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Do you not want feedback?

Emirus

Emirus

Literotica Guru
Joined
Jan 25, 2018
Posts
1,074
Randomly looking through the recent T&C stories I saw one that referred to an Indy Girl. Being a man who has often lusted after the grid girls at Indy and other race circuits around the world I thought, “I’ll have a read of that” with a picture of the lady already in my mind.

The story itself was short and an enjoyable read although nowhere a 5⭐️ Lots of spelling mistakes, punctuation errors, and sentence construction. I was going to leave a constructive comment because I’d received some constructive help when I first published a story. I thought it was his first story but when I looked him up it was his fourth. In ten years. I thought it was in the wrong category because it wasn’t clear until getting towards the end that it was a ts and her boyfriend. I skimmed through his other three stories which were cross dressing and I don’t find a man dressing up as woman interesting.

I thought I’d leave a helpful comment but, although voting was allowed, comments were switched off. I’ll send him an email instead. But he won’t accept emails. I’ll try a pm. But he won’t accept pm’s.

It seems strange to me that voting is on but comments and communication are off. Every story has, despite the errors, a decent rating and I’m sure he’d like to read praise from those who read and follow his stories.
 
Emirus said:
I thought I’d leave a helpful comment but, although voting was allowed, comments were switched off. I’ll send him an email instead. But he won’t accept emails. I’ll try a pm. But he won’t accept pm’s.

It seems strange to me that voting is on but comments and communication are off. Every story has, despite the errors, a decent rating and I’m sure he’d like to read praise from those who read and follow his stories.
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Sounds pretty clear that he doesn't want feedback.

Some people use this site to explore stuff that's very personal and sensitive for them. Some of those folk are self-conscious about their stories and feel embarrassed even by positive comments.

Some people would like positive comments but don't want to take the hateful crap that other commenters will post, so they opt to get nothing.

Some people are happy with their standard of spelling and grammar - even if it's not yours or mine - and don't want to hear advice on how to improve it. Or they prefer to get that advice from somewhere other than random Literotica commenters. (My comments and feedback are open, and I'd estimate about 30% of the feedback I get on spelling/grammar is simply wrong, from people who don't know the rules as well as they think they do.)

And so on. I don't know the poster and I have no clue why he's elected not to receive feedback, but he has the right to make that decision.
 
What he says ^^^^^. Some folk just don't want feedback, some folk don't care what others think, some folk certainly don't want "writer's advice" unless they specifically ask for it. Don't bother - if they've shut down comments, they're not going to want a PM (and might never know they've got one, if they don't use the forums and have shut down notifications). Leave them be.
 
This is interesting. For me I'm having the exact opposite problem. I'm getting high enough rankings (higher that I would have thought as I write quite niche stuff). But the comments are mostly just "Great story", "Write more", "I like this", etc.

As a complete amateur I know I'm making mistakes and could improve greatly, but it's really hard getting that feedback. While it's nice to know people enjoy your stories, you grow and improve based on criticism (in my opinion).

But I also know some (most?) people, like me, just write for themselves. They enjoy the story building and at the end just want to publish on the off chance it brings joy to someone.
 
Emirus said:
Randomly looking through the recent T&C stories I saw one that referred to an Indy Girl. Being a man who has often lusted after the grid girls at Indy and other race circuits around the world I thought, “I’ll have a read of that” with a picture of the lady already in my mind.

The story itself was short and an enjoyable read although nowhere a 5⭐️ Lots of spelling mistakes, punctuation errors, and sentence construction. I was going to leave a constructive comment because I’d received some constructive help when I first published a story. I thought it was his first story but when I looked him up it was his fourth. In ten years. I thought it was in the wrong category because it wasn’t clear until getting towards the end that it was a ts and her boyfriend. I skimmed through his other three stories which were cross dressing and I don’t find a man dressing up as woman interesting.

I thought I’d leave a helpful comment but, although voting was allowed, comments were switched off. I’ll send him an email instead. But he won’t accept emails. I’ll try a pm. But he won’t accept pm’s.

It seems strange to me that voting is on but comments and communication are off. Every story has, despite the errors, a decent rating and I’m sure he’d like to read praise from those who read and follow his stories.
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I've experienced this when I've commented on another writer's work and also when I've received a particularly helpful comment on my story. In the latter situation I've wondered if they chose to not dignify my message with a response or just have everything shut down. I usually chose the better side of humanity and assume they didn't receive the message!!
 
I'm not here to have some unknown stranger "teach" me how to write, no. Being shown screw-ups would be fine if this wasn't the end of the line for most of my stories--most of them have been in the marketplace already, for up to three years. It's a little late to worry about mess-ups in a freely given version. More than half of the "screw-ups" that have been commented on in my work here haven't been the reader knowing more than I did anyway.

I'm here to share stories--to broaden readership--with folks for free when others have paid to read them. I don't believe in unsolicited vigilante "instruction" from strangers, and leaving comments open isn't a request for such writing "instruction." I don't give it and don't welcome it. I'm not in the development process in writing. I've been doing it for decades. What you see is what you're going to get from me.

I think any writer here who really wants detailed critique will ask for it on this board.

I'm sort of interested in how many folks posting to Literotica believe they have the training and experience in writing and editing to tell anyone else how to write. From my observations over twelve years here (and on top of having graduate certificates in both), I don't think many who are doing it have the chops to be doing it.
 
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klapperz said:
This is interesting. For me I'm having the exact opposite problem. I'm getting high enough rankings (higher that I would have thought as I write quite niche stuff). But the comments are mostly just "Great story", "Write more", "I like this", etc.
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Start new threads here, with a link to your stories. You'll find other writers will drop by (mostly other writers, anyway) and take a look, drop you a wide range of comments.

Actively seeking feedback is quite different to unsolicited comments - it's often a different mind set from the person giving feedback, for starters.
 
Emirus said:
Randomly looking through the recent T&C stories I saw one that referred to an Indy Girl. Being a man who has often lusted after the grid girls at Indy and other race circuits around the world I thought, “I’ll have a read of that” with a picture of the lady already in my mind.

The story itself was short and an enjoyable read although nowhere a 5⭐️ Lots of spelling mistakes, punctuation errors, and sentence construction. I was going to leave a constructive comment because I’d received some constructive help when I first published a story. I thought it was his first story but when I looked him up it was his fourth. In ten years. I thought it was in the wrong category because it wasn’t clear until getting towards the end that it was a ts and her boyfriend. I skimmed through his other three stories which were cross dressing and I don’t find a man dressing up as woman interesting.

I thought I’d leave a helpful comment but, although voting was allowed, comments were switched off. I’ll send him an email instead. But he won’t accept emails. I’ll try a pm. But he won’t accept pm’s.

It seems strange to me that voting is on but comments and communication are off. Every story has, despite the errors, a decent rating and I’m sure he’d like to read praise from those who read and follow his stories.
Click to expand...
I don't leave constructive comments and I don't send constructive comments. The last time I left a constructive comment on a story, I found out later that it really pissed the author off. Nothing pisses me off more than someone leaving a comment that tells me I made a spelling or grammar error. Come on, fucker, let's see you write a 20K story and not make a spelling or grammar error. There was nothing else in that story worthy of commenting on?

If I enjoyed reading a story, I'll leave a positive comment. If the person posts a thread here, I'll provide constructive comments. That's it.
 
8letters said:
I don't leave constructive comments and I don't send constructive comments. The last time I left a constructive comment on a story, I found out later that it really pissed the author off.

Me: I left a comment for one of the authors on my favourite’s list about three months ago. I said that I didn’t think that the story I’d just read was up to his normal high standard. He left a not very nice response but not long after deleted the comments and sent me a very nice email saying that he’d lost his temper, later realised that I’d left complimentary remarks on other stories (he’s far better than me) and that, after thinking about it, he saw my point and apologised. It made me even more pleased I had him on my list.

8letters: Nothing pisses me off more than someone leaving a comment that tells me I made a spelling or grammar error.

Me: I can understand that you might feel that way.

8letters: Come on, fucker, let's see you write a 20K story and not make a spelling or grammar error. There was nothing else in that story worthy of commenting on?

Me: That story, and his previous three, were only 2000+ words. The stories were enjoyable (as I’ve said) but the number of errors spoilt the story for me.

When I read a story I want to enjoy it. If there are any errors it doesn’t matter if they don’t spoil the story. I’m not a member of the grammar police. I’m just someone who started reading stories on here 4/5 years ago for enjoyment. I still look at stories the same way. That’s how us fuckers look at stories.

But the errors spoilt a good story. Which disappoints us fuckers.

I doubt if I, or any other fucker, could write a 3k story (let alone 20m) without any mistakes even though us fuckers aim for perfection. I’ve read hundreds of stories and I’ve never read one yet that didn’t contain some mistake. Even stories by my favourite writers who I admire and wish I could be half as good as them.

Although I’ve never read any of yours because this fucker has no interest in incest/taboo. That’s no criticism of you or those who do enjoy that category. It’s just not for a fucker like me.
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8letters said:
I'd guess that Bramblethorn is a woman. I wouldn't use a gender pronoun for someone unless I knew for sure.
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The author describes themselves as transgender in their bio and posts in T&C.
 
Bramblethorn said:
I don't know the poster and I have no clue why he's elected not to receive feedback, but he has the right to make that decision.
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Everyone has that right. But that wasn’t the point of my original post.
 
electricblue66 said:
What he says ^^^^^. Some folk just don't want feedback, some folk don't care what others think, some folk certainly don't want "writer's advice" unless they specifically ask for it. Don't bother - if they've shut down comments, they're not going to want a PM (and might never know they've got one, if they don't use the forums and have shut down notifications). Leave them be.
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Another lesson I’ve learned. I’ll add it to the pile. As long as you keep me on the straight and narrow I’ll be okay.
 
KeithD said:
I'm sort of interested in how many folks posting to Literotica believe they have the training and experience in writing and editing to tell anyone else how to write. From my observations over twelve years here (and on top of having graduate certificates in both), I don't think many who are doing it have the chops to be doing it.
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Perhaps they're busy with paid work.
 
klapperz said:
This is interesting. For me I'm having the exact opposite problem. I'm getting high enough rankings (higher that I would have thought as I write quite niche stuff). But the comments are mostly just "Great story", "Write more", "I like this", etc.

As a complete amateur I know I'm making mistakes and could improve greatly, but it's really hard getting that feedback. While it's nice to know people enjoy your stories, you grow and improve based on criticism (in my opinion).

But I also know some (most?) people, like me, just write for themselves. They enjoy the story building and at the end just want to publish on the off chance it brings joy to someone.
Click to expand...

You're right imo, you cannot improve if you don't know that anything is wrong. I used to leave what I thought was constructive criticism - stuff like good story but you used too many exclamation points or not enough paragraph spacing, left a wall of text. Etc

But I guess even that can be too much because I got quite a hateful response back before and now I don't bother leaving any feedback other than the star system.
 
8letters said:
I'd guess that Bramblethorn is a woman. I wouldn't use a gender pronoun for someone unless I knew for sure.
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Emirus said:
The author describes themselves as transgender in their bio and posts in T&C.
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I think 8letters was responding to electricblue66 there (in relation to me), not commenting on anything Emirus had said.

For the record, my gender here is "deliberately unspecified" and people are welcome to refer to me by whichever pronouns they prefer, but 8letters' approach is generally a wise one and I appreciate the consideration.
 
Emirus said:
8letters: Nothing pisses me off more than someone leaving a comment that tells me I made a spelling or grammar error.

Me: I can understand that you might feel that way.

8letters: Come on, fucker, let's see you write a 20K story and not make a spelling or grammar error. There was nothing else in that story worthy of commenting on?

Me: That story, and his previous three, were only 2000+ words. The stories were enjoyable (as I’ve said) but the number of errors spoilt the story for me.

When I read a story I want to enjoy it. If there are any errors it doesn’t matter if they don’t spoil the story. I’m not a member of the grammar police. I’m just someone who started reading stories on here 4/5 years ago for enjoyment. I still look at stories the same way. That’s how us fuckers look at stories.

But the errors spoilt a good story. Which disappoints us fuckers.
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Just to be clear, I wasn't calling you a fucker. I was calling the people who leave a comment that only points out a spelling or grammar error "fuckers". People who take a dump in the middle of my comments because I'm human really piss me off.
 
8letters said:
Just to be clear, I wasn't calling you a fucker. I was calling the people who leave a comment that only points out a spelling or grammar error "fuckers". People who take a dump in the middle of my comments because I'm human really piss me off.
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Thank you for clarifying your comment. I agree with you about comments that only deal with punctuation and grammar errors. That’s why I say that if the errors are minimal and don’t spoil my enjoyment of the story then I don’t comment on them. In the case of the author I was citing it was a good story. I wanted to tell him that I’d enjoyed it but if he corrected the errors it would be even better.

The best story I’ve written so far (in my opinion) and the only one with a red H is Early One Mourning. There is an anonymous (naturally) comment running to nearly 400 words and its solely devoted to he/she telling me that I needed to rewrite my first paragraph. That was it. No comment on what he/she thought about the story itself or any other errors that might need correcting. Did he/she actually read the story or just the first paragraph? I don’t know. Did he/she 1-Bomb me because of one paragraph? I don’t know. But to spend a considerable amount of time on that one comment seems silly.

In all seriousness I do read your comments on threads and, on the whole, do find them interesting and informative. So I would like you to invite you to comment on Early One Mourning (and any of the others) and I will be grateful for any constructive criticism. That’s not sarcasm it’s a serious statement.

https://www.literotica.com/s/early-one-mourning

I only began submitting stories last April. I think I’m getting better. I read stories by far better writers than myself to help me improve but I know I have a long way to go. At the moment I believe that I am much better at giving constructive criticism than actually writing. I hope that evens out. As soon as possible.
 
Emirus said:
I only began submitting stories last April. I think I’m getting better. I read stories by far better writers than myself to help me improve but I know I have a long way to go. At the moment I believe that I am much better at giving constructive criticism than actually writing. I hope that evens out. As soon as possible.
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I agree with your reaction to the grammar pedant who tried to "improve" your first paragraph. The paragraph was clunky, yes, but the meaning was apparent (and none of the "corrections" were much better, to be honest). I cut a fair amount of slack regarding technical construction (unless it's diabolical) if the story is engaging - yours was. Punctuation could be improved, sure, but could the story be read? Yes, it could, quite easily (by engaging optical auto-correct when reading ;)).
 
Emirus said:
In all seriousness I do read your comments on threads and, on the whole, do find them interesting and informative. So I would like you to invite you to comment on Early One Mourning (and any of the others) and I will be grateful for any constructive criticism. That’s not sarcasm it’s a serious statement.

https://www.literotica.com/s/early-one-mourning

I only began submitting stories last April. I think I’m getting better. I read stories by far better writers than myself to help me improve but I know I have a long way to go. At the moment I believe that I am much better at giving constructive criticism than actually writing. I hope that evens out. As soon as possible.
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A ghost story? Why didn't you tell me it was a ghost story? I don't read ghost stories. I don't like ghost stories. I have nothing useful to say about ghost stories.

Post was:
It's very much not your typical LitE story. It took me a while to figure out that it was going to be a recounting of a romance, not a story where a romance happens. It's a sad story with some good lessons about what's important in life. It was interesting, but not very interesting. There's no drama or tension. It's on the short side, which is good as, because it's not something I'd come to LitE to read, I didn't want to spend a lot of time reading it.

I thought the ending was terrible. A ghost story? Really? What's the point of turning it into a ghost story? This isn't a ghost story site and Romance isn't a ghost story category. I feel like a much better ending would have been when Bob got home after dropping off Tom, he tells his wife that they should go out to dinner tonight and over dinner, discuss taking a vacation together. "I talked with someone this morning and he reminded me that you're the most important thing in the world to me."

If you want to return the favor, I'd suggest reading "My European Summer Vacation" in my sig. It's a LOT longer than yours. It's not your typical incest story and is very heavy on romance.
 
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8letters said:
This isn't a ghost story site and Romance isn't a ghost story category. I feel like a much better ending would have been when Bob got home after dropping off Tom, he tells his wife that they should go out to dinner tonight and over dinner, discuss taking a vacation together. "I talked with someone this morning and he reminded me that you're the most important thing in the world to me."
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That's an authoritative statement based on what, exactly? I've read several romantic ghost stories (but don't ask for titles, because I can't remember any of them); and there'll be truck-loads of ghost stories in Erotic Horror. Yes, just checked the Tags Portal, searched on "ghosts", there's a few hundred (I've written one myself). Oh look, even one in Incest.

The ghost reveal was the point of the story, I think. You're just expressing your own preferences here, 8L.
 
Edit:
I should have said that it's a ghost story and I have nothing useful to say on ghost stories.

Was:
electricblue66 said:
That's an authoritative statement based on what, exactly? I've read several romantic ghost stories (but don't ask for titles, because I can't remember any of them); and there'll be truck-loads of ghost stories in Erotic Horror. Yes, just checked the Tags Portal, searched on "ghosts", there's a few hundred (I've written one myself). Oh look, even one in Incest.
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Erotic Horror is a pretty sleepy category with 10 stories posted so far in August. I wouldn't consider LitE a poetry site and there's way more poems posted so far in August than there are Erotic Horror stories.

Are there some stories (including in incest) that have a ghost? Sure. Do enough stories have ghost in them that a "he was a ghost" twist ending will find a receptive audience? I don't think so.

electricblue66 said:
The ghost reveal was the point of the story, I think. You're just expressing your own preferences here, 8L.
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We have a difference of opinion here. To me, the point of the story was to tell of a story of real-world love, with moments of pure happiness and moments of severe heartbreak. It's a reminder of what's important in life. To find out that at the end that the story was told by a ghost (not the most reliable of narrators) or it was all in Bob's imagination to me ruins the hard-truth nature of the story.

Edit: And why is Tom's spirit hanging around? Why hasn't he gone on to join his wife and daughter on the other side?
 
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8letters said:
It's very much not your typical LitE story. It took me a while to figure out that it was going to be a recounting of a romance, not a story where a romance happens. It's a sad story with some good lessons about what's important in life. It was interesting, but not very interesting. There's no drama or tension. It's on the short side, which is good as, because it's not something I'd come to LitE to read, I didn't want to spend a lot of time reading it.

I thought the ending was terrible. A ghost story? Really? What's the point of turning it into a ghost story? This isn't a ghost story site and Romance isn't a ghost story category. I feel like a much better ending would have been when Bob got home after dropping off Tom, he tells his wife that they should go out to dinner tonight and over dinner, discuss taking a vacation together. "I talked with someone this morning and he reminded me that you're the most important thing in the world to me."

If you want to return the favor, I'd suggest reading "My European Summer Vacation" in my sig. It's a LOT longer than yours. It's not your typical incest story and is very heavy on romance.
Click to expand...


I can’t see how you didn’t realise quite quickly what the story was about. It’s a short story because that’s the right length for it. I can’t see the point of unnecessarily padding out a story. That makes a good story bad. I’ll settle for you finding it interesting. I’m not looking for the Novel prize for literature. It’s a romance story and it’s in the correct category. Your e dung isn’t better than mine. Your ending sounds as though the author couldn’t think of an ending. You did get it right with the point of the story being romance. A lifetime of happiness with the woman he loved despite everything or because of everything that had happened to them. I like a twist at the end of a story. That’s why it’s there rather than just slide off the cliff edge into oblivion. Have you seen the Sixth Sense with Bruce Willis?

Before I begin I’m English of Irish descent with an Irish surname.

I’ve just attempted to read your story. My first impression is your style is similar to mine. Incest/Taboo, which I can see all your stories are about, immediately made it difficult and also, prior to starting reading, I always look to see how many pages. In a one off story six is about my limit. Anything above that I would only read if it was divided into chapters. I have tried to look at the story in an unbiased way although you might not think so. It was a struggle to get to the bottom of page one and then I skipped to the last few paragraphs to see how it ended so I don’t know what happened in between so can’t comment on the quality of the actual story.

1. By c’mere do you mean lost?
2. Was it that obvious I was an American? Why is he sarcastic when he’s only just met her and she’s trying to be helpful. I can understand her asking if he’s a Yank. Don’t ever make the mistake of assuming a Canadian is an American just because of a similar accent. It won’t go down well.
3. Back to my flat la. I thought this was a typo until you used it again further on. What a “la.”
4. That’s going to get heavy fast. I’m English with an Irish surname and Irish grandparents and I’ve visited Ireland on many occasions and never heard the phrase.
5. “Seriously?” She nodded her head. “I’ve never met another Noel.” Is that two people speaking in the same paragraph?
6. You’re right about the “t”. Paddy and Mick saw a job advertised for tree fellers. Paddy said to Mick,”if only Seamus was here we could’a had that job.”
7. What are non-profits? Is that an American phrase.
8. Labor Day (or Labour Day to spell it correctly. lol) means nothing to anyone outside America.
9. That sounds savage. Never heard the phrase before in my lifetime.
10. Her apartment (or flat) would be numbered 23 not 203.
11. Na, na. Does that mean “no?”
12. Peanut butter and jelly. This really is American. Jelly is referred to as jam on this side of the big water so it would be peanut butter and jam. Except over hertbe idea of mixing peanuts and jam is a sickening thought. She would never have said that.
13. Different feelings warring in my mind. That’s a new one. That’s not a criticism.
14. I’d fancy that. She would never have said that in that context.
15. Not at all. She goes from a supposed Irish brogue to the Queen’s English.
16. I assume that Geographic Information Systems was intended to be a joke?
17. She’s got to buy herself a beer if she wants one? He’s a real creep.
18. Paying the restaurant bill. He decided to let it go. This guy really is obnoxious.

That’s the end. Thank heaven you say. That was blunter than I would normally critique but it’s honest and, despite what you might think, it’s not being vindictive. I was in a hurry so there’s probably lots of typos.
 
8letters said:
Erotic Horror is a pretty sleepy category with 10 stories posted so far in August. I wouldn't consider LitE a poetry site and there's way more poems posted so far in August than there are Erotic Horror stories.

Are there some stories (including in incest) that have a ghost? Sure. Do enough stories have ghost in them that a "he was a ghost" twist ending will find a receptive audience? I don't think so.


We have a difference of opinion here. To me, the point of the story was to tell of a story of real-world love, with moments of pure happiness and moments of severe heartbreak. It's a reminder of what's important in life. To find out that at the end that the story was told by a ghost (not the most reliable of narrators) or it was all in Bob's imagination to me ruins the hard-truth nature of the story.

Edit: And why is Tom's spirit hanging around? Why hasn't he gone on to join his wife and daughter on the other side?
Click to expand...

If the story doesn’t find a receptive audience then that’s the way it is. But it’s on 4.70 with 175 votes.

Romance was the point which is why it’s in the Romance category not Horror. Simple really.

Sorry you feel I ruined the story. But I think it’s done ok seeing it was only my 3rd story.

As for your edit as to why is Tom’s spirit hanging around. I thought I’d made it clear that his wife had died on that day, their 48th wedding anniversary. He had died the year previously on that day, what would have been their 49th wedding anniversary. He’s come back that day because it would have been their 50th wedding anniversary and means an awful lot to a couple who’ve been married that long.

I can assure you that’s correct because my wife and I will be celebrating our Golden Wedding in a few weeks time on the 28th September.
 
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