of LGBTI people, e.g. encouraging self-acceptance

So it's quack medicine, more likely to harm than benefit people. That seems like plenty of reason to ban it. Indeed, Google [url="https://www.techradar.com/au/news/google-bans-dodgy-diet-pills-and-snake-oil-salesmen-from-the-play-store"]already bans other shonky medical apps.
Click to expand...

I fear I didn't make my point clear; I'm aware of the stupidity (and danger) of Conversion Therapy. But that implies actual therapy (which is often forced by parents). However, this is a silly app, which I assume the person buys and uses of his/her own free will. No one is forcing them, it is just them and their app trying to brainwash himself/herself. (Obviously, I've not seen the app in question, but how effective could it really be? Has there been any report of someone coming to harm with it? If so, then maybe there's reason to be alarmed...if not?) I'm also for anything that is against Google. However, this does sit on the fringe of the petitioners taking away something the buyer of the app wants. I'm not too motivated to go down that path. Show me a petition to ban all of Google and I'm on-board big time though ;) If anything, the fact that Google has refused this 'suggestion' should move those who are concerned to sever the monetary support of the entire Google machine...and let them know why you're moving on.
 
Bramblethorn said:
Impotent rage against things we can't change isn't "better" than rage directed at evils within one's sphere of influence. It's just a recipe for paralysis, and telling people that they ought to be outraged about something else instead is very rarely effective.
Click to expand...
Not saying you should be enraged, I am saying that it is stupid to be most enraged by something like this. You are still free to be enraged by what ever you want to. An app that isn't forcefully downloaded to your phone, just seems like a waiste of outrage, when people are literally being murdered for who they are.
 
Noting that Google did eventually take the app down: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article...pull-a-pray-away-the-gay-app-lgbtq-group-says

yukonnights said:
I fear I didn't make my point clear; I'm aware of the stupidity (and danger) of Conversion Therapy. But that implies actual therapy (which is often forced by parents). However, this is a silly app, which I assume the person buys and uses of his/her own free will. No one is forcing them, it is just them and their app trying to brainwash himself/herself.
Click to expand...

The app was specifically pitched at "teens" - see screenshot. I would bet my last dollar that some, probably most of the kids who used that app were pressured into it.

Nobody who lives in a supporting, accepting environment seeks out conversion therapy. Why on earth would anybody try to "cure" themselves of same-sex attraction if not for pressure from those around them?

(Obviously, I've not seen the app in question, but how effective could it really be? Has there been any report of someone coming to harm with it?
Click to expand...

It's pretty well known that LGBTI youth are at substantially higher risk of self-harm, and that this is heavily correlated with stigmatising their orientation/identity. Treating it as a "disease" to be prayed away plays into that stigma. Same poison, new packaging.

Gamina said:
Not saying you should be enraged, I am saying that it is stupid to be most enraged by something like this. You are still free to be enraged by what ever you want to. An app that isn't forcefully downloaded to your phone, just seems like a waiste of outrage, when people are literally being murdered for who they are.
Click to expand...

Choosing to focus one's outrage in a direction where it might do some good is the opposite of "wasteful".

You seem to have this idea that outrage needs to be exactly proportional to the magnitude of the evil in question. But that's not how emotions work. They're not moral judgements.
 
Bramblethorn said:
You seem to have this idea that outrage needs to be exactly proportional to the magnitude of the evil in question. But that's not how emotions work. They're not moral judgements.
Click to expand...

If we substitute emotions for E, moral judgement as m, and c for outrage we can find a predictable outcome, because we should recognise that accepting emotions over judgement will inevitably lead to a disproportional sense of outrage. In fact the outrage is exponential, so that outrage leads to more outrage, or outrage x outrage. This has led greater minds than ours to conclude the E/m=c^2 or more simply put E=mc2
:cool:
 
stickygirl said:
If we substitute emotions for E, moral judgement as m, and c for outrage we can find a predictable outcome, because we should recognise that accepting emotions over judgement will inevitably lead to a disproportional sense of outrage. In fact the outrage is exponential, so that outrage leads to more outrage, or outrage x outrage. This has led greater minds than ours to conclude the E/m=c^2 or more simply put E=mc2
:cool:
Click to expand...

Heya Sticky! How's doing?
 
Bramblethorn said:
Noting that Google did eventually take the app down: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article...pull-a-pray-away-the-gay-app-lgbtq-group-says



The app was specifically pitched at "teens" - see screenshot. I would bet my last dollar that some, probably most of the kids who used that app were pressured into it.

Nobody who lives in a supporting, accepting environment seeks out conversion therapy. Why on earth would anybody try to "cure" themselves of same-sex attraction if not for pressure from those around them?



It's pretty well known that LGBTI youth are at substantially higher risk of self-harm, and that this is heavily correlated with stigmatising their orientation/identity. Treating it as a "disease" to be prayed away plays into that stigma. Same poison, new packaging.
Click to expand...

Okay, you convinced me. I hadn't focused on the points you brought out. Any type of shame/stigmatization at a young age no doubt is abusive. ~ :heart:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top